Idea for a funny marshal build, help me build "His Legendariness"

[Demorden]

Hi!

-Disclaimer-


The following may sound like freestyle nonsense, that's because it is.
That's my newest character idea and I didn't develop it that much...


---------------

I am going to start a new mid-level campaign (7-10, not decided yet) soon, and I had a funny idea. A marshal. More specifically, an old human, a retired soldier who is now training his grandson (his cohort, human fighter inspired to Jack B. Quick).

I am not sure how to build it.
I'd like to take at least 4 levels of marshal and maybe more.
Suboptimal? Sure. But I love the concept. I think 8 levels would be a compromise between concept and effectiveness. Consider that my group usually does NOT optimize at all... we usually go for flavor. And anyway the cohort can fight, why should I swing my precious blade more than strictly necessary?!

He should be very good at every social skill.
I'm not looking for diplomancy cheese, to keep it simple I just want to have good success rates with cha-based skills.

He should be grumpy with his cohort, a latin lover with the ladies, and in general a good old charismatic man, an old-school gentlemen that makes everyone feel at ease... except his enemies and those who know him well.

Some examples of possible conversations in spoiler.

After the cohort almost dies:

Jack, you are so stupid, that sometimes I think I should become a druid and have a monkey as a companion. I bet it would obey the simplest orders!

After the cohort overkills some tough enemy:

Great fight, Jack. Apparently, your brain suddenly developed the ability to understand my suggestions. Keep on with the good work, and one day you'll be half as legendary as me.

Caught by a red dragon, things going wrong...


WAIT! You're a LADY red dragon?! That changes everything! Let's discuss our
problems tonight, face to face, I'll take the bards for lounge music and the wine.

Accepting a job from an important person:

Mr King, THEY will happily risk their lives in order to rescue the princess. No, don't thank me. Being a hero is just my duty.

His motto:

There is no charge for awesomeness... or attractiveness.

He often speaks in third person to add some mistery... and attract women.

Legend tells of a legendary warrior whose (refluff needed) kung fu skills were the stuff of legend.
He was so deadly, in fact, that his enemies would go blind from over-exposure to pure awesomeness!



I'd like him to be very annoyingly arrogant, but also very good. He would say things like these just for pride and supposed superiority. When he was young, the world was a better place, and he wants to teach the world the right way to do things. Damn hippy modern adventurers, with their fancy magic items and cheesy templates!
A ludicrous CHA is obviously needed, to survive telling such idiocies.
Also, he would risk his life for friends (and above all for his grandson) if needed, but they would repent that they were saved by "His Legendariness".:smallcool:

That being said... (let me know if it's clear)
As a beginning, I'd like to know what classes would you mix this marshal with.
A couple of fighter levels would be useful. Or maybe knight levels, but IIRC the knight is not fit for dips. Bard levels would be funny, but otherwise useless imho.
And BTW I imagine this character should be lawful. LG or LN.

[Callin]

So you want to play Ramirez?

[Demorden]

So you want to play Ramirez?

I don't know... first of all, I don't know who Ramirez is. :smallbiggrin:

[Zombulian]

Hi!

-Disclaimer-


The following may sound like freestyle nonsense, that's because it is.
That's my newest character idea and I didn't develop it that much...


---------------

I am going to start a new mid-level campaign (7-10, not decided yet) soon, and I had a funny idea. A marshal. More specifically, an old human, a retired soldier who is now training his grandson (his cohort, human fighter inspired to Jack B. Quick).

I am not sure how to build it.
I'd like to take at least 4 levels of marshal and maybe more.
Suboptimal? Sure. But I love the concept. I think 8 levels would be a compromise between concept and effectiveness. Consider that my group usually does NOT optimize at all... we usually go for flavor. And anyway the cohort can fight, why should I swing my precious blade more than strictly necessary?!

He should be very good at every social skill.
I'm not looking for diplomancy cheese, to keep it simple I just want to have good success rates with cha-based skills.

He should be grumpy with his cohort, a latin lover with the ladies, and in general a good old charismatic man, an old-school gentlemen that makes everyone feel at ease... except his enemies and those who know him well.

