Explaining the classes to a newbie. Help!

[Stake A Vamp]

so, I finally got back into the saddle, and I got my group back. Unfortunately, I have to break in two new D&D-ers. so, now i have to explain the classes to them. they have both done some non-D&D RPG experience, so i don't need to explain it all extremely thoroughly, but still, what does the playground think?

Barbarian is all about damage. His ability to dish it out is matched only by his power to absorb it. With d12 Hit points, constitution and strength the only abilities he truly needs, (though dexterity is helpful) and bonuses to constitution and stength in rage, he is the king of damage (well the warlord of damage anyway)

Bard is all about support. Her magic is tailored to be supportive, as are her class abilities. From humble boosts like bard song, to powerful magical enhancements like bull's strength, you magic is not only helpful to her, but to the whole party. the bards skill points and less magic-based abilities (bardic knowledge) allow her to be a skill monkey second only to the rogue in versatility

Cleric is about versatility. The cleric has two main roles in the party, one, and more common in early level, is the secondary warrior, standing alongside the fighter and whooping monster ***, the second, and the time spend filling this role increases as he levels up, is as a secondary caster. the cleric has spells, most of them healing and benevolent, though a good part are also combat oriented.

the druid is about controlling the environment, from simple spells like entangle to more powerful spells like call lightning, to truly terrifying magics like elemental swarm and storm of vengeance. the druid also has myriad special abilities that allow her to fill other niche roles, and an animal companion that almost makes her an effective combatant, but she is primarily a caster (and the only divine primary caster, I might add.)

The Fighter's name says it all. He is the master of combat. Many classes are combat oriented (ranger, paladin, barbarian, and maybe monk.) but all of those classes have one shortcoming, they are specialized, the ranger is either a superb archer, or a duel wielding demon, the paladin's strength is on a horse, and against evil. and the barbarian is too often a one-or-two trick pony, though those tricks are often very effective, but a Fighter, he can do it all. He can dish out damage with a great-sword, go toe-to-toe with sword and shield, or charge into battle on a horse, all in the same day

Monks are all about speed. a Monk can attack faster, move faster, and run faster than any other class. by level 4 she already has two attacks, and by level twenty, she has five. with wisdom bonuses to Armour class, increased movement speed and the ability to fight unarmed and unarmoured, the monk is stealthy and quick.

the paladin is the champion. his abilities make him the ideal warrior against evil. he has the power to detect his foes, bring them down, and bolster his allies against the forces of darkness.

the ranger is one of two things. she is either the dual wielding warrior, at the heart of combat, lashing out left and right, and felling foes as effectively as any barbarian, or an archer who can halve an opposing force before they even reach the party, combined with her favoured enemy, makes her a fearsome foe and staunch ally. her other abilities are near worthless, their animal companion to little too late, and track almost worthless.

the rogue is a specialist in keeping the party out of harms way, the rogue has three main functions. function one, skill monkey/traps. the rogue is the king of traps, he can disarm them, detect them, and even turn them against his foes if he's clever. the second function is scout,his stealth abilities allow him to sneak around the enemy and find out what is upcoming. and finally he is an assassin. he can sneak around an enemy group and attack the leader whilst the group engages his minions.

the motto of the sorcerer is "Power To Burn". the sorcerer has a slower progression of spells, but the spells he can cast, he can cast till the cows come home. the sorcerer cannot do all the tricks a wizard can, but he can do them much more often.

"Preparation. Preparation. Preparation." the wizards chant. a wizard hasn't got the same power as a sorcerer, but his power increases faster, and he is more versatile in his spells. overall a wizard can go as far as a sorcerer, with half the power, assuming adequate knowledge.

any thoughts, comments, congradualations?

[atomicpenguin]

Which edition are you playing?

[scurv]

Tell them to read this comic, It provides decent perspective on how the base classes are played.

[Grinner]

Stop sugar-coating it.

