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TheEscapist
2006-11-24, 02:43 PM
First off, I apologize if this is a rehash of an old thread, but I didn't take the time to look through all the archived threads to check. I'm not sure if newbs such as myself are expected to do so before posting a thread of our own... :smalleek:

But, since the folks at WotC are so reluctant to publish and sort of extensive information on the Far Realms and its layers/denizens (while Lords of Madness is probably my favorite published sourcebook to date, it still fell a little short when it came to the Uvvudaum/pseudonatural creatures/alienists/etc), I now turn to you, the players and DMs, for homebrewed ideas on how to handle alienists and the Far Realms in your campaigns.

Please, post any ideas you have for Far Realms creatures, layers, students of pseudonatural lore, or anything else you think even remotely relates to this topic. When I have some time to write it down, I might post some ideas I've got floating around in my head, once I break them down into game terms.

I am eagerly awaiting your responses, everyone. I'd love to see what you've got.

TheEscapist
2006-11-25, 11:02 AM
Come on, people! Am I the only one obsessed with these unspeakable things not meant to be understood by man?

The_Snark
2006-11-25, 06:08 PM
You aren't alone. There was a creature made a while back, or rather a format for creating generically random things from the Far Realm... Here it is/ (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10719).

Pseudonatural creatures, half-farspawn, and elder eidolons are pretty awesome elements for a campaign using the Far Realms, but I never liked uvvudaums much. First, they're not all that bizarre, and secondly they don't seem powerful enough to be described as lords of the Far Realms. I don't even much like the idea of there being anything more than a who eats (or otherwise destroys) who ecology in the Far Realms. There certainly should not be a uniform class of beings who consistently dominate parts of the Far Realms. Also, creatures from the Far Realm aren't supposed to be terribly interested in the Material Plane, for the most part; if they were, the Material Plane would be in a lot of trouble. For the most part, they ignore the Material Plane and it ignores them.

So the real problem comes when alienists and other wierd cultists start disturbing things from the Far Realms. Alienists, fleshwarpers, elder eidolons, and a variety of half-farspawn/pseudonatural minions work well for opponents here. Tsochar and aboleths sometimes fit in, too, since they're associated with the Elder Evils. There are some good creatures from the Fiend Folio, too; kaorti as an enemy race, plus a few minion-creatures like rukanyr (or whatever they're called) and skybleeders.

If cultists actually manage to summon something powerful from the Far Realms, its first act should always be to consume most of the cult and then start rampaging. Can't reason with them, and they don't discriminate.

The main problem with an entire campaign centering around the Far Realms is that you have to be sparing with its creatures, or else the players get used to them, which should definitely never happen. If possible, try to make sure they don't know what an opponent is or anything about what it can do, which probably means a lot of homebrewed creatures or templates. Most of the enemies will probably be cultists and alienists, with pseudonatural summoned creatures to throw in a bit of wierdness, and then occasionally something wierder appears.

The Sanity variant from Unearthed Arcana is good too, but it should only be used for things from the Far Realms. Ordinary zombies or ordinary spells shouldn't damage sanity.

Golthur
2006-11-29, 03:13 PM
I've pulled in a few "far realms"-ish creatures for my in-progress "Atlantean Lovecraftian steampunk" campaign setting from Call of Cthulhu d20 - including one of my main "bad guy" races, which ends up being modelled after the Shoggoth Lord.

I'm a long time player/Keeper of BRP CoC, so the "unnatural things from beyond" are part of my schtick. Dozens and dozens of these sorts of things in CoC - if you don't have it, you should take a look.

EDIT:

Specific ones I've used in this and other campaigns:
Cthonians
Deep Ones
Fire Vampires
Formless Spawn of Tsthoggua
Hunting Horrors
Leng Spiders
Shoggoths (!)

Flabbicus
2006-11-29, 03:14 PM
Somebody needs to get Callos De Terran here. :wink:

The Vorpal Tribble
2006-11-29, 03:26 PM
I'll have to link you to my stuff on Wizards as the links were messed up here on GITP :smallannoyed:

Some creatures specifically of or possibly of the Far Realm. A few of these are really old, so may need tweaked however...