Some examples of possible conversations in spoiler.

After the cohort almost dies:


After the cohort overkills some tough enemy:


Caught by a red dragon, things going wrong...


Accepting a job from an important person:


His motto:


He often speaks in third person to add some mistery... and attract women.



I'd like him to be very annoyingly arrogant, but also very good. He would say things like these just for pride and supposed superiority. When he was young, the world was a better place, and he wants to teach the world the right way to do things. Damn hippy modern adventurers, with their fancy magic items and cheesy templates!
A ludicrous CHA is obviously needed, to survive telling such idiocies.
Also, he would risk his life for friends (and above all for his grandson) if needed, but they would repent that they were saved by "His Legendariness".:smallcool:

That being said... (let me know if it's clear)
As a beginning, I'd like to know what classes would you mix this marshal with.
A couple of fighter levels would be useful. Or maybe knight levels, but IIRC the knight is not fit for dips. Bard levels would be funny, but otherwise useless imho.
And BTW I imagine this character should be lawful. LG or LN.

This is one perfect situation for me to recommend the Charlatan PrC from Dragon Magazine. Convince everyone that you are a POWERFUL MAAAGE. And later be able to inform those who haven't heard of you, that they have met OL' SCRAPPY, THE GREAT AND POWERFUL.

Also yes while I love the knight class, it doesn't work unless a combo is based off of it.

[Demorden]

This is one perfect situation for me to recommend the Charlatan PrC from Dragon Magazine. Convince everyone that you are a POWERFUL MAAAGE. And later be able to inform those who haven't heard of you, that they have met OL' SCRAPPY, THE GREAT AND POWERFUL.

Also yes while I love the knight class, it doesn't work unless a combo is based off of it.

I just heard the name of the PrC, and I already LOVE it!
Unfortunately, I can't expect the DM to accept Dragon Magazine material.

This is the list of the automatically kosher books:

all core (of course)
all completes (except CM, CSc and CC)
"Races of some stuff" books
Eberron and Faerun stuff
BoVD and BoED
Savage Species
Libris Mortis (hey, it should be "LIBER"...)
-I may miss something, ask if needed-


Then I can propose stuff from other sources, including CM, CSc and CC... but mainly feats and spells, not new mechanics.

EDIT:
Of course, also the Miniatures Handbook is allowed. :smalltongue:

[Callin]

http://billwardwriter.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/Highlander-Connery-Ramirez.gif

I wouldnt take more than 4 levels in Marshall if you are dead set on it. Then I would look into Warblade.

[Demorden]

http://billwardwriter.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/Highlander-Connery-Ramirez.gif

I wouldnt take more than 4 levels in Marshall if you are dead set on it. Then I would look into Warblade.

Ah, great, yes, that's it! Ramirez is a pretty good example!

BTW, unfortunately ToB is banned.
My previous list is quite comprehensive.

Unfortunately, all the best (at least, the latest) 3.5 books were never translated in italian. :smallmad:
And being the only one able to read english well enough to understand new mechanics, new mechanics are banned unless I translate and print the whole books for the party.:smallsigh:

So no incarnum, no ToB, etc. and also, maybe also Dragon Magic, Races of Dragon, Draconomicon will be banned. UA is ok.

If I picked only 4 marshal levels, how would you fill the 6 levels needed to reach 10th? At lvl11 I'd like to take the PrC from Miniatures Handbook that boosts my CHAR and my followers' STR. (don't remember the name, don't have books here)

Once again, I know this is LARGELY suboptimal... If I can keep it at least playable, it's ok. If I can wield a sword decently and I am good at social stuff, my creativity should do the rest.

[Zombulian]

Ah, great, yes, that's it! Ramirez is a pretty good example!

BTW, unfortunately ToB is banned.
My previous list is quite comprehensive.

Unfortunately, all the best (at least, the latest) 3.5 books were never translated in italian. :smallmad:
And being the only one able to read english well enough to understand new mechanics, new mechanics are banned unless I translate and print the whole books for the party.:smallsigh:

So no incarnum, no ToB, etc. and also, maybe also Dragon Magic, Races of Dragon, Draconomicon will be banned. UA is ok.

