losing limbs

[kaaskeizer]

ive been casting spells, throwing houses at people, assassinating them or simply smashed em into pieces. ive been jabbed, stabbed, cut open, tortured, rusted to the ground, and been dissolved in a random ooze.. however, i never lost an arm or a leg in combat, neither have i seen anyone do so...

i was wondering if any of you guys know any good rules for cutting, biting or simply ripping off ones limbs whilst in combat (just taking an arrow to the knee wont suffice in most cases) i dont mind if they're home-brew rules, as long as they are logical and dont take too much time in applying them

if u dont know of any, but have a good idea on how this could, would or should work, i would be more then happy to see your idea on how to do a thing like this..

lets discuss; dismemberment


-Kaaskeizer

[Crake]

I know there's a feat for creatures with regeneration that allows them to rip their arms off and throw them as ranged claw attacks?

[Khedrac]

In general, rules for damage to specific body parts don't work well in D&D, particularly 3.5 and similar. This can be generalised to all level and hit-point-based systems, but some cope better than others.

Right the way back to 1st Ed AD&D's Wilderness Survival Guide the bleeding rules introduced were disproportionately vicious to low-level characters to make them mean anything to high level characters.
More relevant, the spell True Strike tends to make "called shot" rules for attacking any body part a mistake - it just makes wizards more powerful for minimal expenditure.

Rolemaster managed to have the incapacitation of specific body parts with it's critical system having detailed descriptions are effects like "if not wearing head armor then ...". However Rolemaster was generally criticized for have a too-complex combat system (for me that depended on the GM, some were excellent).

Th other problem with such effects in D&D is how to heal from them. Aside from the spell Regenerate which appears to exist specifically for such occasions, there are no rules for the healing of broken bones, torn ligaments, missing limbs etc. In theory a Heal spell cannot mend a broken bone which makes life much much harder if the combat rules generate such results.
The exception is, of course, for creatures with Regeneration.

So yes, you can homebrew such rules, but you need to homebrew the healing of them at the same time. Now other posters may be able to point you at such things (or try the homebrew forums) but in general you are better off with a different system to D&D for such effects.

Also, you might want to note that (WSG not withstanding) somewhere very early D&D had hit-points explained as not actual damage to the character, but he wearing down of their ability to avoid damage, possibly with minor cuts and scrapes (as in most action hero films where the hero can fight to full efficiency despite taking a lot of "hits" from previous opponents). If you take this interpretation you cannot rip body parts off before they hit single figure hit points - you are lucky to even draw blood while pounding them into the ground in a grapple until that point!

[limejuicepowder]

I know there's a feat for creatures with regeneration that allows them to rip their arms off and throw them as ranged claw attacks?

Dafuq? I don't think even Wolverine did something this stupid....though I suppose his enhanced skeleton would prevent him from doing it.

To the OP: I don't know of any such rules, though I'm sure they exist. How good is your google-fu? However, I STRONGLY advise against using those rules. Even with a small chance of limb-loss, parties would be basically required to have a caster that can cast regenerate. Combat would become a roulette of insta-gimp or death (no pun intended) that would favor the NPC's and monsters immensely. Unless your players are totally on-board with a more tedious and deadly game, don't do it.

[Duke of Urrel]

I have toyed with the idea of making maiming (such as blinding) and dismemberment happen occasionally, if only to make the Regeneration spell more useful.

There is mention in the RAW of traps that specifically work to cut off a rogue's fingers ... somewhere. I'm busy now, so I'll just leave it at that.

And I have one piece of advice. I agree with those who say that allowing attacks generally to target specific body parts would throw a monkey wrench into the Hit-Point system, and that it would make maiming and dismemberment too frequent and a burden for lower-level characters. I would have these injuries happen rarely and at random, perhaps when a character is reduced to negative Hit-Points by an attack and fails a Reflex save.

[Callin]

I usually just DM Fiat if it fits the story and or the player has done something completely STUPID. I dont use it often... maybe twice in 12 years.

[Slipperychicken]

In 3.5, dismemberment is incredibly brutal to inflict on someone, and not something covered much in the rules. Limb-replacement is an extremely difficult and costly process. It's fun to do it to enemies, but when two bad rolls means your graceful battle-dancer is confined to a wheelchair... not so fun for most people. It increases lethality and brutality, which is really a matter of taste.

You could, I suppose, look for inspiration in games like Warhammer Fantasy RPG, and basically crib the tables which determine which body part you hit, and what spectacular gore results from a critical hit. Many of the results involve mangling or destroying body parts, including heads. WFRPG is a very brutal and deadly game.

[CaladanMoonblad]

I would agree with Khedrac above; the old Rolemaster/MERPS critical tables are your best bet for a detailed section of rules. Since Rolemaster/MERPS used Percentile for everything, this is a simple add on.

For every confirmed Critical Hit, roll on the RM/MERPS tables.

For healing such injuries, the Spell Lists for Animists (Clerics) include 4 distinct paths of healing, including Blood Ways (Circulatory System), Bone/Muscle Ways, Organ Ways, and Purification. Each of the spells could easily be ported over to 3.5 D&D 9 level spell system, since Rolemaster used a 10 level spell system (just bunch 4 and 5 into 3.5's 4th level). Even the 4 types of weapon damage are similar- Bludgeoning, Slashing, Puncture (and they add Unbalancing/Grappling).