{table=head]Class|Description
Wizard, Sorcerer|Make stuff go boom. Try not to get animal buddy killed. Hard to play effectively.
Cleric, Druid|Buff self, cast spells, and do fighter's job better than the fighter.
Monk|Get lots of abilities, most of which will never come up during play.
Paladin|Realize that morality is for chumps. Take a level in Blackguard.
Barbarian|Kick ass. Silently contend with inner demons. And nothing more.
Ranger|Make Survival checks. Try to be as badass as Legolas.
Rogue|Steal stuff. Be sneaky. Annoy party with larcenous antics.
Fighter|Lash out violently. Cry.
[/table]

Edit: On a serious note, while you're over-representing their abilities in some cases, I think those descriptions are fine. Just be sure that you can handle whatever choices they make.

[Hiro Protagonest]

"Classes bad, point-buy good"

That's about it. I utterly despise class systems.

[Stake A Vamp]

Which edition are you playing?
I am playing 3.5, though 3.0 spell durations and PF rogues and some PF skills (acrobatics replacing jump and tumble, stealth replacing hie and move silently, and perception replacing spot, search, and listen.)

Tell them to read this comic, It provides decent perspective on how the base classes are played.
i would, but our first session is saturday. i will howver, so that they get some ideas of how 3.5 works. thank you kindly

Stop sugar-coating it.

{table=head]Class|Description
Wizard, Sorcerer|Make stuff go boom. Try not to get animal buddy killed. Hard to play effectively.

Cleric, Druid|Buff self, cast spells, and do fighter's job better than the fighter.

Monk|Get lots of abilities, most of which will never come up during play.

Paladin|Realize that morality is for chumps. Take a level in Blackguard.

Barbarian|Kick ass. Silently contend with inner demons. And nothing more.

Ranger|Make Survival checks. Try to be as badass as Legolas.

Rogue|Steal stuff. Be sneaky. Annoy party with larcenous antics.

Fighter|Lash out violently. Cry.
[/table]

my thanks for creating that table, it gave me a good laugh and describes many of the classes simplistically, i will not show this to my players, my experienced players will get ides... bad ideas. like the things i am no longer allowed to do list bad ideas.

[Grinner]

my thanks for creating that table, it gave me a good laugh and describes many of the classes simplistically, i will not show this to my players, my experienced players will get ides... bad ideas. like the things i am no longer allowed to do list bad ideas.

Be sure to catch my edit.

[Razanir]

Monks are all about speed. a Monk can attack faster, move faster, and run faster than any other class. by level 4 she already has two attacks, and by level twenty, she has five. with wisdom bonuses to Armour class, increased movement speed and the ability to fight unarmed and unarmoured, the monk is stealthy and quick.

No. This makes me want to play a monk. Monks are the worst class in the game. Either let them know this or use a monk fix (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=150122). And you know it's a good one when Google will suggest jiriku's name in autocorrect

[JusticeZero]

Those are mechanical. Nobody cares about mechanical, they want to make their creativity work. Talk about what their story role is.

[Razanir]

Those are mechanical. Nobody cares about mechanical, they want to make their creativity work. Talk about what their story role is.

Barbarian– HULK SMASH!
Bard– Adventuring minstrel looking for his next inspiration
Cleric– Serving his god through adventure
Druid– Preserving nature and the natural order of things
Fighter– Human soldier #275
Monk– Spiritual martial artist
Paladin– Serving Law and Good until they meet Belkar
Ranger– Aragorn wannabees
Rogue– Spies, thieves... really anyone who excels at stealth
Sorcerer– I don't care HOW I get my magic. I just blast stuff with it! :smallbiggrin:
Wizard– Um... Mr. Sorcerer? Magic requires discipline and study.

If you're using psionics:
Psion– Wizard clone
Wilder– Sorcerer clone
Psychic warrior– Soldier with limited "magical" (psionic) powers
Soulknife– Jedi without the Force

[Stake A Vamp]

No. This makes me want to play a monk. Monks are the worst class in the game. Either let them know this or use a monk fix (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=150122). And you know it's a good one when Google will suggest jiriku's name in autocorrect

I firmly believe that monk can be a good class, everyone hates on monk, but i play monk, and often it comes out well, honestly, what is eveyones monk hatred based on

Those are mechanical. Nobody cares about mechanical, they want to make their creativity work. Talk about what their story role is.
like i said they have enough expirience with fantasy culture where some examples will get them where they need to be RP-ishly


Barbarian– HULK SMASH!
Bard– Adventuring minstrel looking for his next inspiration
Cleric– Serving his god through adventure
Druid– Preserving nature and the natural order of things
Fighter– Human soldier #275
Monk– Spiritual martial artist
Paladin– Serving Law and Good until they meet Belkar
Ranger– Aragorn wannabees
Rogue– Spies, thieves... really anyone who excels at stealth
Sorcerer– I don't care HOW I get my magic. I just blast stuff with it! :smallbiggrin:
Wizard– Um... Mr. Sorcerer? Magic requires disciple and study.

