Help Me Prove This is a Scam?

[Rosstin]

Hey guys, so I have a person here who's trying to convince me that something called "Instant Payday Network" is some kind of magic moneymaking system.

I can't get any good information by Googling, as it looks to me like the company has done a good job of making what I assume to be fake testimonials.

Is this a scam, and if so, what is the mechanism? It seems to be a type of pyramid scheme, although I can't figure out how it makes money or how it works.

Is it somehow legit or semi-legit? And if so, again, how does it make money, what value is created, etc.

I can understand that there are some legitimate online businesses that allow people to make money by performing menial tasks (like Amazon Mechanical Turk) but this one sounds super fishy.

[Capt Spanner]

Is this the group?

I haven't watched the video yet. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-YjPqLxF0jI

EDIT: Looks like the video is trying to get people to sign up. Looks like they basically harvest your data for marketing companies, at least.

[Melayl]

A safe and wise rule of thumb is: If it seems too good to be true, it almost certainly is...

[Rosstin]

A safe and wise rule of thumb is: If it seems too good to be true, it almost certainly is...

*I* know that. But the world is full of good, honest people who don't...

Here's what some users on GameFAQs helped me dig up, which is good enough evidence for me:

http://www.imreportcard.com/biz-opps/internet-payday

http://www.mywot.com/en/scorecard/instantpaydaynetwork.com?utm_source=addon&utm_content=popup-donuts

[Rosstin]

What really amazes me is the level of Google-foo these scammers use in preventing people from finding good dirt. The web is just full of glowing testimonials on them. Adding the "scam" term to a google search on them brings you to hundreds of pages of fake skeptics who become enlightened and rich after coming to believe in the wonders of the scheme.

As I was sitting in the same bar tonight, a well-dressed woman sat next to me, started making small talk, and then started waxing poetic about an employment seminar. I took a look at the pamphlet she handed me, and sho' nuff it's a $3000 motivational speaking event. What a wacky world we live in, that's the last time I hang out in a bar in downtown Pittsburgh for awhile. That bar was like scamtopia.

[Talanic]

The 'enlightened critic' is a huuuge red flag. The last time I encountered a pattern of them was when my boss (semi-informal job, that one) was looking to get into Zeekler. I told him how hard it was to find unsatisfied customers and what felt wrong, and while he was skeptical of my doubt, he passed on it.

Two weeks later the company got shut down for its massive ponzi/pyramid scheme. That boss holds my opinion in fairly high regard now.

[Telonius]

"Learn how to make hundreds of dollars online! Send us hundreds of dollars and we'll tell you how."

:smalltongue:

[JoshL]

As I was sitting in the same bar tonight, a well-dressed woman sat next to me, started making small talk, and then started waxing poetic about an employment seminar. I took a look at the pamphlet she handed me, and sho' nuff it's a $3000 motivational speaking event. What a wacky world we live in, that's the last time I hang out in a bar in downtown Pittsburgh for awhile. That bar was like scamtopia.

Out of curiosity, what bar? Not that I tend to drink downtown (or spend more time than I have to there). Sounds like it might be a fun place if you are expecting it, to try and turn the tables on them :smallbiggrin:

[Deepbluediver]

A safe and wise rule of thumb is: If it seems too good to be true, it almost certainly is...

I think that there should a class all highschoolers are required to take a course called "LIFE".

One semester will be entitled "Basic Culinary Skills" (aka what eating take out 3 meals a day for 10 years will do to you), another is "Budgeting" (aka credit cards are basically legalized loan-sharking), and the quoted phrase will be the alternative title of the section decicated to "Investing".

Now I just need material for one more semester and I'm good to go.

[Emmerask]

Well from my search its basically an upgrade to the "empower network" which itself is a basic pyramid scam.
Well they sell you very basic blog/twitter and other tutorials (which you can get for free and better everywhere in the net pretty much) for 25$ to 1000$ a month. Oh an motivational speeches :smallsigh:

Also from what I read they make people sign a "do not make any derogatory statements, either oral or written" as part of the contract. The clause of course is not worth the ink (or bits) its written with in most of the world, but not all people know that I guess.

[Z3ro]

another is "Budgeting" (aka credit cards are basically legalized loan-sharking), and that phrase will be the alternative title of the section in "Investing".

That's an...interesting...view of credit cards. Are you of the opinion that all lending is unethical?

[Deepbluediver]

That's an...interesting...view of credit cards. Are you of the opinion that all lending is unethical?

First, let me say that I was trying to keep things light and a little humorous, and you shouldn't read to much into my personal opinions based a few flippant statements.

I fully support the system for people to borrow money, and despite what might seem to be indicated by the above, I do in fact have a credit card myself. But too many people seem to go about this stupidly, either from lack of experience or from having a substandard financial education or just compounding on mistakes and bad luck. And once you've dug the hole, climbing out is like running the hundred yard dash with your arms and legs bound, and you need to drag yourself along with you teeth. And the track is covered in broken glass. And they keep moving the finish line. And there is a 400 pound monkey sitting on your back. And rabid chipmunks are chewing on your soft, fleshy bits.

