Talk me out of Sacred Fist

[Tomokun]

So here's the rules for character creation:

anything from the 3.5 books is OK for classes, feats, spells and items.

Starting gold will be 17,000. Send me a full list and gold cost for approval.No single item is to be more than 3,000gp without approval.

http://www.pathguy.com/cg35lite.htm --------use to create an easy quick char.
http://www.d20srd.org/index.htm ----------use for charachter refeernece and spells.

My stats are:

Strength 14 (+2)
Dexterity 14 (+2)
Constitution 12 (+1)
Intelligence 12 (+1)
Wisdom 16 (+3) = 14 originally but put my 4th and 8th ability points here
Charisma 08 (-1)

I was thinking monk 1/ cleric 5/ Sacred Fist 2, but as I'm putting it together I'm not exactly excited about losing a level of casting for the added BAB.

I do NOT want to go summoner as I already have a great one that I'm partial to, but any other suggestions for a party healer that might be fun I'm definitely interested in. Sacred Fist seems sort of "meh" to me as it is.

I was thinking the Air and Time or Air and Destruction Domains.

[Coidzor]

Can you switch one of those 14s into your constitution?

Have you read the player's guide to healing (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=2710.0)?

Also, are you deadset on a Cleric base or are you open to Druid?

How about Unearthed Arcana variants like Prestige Paladin?

[Venger]

sacred fist doesn't lose caster levels. when the text and table disagree, the text takes precedence. it is a full casting class.

[ddude987]

I would do Factotum 3/ Monk 2/ Ur-priest 2/ Sacred Fist 10/3 XxXxX

[Tomokun]

Can you switch one of those 14s into your constitution?

Have you read the player's guide to healing (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=2710.0)?

Also, are you deadset on a Cleric base or are you open to Druid?

How about Unearthed Arcana variants like Prestige Paladin?

Interesting read...

I'm open to anything. Even considered Warlock with access to the healing domain and the healing reserve feat. :)

[Big Fau]

How about this then?


A member of a sacred fist order refuses to use any weapon. A sacred fist who knowingly carries or uses a weapon loses all class spells and features and advances no farther as a sacred fist until he atones for his action.

RAI: You can't use manufactured weapons, possibly even spells that require attack rolls.
RAW: You can't use any weapons, including Unarmed Strikes.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Wood Elf (Str +2, Dex +2, Con -2, Int -2)
Str 16
Dex 14
Con 12
Int 10
Wis 16
Cha 8

Cloistered Cleric (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#clericVariantCloistere dCleric) 5/ Ruathar 1/ Paragnostic Apostle 1/ Seeker of the Misty Isle 1
Future levels should include one to three more Paragnostic Apostle, zero to two more Ruathar, and ten Contemplative. An alternative would be to replace Contemplative with Divine Oracle, take 2,000 gp from your starting money to get its feat prerequisite via the Frog God's Fane in Complete Scoundrel without having to spend a feat on it.

Your 3rd level feat should be Ancestral Relic, it can be worth up to 13,500 gp, so it's a Monk's Belt. Also note that the Ancestral Relic has no limit to the value it can store, just the magical properties are limited. This can be handled one of two ways:
1. Leading up to your current level, any junk loot that the party would have sold for half value, you've bought from the party pool for that price. Note that the cash for that loot went into the same party pool and you get a portion of it back. You then sacrificed the full value of all that junk loot into your ancestral relic to upgrade it. For example, 1,000 gp worth of loot would be sold for 500 gp, so you paid that for it. In a party of four, you would get back 125 gp of that, so you only pay 3/8 of its value. It only costs you 4,875 gp for your Monk's Belt. This is how you should upgrade it in the future.

2. Spend a few skill points in Craft: timber harvesting, Craft: lumber, and Craft: Furniture. You used Guidance of the Avatar (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/article.asp?x=dnd/sb/sb20010504a) to succeed at any checks you had to make. Invest in 500 gp worth of logging rights, get 1,500 gp worth of raw timber, turn it into 4,500 gp worth of lumber, turn that into 13,500 gp worth of furniture. Sacrifice that 13,500 gp worth of furniture into your ancestral relic, it only cost you a 500 gp investment and a lot of time (and you're an Elf) to get your Monk's Belt. Use this same trick during downtime as well. You could actually make an initial investment of 3,000 gp and have 81,000 gp worth of value stored in it, and not have to worry about investing anything more into it until 15th level.