If you're using psionics:
Psion– Wizard clone
Wilder– Sorcerer clone
Psychic warrior– Soldier with limited "magical" (psionic) powers
Soulknife– Jedi without the Force

oversimplification, but thank you all the same.

[D_Lord]

Well I know one thing that makes monks better, and on thing they are very good at.
What makes monks better is dice stats, not point buy odds for better char.
What they good at, not dieing, monks may not be able to deal out damage, or have as many skills but they are hard to kill.

[ScubaGoomba]

I think your descriptions are fine, although it may help to come up with some examples from pop culture/fiction to help them along, even if they aren't actually from the same genre, as long as they capture the essence of the character. Off the top of my head...

Barbarian: The Hulk (or I guess you could go "Conan")
Bard: ???
Cleric: I would almost go so far as to say Thor (Marvel)
Druid: ???
Fighter: Zoe Washburn (in case they're Firefly fans!), Sokka (Firefly), Gimli, Boromir... there are a lot!
Monk: Any martial arts movie character. You could also cite Aang from Avatar, minus the Airbending
Paladin: Captain America, absolutely (the attitude, at least)
Ranger: Legolas and Aragorn, for sure
Rogue: Indiana Jones!
Sorcerer: Harry Potter (they may call them Wizards, but the inborn nature of their wizardry definitely would put them more in line with the Sorcerer class than the Wizard class)
Wizard: Saruman; Hermione Granger (at least her scholarly approach, despite having inborn magic)

I would avoid Gandalf if only because he doesn't quite demonstrate abilities of any one class.

What also may help is to break classes down into "Power Sources," similar to 4E. Explain that there are classes that use magic, classes that don't, and classes that mix. If they want magic, explain the difference between Arcane and Divine and then sift through the options with the players. At this point, since you've narrowed it down, you could just read the quick blurb at the front of each Class. Make every class sound appealing so the players can pick what they want and not what you want (although it sounds like you're already on the right track, there!).

[Razanir]

I firmly believe that monk can be a good class, everyone hates on monk, but i play monk, and often it comes out well, honestly, what is eveyones monk hatred based on

It's more that its abilities don't synergize. Like they get fast movement, but can only use flurry if they don't move. Stuff like that. It and the fact that it's the most MAD class out there. (MAD = Multiple Attribute Dependent)

[Kane0]

Barbarian - Charge in, get mad and break stuff. Not necessarily in that order. Rely on your big strength and reserves of HP to see you through.
Fighter - Customize the way you want to approach combat with feats aplenty. Just be careful not to generalize too much or you may end up feeling a little overwhelmed.
Paladin - Take up your Deity's weapon, don your heavy armor and smite the evil villains. Some nice charisma based abilities and wisdom based spellcasting floating around too if you can spare the Attribute points.
Ranger - Pick between archery and dual wielding as a fighting style, and provide good tracking on the side. You should also have a fair collection of skills as well.
Bard - The jack of all trades, boost your team with a fancy performance and provide secondary spellcaster support.
Monk - Make good use of your mobility and other little abilities to get in and around fights, dropping frequent and nasty unarmed attacks while doing so. Be careful not to get caught by enemies though, as your HP isn't quite up to the task even though your saves are good.
Rogue - Sneak around, deal with traps, stab people in the back and when your not skulking around be a presentable speaker of the party. Be careful to avoid being the center of attention in a fight despite your good reflexes.
Cleric - Between healing, buffing and a decent amount of melee capability you will always have something to do as a cleric. Just be careful not to overextend yourself or waste critical spellcasting resources. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure!
Druid - Like the cleric, the druid can buff, debuff and fight reasonably well. He also gets an animal companion to help in fights and can change into animal form himself when needed. Don't use any metal gear though, and keep good track of your spells.
Wizard - Learn and prepare the best spell combinations and judiciously use them to save allies and ruin opponents. Make sure to keep your squishy ass out of weapon range though.
Sorcerer - Pump out spell after spell, but make sure each one counts. You don't have the number of choices the wizard does but you can cast more frequently.