Drippitch (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=705973)
M'tu (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=384535)
Muusi (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=434850)
Tohnn (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=692925)
T't't (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=455052)

Golthur
2006-11-29, 03:39 PM
OK, the Drippitch just plain creeped me out.

Well done, well done.

TheEscapist
2006-11-29, 04:02 PM
I'll have to link you to my stuff on Wizards as the links were messed up here on GITP :smallannoyed:

Some creatures specifically of or possibly of the Far Realm. A few of these are really old, so may need tweaked however...

Drippitch (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=705973)
M'tu (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=384535)
Muusi (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=434850)
Tohnn (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=692925)
T't't (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=455052)

I liked them all, but I'm personally a big fan of the t't't... How do you pronounce that, by the way? And was it, perchance, inspired by the mention of the colossal, layer-spanning shapes in the oft-copy-pasted WotC description of the Far Realms (it seems I coincidentally lent out all of my sourcebooks from which I could copy it as an example). Not accusing you of unoriginatlity there, just curious because I've often wondered what the game stats of these "colossal shapes" might be. The closest I've found in the official sourcebooks that I consider somewhat Far Realmsian is the cloud ray from Monster Manual II, possibly because MMII is extremely skimpy on the non-combat-related details of its creatures so it leaves lots of room for imagination.

The Glyphstone
2006-11-29, 04:13 PM
I was going to post a link to my Far Beast rules, but someone beat me to it.:smallsmile:

Callos_DeTerran
2006-11-29, 04:15 PM
Somebody needs to get Callos De Terran here. :wink:



*magical poof entrance* Did someone utter my name?

Hmmm, I would have to say that Golthur has the right idea here. Don't use creatures from the Far Realms very often or players become numb to them. To use them in the properly madness and terror inspiring way they should be used, turn to over information. Propaganda even.

Let players discover eldritch sites of power from long forgotten races who tapped the Far Realm's power. Creepy (Read: like the Necronomicon. Flesh wrapped and skin paged and all that jazz) books that detail these horrendous abominations that no loving deity ever intended to exist and that focus on their previous success's and general unstoppableness. Never once suggest these things can be beaten.

Throw in the sick degenerate cults that have access to technology and magic never seen by your players before and by the time they enouncter something that even resembles a Far Realm being and you'll have them wetting their pants in fear of it.

Under exposure is your ultimate weapon here. Hint at the hopelessness your PC's will face if they get a taste of the Far Realm. And remember, things from the Far Realm don't make sense. Homebrew all you want, have a monkey's body, unicorn headed, sparrow winged, and octupus legged creature stalk the PC's and when they claim such a creature can't exist point out two things.

A) Its D&D. Anything can exist.

B) That they've just met one of the lowest rungs on the Far Realm food chain with the top being insane continent size beings that make gods meekly sit down and just try to contain them.

Hope that helps.

The Vorpal Tribble
2006-11-29, 04:23 PM
I liked them all, but I'm personally a big fan of the t't't... How do you pronounce that, by the way?Unpronouncable by the human tongue :smallbiggrin:

Tee-tuh-teh probably being the closest.


And was it, perchance, inspired by the mention of the colossal, layer-spanning shapes in the oft-copy-pasted WotC description of the Far Realms (it seems I coincidentally lent out all of my sourcebooks from which I could copy it as an example). Not accusing you of unoriginatlity there, just curious because I've often wondered what the game stats of these "colossal shapes" might be.I vaguely recall that line, but I don't believe its what gave me the idea. I wrote it while having a 102 temperature and feeling kinda odd in the head, so I blame the virus... which has just given me an idea...

Callos_DeTerran
2006-11-29, 04:30 PM
There really aren't stats for the collossal shapes drifting between the layers of the Far Realm. They do have deity level power afterall.

Bah, twas not a virus. Twas something giving you...er I guess it wouldn't be divine inspiration. And I shudder to think waht new idea you got from a virus.

TheEscapist
2006-11-29, 08:57 PM
Please, don't misunderstand, I'm not asking because I'm looking for information on how to play a game that takes place entirely inside the Far Realms. I was, however, originally curious if anyone had any ideas for descriptions and characteristics of the infinite layers of the Far Realms, In case a DM were to want to give PC's a firsthand look at what insurountable madness lurks outside the borders of the planes as we know them, right before pulling the party's collective ass out of the 5-dimensional, non-euclidean fire. But now I realize that defining these layers would make the Far Realms seem disappointingly similar to the infinite-layered Abyss...

*sigh* Why does it have to be so difficult to examine and categorize things that our brains and abilities of spatial perception were never meant to understand?

Heh. Really, my obsession with the Far Realms comes from my love of the concept that there can still be things that seem alien and horrifying to people who habitually summon fire elementals to warm their morning bath because they don't feel like getting out of bed. As a former DM of several 2nd edition Planescape campaigns, I find it comforting that even when players have taken a walking tour of the Nine Hells, seen and done it all, I can still find things that they'll only be able to describe as 'weird.'

Igfig
2006-11-29, 09:38 PM
I once made a monster so unstable that all of its stats and abilities changed every turn. Unfortunately I lost the program that generated said stats and abilities.

As for what it's like in the Far Realms, that's a toughie. The Outer Planes all have a certain consistency to them, even the Abyss and Limbo; but the Far Realm has none of that at all. Physics, geometry, philosophy: none of those work there. Inch-long fetuses rain from the sky, spontaneously growing spider legs just before impact and scuttling away into the folds of your clothing. Your limbs suddenly catch fire, but the flames aren't flames, they're mile-long tentacles that light up your surroundings with the blackness they give off. Squares have three edges; triangles have eleven points, one edge, and fourteen thousand faces. Your leg informs you that it's intending to migrate to the back of your head, and then does so. Your visual memories are all cubist and blue. A slug walks past and tips its hat; without perspective, you can't tell whether it's a centimetre long and ten centimetres away, or a hundred kilometers long and a thousand away (or, for all you can tell, a hundred kilometers long and ten centimetres away). Distance is time and time is distance, when they exist at all. Singulars becomes plural and adjectival becomes noun. The Giant updates OOtS at 5:30 AM on a Monday.

Such is the madness of the Far Realm. Sorta.

The_Snark
2006-11-29, 09:42 PM
Unpronouncable by the human tongue :smallbiggrin:

Tee-tuh-teh probably being the closest.

Actually, it reminded me of one of Ray Bradbury's Martian names. Mr. Ttt, I'm pretty sure it was.

Hmmm, description of the Far Realms? Hmmm... let's see. The old Manual of the Planes had some descriptions, but it's pretty generically wierd stuff. A lot of it is replaceable.

My personal view is that being in the Far Realms is somewhat like swimming in jello, except that you can breathe; you're breathing in MADNESS, but you won't suffocate. The layers aren't actually any different from one another; in fact, they're visible from the adjacent layers. Anything can move between layers, just by thinking about it- but they can't physically reach the boundaries between layers, even though they can see them. Occasionally, a layer will sprout a planar trait for a while, or catch fire, or melt into another layer, or whatever.

And yeah, a campaign set in the Far Realms wouldn't really work... It'd be like Call of Cthulu, only without even the semblance of normality, and the inevitable death/insanity would likely happen in hours or days. They're definitely best for short visits, particularly if your PCs have been getting cocky lately. But those visits are awesome... particularly if one of the PCs (or a powerful NPC) goes mad on entering, which pretty quickly cues them in on the fact that their primary objective, now that they're here, should be to get out as soon as possible.

So, yeah... the twin paradoxes with using the Far Realms and associated creatures are:
1: You can't use them too often, or the PCs will get used to them. But they're awesome.

and 2:


so difficult to examine and categorize things that our brains and abilities of spatial perception were never meant to understand?

Yep. You definitely need a good imagination to make them have the right impact...

The Vorpal Tribble
2006-11-30, 12:14 AM
There is a thread on Wizards devoted soley to designing individual layers of the Far Realm. I'll see if I can locate it.

Igfig
2006-11-30, 12:44 AM
Beat you to it. (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=224880)

bosssmiley
2006-11-30, 05:34 AM
Dragon #330 - a Far Realms special.

Spells of madness an aberration cultist PrC that gradually gets madder, more mutated and more uncontrollably powerful (cerebrosis ftw!), about a dozen of the nastiest aberrations I've seen (CR from 1-18), oh and a great article on Far Realm planar intrusions. I haven't read anything so nasty since the first Shadowlands book for L5R! :smallbiggrin:

Read it. laugh evilly. Expect your players to hate you. :smallcool:

On these boards Glyphstone, VT and DementedOne are probably the goto guys for demented gribble. They're great like that.

MegasquidMan
2006-12-14, 12:17 AM
Oooh, SWEET! a Far Realm topic!

I just wanted to say that I'm damn-near obcessed with this realm of existance ever since I bought the Lords fo Madness book.

I currently don't have much to contribute, Buuut... I do have an idea of a killer feat for those who take Abberant feats. I'll type it up tomorrow.

SeekerInTheNight
2006-12-14, 01:02 AM
Alienists huh? ^^ I'd forgotten all about this prestidge class. Never really been my thing you know? But it doesn't mean I haven't read something on it...

But its been a long time. All I remember is that it was in a massive epic story about the redemption of a Succubus by a Paladin, and the conflict between Good and Law. Yes, you heard me, Good and Law.

One of the characters was named Mostin the Metagnostic, an alienist that did a lot of writing on the Far Realms and such. He summoned something... big.

Looking for the story.

MegasquidMan
2006-12-14, 09:43 PM
Alright.

Alright alright alright alright alright alright alRIGHT!

I'm sure someone, beit in here, or on some other board, has made a feat similar to my own, but I have made a Feat concerning Half-Farspawn. Especially those who want to transcend the flesh... to become pure madness incarnate. I must warn you all though, it's for those who want characters (beit PCs, or NPCs) with enough terrifying charisma to make even the bravest hero tremble.


Farspawn Apotheosis [Aberrant Feat]

"Your Half-Farspawn heritage has completely taken over, dramatically transforming your body, making you a true denizen of the Far Realm."

Prerequisites: Character Lv 12, 4 or more Aberrant Feats (excluding this one), + 18 Wisdom, Humanoid (initially, even if you have the Half-Farspawn Template), Half-Farspawn Template.

Benefits: The Benefits are appropriate to what Aberrant Feats you had, beforehand.
Bestial Hide: Instead of your AC increasing by 1 for every 2 Aberrant Feats, it increases by 1 for each Aberrant Feat.
Durable Form: Along with previously granted benefits that this Feat gave you, your size goes up by one (For example: A Medium monster becomes a Large monster, and becuase of the new size, Face increases by 5', Reach increases by 5', +8 Strength, -2 Dexterity, +4 Constitution, Nat AC +2, AC and Atk -1. Calculate accordingly to size increases.)
Inhuman Reach: Your Arms become much more flexible (beit by multiple joints, elasticty, for example); the previous -1 penalty on melee attack rolls in negated.
Inhuman Vision: Spot check racial bonuses are now equal to two for every Aberrant Feat, and Infravision is increases by 10 ft for every Aberrant Feat you possess.
Star Spawn:Your fly speed is equal to your base land speed (average maneuverability becomes good maneuverability). You can use flight for a number of rounds equal to 2x your Constitution Modifier (minimum of 2 rounds), between their uses, you cannot fly for 2 rounds. Resistance to cold becomes 10, Immunities concerning Starspawn remain the same.
Warped Mind: Racial bonuses on Will saves against mind-effecting spells are abilities are now equal to the number of Aberrant Feats you havem You gain 2 psionic Power Points for each Aberrant Feat you have,
Waterspawn: Your swimming speed becomes double your land speed. Your resistance to cold becomes 10. Other racial bonuses pertaining to the Waterspawn Feat remain the same (such as the ability to breath underwater, for example).

Apart from the above mentioned, you gain 2 additional tentacles (see Half-Farspawn Template for details on tentacles), and any reamaining abilities from the Half-Farspawn Template get transferred over.



Now... I did exclude Scavenging Gullet and Deepspawn for a few reasons. One of which being... Do you REALLY want to beef up an already disgusting, and self-explanitory feat like Scavenging Gullet? The bonuses I feel are high enough for it, as it is (Fortitude saves). And as for Deepspawn, there isn't much to improve upon for it( I was thinking of maybe adding Tramorsense for an added benefit for Deepspawn, but I don't know if it really makes a difference since you get Blindsense).

I'd like to see what you all think of this ÜBERLY-POWERFUL, but scene-setting feat for "Those who are madness incarnate, disguised in mortal flesh". I think I did a decent job. Besides, I feel that Half-Farspawn make good guardians/villains (beit mad sorcerers who dream black dreams, clerics/cultists who have inimicable plans for the world around them, or unusual fighters whose moves/fighting styles are as unusual as they are) to make a campaign unsettling, but definetly never boring.

But as mentioned before... never use them often... but if you feel like making an army of them at one point in your campaign (I suggest doing so AFTER a few minor occurances), that would be interesting too.

The_Snark
2006-12-14, 09:50 PM
It's a nice feat, although maybe a bit overpowered. Still, you've taken four feats and a template to get it, so it wouldn't be all that worldshaking—the only thing that looks over the top is the benefit for Durable Form.

Oh, yes, the other problem is that you have to be a humanoid to take Abberant feats, and half-farspawn don't qualify. But I could see that being waived easily enough.

Though I disagree with you on Scavenging Gullet. +4 bonus on saves against ingested poisons/diseases? It isn't all that great, and as cool as the ability to survive off eating such things as rope, parchment, and wood is, it isn't really much of a benefit. Deepspawn, though, is fine as it is.

Also, does it provide any benefit to the generic Abberant Blood feat?

MegasquidMan
2006-12-14, 10:15 PM
Well, The_Snark, the benefits for Durable Form I only translated since the size increases. It was my friend who explained the schematics to me for one certain-sized creature to get understandable changes when size increases.

I kinda forgot about that Half-Farspawn are always considered Native Outsiders. Though, I usually consider a Half-Farspawn human to be a humanoid... in a sense (so yes, This is more inclined to Half-Farspawn Humans/Humanoids... so no Farspawn-induced Dragons, or Tarrasque, people :smallbiggrin: )

Wood, parchment, and rope eh? Hehehe, Your mind is so much cleaner than my own... I figured such advances probably pertaining to eatting hair, teeth, and dung (similar to how a hyena eats, seeing as they eat EVERYTHING on a carcass)... a gross feat requires gross boosts... see why I didn't want to do anything to it? :smallwink:

As for the stackable abilties that Aberration Blood gives (Tail, Slimy Skin, Segmented eyes, etc)... No, they stay the same. If I did advance them, then and only then would the Farspawn Apotheosis feat be too powerful (because then I'd be advancing everything). And yes, to get Aberrant Feats, you need Aberration Blood (I kinda tied this feat to the Half-Farspawn, becuase, unless the... 'inserter', was an Uvuudaum, a Neh-Thallgu, a Psurlon, a Kaorti, or any of the 'recognizable' FarNatives... it gives your character/villain 'room to grow' becuase of the unpredicatableness of the 'other parent' and what it is)

TheEscapist
2006-12-14, 10:57 PM
I like the half-farspawn template, but I had never before actually considered making a character with it. I much prefer it to the pseudonatural template, though, mostly because the pseudonatural's "alternate form" ability is so... boring. Transforming into a writhing mass of mucus, tentacles, eyes, and less recognizable bodily components should translate to a much more substantial game effect than just a -1 to attack rolls against you.

I've always wanted a template that would fit somewhere in the middle of the two, though, since half-farspawn is too high-tier a template for my Wizard 3/Cleric 3/Mystic Theurge 2/Alienist 1 to fudge his summon monster spells with. Anyone have any ideas on how to beef up the alternate form ability, but still keep the pseudonatural template at a +1 level adjustment?

MegasquidMan
2006-12-14, 11:23 PM
hmmmm. That's a tough one. But as for Alternate Form's effect, to me, it makes sense, becuase it's transformed into something unsettling, rather than something pants-wettingly terrifying (to me, a Pseudonatural T-Rex's Alternate form ISN'T a writhing mass of tentacles... imagine a beast with nine eyes, three on each side, and three on the top of the skull going to the nose, 5 short but flailing tentacles, two where it's arms would be, and three beneath them, placed similar to the dots on the "5" side of a six-sided dice, long, writhing, cilia-like tentacles coming from the back, a tail similar to a slug's tail (stumpy and thick), two long growths coming from the shoulder blades, ending in bioluminescent balls, a slimy fin, reminiscant of a mudskipper's, cresting the end of the head, the lower jaw is split in two, and the mouth filled with stinger cell tentacles, like a Jellyfish. All put together in scales colored and as shiny as steel. Ya see, an 'Alternate form' doesn't have to fit the typical as the book recomends.. then again, it does say 'or another appropriately gruesome form, as described by the DM' so I am right to say that you can be more flexible)

TheEscapist
2006-12-15, 06:34 PM
hmmmm. That's a tough one. But as for Alternate Form's effect, to me, it makes sense, becuase it's transformed into something unsettling, rather than something pants-wettingly terrifying (to me, a Pseudonatural T-Rex's Alternate form ISN'T a writhing mass of tentacles... imagine a beast with nine eyes, three on each side, and three on the top of the skull going to the nose, 5 short but flailing tentacles, two where it's arms would be, and three beneath them, placed similar to the dots on the "5" side of a six-sided dice, long, writhing, cilia-like tentacles coming from the back, a tail similar to a slug's tail (stumpy and thick), two long growths coming from the shoulder blades, ending in bioluminescent balls, a slimy fin, reminiscant of a mudskipper's, cresting the end of the head, the lower jaw is split in two, and the mouth filled with stinger cell tentacles, like a Jellyfish. All put together in scales colored and as shiny as steel. Ya see, an 'Alternate form' doesn't have to fit the typical as the book recomends.. then again, it does say 'or another appropriately gruesome form, as described by the DM' so I am right to say that you can be more flexible)

Well, I personally consider the idea of facing down just a regular old T-Rex to be pretty pants-wettingly terrifying, but that's just me... :smallwink:

But back to what I was saying, even your example helps illustrate what I'm talking about. With all those eyes, shouldn't it get a spot bonus or the ability to negate flanking bonuses? All those tendrils and cilia could pick up vibrations in the ground or in the air, so why not a listen bonus or tremorsense? If its exterior anatomy is so weird, why should its internal anatomy be any different? Why not immunity to, or at least fortification against, critical hits?

The point I'm trying to make is that if a pseudonatural creature really is from the Far Realms, the alternate form shouldn't be just for show. In fact, it should be the opposite - the 'normal form' simply allows the pseudonatural create to do a better job of fitting in while on the Prime Material Plane. The misleadingly named 'alternate form' is the pseudonatural creature's native (I hesitate to use the word 'natural') form.

The problem I keep running into is how to give a pseudonatural creature these additional abilities while keeping it at a +1 level adjustment.

MegasquidMan
2006-12-15, 07:32 PM
Well, to me... the eyes and cilia are merely cosmetic: Something to add to the unsettling nature of these things. Also, I usually felt that the "normal form" was something... rudimentary. But then again, I always pictured the higher the summon level, the more accurate (or close enough) the "Normal Form" was (i.e. a Pseudonatural Hyena in Normal form would have no fur, blackened, thick skin covered in veins, a glowing red mane which was actually thin cilia, reddish eyes, two where they should be on the face, and a smaller two by the jawline, and each paw being covered by two thick claw-like talons, one in the front, one on the back, whereas a T-Rex, in Normal Form, would still have the metallic scales, but it's form would be similar to a regual one, only with extra eyes, and small tabs of extra skin here and there).

However, I can understand your feelings on how there should be more... perhaps add weaker versions of tremorsense and negate flanking (or anything else you can think of... maybe add a little list, like Yuan-ti Halfbloods), maybe add penalties, or treat them like skills, with bonuses to add to the dice roll (perhaps bonuses +4 or less).

I hope that this can give you some ideas of what to do.

TheEscapist
2006-12-16, 12:43 AM
I can understand your feelings on how there should be more... perhaps add weaker versions of tremorsense and negate flanking (or anything else you can think of... maybe add a little list, like Yuan-ti Halfbloods), maybe add penalties, or treat them like skills, with bonuses to add to the dice roll (perhaps bonuses +4 or less).

I hope that this can give you some ideas of what to do.

Yeah, I think I'll work on some sort of random pseudonatural ability generator that pseudonatural creatures would use in place of the -1 to attacks against them. The -1 to attacks would be included in the generator, but it'd just be one of the possible pseudonatural abilities the creature has when it assumes its alternate (native) form. It would make more sense for this roll to be made once, when the pseudonatural creature is first created (on paper), but the idea of a creature that has a different ability each time it transforms is appealing, too...

I'll post what I come up with when I'm not too tired to think. :smallsigh:

MegasquidMan
2006-12-16, 03:30 PM
Ok, I can't wait to see it.

Ya know... I've thought about Alienists, and I wondered... has anyone ever bothered to make or play a good Alienist?

I mean, so long as your character isn't a Lawful something, you could play a good character. But would a Good Alienist be distinguishable from a Neutral or Evil Alienist? And if so, how would it be distinguishable? Also, granted it's a 'Prestige Class', but so far the only useful, and uniquely-good classes I've seen are most of the Prestige Classes from Lord of Madness... nothing personal to any of the others, but most of them feel like mere beef-ups of your original classes, and don't bring much meat to the table (unlike a Fleshwarper where you DO take a new, and bizarre interest, or an Abolisher of Keeper of the Cerulean Sign, where they specialize in potent magic and skills that destorys things of an unnatural design, or prevents their influence from spreading [like undead and aberrations]... but not Darkrunners, becuase I merely see them as Underdark Rangers, and the Sanctified Mind [as cool as they are] as a fusion of a Paladin and a Psion, in the rudimentary sense, and Topaz Order is another "beef-up" class, rather than something unique.).

The_Snark
2006-12-17, 03:15 PM
Well, to me... the eyes and cilia are merely cosmetic: Something to add to the unsettling nature of these things. Also, I usually felt that the "normal form" was something... rudimentary. But then again, I always pictured the higher the summon level, the more accurate (or close enough) the "Normal Form" was (i.e. a Pseudonatural Hyena in Normal form would have no fur, blackened, thick skin covered in veins, a glowing red mane which was actually thin cilia, reddish eyes, two where they should be on the face, and a smaller two by the jawline, and each paw being covered by two thick claw-like talons, one in the front, one on the back, whereas a T-Rex, in Normal Form, would still have the metallic scales, but it's form would be similar to a regual one, only with extra eyes, and small tabs of extra skin here and there).


Really? I'd have put it the other way around... it seems like the more powerful the summoned entity is, the more trouble it has keeping the insanity that forms its very being in the semblance of a mortal frame. So even in normal form, a pseudonatural Gargantuan monstrous scorpion looks pretty odd. Once it's transformed, it's no longer even recognizable.

Also, chaos beasts make good Far Realm natives.

And a random table of alternate form abilities would be sorta nice—it never quite made sense to me that changing to a mass of tentacles didn't change its attacks at all. The half-farspawn is a nice change to that, but it is significantly more powerful.

TheEscapist
2006-12-17, 04:02 PM
And a random table of alternate form abilities would be sorta nice—it never quite made sense to me that changing to a mass of tentacles didn't change its attacks at all. The half-farspawn is a nice change to that, but it is significantly more powerful.

It's settled, then! I'll get to work on the random table immediately! Seriously this time, though...

It actually also reminds me of an artifact I designed for 2nd edition that could easily be translated into 3.5, in fact it was actually formed of the last living vestige of a defeated God of Chaos. Sometimes the line between the Far Realms and the planes of chaos gets blurred in my mind (incidentally, a discussion of the difference between the chaos of Limbo and the all-out weirdness of the Far Realms might be good, too, not to mention a bit helpful to my sometimes scattered mind), but I supposed it might be possible to tweak it so it's more Far Realms-aligned.

In the meantime, here (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/Emptiverse/Charidin.jpg)'s a link to a drawing of my wizard/cleric/mystic theurge/alienist, with one of his friendly summoned pseudonatural centipedes in the background.

And here (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/Emptiverse/HelloCthulhu.jpg)'s his kitty familiar in pseudonatural form.

(just kidding)

MegasquidMan
2006-12-17, 09:37 PM
Really? I'd have put it the other way around... it seems like the more powerful the summoned entity is, the more trouble it has keeping the insanity that forms its very being in the semblance of a mortal frame. So even in normal form, a pseudonatural Gargantuan monstrous scorpion looks pretty odd. Once it's transformed, it's no longer even recognizable.

Also, chaos beasts make good Far Realm natives.

And a random table of alternate form abilities would be sorta nice—it never quite made sense to me that changing to a mass of tentacles didn't change its attacks at all. The half-farspawn is a nice change to that, but it is significantly more powerful.


Well, yeah, I kinda... didn't explain myself fully... I figured the Alternative forms would be stark differences than the normal forms... but moreso if the normal forms seem more.. "normaler" the higher you go. Kinda like how a cracked gem isn't a valuable as a refined gem.

And yes, Chaos Beasts make good Far natives, as do Akleu, Kyra, and Xorbeasts (3 out of 6 "Horrors of the Daelkyr" of Ebberon, found in Dragon Issue 348, and yes, you can use them outside of Ebberon campaigns).

BTW, Escapist, that is an AWSM picture of your character. And I like the... Psuedonatural Centipede in the background. I'd scan in an unusual character I drew once, but I don't becuase for those who do know me, and go to this board... I don't want them to know of a secret that I want to hold onto until his premiere (hin't: VERY evil character).

MegasquidMan
2007-03-05, 04:36 PM
Hmm, I thought of something... Is there more than one way for a Half-Farspawn to come into existence?

In Lords of Madness, it's explained that they are typically made by a willing/forced "coupling" (much like how any Half-templated creature is formed). However, much like Yuan-Ti, I can see a few other ways on how to have it happen. here are some of my theories/ideas:

#1: A normal creature being introduced into the Far Realms itself, and surviving... for the most part.

Yes, I kinda gotten a cue from seeing two illustrations in the LoM book. The pic of the wizard trapped in the Far Realm, and Akhando, a Half-Farspawn Cleric of Mak Thuum-Ngatha. The two look similar to me. Plus, I do know that that particular plane of existance is highly morphic, so growing tentacles and alien eyes on your arm whilst hopelessly floating in the Screaming Madness could have indeed made Akhando what he is now.

#2: For Clerics/Cultists, make more by some form of Ritual.

Seeing as I saw the Yuan-Ti Cultist Prestige Class do something similar, it only makes sense to me that this could be another way for this to be feasible to add some alien flavour to disciplies, willing (most likely), or otherwise.

#3: Experimentation through genetic altering (usually forced, unless done on yourself).

This one isn't as clearly though-out as the other ones, but I can see a Fleshwarper, or some mastermind whose head of of organization or cult to do these things. Maybe a Nihilistic Human could be in charge, or even go as far as an unusually intelligent Chuul (or some other Aberration), whose ancestral blood still ring commands to bring terror with an unstoppable army. It's all very open-ended, for now.

I know this thread is a little old, and not recently looks at, but I figured I'd bump it with something a little to add to it.