If I picked only 4 marshal levels, how would you fill the 6 levels needed to reach 10th? At lvl11 I'd like to take the PrC from Miniatures Handbook that boosts my CHAR and my followers' STR. (don't remember the name, don't have books here)

Once again, I know this is LARGELY suboptimal... If I can keep it at least playable, it's ok. If I can wield a sword decently and I am good at social stuff, my creativity should do the rest.

Ah the Warchief PrC. I don't think it gets very much love around here unfortunately. Go for it though.
There's also always the Legendary Captain PrC from Stormwrack, but I'm not sure I saw it on your list...

[kestrel404]

My suggestion is Mythic Exemplar (Complete Champions), path of Reikhardt. Best entry is Bard 3/Marshal 1.

Build goes: Bard 3/Marshal 1/Mythic Exemplar 10/Some Bard PRC 6.

Mythic exemplar advances bard casting (1/2), inspire courage, and Marshal auras.

Good feats for this build include: Melodic Casting, Extra Music, Lingering Music, Fiery Burst (once you hit 3nd level spells, there are a few bardic fire spells).

Build focuses on being skillful, party face, with mostly utility and buff spells to help allies.

Overall, the build suits what you want is still manages to be relatively well optimized.

Hope that helps.

[Callin]

Yea i was typing up the reply while you posted yours :smallwink:

Hmm the other 6 levels... Well the Warchief does look promising.

[Malrone]

If you think this character will actually have the guff to impress others with his bull, take a look at the Legendary Leader PrC, out of Heroes of Battle iirc. Class abilities include command auras, luck bonuses, and being so full of your own **** you become immune to fear.

[prufock]

This is the list of the automatically kosher books:

all core (of course)
all completes (except CM, CSc and CC)
"Races of some stuff" books
Eberron and Faerun stuff
BoVD and BoED
Savage Species
Libris Mortis (hey, it should be "LIBER"...)
-I may miss something, ask if needed-


You left out the Miniatures Handbook!

Mythic Exemplar, however, is in Complete Champion, so I'm not sure you can get it.

Marshal/Paladin/Bard (with the Devoted Performer feat if necessary) seems like it would fit your concept well. You're going to be all Cha-focused, and it seems like you're going for something that doesn't focus on spellcasting.
Paladin 2-5: At least 2 levels for Divine Grace, charisma to all your saves, heck yeah. Going to 4 is a decent plan, grabbing Turn Undead to power divine feats. Level 5 would give you a slightly better mount.
Bard 3: So you can pump your inspire courage a bit, grab Song of the Heart feat as well as Inspirational Boost spell and a Badge of Valor. Vest of Legends when you can get it. More bard later if you want good spells, but your casting is going to be delayed a lot with this build.
Marshal 3-whatever: You want Motivate Charisma. Art of War, Motivate Strength, and Motivate Dexterity are good choices, or use one to pump your weakest save. Other options depend a lot on your tactics.

[Demorden]

You left out the Miniatures Handbook!

Yeah, you're right, thanks! :smallbiggrin:


Ah the Warchief PrC. I don't think it gets very much love around here unfortunately. Go for it though.
There's also always the Legendary Captain PrC from Stormwrack, but I'm not sure I saw it on your list...
In fact, I have to discuss with my DM for any single material that helps a marshal to be a good pc class.
No Stormwrack, no Heroes of Battle, no Complete Champion, no Dragon-related stuff... unless I get some special permission.

I've read the Mythic Examplar in recent past, and it's nice, I'll see if it fits the concept as it is in my mind. Eventually, I'll propose it to my DM.
I just would like to avoid bard. Basically because I'd like the marshal class to be the mechanical base, and the ex-fighter thing to be the fluff base. So, from a fluff point of view (how many times can I type "fluff" in a paragraph?!), the bard doesn't seem very fit.

I'd prefer a dip in sorc or warlock.

"I'm the finest sword in the realm, but that's just the top of the iceberg! I also have PHENOMENAL COSMIC POWERS!" (get the quote, win a cookie)

Would it be a bad idea?