People make bad decisions when taking on loans for houses or businesses or investing as well, but these tend to be much more difficult to aquire (since the lenders vet the applicants more carefully) and there are usually more protections in place in case things go south. The insidious thing about credit cards is that its really easy to get a lot of them and then max them all out. And if you get in trouble just once, you can get hit in the face with an avalanche of fees, seemingly out of nowhere.
But the biggest issue is the interest rates. Credit cards usually have an interest rate, even for their best customers, several times that interest rate of other loans. Addmittedly, the credit card company(s) are taking on a fair amount of risk with their easy lending standards, but that won't stop them from making a claim on your house, your liver, your sanity, and your firstborn child if you can't pay.

Having a credit card, or any loan, really, is like walking through a dungeon full of traps (yes, I'm using THAT analogy, since this IS a gaming forum). A good education provides you with a map, and a REALLY good education paints all the trip wires and pressure plates in neon-orange dayglo paint.
Unfortunately, most people don't have a good education. And quite a few have a BAD education, which is like walking through the dungeon blindfolded, and with some one shouting at you to go faster. And there is a 400 pound monkey sitting on your back. :P

As I said, I have a credit card. I also pay off the full balance every month, so I never incur any additional costs in interest. I keep a credit card for 2 reasons. First, it gives a better discount (rewards program) than the debit card did, which is what I used for a long time prior. And secondly, somewhat ironically, if you've never had a credit card it shows up really badly on your credit report when you eventually want to take out that loan for a house. Yes, the fact that I'd never been in debt a day in my life would work against me if I decided to just use cash all the time and not tempt fate with a credit card.
Stupid, but that's the way the system works.


So I'm not claiming that every person needs to graduate from highschool as the Gordon Gecko of finance. But it will be to their VAST benefit to know where to look for the worst of the traps and pitfalls, and the best way to help themselves get back on track when they inevitably screw up. In other words, to know the system.
Because everyone, eventually, somewhere, will screw up at something.

/endrant

[Jimorian]

Also, the interest rate for credit cards in many cases is literally MORE than what loan sharks used to charge (historically 25%). So yes, legal loan sharking is a very very apt description.

[dehro]

allow me to introduce these guys (http://www.419eater.com/)..
the way they manage to turn the tables on some of the would be scammers out there is sometimes hilarious sometimes true genius.
their archive is an endless supply of laughter

[leafman]

I think that there should a class all highschoolers are required to take a course called "LIFE".

One semester will be entitled "Basic Culinary Skills" (aka what eating take out 3 meals a day for 10 years will do to you), another is "Budgeting" (aka credit cards are basically legalized loan-sharking), and the quoted phrase will be the alternative title of the section decicated to "Investing".

Now I just need material for one more semester and I'm good to go.

The last semester, "Mechanics", everything from properly useing basic tools (hammers, wrenches, etc.) to changing tires and jump starting a car. :smallwink:

[Z3ro]

snip

Sorry if if I came across harsher than I intended. I find that many people do have that exact attitude (without any of the nuance) with regards to credit cards i.e. that they are a tool that can benefit or harm people. I've dealt with too many people who didn't take advantage of things (like credit cards) that would have improved their lives because they didn't have all the information. Your dungeon example is actually very apt.

[Deepbluediver]

Sorry if if I came across harsher than I intended.

Hehe, no worries, I wasn't upset. Sometimes I just forget that its a lot harder for people to pick up on the nuance and tone of something I write out as opposed to anything I speak. That's when those little smilies are handy; guess I just forgot this time.

But no, your real punishment is having to read the walls of text that is my response when I think I'm being misunderstood.

Sometimes I think I have a little elf (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0010.html) in me. Or maybe lawyer (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0282.html). :smallbiggrin:



The last semester, "Mechanics", everything from properly useing basic tools (hammers, wrenches, etc.) to changing tires and jump starting a car. :smallwink:

Yeah, that'll work.

So basically we have:
Food & Health
Money- Short term
Money- Long term
How to keep from ending up as a "Darwin Award"


Just about covers everything, I think. :smalltongue:

[nedz]

This (http://www.snopes.com/) site is very good, though they focus more on Myth busting they do cover scams.

[Karoht]

The google fu is weak.
I google'd the phrase "Instant Payday Network Scam" and got a few youtube videos which explain the scam. I only browsed the first 30 seconds of them, but they lay it out pretty quickly. "Instant Payday Network Scam Exposed" got me fewer worth while hits.

And yes, these guys have indeed paid quite a sum of money to google to have their pro-scam testimonials up at the top. I clicked page 10 of the search results and got lots of pages that were not positive testimonials, though most were snippets on forums such as this post. Still, an investment that large to keep their good testimonials at the top is fishy on it's own.

In the event that you can not find something via google, always try youtube, you would be amazed at what you find.

[Rosstin]

Gosh I should remember the name of the restaurant/bar... it was an old-timey diner sort of place, they had an open-faced beef sandwich, lots of meat on the menu, cute stools... It was near SW Randalls.

I'm sure all the bars downtown are like that at night.