How to resurrect a demon lord who died aeons ago? [Archive]

Clovis

2013-04-13, 06:38 AM

Have him talk to Lolth, that should do the trick. Only now he's beholden to Her... Any deity residing in the Abyss should be able to do this. A disembodied mind should have no problem communicating with a deity.

Depending on your cosmology some of the most powerful demon lords might have cosmic ranks (1 cosmic rank equals one divine rank) and may channel the power of the Abyss in a way that's comparable to deities. Then he might be able to cajole another demon lord to build him a new body, though there's the subordination thing again.

But aren't demons supposed to remanifest after their demise? Has he expired within the Abyss or outside?

Wings of Peace

2013-04-13, 06:41 AM

This is one of those things that is pretty much entirely up to the lore of the campaign setting. It can be done mechanically but the real question is "why". When you're the DM you're allowed to invent the reasons that this sort of thing can happen, heck that's how a lot of major plot artifacts/rituals/arbitrary-plot-points come into existence in many campaigns.

Now if you're a character in the campaign and you need a way to resurrect the demon lord there's a plethora of options. You could use a similar technique to the one above and investigate campaign specific options via roleplay, you could bank on a Miracle/Wish spell going according to plan (highly dangerous but not impossible), or you could even find an epic level spellcaster to craft a ritual to bring back the demon lord for an exorbitant price.

I'm sure there are far more practical means of accomplishing the ressurection but it's roughly 4:30am and I don't have the energy to browse my books right now.

Clistenes

2013-04-13, 06:42 AM

A Miracle spell could do the trick.

A True Resurrection spell only works if the creature has been dead less than ten years per caster level, but since the demon lord's mind is still around trying to resurrect, maybe he can bypass the time limit (it would be a houserule). Maybe if you use a Wish to restore its body, combined with True Resurreciton and a the special status of the demon's soul it will do the trick.

Flickerdart

2013-04-13, 09:20 AM

Start sacrificing virgins in his name. Something's bound to happen sooner or later.

Slipperychicken

2013-04-13, 10:25 AM

Is it impossible? His disembodied mind is trying accomplish this, but I don't see any way.

There's no way in the rules. But this is within the bounds of DM fiat Plot Stuff, so following the plot will get you there.

As a start, you could try making some Knowledge checks or visiting a library. They always have a forbidden tome or two lurking in the back shelves. If that doesn't turn up any leads, try sacrificing to the demon or adventuring for a while.

Gazebo's Bane

2013-04-13, 10:38 AM

Start sacrificing virgins in his name. Something's bound to happen sooner or later.

And even if nothing happens, it passes the time.

Slipperychicken

2013-04-13, 11:16 AM

And even if nothing happens, it passes the time.

If you describe it in enough visceral detail (and with enough enthusiasm and bravado), your DM might get disgusted and just have the demon come back so he doesn't have to hear it again.

Either that, or you get to fight some Paladins who'll try to bust your demon-cult.

Rabidmuskrat

2013-04-13, 11:34 AM

If you get lucky you can then sacrifice the paladins. Odds are they are virgins too.

Hell, if you do things right you only need a single virgin to start with. After that, they get home delivered.

Flickerdart

2013-04-13, 11:35 AM

Either that, or you get to fight some Paladins who'll try to bust your demon-cult.
Then you can start sacrificing Paladins.

Gnome Alone

2013-04-13, 12:07 PM

Start sacrificing virgins in his name. Something's bound to happen sooner or later.

Damn. I clicked on this thread specifically to post almost this exact sentence. I see it's been taken care of.

Zero grim

2013-04-13, 12:11 PM

Wish or miracle to restore his body would be the most simple way, this can be achieved with a large enough cult doing a good enough sacrifice.

Though if your a disembodied mind then the solution here is obvious, you posses someone weak of will and then slowly move up the ladder until you can posses someone powerful enough to cast miracle or other such thing, that gives a great timer for the party to track down either the target or the demon and stop him coming to power.

deities can also restore things to life regardless of circumstances, the only thing that can stop a deities resurrection (or whatever the abilities called) is a higher ranked deity.

Dayaz

2013-04-13, 12:17 PM

Odds are they are virgins too.

Hell, if you do things right you only need a single virgin to start with. After that, they get home delivered.

