Non-spellcaster Alchemy

[dangerginger]

Craft (Alchemy)To make an item using Craft (alchemy), you must have alchemical equipment and be a spellcaster.

What the heck can one do with Alchemy if not a spellcaster? And who plain ignores that requirement?

[Callin]

I always thought that was a stupid idea. I always got rid of it.

I wonder if just having a CL from a SLA or using Wild Talent to meet the requirement would work?

[ksbsnowowl]

Note that is a 3.5 rule. In 3.0 anyone could take ranks in Alchemy.

Most people ignore it, as it is stupid.

[Man on Fire]

What the heck can one do with Alchemy if not a spellcaster? And who plain ignores that requirement?

Rogue, craft dozens of flasks of Alchemist Fire and Acid and whatever else you can, specialise in throw weapons. Now you are that evil monster of the group who throws acid at guys in robes and pointy hats.

[Eldonauran]

I always thought that was a stupid idea. I always got rid of it.

I wonder if just having a CL from a SLA or using Wild Talent to meet the requirement would work?

I also think its a unwise ruling. I usually change that requirement from 'must be a spellcaster' to 'must have ranks in spellcraft', when I act as DM. Just because you lack the ability to cast spells doesn't mean you can't study them and develop some sort of understanding. Slap some UMD device in with it, and you very well could be a spellcaster.

[dascarletm]

Alchemy is like Chemistry, but more fanciful. There really isn't any item I can see needing spells for. That's what Magic Item Crafting Feats are for.

[Talionis]

Its part of the hate of all non-spellcasters in 3.5. Ignore it. All casters tend to be better than the strongest non-caster, so I see no reason to allow them to take craft (Alchemy), even from fluff.

[DarkEternal]

To ask a question, are there any actual good items you can make with Alchemy? Any good lists of stuff that can be done with it from various sources? Honestly, the only sort of good things that I have seen, I've seen in the PHB (Tanglefoot bag, Thunderstone, Alchemist Fire and Sunrod). From other sources, they are quite crappy and expensive, giving you a few minutes of +1 to listen or spot or some other skill enhancement.

[Psyren]

Note that Pathfinder removes the spellcaster requirement as well.

There's also a bunch of alchemical items you can make in Pathfinder - there's a pretty good list here (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/goods-and-services/herbs-oils-other-substances) that it would be pretty easy to port backwards into 3.5.

Of course, the easiest way to make most of this stuff is to be an Alchemist, which is a spellcaster :smalltongue:

[tyckspoon]

Here's a few useful alchemy items..

Complete Adventurer:
Flash Pellet- Thrown, 5 ft range increment. DC 15 Fort save against blinding in a 5ft radius.

Ironman Capsule- ignore being Staggered for one round. Situationally useful, but hey, it's only 15 GP (if you ignore the 100 GP up-front cost of an alchemical capsule retainer to mount it in so you can use it correctly, anyway >.>)

Weapon Capsules-
Now, these are pretty nice. 100 GP charge to modify your weapon to use one (or 450 to be able to mount three at a time) and then you can trigger it as a Swift action. They can also be used to apply poisons if you want to be a poisoner. Options include Quick(element), which gives 1d6 energy damage to your attacks for a round, Quicksilver that makes your weapon Silvered for 3 rounds (so a cheaper and faster if shorter alternative to Silversheen), and ghostblight, which lets you strike incorporeal foes as if you had Ghost Touch for 3 rounds (this is pretty awesome.)

Complete Scoundrel:

Nerv- +2 bonus against fear for an hour. Mainly useful for its long duration, you can pre-buff with this when you expect to be facing fear-causing enemies. Also stacks with basically everything, because Alchemical Bonus.

Dungeonscape:

Bottled Air- clears smoke/fog/gas effects from one square.
Ghostwall Shellac - causes surfaces to block incorporeal and Ethereal creatures that could normally pass through them.
Lockslick- +2 Alchemical bonus to applicable Open Lock or Disable Device checks (not huge, but stacks with most things, is helpful, and your buy-in price gets you 10 applications, so it's much more cost-effective than most alchemical items.)
Trollbane- disables Regeneration. Don't have fire for that troll? Don't know or don't care to find out how to beat a more exotic Regeneration? Trollbane that sucker.

Magic of Eberron:
Bloodspikes - give a minor effect for an hour and can be expended for a greater effect any time within that hour. The most notable one is the Tempo bloodspike, which has no continual effect but can be expended for an extra move action.

[Deepbluediver]

Alchemy is like Chemistry, but more fanciful. There really isn't any item I can see needing spells for. That's what Magic Item Crafting Feats are for.

That's what I always figured it was supposed to be. Except for some reason 3.5 tried to make it "magic spell in a bottle".

Which means that non-casters can't have nice things (again) and most of the potions and other things end up being just like scrolls, which are already stored magic. I have yet to see a good justification for that, and I fully support changing any of the required rules to seperate Alchemy from actual spellcasting.

[Grinner]

I remember seeing something about improved Alchemist's Fire somewhere in a Dragon Magazine. It was in an article about exotic plants

[Eldan]

The Pathfinder SRD has tons of nice alchemical items, by the way. Dozens and dozens, to cause and cure all kind of conditions.

[Erik Vale]

Fixed by a feat (http://dndtools.eu/feats/unearthed-arcana--90/craft-alchemical-item--447/). Also gives the benifits of some free achemical items due to craft points.

Of course, this is assuming your willing to spring a feat.

[Than]

To ask a question, are there any actual good items you can make with Alchemy?

Since I am currently playing an Alchemist Erudite I made myself an excel document with lists of alchemic items I've found, their market prices, and craft DCs when listed. It's far from exhaustive (E.G.: I don't have the Ravenloft books) but I'm willing to share my list. Here's a direct download link from my dropbox. You'll still need the books themselves as most items here only have a base description of what they do and all of those written for personal reminders.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/19899461/Alchemy%20Data.xlsx

Personal favorites: Antitoxin, tindertwig, alchemist's mercy, catstink, firestone, ice crystal, spy buttons, eggshell grenade (dust), blasting pellets, hearthfire, healing salve (we're a full tomb-tainted party), scentbreak, ditherbomb, list from Eberron Campaign Setting, explosive packs, ipecac (DM has that book), frostfire, instant rope, clearwater tablet (we're evil), liquid light, nerv, rust cube, auran mask, fast torch, Pure Element Water, razor ice powder, shapesand, firmament stone.

[Vizzerdrix]

Something of note: Arms and Equipment Guide has a nice ranged weapon called the Gnome Calculus. Basically a big sling for throwing alchemical items.

[Talionis]

To ask a question, are there any actual good items you can make with Alchemy? Any good lists of stuff that can be done with it from various sources? Honestly, the only sort of good things that I have seen, I've seen in the PHB (Tanglefoot bag, Thunderstone, Alchemist Fire and Sunrod). From other sources, they are quite crappy and expensive, giving you a few minutes of +1 to listen or spot or some other skill enhancement.

The Master Alchemist Feat which requires the Grenadier feat allows you to use some of your alchemical items in fun ways. The best of which is effectively the ability to counter spells using your Craft Skill versus their caster level.