Other good classes for those new to the game:

Warlock/Dragonfire Adept - Much like the sorcerer, these two have less magic to choose from but more use of it. They can blast magic all day long but won't have many tricks to choose from. They can be tough to kill though!
Beguiler/Warmage/Dread Necro - Specialist mages, these classes take a one or two schools of magic and really focus on it. Learn the playstyle of these schools of magic and these classes will serve you well.
Hexblade/Swashbuckler/Marshal/Dragon Shaman - Other variant warriors, these all have a preferred niche on the front line of combat, much like the Barbarian and Paladin. Once you have figured out their favorite tactics you're good to go.

[Devils_Advocate]

Cleric, Druid, Wizard, Sorcerer, Bard: The spellcasters. Limited in how many spells they can cast per day. Traditionally spells available for the day are picked ahead of time at the start of the day, but in 3rd Edition some classes break this rule. At high levels they can cast stupidly many spells per day, in addition to being able to cast more powerful spells, thus making them crazily powerful.

Clerics specialize in healing the living and fighting undead, unless they're Evil, in which case they specialize in making and supporting undead to fight on their behalf. Druids are like Evil Clerics except they're good at tearing people to pieces using wild animals rather than reanimated corpses. Wizards get the most potent spells at the cost of otherwise pretty much sucking.

Sorcerers choose from the same spells as Wizards, but use a somewhat different type of spellcasting than Wizards, Clerics, and Druids. This frees you from agonizing over which spells to prepare each day by requiring you to instead agonize over which spell(s) to gain each time you level up, with the risk of screwing up your character long-term if you make bad choices. :P (But one or two poorly chosen spells won't cripple a Sorcerer by any means, and you're even given limited opportunities to fix your mistakes later, so it's not really a huge deal.)

Bards use the same type of spellcasting as Sorcerers but have their own list of spells to pick from. They get less actual spells than the other casters, but make up for it a bit in the form of their own special music-based magic that is also limited in uses per day and has effects similar to spells', but otherwise works differently, for some reason. Best at bolstering their allies and also at socially influencing people, whether through magic or just by talking to them. Also good at social skills and knowing lore. Some sorta lore is often relevant, on an adventure, FYI. They can learn spells and skills for all manner of things, too, so if you like customization and lots of options, there's that.


Barbarian, Paladin, Monk: the melee warriors. "Melee" refers to hand-to-hand combat, in case you didn't know that.

Barbarians are quite good at hitting things very hard and surviving taking lots of hits. Monks are best at tumbling past the Evil Wizard's minions, punching the Evil Wizard in the face, and putting him in a headlock.

Paladins are especially good at hurting Evil things, eventually get special extra-tough horses to ride (which is important for a mounted combat character, since the sorts of things high-level characters fight will vaporize normal horses), and minored in Cleric. They are required to be kind and honorable, and get their superpowers taken away if they don't. Many players consider the class undesirable for this reason, as characters of other classes can keep rather more impressive powers by following less restrictive codes of combat, or even no code at all.


Ranger, Rogue: the scouts. Good at sneaking around, good at noticing things. Not generally the heavy hitters that other classes are, they use special combat styles to make up for it. (The Monk is kind of this, except Monks don't get enough skill points to be optimal at both reconnaissance and battlefield mobility, and if you want to be good at recon, you're really better off with Rouge or Ranger, so...)

Rogues excel at breaking and entering, stealing your wallet, forging documents, and stabbing unwary people in the kidneys. Lots of folks tend to be leery of Rogues for some reason or other.

