3.5 balance.

[LeonCross]

As part of my upcoming 3.5 campaign, I've been toying around with letting players customize their core classes a bit. This will be done under the guise of a "prequel" game in which they are attending a school for adventurers, where they will be assigned their adventuring group.

Part of this will be choosing their Classes and classes.

Do you guys see any huge balance issues with allowing them to pick their in class skills? They'd get to pick a number of skills equal to the number of skills their class normally gets.

Trade offs: if I allowed them to trade off some things, such as trading hit die for trained skills, how many in class skills would you say a hit die is worth? How many trained skills is lowering a save a step worth?

[Grod_The_Giant]

Do you guys see any huge balance issues with allowing them to pick their in class skills? They'd get to pick a number of skills equal to the number of skills their class normally gets.
Not really. I mean, worst-case, everyone takes UMD, I guess.


Trade offs: if I allowed them to trade off some things, such as trading hit die for trained skills, how many in class skills would you say a hit die is worth? How many trained skills is lowering a save a step worth?
I'd say one step down (d8->d6) is worth either about 3 extra skill points/level. (2 is not enough, 4 feels like too many)

[dascarletm]

In the DMG there is a section on class customization. If you haven't looked it over I'd check it out.

[LeonCross]

0.o. How in gods name did I overlook that? Guess in all my quests to build optimal characters, I always stuck to researching things that didn't require DM approval (outside of, you know, allowing X character into the game. Lol.)

[Eslin]

Be more lenient the lower tier the class is - the fighter deserves to have 4+int skills that include knowledge: history, sense motive, spot and listen already, while the wizard doesn't need to get any stronger.

[AmberVael]

While you're thinking about customization options, I'd suggest looking into weapon groups. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/buildingCharacters/weaponGroupFeats.htm) It makes more sense than the current system, lets people wield what they want to wield, and really doesn't break anything. It's a small but useful customization tool.

I'm not sure about saves. Dropping a save from Good to Bad has fairly significant impact... I think it might be better to allow people to swap which saves are good and which are bad, not so much trade saves for other things.


I'd say one step down (d8->d6) is worth either about 3 extra skill points/level. (2 is not enough, 4 feels like too many)

I... don't know that I'd agree with that. Three extra maxed skills is really quite a notable thing, with the right skill picks. I can at least say I wouldn't go higher than 3 skill points per level, and I definitely wouldn't give 1. I might lean towards 2. Maybe you could go either way, though I'd say 3 is generous.

[Vizzerdrix]

Why not just use the generic classes from Unearthed Arcana?

[eggynack]

Most of the skills are pretty meh, but there are a few high power ones you'll probably have to pay close attention to. A shorthand, mostly from memory, list goes UMD, diplomacy, iajatsu focus, autohypnosis, spot and listen maybe, spellcraft, and the best skill in the game, forgery. As long as you make sure that the changes are being made largely flavor reasons though, it should be fine. In order to get a better idea of what someone would do with access to every skill, take a look at the factotum handbook (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=2720.0). Realistically the characters would be a lot closer to an expert, so they'd lose some of the skills you'd only want to be trained in. However, it's a good starting point to understanding the balance of skills.

[Greenish]

A shorthand, mostly from memory, list goes UMD, diplomacy, iajatsu focus, autohypnosis, spot and listen maybe, spellcraft, and the best skill in the game, forgery.No Handle Animal? It's the commoner's UMD!

[eggynack]

No Handle Animal? It's the commoner's UMD!
True enough. My list is kinda slapdash and arbitrary. The factotum handbook one is way better, particularly because it gives amount of points, as well as reasons for each one.