Question on Monks

[Immabozo]

So I was reading the monk (because my DM likes to throw archers at me that shoot one powerful shot at me, the large half ogre half minotaur, and a two level dip in monk seems like it MAY be viable for deflect arrows) so the thing about attacking with knees and elbows, do I get extra attacks from that, or is it just flavor? I'm wondering, if I got rid of my axe and did this, would I have a fist/fist/elbow/elbow/knee/knee/kick/kick attack? All swinging at my enourmous strength bonus? With all the hate on monk's this cant be right. So is it just flavor? Like arrested and handcuffed, the monk is still just as good with only his legs free for kicking?

[Divide by Zero]

A monk can attack with any part of their body, but you're still limited in how many attacks you can make in a round by your BAB, flurry, etc. So if you get three attacks per round you could do fist/knee/elbow or fist/fist/fist or any other combination you want, but you still only get three attacks.

[The Boz]

It doesn't give you extra attacks, it just means that your primary attacks can, instead of whatever weapon you're holding, be unarmed damage via knees OR elbows OR whatever. Flurry of blows ~doubles your number of attacks, but that is it.
There are better ways of dodging arrows than a 2 level monk dip. What class/race are you, anyway? What system is this?

[Urpriest]

So I was reading the monk (because my DM likes to throw archers at me that shoot one powerful shot at me, the large half ogre half minotaur, and a two level dip in monk seems like it MAY be viable for deflect arrows) so the thing about attacking with knees and elbows, do I get extra attacks from that, or is it just flavor? I'm wondering, if I got rid of my axe and did this, would I have a fist/fist/elbow/elbow/knee/knee/kick/kick attack? All swinging at my enourmous strength bonus? With all the hate on monk's this cant be right. So is it just flavor? Like arrested and handcuffed, the monk is still just as good with only his legs free for kicking?

You don't get extra attacks from your knees and elbows, and even if you did being a Monk wouldn't make you better at doing so than someone else with Improved Unarmed Strike and good unarmed damage. You get extra attacks if you have multiple natural weapons (unarmed strike is just one) or multiple arms (so you can use Multiweapon Fighting, note that probably only one of the "weapons" here can be an unarmed strike depending on interpretation).

Monks don't have any special unarmed fighting powers that other people don't, they just get the relevant feats prerequisite-free.

In terms of Deflect Arrows itself, the prerequisites aren't very high, so depending on your build you may be better off taking it as a normal feat.

[Immabozo]

The thing is, it has a prerequ feat. I just got my level 12 feat and my next feat needs to be improved power attack so I can melt faces.

My character is a dwarf with the half ogre and half minotaur templates (Dragon Mag) Whirling Spirit lion totem Barbarian 5/Bear Warrior 1/Dungeoncrasher fighter 4/War Hulk 2

[Man on Fire]

The thing is, it has a prerequ feat. I just got my level 12 feat and my next feat needs to be improved power attack so I can melt faces.

My character is a dwarf with the half ogre and half minotaur templates (Dragon Mag) Whirling Spirit lion totem Barbarian 5/Bear Warrior 1/Dungeoncrasher fighter 4/War Hulk 2

You cannot take Monk with that, alignment restrictions - Monk must be Lawful.
Too bad, because those two templates for monk are great.
I suggest you better ignore the whole arrow things, caster in your party shoud deal with it. You focus on charging and doing damage. Take more Bear Warrior and Warshaper, maybe Fist of the Forest.

[dascarletm]

A two level dip may not be so bad. See if you can trade out some of the class features for others. What are your ability scores?

MLH 4/16/13
EDIT:

Didn't notice some things.

Just get some anti-arrow buffs/equipment.

[Immabozo]

You cannot take Monk with that, alignment restrictions - Monk must be Lawful.

darn, you are correct.


Too bad, because those two templates for monk are great. I suggest you better ignore the whole arrow things, caster in your party shoud deal with it. You focus on charging and doing damage. Take more Bear Warrior and Warshaper, maybe Fist of the Forest.

2 levels of War Hulk and then I was thinking about War Shaper. Not a bad suggestion.


MLH 4/16/13
EDIT:

Didn't notice some things.

Just get some anti-arrow buffs/equipment.

Whats MLH? But what arrow buffs, equipment do you suggest?

[KillianHawkeye]

Get a Crystal of Arrow Deflection (MIC) to add a bonus to your AC versus ranged attacks. The middle one is +5 AC for 2500 gold. If you have a +3 armor you can get the best one, but I don't remember the specifics on it.

[Immabozo]

Get a Crystal of Arrow Deflection (MIC) to add a bonus to your AC versus ranged attacks. The middle one is +5 AC for 2500 gold. If you have a +3 armor you can get the best one, but I don't remember the specifics on it.

I'll check it out, thanks!

