PF -> 3.5: Obitu

[gurgleflep]

How would I convert this race (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/3rd-party-races/alluria-publishing/Obitu) into 3.5? I was showed it when asking for help in future segment of a campaign I'm running that requires the PCs to become undead. I thought it was pretty interesting, but have no clue what I'd change on it to make it more 3.5 friendly. Any help would be appreciated.

[kevin_video]

Well Acrobatics is Balance, Jump, and Tumble, so you could either keep all three, or just have it refer to Balance and Tumble instead.

Other than that, I'd leave it as is and make it a +1 LA. It's about on par with the aasimar and tiefling.

[gurgleflep]

Well Acrobatics is Balance, Jump, and Tumble, so you could either keep all three, or just have it refer to Balance and Tumble instead.

Other than that, I'd leave it as is and make it a +1 LA. It's about on par with the aasimar and tiefling.

It doesn't make sense for it to have jump, so I'll just keep it in Balance and Tumble, put on the +1 LA and call it good. Thank you, and Happy Easter... unless you're from a religion that doesn't celebrate it, in which case have a nice day :smallsmile:

[LOTRfan]

As a general rule, you don't really have to do much to convert a race from Pathfinder to 3.5e. The only thing that really needs to be kept in mind is that the power level of races in Pathfinder is a bit higher than it is in 3.5, so for the most part it is safe to say any Pathfinder race is LA +1 in a D&D game.

Also, I don't mean to derail the thread, but I read your signature and I do believe there is an Orc-Drow hybrid in a third party book. A "Brood," I believe it was called. It sucked mechanically, though.

[VeisuItaTyhjyys]

Is it correct to assume you want them to be somewhere in the general power range of the LA +0 races? If so, you should drop one of +2 ability modifiers so that the Obitu has the standard 3,5 +2/-2, rather than the Pathfinder +2/+2/-2. I would keep the Dex bonus and lose the strength bonus, if only so that the Obitu don't just become universally superior half-orcs. You could also let them choose either strength or dexterity, so that there is a little more variety when the whole party turns obitu. I don't see a problem with medium size, normal speed, darkvision, or the poison/disease saves. The latter is certainly less important than the bonus dwarves get against spells, SLAs, and poisons; even though it's a larger bonus, poison and disease are, at least in my experience, less common and easier to deal with than spells, so saving against them is nice, but not nearly as essential. I don't really see a problem with Nimble Form, after skills are converted back to 3.5 (I would turn the bonus from Acrobatics into a bonus to just Tumble, probably). Negative Energy resistance should almost definitely go, but I'm not really sure about Improved Initiative. Sleep Immunity is a judgment call, since it's probably going to end up primarily flavor; I generally don't cast sleep on my players, and the trancing stuff really just saves everyone the trouble of players spending, like, two hours deciding the watch order when they rest :smallwink:. If you think you'll ever want to put the PCs to sleep so that they can get captured, or something like that, drop it. Similarly, if you don't want the obitu stealing the elves' schtick (especially if you already gave them a dexterity bonus), drop it.

[gurgleflep]

As a general rule, you don't really have to do much to convert a race from Pathfinder to 3.5e. The only thing that really needs to be kept in mind is that the power level of races in Pathfinder is a bit higher than it is in 3.5, so for the most part it is safe to say any Pathfinder race is LA +1 in a D&D game.

Also, I don't mean to derail the thread, but I read your signature and I do believe there is an Orc-Drow hybrid in a third party book. A "Brood," I believe it was called. It sucked mechanically, though.

Even the core races? I've not looked at many of the books, but the half-orc seems to be pretty close.
Which book would that be in?


Is it correct to assume you want them to be somewhere in the general power range of the LA +0 races? If so, you should drop one of +2 ability modifiers so that the Obitu has the standard 3,5 +2/-2, rather than the Pathfinder +2/+2/-2. I would keep the Dex bonus and lose the strength bonus, if only so that the Obitu don't just become universally superior half-orcs. You could also let them choose either strength or dexterity, so that there is a little more variety when the whole party turns obitu. I don't see a problem with medium size, normal speed, darkvision, or the poison/disease saves. The latter is certainly less important than the bonus dwarves get against spells, SLAs, and poisons; even though it's a larger bonus, poison and disease are, at least in my experience, less common and easier to deal with than spells, so saving against them is nice, but not nearly as essential. I don't really see a problem with Nimble Form, after skills are converted back to 3.5 (I would turn the bonus from Acrobatics into a bonus to just Tumble, probably). Negative Energy resistance should almost definitely go, but I'm not really sure about Improved Initiative. Sleep Immunity is a judgment call, since it's probably going to end up primarily flavor; I generally don't cast sleep on my players, and the trancing stuff really just saves everyone the trouble of players spending, like, two hours deciding the watch order when they rest :smallwink:. If you think you'll ever want to put the PCs to sleep so that they can get captured, or something like that, drop it. Similarly, if you don't want the obitu stealing the elves' schtick (especially if you already gave them a dexterity bonus), drop it.

