Monster with No STATS!!!

[EugeneVoid]

I remembered an old thread where people were optimizing something no stats in anything.
So a Ghost Brute Shrieker is a good start right?

Current Progress:
Str -
Dex -
Int -
Con -

Wis and Cha should be minimized as much as possible. Bringing this beast out to challenge players is the final Goal of this project.

[Karnith]

Actually, it'd be a Ghost Brute (Libris Mortis, I think) Shrieker, since you can't normally apply the ghost template to a shrieker.

And it'd have Con -, too.

[Phelix-Mu]

It's pretty hard to deal with those last two stats (Wis and Cha) and have something interesting.

Look....

A CHAIR!:smalltongue:

[Karnith]

It's pretty hard to deal with those last two stats (Wis and Cha) and have something interesting.
Yeah, it can't actually be a creature if it doesn't have a wisdom and charisma score, but Wis 2 and Cha 1 are about as close as we can get.

Can we apply a template to get this thing down to Wis 1 and Cha 1?

[EugeneVoid]

Bump :P
Please tell me how to get -wis and -cha. The cr adjustment is no issue.

[Urpriest]

Bump :P
Please tell me how to get -wis and -cha. The cr adjustment is no issue.

You can't. Every creature has at least Wis 1 and Cha 1. A being without Wis can't perceive the outside world, while a being without Cha can't tell the difference between itself and the outside world. Once you have either Wis - or Cha - you're an object, not a creature.

[Phelix-Mu]

Gelatinous shrieker (Gelatinous template, Savage Species, -4 to Wis and Cha) would do the trick, but I can't get it to be undead now. Anyone know how to make an ooze undead?

[Guizonde]

You can't. Every creature has at least Wis 1 and Cha 1. A being without Wis can't perceive the outside world, while a being without Cha can't tell the difference between itself and the outside world. Once you have either Wis - or Cha - you're an object, not a creature.

behold the dread gazebo!!! it kills you to death, then eats you to death too!!:smallbiggrin:

[Averis Vol]

I coulda sworn this thread was going to be about the mistress of pain. Oh well, I'll go back to lurking.

[Gildedragon]

You mean Lady of Pain...
Or do you? :smallamused:

An entity that does not perceive the world or distinguish itself from it...
sounds like a very overdeity concept.
excellent for the high-god of a pantheistic pantheon

[Kazyan]

Maybe a templated-out creature with auras and such could be the dangerous centerpiece in a BFC-tastic encounter, even while ability drained to 0 Wis and Cha. Frightful presence, for one.

[Averis Vol]

You mean Lady of Pain...
Or do you? :smallamused:

An entity that does not perceive the world or distinguish itself from it...
sounds like a very overdeity concept.
excellent for the high-god of a pantheistic pantheon

Yes, yes I did mean the lady of pain, not sure why I said mistress. :smallbiggrin:

Just meant to reference the fact that she had no published stats.

[Gildedragon]

Freudian slip?

As to cha - wis -
getting one gets you the other. From the M.M.: "Anything without a Wisdom score also has no Charisma score"
And urpriest is right, a creature with either of those is an object

[Phelix-Mu]

Bump :P
Please tell me how to get -wis and -cha. The cr adjustment is no issue.


Freudian slip?

As to cha - wis -
getting one gets you the other. From the M.M.: "Anything without a Wisdom score also has no Charisma score"
And urpriest is right, a creature with either of those is an object


You can't. Every creature has at least Wis 1 and Cha 1. A being without Wis can't perceive the outside world, while a being without Cha can't tell the difference between itself and the outside world. Once you have either Wis - or Cha - you're an object, not a creature.

Hmm, actually, the discussion was about templates. We'd already concluded that you can't have a critter with either/both Wis- or Cha-. The OP was saying "-Wis" or "-Cha", as in templates that subtract from Wisdom or Charisma (I think).

Ghost brute shrieker is already pretty rock bottom, as it has a Wisdom of 2 and Charisma of 1. A template that works on a plant and reduces Wisdom by -2 is about the best we can hope for.

[The Viscount]

A ghost brute shrieker actually has a Cha of 9 from the ghost brute template. Gelatinous creature is a good thought, though the change to aberration would require application of the ghost template, which shrieker would need a higher cha score to qualify for.

[Gildedragon]

There is Blightspawned -2 wis, -2 cha, works on plants
it's from UE I think