[DustyBottoms]

If you wanna dip caster, I'd look into Duskblade or Warmage so you can cast with some armor on. Also, Warmage is CHA-based for spells, a la sorc. Duskblade iirc was CHA INT. ^.^

Edit: Duskblade is INT, my bad.

[Demorden]

If you wanna dip caster, I'd look into Duskblade or Warmage so you can cast with some armor on. Also, Warmage is CHA-based for spells, a la sorc. Duskblade iirc was CHA INT. ^.^

Edit: Duskblade is INT, my bad.

You know what? Maybe Psionic Warrior...

Marshal8/PsWar2/PrC XX
or
Marshal4/PsWar2/Fight4/PrC
or
Marshal4/PsWar6/PrC

These seem viable.
What are your thoughts?

[Zombulian]

Yeah, you're right, thanks! :smallbiggrin:


In fact, I have to discuss with my DM for any single material that helps a marshal to be a good pc class.
No Stormwrack, no Heroes of Battle, no Complete Champion, no Dragon-related stuff... unless I get some special permission.

I've read the Mythic Examplar in recent past, and it's nice, I'll see if it fits the concept as it is in my mind. Eventually, I'll propose it to my DM.
I just would like to avoid bard. Basically because I'd like the marshal class to be the mechanical base, and the ex-fighter thing to be the fluff base. So, from a fluff point of view (how many times can I type "fluff" in a paragraph?!), the bard doesn't seem very fit.

I'd prefer a dip in sorc or warlock.

"I'm the finest sword in the realm, but that's just the top of the iceberg! I also have PHENOMENAL COSMIC POWERS!" (get the quote, win a cookie)

Would it be a bad idea?

PHENOMENAL COSMIC POWERS (throws bag of glitterdust at enemies). Behold! The Charlatan!


Edit: myehh, Psywar doesn't work particularly well with this imo. Mostly since a lot of this building seems to be coming from a fluff perspective, and I just can't really see a Marshal Psywar being what you described.

[Dayaz]

he ight have PHENOMENAL COSMIC POWERS, but does he have a iitty bitty living space?

Alas, the quote is Genie from Aladdin, now about that cookie~

[Demorden]

he ight have PHENOMENAL COSMIC POWERS, but does he have a iitty bitty living space?

Alas, the quote is Genie from Aladdin, now about that cookie~

http://static.giantbomb.com/uploads/scale_small/1/15228/818734-cookie_monster.jpg
Win this encounter and get it!
BWAHAHAHAHA!:smallamused:


Edit: myehh, Psywar doesn't work particularly well with this imo. Mostly since a lot of this building seems to be coming from a fluff perspective, and I just can't really see a Marshal Psywar being what you described.
It is not the most fit class fluff-wise, sure.
And yet, a psywarrior is basically a fighter, just with some mental powers...
I see it better than melee casters. Also, if memory serves, it manifests on cha.

Not sure yet, just investigating the possibilities.

[Zombulian]

I think they use Wis actually.

[kestrel404]

You know what? Maybe Psionic Warrior...

Marshal8/PsWar2/PrC XX
or
Marshal4/PsWar2/Fight4/PrC
or
Marshal4/PsWar6/PrC

These seem viable.
What are your thoughts?

Psy-war (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/classes/psychicWarrior.htm) is wisdom based, which makes it hard to pair with a charisma-based class like Marshal.

Wilder is not as bad a class as everyone says, it's just the lack of power variety that's annoying.

However, if you're looking for options, you may want to consider Sorceror, Favored Soul (from complete divine) or Warlock (from complete arcane).

Here are a few general builds that would work well:
Marshal 3/Favored Soul 4/Warpriest X - while Warpriest only advances at 1/2 casting, it's a nice solid PrC for leadership-oriented divine casters. Since there's no diety requirement attached, you can enter it as a 'warrior of love' or some such and get away with it.

Marshal 4/Warlock 1/Mindbender N - requires the Practiced Spellcaster (Warlock) feat, but this will do quite nicely for what you want.

For Sorceror, I suppose you could go with Eldritch Warrior if you wanted.
Marshal 3/Sorceror 6/EW 10

[Shining Wrath]

You want high charisma. You also want to mix well with Marshall. And you want to be able to, at least a little, justify a whole lot of arrogant.

