[3.5 Most spells per round?

[mattie_p]

OK, so as a thought exercise, I'm trying to come up with the most spells an individual can cast in a single turn. So far I have a cleric with celerity domain, casting a DMM maximized empowered time stop (7 apparent rounds for 14 spells [7 standard and 7 swift]), + swift action spell during the same round he/she cast timestop, + immediate action spell following the same.

Total is 17 spells (14 via time stop, + time stop + swift + immediate). Can anyone top that?

Assumptions - level 20. All 3.5 books are available. No pun-pun/infinite loops - but if you have one to share, feel free. No fast time planes exist.

EDIT: psionics, mysteries, etc permitted. Even if you get your buddy/cohort to WRT you, it counts as another turn.

[Nettlekid]

This is probably cheating, but whatever. I'd go with Erudite 20, learning Body Outside Body from some Wu-Jen somewhere. Manifest that, and now you have a few clones who can also manifest that, and you do that repeatedly until satisfied. This can take a single turn, as they get to go immediately. Since Psionics are SLAs (I think, right?) your clones keep them, and they get their own PP pool. So now you have tons of clones, all of whom can manifest on their own. That's lots of spells.

[Karnith]

Is cheese involving Beholder Mage and/or nagahydra (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20040709a&page=4) ruled out?

Also, add "shapechanged into a chronotyryn" (Fiend Folio) there to double the number of spells you cast.

[Andion Isurand]

You could use Miracle to duplicate the Ability Rip spell, if you have a non-class feature supernatural ability to trade... and swap it with a choker's supernatural Quickness ability.

You could also use Miracle to duplicate the Schism power, assuming you have a means of casting spells without verbal or somatic components.

[TypoNinja]

What about using Greater arcane fusion to cast Arcane fusion, Arcane fusion to cast Celerity, Celerity to cast Greater and looping that till you run out of Greaters? Each circuit should leave you with two free spells from the Fusions.

A bunch of fell draining magic misslies with metamagic reduction so they are still 1st's would even make it an actually threatening combo.

[Flickerdart]

Sanctum Arcane Fusion is a well known infinite spells per round loop.

[Tvtyrant]

Be a level 10 Beholder Mage for 9 spells a round, then shapechange into a Spellweaver using the 9th spell in that round to get 6 level 1 spells. Nets you 15 before adding in quickened spells.

Beholder Mage: Lords of Madness
Spellweaver: Fiend Folio?

[Dimers]

I'm no optimizer, but a regular psion can use schism and Linked Power to cast four spells every round, and temporal acceleration to get a few bonus rounds. With Overchannel, a level 20 cheeseless psion can get four rounds from temp-accel ... so that's 16 during the temp-accel plus 2 others in the same round it's cast. Can't use Linked Power with temp-accel because it's already at the max PP expendable.

[A_S]

What about using Greater arcane fusion to cast Arcane fusion, Arcane fusion to cast Celerity, Celerity to cast Greater and looping that till you run out of Greaters? Each circuit should leave you with two free spells from the Fusions.

A bunch of fell draining magic misslies with metamagic reduction so they are still 1st's would even make it an actually threatening combo.

This. Fusion/Celerity chaining gets you spells/round limited only by your spells per day. Since the OP specifies no infinite loops, this is probably the way to go.

[Namfuak]

Assuming favorable reading on RKV, you could get as many spells per round as you have turn attempts by combining Battle Blessing and Divine Impetus. Human Cleric (turn undead) 4/Crusader 1/RKV 10/Dread Necromancer 1/Prestige Paladin 1/Cleric 3. If you had 18 cha to start, put in 4 over levels, and perhaps a a +6 item gets you 28 charisma, or 12+12 attempts per day. Battle blessing would be taken at 18th level, so level 1+Bonus+3+6+9+12+15 would be extra turning, so 7*4=28 extra uses on both sides. That gives you a total of 81 swift actions+1 regular/full round, before including nightsticks. I think at that point you would be running out of spells before you ran out of swift actions, but if you count manuevers as spells you would get back your crusader manuevers as you used them anyway, I think.

Feel free to poke holes in this, I'm sure I got something wrong.

EDIT: Forgot about the swift action you get for free :smallbiggrin:

[TypoNinja]

This. Fusion/Celerity chaining gets you spells/round limited only by your spells per day. Since the OP specifies no infinite loops, this is probably the way to go.

Versatile Spellcaster, lets you upstep your spell slots to squeeze out even more mileage.

[A_S]

Ooh, and Twin Spell + metamagic reduction should be in there too.

[mattie_p]

OK, lots of nifty ideas, I can't run them all down in books now. Anyone want to tackle your (or another's) ideas to come up with a total in a single round?

[FreakyCheeseMan]

At 10th level, Anima Mage gets the capacity to cast any spell they have prepared as an immediate action.

Any. Spell.

So... quickened plane shift to the ethereal plane, immediate genesis to create a plane where time flows one thousand times as fast, and cast as much as you like.

EDIT: This is also part of my core argument for "To hell with your Incantrix, Anima Mage is the most broken prestige class in the game."