Really? All of my paladins have been fairly promiscuous...

And I love the second part of this comment <3 Home delivered virgins, it's almost a shame to waste them on sacrificing. (What? You're sacrificing them to a bleedin demon lord's MIND! You don't get to judge me!)

Jack_Simth

2013-04-13, 12:23 PM

Is it impossible? His disembodied mind is trying accomplish this, but I don't see any way.
By RAW? Absolutely. Clone (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/clone.htm) plus Eschew Materials (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#eschewMaterials). It can be done by a 15th level Wizard (eschew materials is to get rid of the need of the no-price-listed component of the cubic inch of flesh).

Big Fau

2013-04-13, 12:26 PM

The 3rd module of Barrow of the Forgotten King has Sertrous doing this, so there may be something you can plunder from it.

Gnome Alone

2013-04-13, 12:36 PM

Really? All of my paladins have been fairly promiscuous...

Yeah, no sense in letting that disease immunity go to waste.

SamBurke

2013-04-13, 12:55 PM

Yeah, no sense in letting that disease immunity go to waste.

There are two threads going on at the same time in this one page... It is most amusing.

Flickerdart

2013-04-13, 01:00 PM

By RAW? Absolutely. Clone (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/clone.htm) plus Eschew Materials (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#eschewMaterials). It can be done by a 15th level Wizard (eschew materials is to get rid of the need of the no-price-listed component of the cubic inch of flesh).
"Unlike most other living creatures, an outsider does not have a dual nature—its soul and body form one unit. When an outsider is slain, no soul is set loose. Spells that restore souls to their bodies, such as raise dead, reincarnate, and resurrection, don’t work on an outsider."

Clone doesn't work for outsiders, because they don't have souls.

Gildedragon

2013-04-13, 01:58 PM

Rather they are souls.

Alternatively: wait for strange eons for death to die.

On paladin sacrifice: that's why you got to do things right and set up shop in a region where the dominant religious mores are prudish.
Alternatively: start sacrificing the very promiscuous (100+ partners): organize bacchanalia and go to town.

Jack_Simth

2013-04-13, 02:10 PM

"Unlike most other living creatures, an outsider does not have a dual nature—its soul and body form one unit. When an outsider is slain, no soul is set loose. Spells that restore souls to their bodies, such as raise dead, reincarnate, and resurrection, don’t work on an outsider."

Clone doesn't work for outsiders, because they don't have souls.
Hmm... yes, that does put a damper on that plan. Of course, if you are looking at the type definition anyway, you've got the follow-up clause of "It takes a different magical effect, such as limited wish, wish, miracle, or true resurrection to restore it to life." built right into the type, with no limitations on how long it has been. So a Wizard-13, with Limited Wish, can do it.

Nettlekid

2013-04-13, 03:01 PM

Teleport Through Time (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/pg/20030409b), anyone? Use some powerful divination spell/power like Hypercognition to find a location, probably in an infinite plane like the Abyss or the Astral Plane, that has a flower growing on soil which hasn't been touched since like, the world began. Maybe the Far Realm has something. If you don't know exactly when the Demon Lord died, send your Warforged or Elan buddy back to the beginning of time and have them wait it out. As an added bonus, they'll probably be level 1,000,000 by the time you meet up again. Anyway, go back in time and True Resurrect the Demon Lord within the range of the spell time. Or stop him from dying. Then take him back to your time.

The Viscount

2013-04-14, 03:05 PM

Orcus brought himself back with some undefined process, so there's definitely precedent for it.

Telonius

2013-04-14, 04:26 PM

Orcus brought himself back with some undefined process, so there's definitely precedent for it.

Tenebrous Apostate from Tome of Magic might be a good place to start looking. If you can treat the demon lord as a Vestige, there's a shot that it will somehow come back.

Slipperychicken

2013-04-14, 04:35 PM

The Viscount

2013-04-15, 01:43 AM

Tenebrous Apostate from Tome of Magic might be a good place to start looking. If you can treat the demon lord as a Vestige, there's a shot that it will somehow come back.

Tenebrous the Vestige is really weird, the remains of Orcus quasi-divinity after he came back from death. We can't really return vestiges, as we cannot determine where they are.