*Ponders*

Sorcerer. Sorcerer with a familiar that he can talk to instead of Jack when he wants to insult Jack. "Poe, don't you think Jack really needs to learn how to get out of the way of an ogre's club instead of blocking with his face?".

[Dayaz]

There is also the Dragon Shaman from PHB2 >.> I made a built from marshal2/Dragon Shaman 5 that gave you +6 to attack on charging... so if you have a fighter buddy, you and him charge with PA with 2h weapons, and then if things are going bad switch to Aura of Vigor 2

Plus, all the auras have something to do with CHA if I remember right, so you'd have 3 auras going at all times, and with 4 levels of DS you get a breath weapon, opening up metabreath feats like Entangling Breath and Clinging Breath

[Zombulian]

Also, bear with me here, but for supporting, Hexblade can be pretty good as long as you use some of this fixes posted here (http://irongamersguild.wikidot.com/forum/t-248314/unofficial-fix-for-hexblades-from-an-official-source).

[Demorden]

You want high charisma. You also want to mix well with Marshall. And you want to be able to, at least a little, justify a whole lot of arrogant.

*Ponders*

Sorcerer. Sorcerer with a familiar that he can talk to instead of Jack when he wants to insult Jack. "Poe, don't you think Jack really needs to learn how to get out of the way of an ogre's club instead of blocking with his face?".



Psy-war is wisdom based, which makes it hard to pair with a charisma-based class like Marshal.

Wilder is not as bad a class as everyone says, it's just the lack of power variety that's annoying.

However, if you're looking for options, you may want to consider Sorceror, Favored Soul (from complete divine) or Warlock (from complete arcane).

Here are a few general builds that would work well:
Marshal 3/Favored Soul 4/Warpriest X - while Warpriest only advances at 1/2 casting, it's a nice solid PrC for leadership-oriented divine casters. Since there's no diety requirement attached, you can enter it as a 'warrior of love' or some such and get away with it.

Marshal 4/Warlock 1/Mindbender N - requires the Practiced Spellcaster (Warlock) feat, but this will do quite nicely for what you want.

For Sorceror, I suppose you could go with Eldritch Warrior if you wanted.
Marshal 3/Sorceror 6/EW 10



There is also the Dragon Shaman from PHB2 >.> I made a built from marshal2/Dragon Shaman 5 that gave you +6 to attack on charging... so if you have a fighter buddy, you and him charge with PA with 2h weapons, and then if things are going bad switch to Aura of Vigor 2

Plus, all the auras have something to do with CHA if I remember right, so you'd have 3 auras going at all times, and with 4 levels of DS you get a breath weapon, opening up metabreath feats like Entangling Breath and Clinging Breath

These are all good ideas. I like sorcerer, and warlock in particular. Sorc would be a 1lv dip, while warlock gives its best at 4th, 6th (or maybe 12th, depending on how much I want to follow that path... But I'm inclined to take only 4 or 6). It's also easy to build, and having at will SLAs is more conceptually coherent.
Beguiling influence, baleful utterance and charme are the 3 first things I could use very well.

Marshal4/Warlock6 seems a good solution to fill the first 10 levels.

Sure I could optimize more, but hey, it sounds cool and it's a build that calls for creativity! ;)

I just don't like the fact that I have to be either evil or chaotic, by RAW (IIRC).

I could be a gentle and pleasant LE charismatic guy (Elan's dad, anyone?).

EDIT: Hexblade is a little too exotic imho. And IIRC, it comes from PHBII, doesn't it? It' banned unless I get permission.

[Zombulian]

These are all good ideas. I like sorcerer, and warlock in particular. Sorc would be a 1lv dip, while warlock gives its best at 4th, 6th (or maybe 12th, depending on how much I want to follow that path... But I'm inclined to take only 4 or 6). It's also easy to build, and having at will SLAs is more conceptually coherent.
Beguiling influence, baleful utterance and charme are the 3 first things I could use very well.

Marshal4/Warlock6 seems a good solution to fill the first 10 levels.