[A_S]

OK, lots of nifty ideas, I can't run them all down in books now. Anyone want to tackle your (or another's) ideas to come up with a total in a single round?

I'm working on one; it involves serious spreadsheets.

[Andion Isurand]

The problem with the RKV + battle blessing idea, is that you're still limited to one quickened / swift action spell per round.

[mattie_p]

At 10th level, Anima Mage gets the capacity to cast any spell they have prepared as an immediate action.

Any. Spell.

So... quickened plane shift to the ethereal plane, immediate genesis to create a plane where time flows one thousand times as fast, and cast as much as you like.

EDIT: This is also part of my core argument for "To hell with your Incantrix, Anima Mage is the most broken prestige class in the game."

I did say in the op that fast time planes don't exist...

[FreakyCheeseMan]

I did say in the op that fast time planes don't exist...

D'oh. That's what I get for skimming.

Oh well, the Immediate Spell thing might be useful anyway, depending on build.

[A_S]

Here's my quick attempt:

-----

Build: Spellscale (or any +2 cha race) Sorcerer 10/Incantatrix 10

Relevant feats:

Twin Spell
Easy Metamagic (twin spell)
Practical Metamagic (twin spell)
Arcane Thesis (celerity)
Arcane Thesis (greater arcane fusion)
Arcane Thesis (dancing lights)

Along with the bonus from Incantatrix, these allow all three Arcane Thesis'd spells to be twinned without level adjustment.

Cha 20 (base) + 5 (levels) + 6 (enhancement) + 5 (inherent) = 36, for a total of 84 spells per day.

Item: Third Eye (clarity)

Round 1:
Standard action: Cast Arcane Spellsurge.
Move action: Draw your Giant +9001 Greataxe of Murdering.

Round 2:
Standard action: Cast Twinned Greater Arcane Fusion to cast Twinned Celerity four times. Use your eight standard actions to cast Twinned Greater Arcane Fusion eight more times, for a total of 32 spells. Use them to cast Twinned Celerity 19 times and Twinned Dancing Lights 13 times. Use your 38 standard actions (from the 19 Twinned Celerities) to cast Twinned Dancing Lights 38 more times.
Move action: Sheathe your Giant +9001 Greataxe of Murdering.

End result: Dancing Lights has been cast 102 times in one round (didn't count the Celerities or Arcane Fusions as "spells cast," since they were a means to an end). Enjoy the fireworks.

-----

Obviously, this hasn't gotten even close to the upper bound for this approach. You could easily have more spells/day, which are the limiting factor. Ideas:

Have multiple casting classes, advanced by dual progression PrC's like Ultimate Magus.
Cheese out your casting stat(s), which I haven't done at all.
Loredrake Dragonwrought Kobold shenanigans.
...I'm sure there's more.

Hopefully this works as a proof-of-concept, though.

*edit* Realized that since I'm casting my Celerities as standard actions rather than immediate actions, I can't put off the Daze condition, so I need to be immune to it. Added a Third Eye to take care of that.

*edit 2* Arithmetic was off.

*edit 3* Sources:

RotD - Spellscale, Practical Metamagic
CArc - Twin Spell
PHB2 - Arcane Thesis, Celerity
Dragon #325 - Easy Metamagic
PGtF - Incantatrix
DrM - Arcane Spellsurge
CM - Arcane Spellsurge, Greater
MIC - Third Eye

[Darrin]

Glyph Seal. Attach it to a pocket that contains spell components, or attach it to an arrow keyed to trigger when you touch it. Free action to draw spell components or ammunition.

Get more Glyph Seals. Rinse & Repeat.

[Vaz]

Using Ardent 3 with Practised Manifester taken at Level 2 or before can manifest Schism (split mind to allow purely mental action) while ensuring you have access to an alternate form to make use of Surrogate Spellcasting and Eschew Materials can cast any non-costly ingredient/non focus requiring spell requiring a standard action to cast, regardless of Verbal or Somatic components or not, in addition to any other action.

An Ardent 10 with the Dominant Time Mantle, using the Substitute Powers ACF to place Synchronicity on it, and taking Linked Power and Metapower Linked Synchronicity, for 1pp, you gain an extra action each turn; combined with Schism (as above, doesn't require Practised Manifester) allows twice the number of spells cast per turn.

This stacks on top of whatever other 10 level build you have in mind.

[mattie_p]

I thought about schism, wasn't sure how to work it in with a time-stop or similar caster.

For all others, especially shapechanging into a monster, please cite your sources, just for ease of reference, please.

@ Darrin: where is Glyph seal?

[TaiLiu]

@ Darrin: where is Glyph seal?
Magic Item Compendium.

[A_S]

Edited to add sources above.

[mattie_p]

Thanks, A_S. So we have 102 spells in a single turn, although they are all geared towards casting Dancing Lights. Granted I didn't specify spell levels you needed to be able to cast. Anyway...

Anyone top that yet?

