Suppressing Su aura abilities

[Mr. Wongburger]

Essentially, is it possible?

I found a thread that was about a year old asking the same or a similar question but the best answer was that "you should be able to." I checked the DMG and PHB but only found this with regard to the ability itself:



Supernatural Abilities (Su)
Supernatural abilities are magical and go away in an antimagic field but are not subject to spell resistance, counterspells, or to being dispelled by dispel magic. Using a supernatural ability is a standard action unless noted otherwise. Supernatural abilities may have a use limit or be usable at will, just like spell-like abilities. However, supernatural abilities do not provoke attacks of opportunity and never require Concentration checks. Unless otherwise noted, a supernatural ability has an effective caster level equal to the creature’s Hit Dice.


I'm trying to see if a Coure Eladrin as a cohort (Coures have Magic Circle against Evil aura as a supernatural ability) would be able to suppress the effect for any number of reasons. I'd like to find actual D&D documentation citing the ability to do so as opposed to inferring that if it doesn't say I'm unable do something then I should be able to do it (the absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence blah blah blah).

[Carth]

Serpent Kingdoms has the ability rip spell, which might be suitable depending on what you want to do.

[Mr. Wongburger]

I'd rather not completely get rid of the ability if I don't have to; it does have great utility. If at all possible I'd like to be able to suppress it when monsters summoned by our party's Malconvoker (summoner of evil monsters) has a good spell or spell-like-ability he'd like his puppet to confer to the party (specifically something that has a range of touch). It would be annoying to have to move the Coure far enough away to allow the summoned evil monster to transfer a beneficial spell or ability; let alone the fact that the Coure herself couldn't partake.

However, after reading the description for Protection from Evil a little closer:


This spell wards a creature from attacks by evil creatures, from mental control, and from summoned creatures. It creates a magical barrier around the subject at a distance of 1 foot. The barrier moves with the subject and has three major effects.
First, the subject gains a +2 deflection bonus to AC and a +2 resistance bonus on saves. Both these bonuses apply against attacks made or effects created by evil creatures.
Second, the barrier blocks any attempt to possess the warded creature (by a magic jar attack, for example) or to exercise mental control over the creature (including enchantment (charm) effects and enchantment (compulsion) effects that grant the caster ongoing control over the subject, such as dominate person). The protection does not prevent such effects from targeting the protected creature, but it suppresses the effect for the duration of the protection from evil effect. If the protection from evil effect ends before the effect granting mental control does, the would-be controller would then be able to mentally command the controlled creature. Likewise, the barrier keeps out a possessing life force but does not expel one if it is in place before the spell is cast. This second effect works regardless of alignment.
Third, the spell prevents bodily contact by summoned creatures. This causes the natural weapon attacks of such creatures to fail and the creatures to recoil if such attacks require touching the warded creature. Good summoned creatures are immune to this effect. The protection against contact by summoned creatures ends if the warded creature makes an attack against or tries to force the barrier against the blocked creature. Spell resistance can allow a creature to overcome this protection and touch the warded creature.

I guess it would be possible for two things to happen:
a) The Coure could "force the barrier against the blocked creature" thereby negating the "prevents bodily contact by summoned creatures" effect against that particular summoned monster maybe?
b) She could willingly fail her saves vs the summoned monster's spells and abilities since the protection only grants a +2 save bonus and the only prevention offered is vs things that would take control of the character.

Would either of those solutions work?

[Phelix-Mu]

Book of Exalted Deeds was published quite early on in 3.5, and certain language may still have been in the works. The general entry for the Angel category in the Monster Manual has language stating that the ability can be dispelled, but that the angel can turn it on again as a free action on its next turn.

If it can be suppressed by an outside effect, it seems sensible for the creature to be able to suppress it on his or her own. Maybe have suppressing it take a standard action (like the casting of dispel magic) if you want to avoid creatures strobing their auras at will.

Compare with the process for voluntarily suppressing spell resistance.

[Mr. Wongburger]

From MM I:


Protective Aura (Su): Against attacks made or effects created by evil creatures, this ability provides a +4 deflection bonus to AC and a +4 resistance bonus on saving throws to anyone within 20 feet of the angel. Otherwise, it functions as a magic circle against evil effect and a lesser globe of invulnerability, both with a radius of 20 feet (caster level equals angel’s HD). This aura can be dispelled, but the angel can create it again as a free action on its next turn. (The defensive benefits from the circle are not included in an angel’s statistics block.)


From what you're saying, if the "angel can create it again as a free action", it should logically be able to be suppressed as some sort of an action (free seems to be the logical choice). Also, since the circle effect is the same for the Eladrin race, it stands to reason they should have the same type of control over it that the Angel race does.

I guess with wording as shifty and vague as it is, it ultimately boils down to DM discretion.

Thanks for the input everyone, I greatly appreciate it.

[Daftendirekt]

Antimagic Field suppresses (Su) abilities. A bit extreme, but it's there.

[Phelix-Mu]

From MM I:


From what you're saying, if the "angel can create it again as a free action", it should logically be able to be suppressed as some sort of an action (free seems to be the logical choice). Also, since the circle effect is the same for the Eladrin race, it stands to reason they should have the same type of control over it that the Angel race does.

I guess with wording as shifty and vague as it is, it ultimately boils down to DM discretion.

Thanks for the input everyone, I greatly appreciate it.