[Urpriest]

I don't think Improved Power Attack is that great for you (and besides, it relies on your DM being ok with material in the Netbook of Feats, but I assume you already cleared that with them). Provided you do most of your fighting in bear form, you've got two claws and a bite. The two claws are at the same attack bonus, the bite at -5 lower, or only -2 lower if you have Multiattack. You'd probably be using the same Power Attack penalty on both of them anyway. I think you're better off taking Improved Unarmed Strike as a feat, since unless you're using a Mouthpick weapon or something you're missing your iteratives. Once you get iteratives then Improved Power Attack might be worth taking, but only then.

[animewatcha]

Do you have like 11k or so to spare? Cause there is an arm graft that gives effectively Deflect arrows, but more than the feat.

[Sajiri]

While I have nothing to contribute that isn't said already, I find the thought of a HALF ogre, HALF minotaur DWARF to be confusing and amusing.

[Curmudgeon]

A Monk attacking with elbows, feet, and head butts is no different than a dagger wielder attacking with left edge, right edge, and point. In both cases these are just different striking surfaces of a single weapon.

[dascarletm]

But what arrow buffs, equipment do you suggest?

Wind Wall, that's all you need. Entropic Shield....

[TuggyNE]

While I have nothing to contribute that isn't said already, I find the thought of a HALF ogre, HALF minotaur DWARF to be confusing and amusing.

"Other half also half."

[Spuddles]

Typically if you have a claw/claw/bite routine, that cannot be used with your BAB/BAB/BAB/BAB routine unless you use a weapon.

A full attack on monk can go BAB/Flurry/BAB/BAB/BAB/claw/claw/bite where the BAB and flurry attacks are made as unarmed strikes. Note that you are accumulating some penalties on those attacks- -2 on everything for flurrying and an additional -5 on the natural weapons as secondary natural attacks.

[Pickford]

Typically if you have a claw/claw/bite routine, that cannot be used with your BAB/BAB/BAB/BAB routine unless you use a weapon.

A full attack on monk can go BAB/Flurry/BAB/BAB/BAB/claw/claw/bite where the BAB and flurry attacks are made as unarmed strikes. Note that you are accumulating some penalties on those attacks- -2 on everything for flurrying and an additional -5 on the natural weapons as secondary natural attacks.

Not if you're above level 5 of course, then it's -1, and above level 9 it's -0.

[Lhurgyof]

If you can use it, a beetle buckler will also catch arrows for you.

[Spuddles]

Not if you're above level 5 of course, then it's -1, and above level 9 it's -0.

Quite true; I just assume no one ever takes more than 2 levels of monk :smallbiggrin:

[tyckspoon]

Get a Crystal of Arrow Deflection (MIC) to add a bonus to your AC versus ranged attacks. The middle one is +5 AC for 2500 gold. If you have a +3 armor you can get the best one, but I don't remember the specifics on it.

It gives you Deflect Arrows as a bonus feat, actually. :smalltongue: Although the Lesser crystal should do for most things if your AC in general isn't completely shot; +5 is a pretty decent buff.

[Immabozo]

I don't think Improved Power Attack is that great for you (and besides, it relies on your DM being ok with material in the Netbook of Feats, but I assume you already cleared that with them). Provided you do most of your fighting in bear form, you've got two claws and a bite. The two claws are at the same attack bonus

Actually, with Bear Warrior, it contradicts itself one paragraph to the next. At first its that a bear warrior turns into a bear when raging, the next paragraph says he CAN turn into a bear when raging, but either way, it still gives the bonuses when raging. I've decided against continuing in the class because I dont want to abuse that fact. I actually genuinely thought that you COULD transform only if you wanted, but got the bonuses anyway. I cleared that up later and decided against continuing to abuse it.

But I did not know Improved Power attack was OGL content. I'll have to check with my DM, but he is very open to third party content, so I have little doubt it will be approved

But so I am using an, I think, gargantuan +3 dwarven war axe (in 2 hands) for 4D8 +19 (21 when raging) damage and swinging at +21/+16 and a gore at +16 for 1D8 +4 (+6 when raging) (+23/+23/+18 and a gore at +18 when raging)


While I have nothing to contribute that isn't said already, I find the thought of a HALF ogre, HALF minotaur DWARF to be confusing and amusing.

I agree ^.^ I loved the dwarf and giant race combo estecially.


It gives you Deflect Arrows as a bonus feat, actually. :smalltongue: Although the Lesser crystal should do for most things if your AC in general isn't completely shot; +5 is a pretty decent buff.

I was thinking about this, I have a 42 AC when raging and he still hits me almost every time with arrows. I am pretty sure he thinks the "Initiate of the Bow" PrC is a lot better than it is. Makes me think he is back to using True Strike like he did before, like it's a free action spell! Even though 47 AC VS arrows is damn good, 44 AC VS arrows and catching one per round is pretty darn good!

[Gildedragon]

Equipment might be the best way to go. But monk is still viable via the chaos monk variant from drag mag