Nasty 3.5 monsters

[Balor01]

Can you guys point me toward monsters (up to CR 10) that:

- do not rely on dealing a ton of damage
- do not rely on huge AC
- do not rely on a ton of hp

... but are still nasty.

MM2 included.


thanks

[hymer]

A tenth level human beguiler?

[Gerrtt]

Aboleth, played appropriately, is quite nasty.

[Morbis Meh]

Can you guys point me toward monsters (up to CR 10) that:

- do not rely on dealing a ton of damage
- do not rely on huge AC
- do not rely on a ton of hp

... but are still nasty.

MM2 included.


thanks

Adamantine Horror MM2 *ducks and covers before eventual flood of books comes his way*

[GutterFace]

Human Ghost :)

throw some ghost feats on them to scare people and cause trouble.


i always had fun by throwing anything that Burrows, spits acid or sunders or fears.

[Tar Palantir]

My party has a mortal fear of Drowned, and I'm no longer allowed to use them. They do have a bunch of HP and it certainly helps, but that's not why they're dangerous. The ever-escalating Con checks to avoid being taken out of the fight and subsequently die are what make it dangerous :smallbiggrin:.

[Ardantis]

You're not going to believe me, but... Chokers.

Either template them all up to boost their stats or use them en masse, but these stealthy aberrations have two advantages-

1) They use Improved Grab to start a grapple and constrict that prohibits all spellcasting with verbal components

2) They get an extra standard or move action every round.

In fact, the low Int is the only thing keeping them from being awesome (if disgusting) PCs.

[limejuicepowder]

Rust Monsters, if you want your players to hate you. They are especially evil if they form the first wave of a two part attack, and the second wave is something with power attack.

A slightly more serious answer would be pixies. I've never actually fought them, but they have lots of abilities that would be make them extremely annoying - they also have the intelligence to make good use of those abilities.

[Deox]

My party has a mortal fear of Drowned, and I'm no longer allowed to use them. They do have a bunch of HP and it certainly helps, but that's not why they're dangerous. The ever-escalating Con checks to avoid being taken out of the fight and subsequently die are what make it dangerous :smallbiggrin:.

I used these in the first session (currently now an epic game) and the party was none too pleased as half of them began dropping like flies almost instantly.

Another, really fun one is the Boneclaw. Amazing stats and reach, not to mention unholy toughness.

[Callin]

Black Puddings always make us groan at the table.

[Autopsibiofeeder]

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20060823145009/forgottenrealms/images/3/34/Mind_flayer.jpg

[Tvtyrant]

Beholders are my entry. They have 3 SoL rays and a lot of SoS. It's like fighting a laser light show.

[Zaq]

My players have ALMOST forgiven me for the time I sent them against a Cranium Rat Swarm. Five years ago. After nerfing it to allow melee folks to touch it.

[Deox]

If you truly hate people, there is also the Ephemeral Swarm in MM3.

[mregecko]

Balhannoth.

Any creature that can see in the dark, grapple you from 15' away, while on the ceiling, has a permanent dimensional lock, AND if you're grappled you are put into an Antimagic Field....

Oh, and it has DR 15/magic. So if you try to attack it while grappled... Have fun overcoming that DR with a light weapon.

Yeah. I've had 3 of these decimate a party before.

[Gerrtt]

That DR 15/Magic can be overcome with a simple +1 light weapon...if I'm not mistaken.

Other than that, the last one sounds nasty.

[Callin]

Yea but not in an Anti Magic Field

[Gerrtt]

Gur, missed that.

Quite nasty indeed.

[Autopsibiofeeder]

The magic weapon does not work, but the DR does?

[Callin]

Depends on if its Ex or Su. But the creature in question does not emit an AMF but suppresses all magical abilities and SLA and Spellcasting by whatever he is grappling also all of their magical gear.

[Divide by Zero]

The magic weapon does not work, but the DR does?

Damage reduction isn't magical unless it comes from a magic effect.

[Shining Wrath]

Allip. CR 3 but Wisdom drain combined with a babble attack that requires Will saves. And incorporeal. Causes NO physical damage, but a group can drop the entire party to 0 Wisdom.