Well, I was aiming more for a standard action to suppress, for balance reasons. Free action to turn on and free action to turn off sounds like a length of rope by which a DM might hang him or her self (though the effect in question is quite tame, precedent can be a slippery slope with ad hoc rulings).

By some kind of fluff logic, the default is that it is up all of the time. Thus, the effect is there with no effort or action, and re-establishing it is a free action too. So, it's easy to put up. But maybe it takes a smidgeon of effort for the eladrin to put it down.

As I said before, compare with lowering spell resistance. Even at a standard action, this stands to be 100% more useful.

[Mr. Wongburger]

Well, I was aiming more for a standard action to suppress, for balance reasons. Free action to turn on and free action to turn off sounds like a length of rope by which a DM might hang him or her self (though the effect in question is quite tame, precedent can be a slippery slope with ad hoc rulings).

I'm not certain how being able to turn on and off the ability as a free action could be game-breaking. With it off I'm more vulnerable to evil creatures; with it on I'm not. Unless I'm missing some kind of cheese-combo, the only reason to turn it off is to benefit from an evil summoned creature's touch spell (or just any buff spell I guess). It's pretty specific and while it's down other evil creatures can have a normal attempt to attack me.

Maybe "allowing" the effects to take place (i.e. willingly failing my saves and whatnot) is more in-tune with the rules?

[Phelix-Mu]

I'm not certain how being able to turn on and off the ability as a free action could be game-breaking. With it off I'm more vulnerable to evil creatures; with it on I'm not. Unless I'm missing some kind of cheese-combo, the only reason to turn it off is to benefit from an evil summoned creature's touch spell (or just any buff spell I guess). It's pretty specific and while it's down other evil creatures can have a normal attempt to attack me.

Maybe "allowing" the effects to take place (i.e. willingly failing my saves and whatnot) is more in-tune with the rules?

The only balance issue I was referring to is setting a precedent that similar abilities might be argued to work the same way. This one seems pretty tame, but the process of logical induction can be dangerous if one lets the players go around using it at will. As long as the DM is clear on it being just this ability working this way, then there shouldn't be a problem (as far as I can see, though admittedly I am not an expert on this particular spell).

[Fyermind]

This would be particularly problematic on damaging auras or Save-vs-effect auras. By turning them off and back on they would include their targets anew forcing new saves or dealing new damage.

[Kazyan]

Do auras require line of effect? If so, drape a cloak over her, or put her in a Resiliant Sphere in combat situations. The glossary doesn't tell me if LoE is needed, though.

[Mr. Wongburger]

This is all I can garner as far as the Magic Circle spell goes:

Area: 10-ft.-radius emanation from touched creature

All creatures within the area gain the effects of a protection from evil spell, and no nongood summoned creatures can enter the area either. You must overcome a creature’s spell resistance in order to keep it at bay (as in the third function of protection from evil), but the deflection and resistance bonuses and the protection from mental control apply regardless of enemies’ spell resistance.
Nothing about LoE; although cloaking and un-cloaking to negate and re-instate the effect may have the same precedent problems alluded to earlier.

Speaking of, I now see the problem with "Well his Su aura can do that, why can't my Su Fear aura do that?" causing multiple saves and all sorts of hell.

It's really starting to sound like I'll just have to deal with this aura being on constantly, which isn't as bad as I had originally anticipated. I'll just brew up some entertaining RP situations resulting from any minor conflicts it could cause.

[TuggyNE]

This is all I can garner as far as the Magic Circle spell goes:


Nothing about LoE; although cloaking and un-cloaking to negate and re-instate the effect may have the same precedent problems alluded to earlier.

Actually, since it's an emanation (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/spellDescriptions.htm#burstEmanationorSpread), it's blocked by total cover and lack of line of effect:
A burst spell affects whatever it catches in its area, even including creatures that you can’t see. It can’t affect creatures with total cover from its point of origin (in other words, its effects don’t extend around corners). The default shape for a burst effect is a sphere, but some burst spells are specifically described as cone-shaped. A burst’s area defines how far from the point of origin the spell’s effect extends.

An emanation spell functions like a burst spell, except that the effect continues to radiate from the point of origin for the duration of the spell. Most emanations are cones or spheres.

[…]

Line of Effect
A line of effect is a straight, unblocked path that indicates what a spell can affect. A line of effect is canceled by a solid barrier. It’s like line of sight for ranged weapons, except that it’s not blocked by fog, darkness, and other factors that limit normal sight.

You must have a clear line of effect to any target that you cast a spell on or to any space in which you wish to create an effect. You must have a clear line of effect to the point of origin of any spell you cast.

A burst, cone, cylinder, or emanation spell affects only an area, creatures, or objects to which it has line of effect from its origin (a spherical burst’s center point, a cone-shaped burst’s starting point, a cylinder’s circle, or an emanation’s point of origin).

An otherwise solid barrier with a hole of at least 1 square foot through it does not block a spell’s line of effect. Such an opening means that the 5-foot length of wall containing the hole is no longer considered a barrier for purposes of a spell’s line of effect.

[Phelix-Mu]

Actually, since it's an emanation (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/spellDescriptions.htm#burstEmanationorSpread), it's blocked by total cover and lack of line of effect:

Oh, then get the coure one of those animated shields that can be changed into a tower shield (sized for the coure, ofc...a normal one would be humourous, though). Or [enter workaround with number between 1 and 100000].