Sure I could optimize more, but hey, it sounds cool and it's a build that calls for creativity! ;)

I just don't like the fact that I have to be either evil or chaotic, by RAW (IIRC).

I could be a gentle and pleasant LE charismatic guy (Elan's dad, anyone?).

EDIT: Hexblade is a little too exotic imho. And IIRC, it comes from PHBII, doesn't it? It' banned unless I get permission.

Nope. CWar.
Also Warlock 12 unlocks some pretty cool UMD stuff.

[Demorden]

Nope. CWar.
Also Warlock 12 unlocks some pretty cool UMD stuff.

The Hexblade is good for a 2-3lvl dip, as-is. (I can't expect homebrew material to be allowed, no matter how good it is)

That would mean marshal7-8/hexblade2-3. It would be nice. Buff and debuff together.:smallcool:

Pro: I'd stop leveling as a Hexblade before arcane caster failure can even happen, benefitting from the marshal's heavy armor proficiency.:smallwink:
Con: curses aren't half as good as invocations, imho.:smallfrown:

Hey, thanks to everyone for your opinions!

Keep sharing your thoughts please! For example, I'd like to enter a PrC at lvl11.
Warchief fits character concept very well, but I will happily listen for better ideas.:smallamused:

Remember, in this case at least, fluff>optimization.

[Zombulian]

The Hexblade is good for a 2-3lvl dip, as-is. (I can't expect homebrew material to be allowed, no matter how good it is)

That would mean marshal7-8/hexblade2-3. It would be nice. Buff and debuff together.:smallcool:

Pro: I'd stop leveling as a Hexblade before arcane caster failure can even happen, benefitting from the marshal's heavy armor proficiency.:smallwink:
Con: curses aren't half as good as invocations, imho.:smallfrown:

Hey, thanks to everyone for your opinions!

Keep sharing your thoughts please! For example, I'd like to enter a PrC at lvl11.
Warchief fits character concept very well, but I will happily listen for better ideas.:smallamused:

Remember, in this case at least, fluff>optimization.

Just btw, it's not homebrew, it's proposed reworks done by the original writer of the class. So pretty legit.

[Demorden]

Just btw, it's not homebrew, it's proposed reworks done by the original writer of the class. So pretty legit.

Yes, I've read it after my comment. Though I fear that the "this is not official" thing will be enough to ban it. Don't know. I will ask, but I cannot safely assume that it will be allowed.

BTW the more I study my options, the more confused I am lol.
So many options could fit this character concept...

I am trying a slightly different approach. The one I usually choose after all. I'm considering the PrCs to see where I want to get. The already suggested Warpriest is cool, but the Evangelist is nice too. The Warchief is underoptimized but would make my combo with the cohort interesting... I think I'm going to cry. This build is making me feel like a total noob overwhelmed with choices! :smallbiggrin:

EDIT: you know what?! I could rework the charlatan with my DM if he agrees, just so that I'll pretend to be a powerful, ubercool MUNDANE character...

[Zombulian]

Yes, I've read it after my comment. Though I fear that the "this is not official" thing will be enough to ban it. Don't know. I will ask, but I cannot safely assume that it will be allowed.

BTW the more I study my options, the more confused I am lol.
So many options could fit this character concept...

I am trying a slightly different approach. The one I usually choose after all. I'm considering the PrCs to see where I want to get. The already suggested Warpriest is cool, but the Evangelist is nice too. The Warchief is underoptimized but would make my combo with the cohort interesting... I think I'm going to cry. This build is making me feel like a total noob overwhelmed with choices! :smallbiggrin:

EDIT: you know what?! I could rework the charlatan with my DM if he agrees, just so that I'll pretend to be a powerful, ubercool MUNDANE character...

That could be interesting. Tell me how it goes.

[Dayaz]

Well, Warchief goes well with the Marshal/Dragon Shaman I brought up, since you could then give everyone the Warchief Rage, 3 Auras, 2 of which would give them all a total attack bonus of +6 from charging, and one other misc thing, and all the tormenting being able to use a breath weapon and metabreaths can enjoy.

The build itself makes your guy awesome, and absolutely terrifying if he has his 'tribe' be a bunch of fighters and barbarians.