Rangers are wilderness survivalists good at tracking. A Ranger specializes in dealing with particular types of enemies of the Ranger's choice. Rangers arguably make the best archers, at least without much optimization, being the only core base class particularly suited to this. Two-weapon fighters arguably make the weakest melee warriors, including dual-wielding Rangers. Choose the archery combat style is what I'm saying here.


Fighters are the designated warrior class... in a combat-oriented game in which every class is given significant combat capability. They ostensibly make up for their lack of other abilities by being the most skilled at fighting. They tend not to actually be better at fighting than the characters with cool superpowers. The bonus feats that they get are generally not good enough that getting a whole lot of them is terribly helpful, and do not allow a Fighter's capabilities to scale with level in a fashion competitive with other classes. The real trick of using the Fighter class is to take a few levels to get some feats you want for your character and then get the heck out.


Bard is all about support. Her magic is tailored to be supportive, as are her class abilities. From humble boosts like bard song, to powerful magical enhancements like bull's strength, you magic is not only helpful to her, but to the whole party.
This is like the statement "Break enchantment can reverse even an instantaneous effect, such as flesh to stone", in that, while technically accurate, the non-example chosen is quite misleading. (Bull's strength isn't a Bard spell, and break enchantment can't reverse flesh to stone.)


The Fighter's name says it all. He is the master of combat. Many classes are combat oriented
Every class in D&D is combat oriented.


but all of those classes have one shortcoming, they are specialized
That's not a shortcoming in a system that heavily rewards specialization. It is both possible and likely for a D&D character to be able to neutralize a significant majority of foes by mastering a few modes of attack.

Also, spellcasters tend to have the most ways to fight things. There's more variety in their numerous attack spells than there is in the weapons and special attacks (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/specialAttacks.htm) available to fighters.

[Doorhandle]

"Classes bad, point-buy good"

That's about it. I utterly despise class systems.

Not going to help him explain it though, even if it is a legitimate complaint.

Also, way I see it* the rogues' main goal is getting into and out of places, whether they are treasure hordes, locked rooms, or fancy clubs, and their excessive list of skills helps this. The sneak attack is an attempt to ensure they are relevant in combat despite this.
They're are also the best at dealing with traps and sneaking, although other classes can substitute quite well.

The fighter, as I see him, has the advantage of being a perpetual motion machine: Assuming normal gear for all classes, a fighter will always be fighting at maximum capacity; as opposed to being limited by how often they can use powers(like the barbarian's rage, limited times/day) and what they can use powers against (paladins can smite evil and only evil.)
The problem is, the best of the fighter is markedly behind the best of the other classes even before spells, and he has NOTHING to make up for it, a problem when all the other classes can get by their limits by resting or choice of campaign.


*(also hackmaster)

[StreamOfTheSky]

Uh.... so you're not going to give it to them straight, I take it?

Because I can't take statements like, "The Fighter's name says it all. He is the master of combat." seriously.

If you're going to give the romanticized notions of what the classes were supposed to be, why not just have them read the fluff before the mechanical bits of each class entry. I think they're pretty well written, I especially love the rogue's:


...What they do share is versatility, adaptability, and resourcefulness. In general, Rogues are skilled at getting what others don't want them to get: entrance into a locked treasure vault, safe passage past a deadly trap, secret battle plans, a guard's trust, or some random person's pocket money.

I mean, holy crap! How can one read that awesomeness and not want to play a rogue?

[Kyberwulf]

Well, apperently, Every class should be listed as useless. Except for wizards.

[TuggyNE]

Well, apperently, Every class should be listed as useless. Except for wizards.

Ahhh, no. No one who has posted in this thread would agree with that exaggeration. For one thing, druids. Also, clerics.

An intro should, however, note that Rogues can be a bit frustrating at times, both in and out of combat; that Rangers may have trouble doing enough damage to be really useful, and that their animal companions are nigh-worthless; that Bards take a bit of a knack to run right; and so on.

[Arbane]

I think your descriptions are fine, although it may help to come up with some examples from pop culture/fiction to help them along, even if they aren't actually from the same genre, as long as they capture the essence of the character. Off the top of my head...

(SNIP)
Bard: ???
Druid: ???


Bard: Sir Robin's Minstrels :smallwink:
Druid: Radagast, Poison Ivy