Note that additional properties can be added to an existing item per MIC p234 and DMG p282. When adding a property that's not listed in the waist slot of MIC p234, you would pay full price for the most expensive item's properties and 50% more than normal for each additional property, per DMG p282.

I'd trade your free Knowledge domain for Knowledge Devotion in Complete Champion, and put at least one rank in each of the relevant Knowledge skills (Arcana, Dungeoneering, Local, Nature, Religion, Planes) to always get at least a +1 attack and damage from it. For your other two domains I'd probably pick Time and Magic, and start with two Wands of Wraithstrike with 33 charges remaining on each.

From Paragnostic Apostle you'll want Mind Over Matter and Spatial Awareness, in whichever order you choose. Get a Lesser Metamagic Rod of Extend, and get an exception to that 3k limit for a Rod of Bodily Restoration (MIC, 3,100 gp). You'll have the Travel domain via Seeker of the Misty Isle, so put (Extended) Longstrider on yourself, which gives +20 ft. with Spatial Awareness. Also use (Extended) Luminous Armor (BoED), which gives an extra +2 AC with Mind Over Matter, and put (Extended) Magic Vestment on your Luminous Armor. The Rod of Bodily Restoration is to fix the Str damage sacrifice that occurs when Luminous Armor ends, and it'll have two more charges each day for party healing. Be sure to get four cross-class Survival ranks via Cleric, and spend all four Ruathar skill points on it to qualify for Seeker of the Misty Isle. See if an arcane caster in the party is willing to put (Extended) Greater Mighty Wallop and Greater Magic Weapon on your unarmed strike every day if you buy him a Lesser Rod of Extend.

[Venger]

I would do Factotum 3/ Monk 2/ Ur-priest 2/ Sacred Fist 10/3 XxXxX

stagger your levels, going factotum 1/monk2/factotum 3/up2/sf10/xx3

since you require 8 ranks in spellcraft (a cc skill for monks) for ur-priest, a factotum level at 5 means you can afford the ranks in it at-cost.

[ddude987]

stagger your levels, going factotum 1/monk2/factotum 3/up2/sf10/xx3

since you require 8 ranks in spellcraft (a cc skill for monks) for ur-priest, a factotum level at 5 means you can afford the ranks in it at-cost.

Thanks.

Also, sacred fist has full casting. Text supersedes table. All in all, Sacred Fist is a great gish class.

edit: That's been said already. not ninja'd... just bad at reading.

[Gavinfoxx]

I prefer Monk/Mystic/Sacred Fist...

[Hikarizu]

I am gonna leave this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MfkHkdu5IEI) here. Seemed relevant. Yes, that is a bit too much fake blood.

[Tomokun]

I prefer Monk/Mystic/Sacred Fist...

Hmmm... what about a duskblade?

[Gavinfoxx]

Duskblade is fine, but do you know where Mystic is? It's in Dragonlance Campaign Setting, and works fine for a Monk2/Mystic 4/Sacred Fist 10.

[Tomokun]

Duskblade is fine, but do you know where Mystic is? It's in Dragonlance Campaign Setting, and works fine for a Monk2/Mystic 4/Sacred Fist 10.


Okie dokie... so I was playing around with some of the stuff you guys showed me, and then I put together this - tell me what you think ;)

I actually think this guy might be even better at healing, and he'd have more low level spells because of the feat and domain choices.


<tt>In reply to Narrator (msg # 2):

Ok, here's what I've got as an initial go.