[Demorden]

Well, Warchief goes well with the Marshal/Dragon Shaman I brought up, since you could then give everyone the Warchief Rage, 3 Auras, 2 of which would give them all a total attack bonus of +6 from charging, and one other misc thing, and all the tormenting being able to use a breath weapon and metabreaths can enjoy.

The build itself makes your guy awesome, and absolutely terrifying if he has his 'tribe' be a bunch of fighters and barbarians.

Yes, I agree that would be a very nice build.
I just cannot assume that PHBII will be kosher... you know, even if I translated the mechanics I need for the DM, someone could say that it's unfair that I have a much larger choice. Next argument could be "if you want to introduce a new book, make it completely available to everyone". And since I'm not a scribe, I'm not sure I feel like translating a whole book.

I don't know, really... I can try to talk the DM into allowing it.


That could be interesting. Tell me how it goes.


The best would be rework it so that I can lie about the cohort.

I've promised to that vain idiot of your father to make you the most famous hero of the realm, and for all goodness' sake, I'll do it, no matter the cost.http://schoolofdisney.com/Stories/Hercules/music/hercules137.gif


I am well aware that I have heavy (and somewhat ambiguous) limitations for my build, that's why I thank you all for your help in exploring every single possibility! :smallsmile:

[dantiesilva]

I know I am kind of a late comer to the suggestions but I have had a lot of fun with a marshal X/FighterX/Dragon samuraiX You could switch Fighter for 4 levels of paladin take the dragon mount from dragon magic ACF and it would flow as dragons have high Cha, you would have a dragon mount, and you would worship a dragon as your lord and thus gain a breath weapon. Everything but the dragon mount is in the allowed sources so it should be fine.

Thats strictly speaking fluff wise that is, though the cha from Marshal adds to the paladin fun of smite.

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20030906c

That is the link to the Dragon samuria from MH

Hope this helps you out.

I played in a 3 party group with a cleric and a bard and I dealt the most damage by going mounted combat.

[Demorden]

I know I am kind of a late comer to the suggestions but I have had a lot of fun with a marshal X/FighterX/Dragon samuraiX You could switch Fighter for 4 levels of paladin take the dragon mount from dragon magic ACF and it would flow as dragons have high Cha, you would have a dragon mount, and you would worship a dragon as your lord and thus gain a breath weapon. Everything but the dragon mount is in the allowed sources so it should be fine.

Thats strictly speaking fluff wise that is, though the cha from Marshal adds to the paladin fun of smite.

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20030906c

That is the link to the Dragon samuria from MH

Hope this helps you out.

I played in a 3 party group with a cleric and a bard and I dealt the most damage by going mounted combat.

Thanks, that was interesting. That's an option, indeed.
I just would like to avoid breath weapon (I think this character would say that spitting fire/lightnings/snowballs is just gross).

Also, damage dealing is not a top priority. I have a cohort for that (which will be as optimized as a mundane melee guy can be). I should be a "utility pc". Buffing, providing strategies, being the "face" and with some cool special ability.

The more I think about it, the more I am inclined to go marshal4/warlock6/whatever (warchief being an option)


<hr />

Assuming I'll go that way, the abilities will be
CHA>INT>WIS>CON>DEX>FOR (don't worry, we usually play with an ability-roll system that makes bad rolls almost impossible... almost)

What feats should be considered a must-have? I'm not expert of marshals and warlocks.

[dantiesilva]

If you do not want to be a damage dealing machine warlock not a wise choice. Cleirc is not bad, or a wizard transmuter, but would not fit as well. Thats why I suggested paladin as you are geting cha synergy as well as getting mostly buff spells. Not to mention the abilities are party happy. and a 10d8 is not what I call damage dealing when you are level 16, a warlock at that level would be doing over 20 optimized. I have a warlock in a group I play in now that dose about 18 or more and she is only level 13. Though you could ask your DM if you could change breath weapon for perhaps more auras, or draconic feats. Better elemental weapon. It is not that bad of a PrC if you want to play for fun.