Nymph. Save or blind, save or stun, Fort saves.

[Autopsibiofeeder]

Damage reduction isn't magical unless it comes from a magic effect.

As far as I know it is Ex or Su, and when it is Su it does not work in an antimagic field. It doesn't say in the book which type this monster has (at least, I did not find it).

[Boci]

As far as I know it is Ex or Su, and when it is Su it does not work in an antimagic field. It doesn't say in the book which type this monster has (at least, I did not find it).

Doesn't matter though in this case, as the balhannoth doesn't actually evoke an anti-magic field, merely supresses all magical gear of a grappled target and prevents them from casting spells or using SPA.

[mregecko]

As far as I know it is Ex or Su, and when it is Su it does not work in an antimagic field. It doesn't say in the book which type this monster has (at least, I did not find it).

DR/magic is a Su ability that is suppressed in an antimagic field.

However, the Balhannoth itself isn't IN an antimagic field. It imposes an antimagic-field LIKE effect on its opponents:

"When a balhannoth grapples an opponent, all the magical properties of that opponent’s magic items are suppressed. In addition, a creature grappled by a balhannoth cannot cast spells or use spell-like or supernatural abilities. A balhannoth automatically suppresses magic items by holding orwearing them."

So technically, any ongoing spell effects (buffs etc) are still active. But all magic equipment is suppressed, and any spellcasting is impossible. So yeah, the DR/15 magic applies to grappled opponents, who will not have magic weapons.

They're so, so mean.

EDIT: Ninja'd by Boci.

[Autopsibiofeeder]

Ow, that is mean, yeah.

[Essence_of_War]

Incorporeal undead are pretty terrifying at low levels.

Allip and Shadow are both CR 3, and both can be devastating to lower level parties.

[Jesterface]

Mind Flayers make nasty boss monsters. Especially if you're willing to use MM4 and utilise the 'Ogre Guard Thrall', with it's 'Echo Mind Blast' ability.

[Guyver87]

Greater Phantom Template from MM5 can also be quite nasty.

Firstly it gives the creature using it deflection bonus to AC equal to it's Charisma modifier.

Secondly, thanks to the Phantom Defence ability, all the AC from armour, shields, and so on works against both the corporeal, and incorporeal attacks.

Thirdly Incorporeal Jaunt ability, lets our Phantom to become incorporeal, or corporeal again, as a Swift Action.

And lastly Greater Phantom can attack normally, while being incorporeal. It can't use grapple, constrict, swallow whole, or any other special ability to relies on prolonged contact, but it's still nice.

Other flaw is the fact, that such being gets 50% more damage from Ghost Touch, but Your Players would have to know about it, so...

And this template apparently has no LA, which is quite nice for any GM.

I am also quite fond of using Spellwarped Creature from MM3 against the Players.

Not only it has some enhancements to the Attributes, but also quite nice SR, and additional boosts acquired by resisting spells.

http://www.realmshelps.net/monsters/templates/spellwarped.shtml (http://www.realmshelps.net/monsters/templates/spellwarped.shtml)

Fights against such a monster are quite similar to the scenes with Sebastian Shaw from "X-Men: The First Class", which for a geek like me, is a added bonus.

[Phelix-Mu]

I like using some fey with unexpected class levels.

I think it was...All-Consuming Hunger? I really liked that monster for some reason. Seems like it was from the Underdark supplement.

[Killer Angel]

In the MMII, there's the Spell Weaver (which is around CR10)... I know it was made along with the 3.0 haste, but if you keep its abilities in 3.5, it can basically cast a total worth of six spell-levels of spells per round (to a max of 6 first-lev. spell), which can be more effective than a single quicken spell, at that level.

Obviously, the "nasty" part, depends on what spells will be casted...

[rot42]

Demonet Swarm (MM IV 48; CR 2): 60' sonic mind affecting aura of -2 to all d20 rolls (other demonhive creatures are immune); no save.