[Gazzien]

Thanks, A_S. So we have 102 spells in a single turn, although they are all geared towards casting Dancing Lights. Granted I didn't specify spell levels you needed to be able to cast. Anyway...

Anyone top that yet?

I believe that combo works for any spell of Dancing Light's level, unless I missed something; just pull a Red Mage and change the spell that Arcane Thesis is keyed to.

[A_S]

Yeah, I picked Dancing Lights because it was a silly level 0 spell. It'd work just as well for any other level 0 spell, or slightly less well for higher level spells (just because you'd effectively have less spells known to work with, though that could be partially mitigated via Versatile Spellcaster).

*edit* Also, the spell sequence can be improved on (turns out the optimal choice is always to prioritize Twinned Greater Arcane Fusions over Twinned Celerities wherever possible, since they get a 4x return per spell rather than only a 2x return, then use only as many Twinned Celerities as necessary to make sure you don't run out of actions). New action sequence:

Round 1: Cast Arcane Spellsurge.

Round 2: Cast Twinned Greater Arcane Fusion for four spells. Use them all to cast Twinned Celerity. Use all 8 of your standard actions to cast Twinned Greater Arcane Fusion for 32 spells. Use 7 of them to cast Twinned Celerity and 25 of them to cast Twinned Dancing Lights. You now have 14 standard actions. Use 6 of them to cast Twinned Greater Arcane Fusion (you're now out) for 24 spells, and the remaining 8 to cast Twinned Dancing Lights. Use all 24 of your pending Greater Arcane Fusion spells to cast more Twinned Dancing Lights.

Total copies of Dancing Lights cast: 114

[Rubik]

Sanctum Arcane Fusion is a well known infinite spells per round loop.A psion 17/illithid savant 3 who grabs Font of Power (from a metamind) and a psicrystal, Synchronicity, and Affinity Field can pop off an infinite number of 9th level powers per round, and won't ever dry up (especially with Temporal Reiteration in play).

However, the OP DOES say no infiniloops. But a psion who manifests Fission on himself and his psicrystal, then Metamorphosis into a chronotyryn, has Linked Power, and Temporal Acceleration can get a damned lot of powers off, especially if his psicrystal has a dorje or two.

[ironwizard]

Pre-cast set up

Wiz 3/Sor 7 (or Sor + PrCs that don't loose casting)/ Ultimate Magus 10

At UM 10 add Mordenkainen's Lubrication to your list of sorcerer spells known. Drop feats on your favorite Metamagic reducers to get Twin and repeat down to +0 on ML. Take Versatile Spellcaster. Gain immunity to Daze with an item, template, race, w/e makes you happy.

Turn 1:

Use Greater Acrane Fusion + Celerity loop, using your 7th level spell from GAF to cast Twinned repeat ML as a sorcerer top refresh your spell slots. Every 2 castings of Twinned ML refreshes GAF (via Versatile Spellcaster) and provides the same thing for your next turn. Do this until you run out of spell slots, using VS to sac your lower level ones as needed. Eventually, even with ML and GAF, you'll run out of slots

Absurd number of MLs cast

Turn 2: Your Twinned Repeated MLs just went off, supercharging your spell slot batteries! AF/GAF + Cerlerity loop again, now with more spell slots! See above for the silliness of it.

No numbers atm cause I'm not breaking out spreadsheet at 3AM. Maybe tomorrow.

[Gice]

Dragonlance's Heroic Surge feat (Age of Mortals book) lets you take an additional standard or move action in addition to your normal actions.

Per day, you get 1 surge per four character levels (so 5/day at level 20). You can take at most one additional action per round.

This action can be used to cast a single spell in any case and it might be more useful in a time stop (in this experiment) (since you get d4+1 rounds, meaning you can use a surge every round).

[Sith_Happens]

Total copies of Dancing Lights cast: 114

How many total copies of Celerity?

[Flickerdart]

At UM 10 add Mordenkainen's Lubrication to your list of sorcerer spells known.
Lucubration is a 6th level spell, no dice.

[Eldariel]

It's fairly easy to go infinite with Mage's Lucubration (or equivalents) combined with e.g. Sanctum Spell and Twin to restore itself and another spell. Of course, you didn't really ask for infinites but they're there and quite easy to come by. Wyrm Wizard and such...

[A_S]

How many total copies of Celerity?

22 Celerities, and 30 GAF's. Of course, if these count toward the total, there's no point in doing the additional optimization for maximum Dancing Lights; the total number of spells is just going to be 2 x ([spells/day] - 1), since everything is twinned and Arcane Spellsurge is the only thing you need to cast ahead of time.

[Rubik]

Lucubration is a 6th level spell, no dice.But he said lubrication. AKA, Grease.

That's a 1st level spell. :smallwink:

[Curmudgeon]

Assumptions - level 20. All 3.5 books are available.

Dragonlance's Heroic Surge feat (Age of Mortals book) lets you take an additional standard or move action in addition to your normal actions.
That's a Dragonlance book, not a D&D 3.5 book. The only overlap between those two systems is Dragonlance Campaign Setting, a Wizards of the Coast publication.