With paladin you could go the DMM route later on if you wanted to. Throw this is , Motivate Charisma: Bonus on Charisma checks and Charisma-based skill checks, and now your main skills are almost completely optimized, just instead of trying to turn an enemy into an ally try the GITP fix were instead you try to make deals and such. I am not a huge fan of it, but it does work from time to time.

Also from what I have read your court would be this mans grandson who he is training to be a tripper. Thus a warlock would also not exactly fit perfectly. I know there are ways but you again do not want massize damage fun.

[Demorden]

If you do not want to be a damage dealing machine warlock not a wise choice.
It may seem so, but I'd take mainly non-damage-dealing invocations. See below.



With paladin you could go the DMM route later on if you wanted to. Throw this is , Motivate Charisma: Bonus on Charisma checks and Charisma-based skill checks, and now your main skills are almost completely optimized, just instead of trying to turn an enemy into an ally try the GITP fix were instead you try to make deals and such. I am not a huge fan of it, but it does work from time to time.
Again, this is another good option, except I can't use 3rd party fixes.
Pally seems a little too serious for this character, but eventually that's why we have paladins of freedom. :smallwink:



Also from what I have read your court would be this mans grandson who he is training to be a tripper. Thus a warlock would also not exactly fit perfectly. I know there are ways but you again do not want massize damage fun.
this is true. but an at-will "Shatter"-like effect opens a wide range of creative uses, and this is just an example. there's also an invocation that works like a dimension door. Need a flanker? Here I come! Wanna grapple? Psh! try your best!

And after every similar action, I could shout: "WOAH! I am still quite cool, despite my age! How are you doing instead, Jack?! Are you managing to learn something from all those cuts and bruises? Good! Need a help?" :smallcool:

[dantiesilva]

Sounds like the player in my game, then they got killed by a level 5 displacer beast with the abomination template. Just be careful with warlock as they have many great abilities, but one wrong step and your dead.

And yes shattering a enemy's fortifications or their shield or armor dose sound amusing. Greasing the weapon they are holding. Using unseen servant to flank, yes the fun with the low level spells and abilities of spellcasters is always amusing.

What do you have in your party? May help us a bit.

[Demorden]

Sounds like the player in my game, then they got killed by a level 5 displacer beast with the abomination template. Just be careful with warlock as they have many great abilities, but one wrong step and your dead.

And yes shattering a enemy's fortifications or their shield or armor dose sound amusing. Greasing the weapon they are holding. Using unseen servant to flank, yes the fun with the low level spells and abilities of spellcasters is always amusing.

What do you have in your party? May help us a bit.

I don't know yet what the other players will present.
But be sure that the optimization level is ridiculuosly low, on average.

I'm by far not a great optimizer too. But this fact does not change the situation.
In fact, also we usually don't care about roles. So it happened that we were utterly unbalanced. The spirit is that "I do not want to play something based on YOUR choice".

That being said, I expect no casters, or if any, evokers, enchanters, and healers. Nothing special. Also, I don't expect from my DM any encounter complex enough to need real raw power. I may be wrong... But if that's the case, I have a halfling conjurer/druid/arcane hierophant built with the early entry trick, ready to rumble. :smalltongue:

[dantiesilva]

If optimization level is low you can just about play anything then really and not care. Even taken Marshal all the way.

After all 1/day making all your allies move so they can full attack/ Flank and granting a +2 bonus is not that bad. The saves for the class are really decent as is the BAB for someone who is not a frontliner. Get a few wands that let you buff your allies or something and you should be fine just playing a straight Marshal.

Max diplomacy, Bluff, and Sense motives, then work on whatever else you want and you should be all set. Take feats that buff your skills or make you able to use more then one aura at a time, and you should be more then fine.

Have your court be the heavy hitter, I would go even as far as saying make him old age -3 to physical stats +2 to mental stats, to make sure you have a high Int, wis, and Cha so that you have a lot of skill points, your ranks will be sky high for your social skills, and well the wisdom you can take the feat Zen archery and use it in place of Dex for the bow.

I know there are ways to get Dex, Wis, and Int to your bow but can not think of them at this time. But if you are playing as you said just for the fun you should not need it. Perhaps talk one of your allies into getting a court though and getting at least a cleric to follow you around just for the healing if no one is playing a caster.