Focalor (3rd level vestige, Tome of Magic 31): -2 to all d20 rolls to all adjacent creatures; no save. Also available with two feats. The Lost template (Magic of Incarnum 183) can add in a similar Charisma based aura of Shaken.

Larval Flayer (CPsi 133; CR 1): they teleport onto your PC's head to eat the brains with a touch attack and grapple (sadly no Improved Grab). There is a sweet spot around levels five to maybe nine or so where you can throw in a half dozen or so of the little buggers without increasing the encounter level too much but still expect to get a couple points of Intelligence damage. Plus they are just gosh-darned adorable.

Necrosis Carnex (MM IV 104; CR 3): all living creatures within 30' take -2 to attacks and saves; no save.

Vasuthant (MM III 182; CR 2): 3/day force rerolls. I think this ability is supposed to apply only to rolls that very directly apply to the Vasuthant (e.g. its attack roll or a PC's turn undead check but not your check to stabilize or your save vs. a Medusa's gaze), but it is written as simply "force its opponent to reroll a favorable die roll".

[Balor01]

Aillip will be the horror that lurks in the tomb. A ton of Aillips.

[Boci]

Dread Blossom Swarm from MM III are pretty viscious. At CR 6 it has Fly speed 60 (good), ie: you are not getting away. Crummy AC, but half damage from weapons slashing and piercing weapons and regen 5 (fire and cold). Decentish saves, except for will (but then its a plant swarm. Good luck exploiting that weakness).

Offense-wise it has not only distraction (DC: 15), but also poison that aparalyses you for 1 round (1 minute as secondary damage), and you if you fail this save, or are otherwise paralysed, in additional to the 3d6 damage, you take 1d6 con damage.

[Deox]

Dread Blossom Swarm from MM III are pretty viscious. At CR 6 it has Fly speed 60 (good), ie: you are not getting away. Crummy AC, but half damage from weapons slashing and piercing weapons and regen 5 (fire and cold). Decentish saves, except for will (but then its a plant swarm. Good luck exploiting that weakness).

Offense-wise it has not only distraction (DC: 15), but also poison that aparalyses you for 1 round (1 minute as secondary damage), and you if you fail this save, or are otherwise paralysed, in additional to the 3d6 damage, you take 1d6 con damage.

I've actually shifted into this. I should be "given" to people as rewards for things and slowly kill them.

[Kuulvheysoon]

Adamantine Horror MM2 *ducks and covers before eventual flood of books comes his way*

No. Just... no. That's descending into TPK-status.


I like using some fey with unexpected class levels.

I think it was...All-Consuming Hunger? I really liked that monster for some reason. Seems like it was from the Underdark supplement.

All-Coonsuming Hungers are pretty neat.

I also like the... Earth Wraith? It's that dusty undead from MM3 that can crumble metal weapons/armor.

[laeZ1]

A slightly more serious answer would be pixies. I've never actually fought them, but they have lots of abilities that would be make them extremely annoying - they also have the intelligence to make good use of those abilities.

Pixies, for sure. They have greater invisibility as a racial feature (can turn it on and off at will) and have arrows that either A) put you to sleep (fort save) or B) make you LOSE YOUR MEMORY (will save). 1 in 10 pixies also can cast Otto's irresistable dance 1/day as a touch attack (1d4+1 rounds dancing, provoking AoO, and doing nothing else, no save, allows spell resistance). Not to mention a slew of spell-like abilities, including perm. image, detect law, good, chaos, evil, and polymorph.

The only reason I know so much about them offhand is because one of my players just made a warshaper pixie, and I've been helpping him learn everything he can do now.

(Edit: Best thing is, they're in MM1)

[Balor01]

Just an observation. If I was a PC and was intelligently attacked by Pixies while being low lvl, well - I can say this would not end well for DM. Very very OOC. Point being, Pixies are a playful and rather secretive race. To have a "squad of pixie killers" is indeed "going full retard".

It is always possible to have a good plot behind this, but without it, DM can expect a very very tough OOC session.

Thatswhy I like aillips. No mersy in these undead f*ckers.

