Dim Light [Pathfinder]

[Slylizard]

Apologies if this is covered elsewhere, but my google-fu has failed to find a previous thread.

Playing Pathfinder and discussing exactly how far characters can see in differing light situations with differing visions. We're very confident in the rules surrounding illuminated light at night, and similar with moonlit nights. But what happens in simple dim light?

The low-light vision entry (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/special-abilities#TOC-Low-Light-Vision) states that "they can see twice as far as normal in dim light". However I am unable to find any description as to how far you can see in dim light normally.

We have two theories on the matter:
1. low-light vision page (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/special-abilities#TOC-Low-Light-Vision) says that a character can see outdoors on a moonlit night as well as they can normally. The Vision and Light page (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/vision-and-light) says "Areas of dim light include outside at night with a moon in the sky, bright starlight, and the area between 20 and 40 feet from a torch.". Thus a moonlight night is 100% dim light for everyone. So to extend that a character with low-light vision can thus see as far as they can possible see in dim light (i.e. they effectively ignore dim light).

2. They can see twice as far as a normal person (as per the low-light entry (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/special-abilities#TOC-Low-Light-Vision))... but nothing defines how far a normal person can see.

So my question is... assuming a character with low-light vision was in the tunnel of never-ending dim light (i.e. a tunnel with dim light that stretches on forever), how far can they see?

[Keneth]

I asked this question a while ago and the simplest answer is that the rules suck and have done so since the release of third edition. As far as I can tell, you can see as far as the curvature of the planet will allow in dim light, though the -1/10 ft. penalty to Perception will prevent you from actually nothing stuff pretty quickly. Everything in dim light also gets concealment and Perception DCs get at least a +2 increase due to unfavorable conditions. The only thing low-light vision does, to my knowledge, is increase the radius of illumination for that character; i.e. a torch for a character with low-light vision has a 40-ft. radius of normal light and a 40-ft. radius of dim light (rather than 20/20).

They could have worded that differently after more than 10 years of confusion. :smallannoyed:

[Hendel]

Low-light vision doubles how far you can see in anything but total darkness.

In the dark with a torch a normal human can see 20 feet as normal light and another 20 feet as dim light (there is a 20% miss chance and you can use stealth). A character with low-light vision can see 40 feet as normal light and another 40 feet (or 80 feet total) as dim light.

It has no effect in total darkness. See page 172 of the PF Core rules or here (http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/additionalRules.html) under Vision and Light.

Edit: Sorry, after rereading your post, I guess the answer is indeed that a character can see as far as there are no obstructions in dim light. So, if you are at the start of an endless tunnel of dim light it would be the same as if you were at the start of an endless tunel of normal light except you have a 20% miss chance and creatures can make a Stealth check in the tunnel.

Under Plains Terrain in the Environment section it says that you can make a perception check up to 6d6x40 feet (max 1440 feet) away. So maybe that we be a good place to start provided there were no obstructions in the tunnel.

[Keneth]

Under Plains Terrain in the Environment section it says that you can make a perception check up to 6d6x40 feet (max 1440 feet) away.

That's interesting, I never knew there were specific Perception rules in the Environment section. Maybe I should read them at some point...