My favorite crit from RM/MERPS? Under Puncture... "Shot through heart (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KrZHPOeOxQQ). Reels 10 ft to a spot suitable for dying. Weapon stuck in spinning victim for at least 3 rounds." Great for arrows, terrible for spear wielders.

Under the Slashing crits, there is dismemberment crits, from the loss of a leg (and bleeding out), the loss of an arm (and bleeding out), and the loss of a hand (bleeding out not as bad as arm or leg).

I liked how RM/MERPS did bleed damage. A single critical with a high bleed damage just kept going and going... you could die in 10 rounds without using a tourniquet. The game still had hit points, but its body damage rules was one step more complex than d20. It would be easy enough to import these as house rules of course.

[rexreg]

through 1st & 2nd ed. AD&D the group i play w/ used crit tables...they might have come from an old Dragon Mag, not sure... i have a 2nd ed. Planescape character who has a list of every major maiming she has suffered (arm cut off, decapitated thrice, left leg removed @ hip, etc.)
we also use/used a spell called Repair Injury (3rd lvl Cleric spell) & allowed it to be a fix for such injuries (if you were still alive)
there are separate crit charts for slashing, piercing, & bludgeoning effects

Critical Hits (Slashing)
01-31 damage X2
32-62 damage X3
63-64 Shield Destroyed: no effect if no Shield
65-66 Helm Destroyed: reroll if no Helm
67 Voice box destroyed; no V spell casting; if collar/gorget is present Crit. is negated & collar destroyed
68-70 Head Shot (Dam. X4): if Helm present it negates the Crit. & is destroyed
71-72 Eye Removed: Helm negates but is destroyed
73 Eye Removed
74 Knee Split: ½ movement
75 Knee Split: no movement
76 Hand Removed: roll for which hand
77 Leg Removed @ Ankle: roll for which leg: no movement w/out aid
78 Leg Removed @ Knee: roll for which leg: no movement w/out aid
79 Leg Removed @ Hip: d6 dam/ rnd; roll for which leg: no movement w/out aid
80-81 Off-Arm Removed @ Wrist: if Shield is Present it is destroyed & negates the Crit.
82-83 Off-Arm Removed @ Elbow: if Shield is Present it is destroyed & negates the Crit.
84-85 Off-Arm Removed @ Shoulder: d6 dam/rnd: if Shield is Present it is destroyed & negates the Crit.
86 Weapon Arm Removed @ Wrist
87 Weapon Arm Removed @ Elbow
88 Weapon Arm Removed @ Shoulder: d6 dam/rnd
89 Abdominal Injuries: ½ Carrying Capacity
90 Chest Injuries: ½ Carrying Capacity
91 Abdominal Injuries: Death in d6 Rounds
92 Chest Injuries: Death in d4 Rounds
93 Abdominal Injuries: Death in 2-12 Days
94 Chest Injuries: Death in d6 Turns
95 Abdominal Injuries: Immediate Death
96 Chest Injuries: Immediate Death
97-98 Throat Cut: Immediate Death: can’t cast V spells
99 Spinal Injury-Incapacitated: d3—for neck/upper back/lower back
100 Decapitation: Immediate Death

[Guizonde]

:elan: i can help!

our resident "that guy" is quickly turning into our resident "bad luck brian", if you grok my spiel. more to the point, he has managed in less than a month and in two separate campaigns to lose both his right hand and his left leg below the knee.

dnd 3.5: his sorceress touched some kind of evil altar, and wound up paralyzed. such was the paralysis that dispell magic didn't work, and we couldn't exactly leave his character (certain death was certain). the monk started sawing off the right hand at the wrist. my cleric wasn't high level enough for regeneration, so the dm ad-libbed a damage resistance for his wrist (like breaking a chest, but with more amputation). i could ask him what the dr was.

warhammer frp: if you need rules to mangle pc's, i think this is the one (besides conan). bad luck brian wound up with a horse falling from a great height on top of him, and since he was sent to -9 hp the dm rolled on the crit table. amputation below the knee. iirc, it's up to the dm to call it precisely, but amputation of limbs is frequent in battles in this system.
since aid was received in 1 round in both cases (he seems to be mangled when medics are around... weird), he survived. so far, he's strapped a wand to his wrist stump in dnd, and his whfrp archer now has a banded club as a peg-leg (note to self: when dungeon delving, bring prosthetics)
i'd say as a general rule, critical damage or high rolls on called shots mean amputation.
regarding broken bones, i do believe heal and cure spells mend them in dnd. you can always use the "mend" spell for constructs (or on one dimensional pc's if you're feeling insulting)

hope this helps! :smallsmile:

[prufock]

Pathfinder has rules for that with a combat maneuver called Sever.

Star Wars Saga Edition has maiming foes (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75862/19435086/Official_Errata_Compilation_Thread) in the errata, as well as the Severing Strike talent.

The previous version of Star Wars RPG had a random hit location on critical hits, by rolling a d6 you could get a leg, an arm, or even the head.

[b300mussolini]

during grapple checks i let my players and monsters who are in control of the grapple attempt to break each others bones as a option, if they pin the creature and have a high enough str score they can even rip off limbs. which the dwarf barbarian promptly used to rip off both arms of a giant i throw at the party.

but when it comes to other versions of limb loss i normally say only on a Nat 20 can you do it, you make a CMB check against the creature and it uses either its dex or con score and you cant target the head or heart without vorple

[dascarletm]

I toyed with the idea that, for players, Vorpal would work differently. Instead of instant head-shot roll randomly for what limb gets hacked off.