[Kuulvheysoon]

Just an observation. If I was a PC and was intelligently attacked by Pixies while being low lvl, well - I can say this would not end well for DM. Very very OOC. Point being, Pixies are a playful and rather secretive race. To have a "squad of pixie killers" is indeed "going full retard".

It is always possible to have a good plot behind this, but without it, DM can expect a very very tough OOC session.

Thatswhy I like aillips. No mersy in these undead f*ckers.

Depends where you draw your inspiration for the fae from. For instance, when I DM, fae as a rule are CN (with the occasional CE exception). They're utterly inscrutable to mortals. And where do I get that from?

Most mythology, notably Irish, as well as a healthy dose of Shakespeare.

[rgrekejin]

If your party is non-evil, the Grey Jester from Heroes of Horror. They're not anything special on their own, but they can control living creatures that they've charisma-drained to zero, and the fluff says that Jesters prefer to abduct children. Have the Jester use children as human shields whenever possible. Because it's not a spell per se, it's pretty hard to dispel or otherwise disrupt, and if you have a large enough swarm of bleak-eyed children running around, it can be quite a headache for PCs to deal with them all. Depending on how you interpret the Jester's control, they could have children armed with daggers that would slit their own throat if the PCs take offensive actions.

[laeZ1]

The unbeatable giant crab. They grapple you, then scurry away and drown you before devouring you.

A swarm of monkeys. They nauseate people (by flinging excrament at them), disarm them and chew on their equipment, as well as damage them for being in the swarm.

I've never used a mimic as a DM, nor have I ever encountered one as a player, but one of my players got his rear handed to him by one in a different DM's game. I think they're adhesive...

Depending on the party's makeup, other things could play into effect, making the encounter more dangerous without having to rely on the monster itself being powerful. Consider a water-based area, with the only opponent being a sorceror who is particularly adapt at counterspelling. No flying for those people in heavy armor.

[limejuicepowder]

Just an observation. If I was a PC and was intelligently attacked by Pixies while being low lvl, well - I can say this would not end well for DM. Very very OOC. Point being, Pixies are a playful and rather secretive race. To have a "squad of pixie killers" is indeed "going full retard".

It is always possible to have a good plot behind this, but without it, DM can expect a very very tough OOC session.

Thatswhy I like aillips. No mersy in these undead f*ckers.

That's kind of why I used "annoying" rather then "deadly." For starters, a classless pixie is low CR; it doesn't take much to be deadly to low level characters (usually, all it takes is a little bit of luck).

However, every single one of a pixie's abilities should have a "let's test your patience" subtext. Even with 4 hit points, I can easily imagine one faking the entire party out of their shorts and flying away laughing. That kind of BFC can be used to cause serious harm, if the pixie is feeling wrathful.

[Pesimismrocks]

I've never used a mimic as a DM, nor have I ever encountered one as a player, but one of my players got his rear handed to him by one in a different DM's game. I think they're adhesive...

Yeah they're adhesiveand it does wonders against the party. It strikes them where they're weakest, their greed. Somehow no matter how many poison traps I've seen used, no matter the damage a mimic does, my party and me always fall for the fake treasure chest.

Best use ive ever seen is in a room with 3 treasure chests and lots of furniture. Rogue, Fighter and Monk neutralised spellcasters ripe for the picking from animated objects.

Perhaps not the worst monster in straight out power, but nasty when used by a sneaky DM

[Thebar99]

I've never used a mimic as a DM, nor have I ever encountered one as a player, but one of my players got his rear handed to him by one in a different DM's game. I think they're adhesive...

Step 1: Advance mimic by HD.
Step 2: Dungeonbred template to reduce size to normal (unless in a giant's lair or something).
Step 3: Wait.
Step 4: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oE8qhT-MDC8
Step 5: ???
Step 6: Profit!

Best part is it only fools stupid players (the smart ones know enemies don't leave treasure in a box, they use it themselves).

[Zaq]

Yeah they're adhesiveand it does wonders against the party. It strikes them where they're weakest, their greed. Somehow no matter how many poison traps I've seen used, no matter the damage a mimic does, my party and me always fall for the fake treasure chest.