Belial_the_Leveler

2013-04-15, 02:11 AM

A cosmic descryer can boost his caster level by 1 for every 5 damage he takes. A cosmic descryer with regeneration and immunity to nonlethal damage can boost his caster level to infinity by RAW. So that true ressurection will work regardless of how far back the demon lord died.

Otherwise, use Epic Spellcasting.

Waspinator

2013-04-15, 02:20 AM

The Book of Vile Darkness might have some ideas. Sacrificing a ton of people to the demon is the usual route this kind of thing takes in fiction.

herculesftw

2013-04-15, 02:29 AM

create your own epic spell, done

Alleran

2013-04-15, 02:44 AM

Really? All of my paladins have been fairly promiscuous...

And I love the second part of this comment <3 Home delivered virgins, it's almost a shame to waste them on sacrificing. (What? You're sacrificing them to a bleedin demon lord's MIND! You don't get to judge me!)
I honestly don't really see the point of sacrificing virgins. If you're sending them to eternal torment to slake a demon lord's unholy pleasures, wouldn't said demon lord be more likely to want a sacrifice that knows what it's doing once it arrives?

So to speak.

Flickerdart

2013-04-15, 08:45 AM

I honestly don't really see the point of sacrificing virgins. If you're sending them to eternal torment to slake a demon lord's unholy pleasures, wouldn't said demon lord be more likely to want a sacrifice that knows what it's doing once it arrives?

So to speak.
I imagine it's simply because fiends enjoy witnessing the destruction of purity, and have a use for souls harvested during this process. Since fiends have way higher charisma than humans, it's likely that the demon lords already have much better harems anyway.

Krobar

2013-04-15, 09:44 AM

If it doesn't specifically HAVE to be resurrection, you can always Wish that whatever killed said demon lord instead failed to kill him.

Silva Stormrage

2013-04-15, 12:50 PM

This... ironically might cause the Demon Lord's "death". You go back in time, pick him up, drag him back to the present, and he effectively doesn't exist for the whole time in between.

Remember to bring some Contingent Greater Restorations to deal with the Int damage from temporal drift.

You could teleport to the year after he died. Then resurrect him with True Resurrection

Jon_Dahl

2013-04-21, 02:45 AM

Hey, I think I have this covered now!

First, you create the dead body using a Wish. I think this is within the limits of the spell... "I want to have the demon lord X's original and complete dead body in front of me right now, in perfect and unharmed condition, in its peak state of physique."

Next, you apply Philosopher's Stone upon it. It works "for any dead body it is sprinkled upon". I guess "any" means any, right?

So you need one 9th-level spell and one minor artifact.

Am I correct?

Rhynn

2013-04-21, 02:52 AM

If you describe it in enough visceral detail (and with enough enthusiasm and bravado), your DM might get disgusted and just have the demon come back so he doesn't have to hear it again.

So that's how magic works in Unexpurgated Carcosa!

"I give, I give - you summon and bind Cthulhu already! Just stop reading the description of the spell!"

PlusSixPelican

2013-04-21, 04:17 AM

Revive Outsider? (Following is from the recently errata'd Spell Compendium, p. 175)

Revive Outsider
Conjuration (Healing)
Level: Cleric 6
Components: V, S, M, DF
Casting Time: 1 minute
Range: Touch
Target: Dead Outsider Touched
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: None; See text
Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless)

Sprinkling the components of its home plane over the body of the outsider, you chant and pass around the corpse three times. With the final words of the spell, the outsider's eyes open, alive once more.

You restore to life a dead outsider, as with the raise dead spell. You restore to life any creature of the outsider type of up to your level in Hit Dice, and the creature can have been dead for any length of time.
Material Components: A bit of soil, water, or other unworked, natural material from the outsider's native plane, and a diamond worth at least 5,000 gp.

So, find the body, get some planar gunk and a diamond. Otherwise use Wish?

ericp65

2013-04-21, 09:13 AM

How and where was said demon lord slain? And, can it truly be said to have been slain, if its mind was separated (doesn't look like death to me)?

If a high-ranking, named fiend is slain on its home plane, it is forever and utterly annihilated, but with time (~50 years), another fiend of comparable power steps in to take the fallen fiend's place. I don't recall the source, but that's how it's described in published materials.