Spend 8K on chausable of fell power
2000 on Dimension Stride Boots
4K Cloak of Charisma +2
1350 Mithril breastplate
650 Gold left over

Cleric 3 / Warlock 1 / Eldritch Disciple 4
Chaotic Neutral

Strength 08 (-1)
Dexterity 14 (+2)
Constitution 12 (+1)
Intelligence 12 (+1)
Wisdom 16 (+3)
Charisma 14 (+2)
Size: Medium
Height: 5' 10"
Weight: 175 lb
Skin: Tan
Eyes: Gray
Hair: Bald, Black stubbley and a goatee


Domains: Force and Spell

XP:
XP Needed:

Total Hit Points:

Speed: 30 feet

Armor Class: 12 = 10 +2[dexterity]

Touch AC: 12
Flat-footed: 10
Initiative modifier: +2 = +2 [dexterity]
Fortitude save: +12 = 10 [base] +1 [constitution]
Reflex save: +9 = 7 [base] +2 [dexterity]
Will save: +10 = 7 [base] +3 [wisdom]
Attack (handheld): +4 = 5 [base] -1 [strength]
Attack (unarmed): +4 = 5 [base] -1 [strength]
Attack (missile): +7 = 5 [base] +2 [dexterity]
EB 2d6 +1d6 from Chausable

Grapple check: +8 = 6 [base] -1 [strength]

Languages: Common, Elven

Feats:
Level
1 Extra Turning
- Domain Spontaneity

3 Retrieve Spell

6 Extra Invocation - Baleful Utterance

Cleric:
Turning Attempts:9 = 3+Cha Mod (2) +4 (Extra Turning)
Spontaneous Healing Spells

Warlock:
1d6 EB
Least Invocation - See the Unseen

Eldritch Disciple:
Gift of the divine Patron - Healing Blast
Eldritch Blast - 1d6
Gift of the divine Patron - Damage Reduction (1/2 ED class level)
Least Invocation - Eldritch Spear
Traits:

16
4

Skill Name Ability Ranks Misc.
Modifier Modifier

Appraise Int 1 = +1
Balance Dex* 2 = +2
Bluff Cha 1 = +1
Climb Str* -1 = -1
ConcentrationCon 14= +1 +11 +2
Craft_1 Int 1 = +1
Diplomacy Cha 2 = +2
Disguise Cha 2 = +2
Escape Artist
Dex* 2 = +2
Forgery Int 1 = +1
Gather
Information Cha 2 = +2
Heal Wis 3 = +3
Hide Dex* 2 = +2
Intimidate Cha 2 = +2
Jump Str* -1 = -1
Knowledge
(arcana) Int 9 = +1 +8
Knowledge
(history) Int 3 = +3
Knowledge
(religion) Int 12 = +1 +11
Knowledge
(planes) Int 6 = +1 +5
Listen Wis 3 = +3
Move Silently
Dex* 2 = +2
Perform_1 Cha 2 = +2
Ride Dex 2 = +2
Search Int 3 = +1
Sense Motive Wis 2 = +2
Spellcraft Int 14 = +1 +9 +4
Spot Wis 2 = +3
Survival Wis 2 = +3
Swim Str** -1 = -1
Use Rope Dex 2 = +2
* = check penalty for wearing armor

Know Planes >=5 ranks gives +2 on survival checks on other planes.

Human:

Extra feat at first level (already included)
Four extra skill points at first level (already included)
One extra skill point at each additional level (already included)

Bonus Feats (already included)

High intelligence gains bonus spells daily


Cleric Spells
0 - 5
1 - 3(1)+1
2 - 2(1)+1
3 - 1(1)+1



Equipment:

0 lb
2 lb
5 lb
3 lb
1 lb





10 lb
4 lb
2 lb
3 lb
_____
30 lb Weapons / Armor / Shield (from above)
Backpack
Bedroll
Blanket, winter x1
Case (for map or scroll)
Chalk
Ink vial
Ink pen
Paper sheets x10
Parchment sheets x10
Rope (50', hempen) x1
Waterskins x1

</tt>

[nedz]

OK, well that's a different kettle of fish.

Your basic choices are
Cleric 3/Warlock 2/Eldritch Disciple 10 -3 Cleric levels, -3 Invocations
Cleric 4/Warlock 1/Eldritch Disciple 10 -2 Cleric levels, -4 Invocations

The first option allows you to take Extra Invocation at 9th level rather than 12th level. Quicken SLA is available at 15th level — either way.

Practiced Spellcaster is an obvious feat choice.

Ed: rather than spend a feat on Domain Spontaneity you could look at playing a spontaneous cleric (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/spontaneousDivineCasters.htm) — YMMV.

[ericgrau]

I kind of like enlightened fist. Same thing but arcane: arcane touch spells are nice on punches, the buffs mesh well and there's armorless synergy. But do what you want.