Best use ive ever seen is in a room with 3 treasure chests and lots of furniture. Rogue, Fighter and Monk neutralised spellcasters ripe for the picking from animated objects.

Perhaps not the worst monster in straight out power, but nasty when used by a sneaky DM

The worst mimics look like doors. Especially if there's some kind of "get out now!" deathtrap . . . you know, the room filling with sand, walls closing in on you, deadly neurotoxin seeping in, etc. Takes a very skillful GM to make that a fun encounter instead of a nearly "rocks fall" level TPK, but when it works, it's genius.

[Tvtyrant]

The worst mimics look like doors. Especially if there's some kind of "get out now!" deathtrap . . . you know, the room filling with sand, walls closing in on you, deadly neurotoxin seeping in, etc. Takes a very skillful GM to make that a fun encounter instead of a nearly "rocks fall" level TPK, but when it works, it's genius.

You could use some sort of approaching colossal ooze. The party runs down the hallways as it slithers forwards, jumping pits and running through doors. Suddenly one of the doors grabs the Rogue and begins strangling him/her.

[DarkEternal]

For their CR, Shadows are disgustingly powerful. CR 3 incorporeal undead that take away 1d8 strength with a touch attack and can't be hurt with anything but magical weapons and/or magic attacks(both of which can miss unless it's force damage). At that level, it's hilariously strong.

Basiliks are pretty strong as well, fail a save on those levels and you are pretty much done for.

[Phelix-Mu]

I also like the... Earth Wraith? It's that dusty undead from MM3 that can crumble metal weapons/armor.

Dust wight? Too lazy to check at the moment.

They actually had a bit of a streak going of monsters that look like type x but are actually type y. Nice pics and concepts in MM3, better than MM4, I thought, which had lots of stuff for specific monster types, but if you weren't look for one of twenty flavors of spawn of Tiamat, not such a great book.

[Friv]

For their CR, Shadows are disgustingly strong. CR 3 incorporeal undead that take away 1d8 strength with a touch attack and can't be hurt with anything but magical weapons and/or magic attacks(both of which can miss unless it's force damage). At that level, it's disgustingly strong.


Yeah, the first time that I ran a group against a shadow it was nearly a total disaster.

A party of four level 3s - traditional fighter / wizard / rogue / cleric build, but I wasn't totally thinking; the wizard was an Enchantment specialist with no applicable second-level spells and not many applicable first-level spells (one magic missile was the extent of his ability to affect incorporeal undead), and the rogue didn't have a magic weapon. I didn't expect it to be a long fight - it was an intro to the dungeon - so I wasn't super-worried; I expected a single Turn to deal with the problem, or alternately for the fighter to kill it in two hits (he had a magic longsword, and tended to charge and power attack, so he usually dealt around 1d8+7 damage).

I was wrong.

Fight started - shadow won initiative. Shadow hit the fighter and dealt 6 Str damage, dropping him to Str 10.

Fighter missed. Cleric tried to turn undead, and failed. Rogue looked for a way to help, and couldn't think of anything. Wizard launched a magic missile for 4 damage. Shadow had 15 HP left.

The shadow went again, and hit the fighter again, dropping him to Str 6. The cleric botched another turn attempt, leaving him with only one.

At this point, the wizard grabbed the fighter's longsword and set about the shadow, scoring a critical hit and killing it instantly. It was hilarious.

[ZamielVanWeber]

The Pyroclastic Dragon from Draconomicon has a breath weapon that is save or die, but not explicitly a death effect, so it can be harder to work around. The save DC also gets decently high on its own.

[ShriekingDrake]

For their CR, Leech Swarms from Stormwrack are NASTY.

[Humble Master]

As a Dm I find Drowned, Cranium Rats and Mind Flayers to all be suitably nasty monster to throw at the party. I will give kudos to the Spectral Lurker for killing people in the most obscure manner. It grasps them, turns them incorporeal, drags them into a wall and then turn the corporeal.

Allips and Shadows are very powerful and can easily drain a party to 0 in no time.

If played with actual superhuman intelligence Dragons are by far the most nasty creature ever.