This all sounds pretty reasonable. I'll give them the choice of either the strength or the dexterity, and probably take away their sleep thing.
Thank you for the help, this is great :smallsmile:

[LOTRfan]

Well, compared to the standard D&D half-orc, pathfinder Half-Orcs get a net +2 bonus to their ability scores (which is not only already better than the -2 penalty D&D half-orcs take, but it can be a bonus to any ability score they choose), Orc Ferocity, a +2 bonus to intimidation checks, and weapon familiarity. I'd say that is significantly better than the LA +0 SRD Half-Orc. Which isn't saying much, I admit, seeing as Half-Orcs don't have anything going for them at all.

I tried to correct this by house-ruling the Half-Orc as having the penalty scores given by the SRD, while also having the Ferocity ability (renamed Lesser Ferocity to differentiate it from the Ferocity ability boars have) and the +2 bonus to Intimidation checks.

I can't for the life of me remember what book it is from. I remember that overall the book was extremely lackluster, save for the cool hybrid race ideas that were poorly executed.

[Prime32]

One thing to bear in mind is that 3.5 already has "positive energy undead" (see Book of Exalted Deeds and the Eberron Campaign Setting), with a smaller set of immunities and the ability to be turned by evil clerics/rebuked by good ones.

The easiest way to handle that would probably be using the Necropolitan template but changing undead to deathless.


Negative Energy resistance should almost definitely go, but I'm not really sure about Improved Initiative.Negative Energy Resistance is far, far less useful than Improved Initiative. The former only applies against a small number of enemies and doesn't scale well (plus when it does show up it's usually something like "attacks deal +1d6 neg damage" on a high-level monster, in which case you'll barely notice it's gone). The latter applies all of the time, and winning initiative can change the outcome of a fight completely. I'd go so far as to say it's the race's most powerful feature.

EDIT: Also a common buff (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/deathWard.htm) makes you immune to negative energy anyway. If you're worried about enemy clerics casting inflict wounds, don't be - those spells inflict much less damage than the other stuff he could be doing. Harm and mass harm are dangerous, but that's two spells in the entire game and clerics can't cast them spontaneously.

[gurgleflep]

One thing to bear in mind is that 3.5 already has "positive energy undead" (see Book of Exalted Deeds and the Eberron Campaign Setting), with a smaller set of immunities and the ability to be turned by evil clerics/rebuked by good ones.

The easiest way to handle that would probably be using the Necropolitan template but changing undead to deathless.

Negative Energy Resistance is far, far less useful than Improved Initiative. The former only applies against a small number of enemies and doesn't scale well (plus when it does show up it's usually something like "attacks deal +1d6 neg damage" on a high-level monster, in which case you'll barely notice it's gone). The latter applies all of the time, and winning initiative can change the outcome of a fight completely. I'd go so far as to say it's the race's most powerful feature.

EDIT: Also a common buff (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/deathWard.htm) makes you immune to negative energy anyway. If you're worried about enemy clerics casting inflict wounds, don't be - those spells inflict much less damage than the other stuff he could be doing. Harm and mass harm are dangerous, but that's two spells in the entire game and clerics can't cast them spontaneously.

A positive energy undead would be like the good lich, right?

[Prime32]

A positive energy undead would be like the good lich, right?I'm pretty archliches and baelnorns are still undead. I'm referring to the Deathless type; I can't post the details, but you can find them in those books or with a little digging.

[gurgleflep]

I'm pretty archliches and baelnorns are still undead. I'm referring to the Deathless type; I can't post the details, but you can find them in those books or with a little digging.

Okay, thank you. I'll begin my search now. :smallsmile:

[ericgrau]

PF races are pretty close to 3.5 except for the extra +2 stat bump. Drop the +2 strength and I'd say you're good to go. Even with the +2 strength the race is weaker than some LA 0 3.5 splatbook races.

I'd convert the +2 acrobatics to +2 balance and +2 tumble, based on the fluff.

While the list of abilities seems impressive they suffer from dwarf syndrome, in that they have a long list of abilities that seem like big numbers but are actually too minor in scope to actually matter. For example for negative energy resistance, I don't think I've been hit by a negative energy damage attack in my last 2-3 campaigns. I think 3 campaigns ago I was hit by one. They may have been short campaigns due to personal issues, but we're still talking about around 2 years IRL here. There's no need to mess with anything besides ability scores.

[gurgleflep]

PF races are pretty close to 3.5 except for the extra +2 stat bump. Drop the +2 strength and I'd say you're good to go. Even with the +2 strength the race is weaker than some LA 0 3.5 splatbook races.

I'd convert the +2 acrobatics to +2 balance and +2 tumble, based on the fluff.

While the list of abilities seems impressive they suffer from dwarf syndrome, in that they have a long list of abilities that seem like big numbers but are actually too minor in scope to actually matter. For example for negative energy resistance, I don't think I've been hit by a negative energy damage attack in my last 2-3 campaigns. I think 3 campaigns ago I was hit by one. They may have been short campaigns due to personal issues, but we're still talking about around 2 years IRL here. There's no need to mess with anything besides ability scores.

Sounds good to me.

Thank you all for helping by the way :smallsmile: