World of Warcraft XV: Thunder, Thunder, Thunder King Ho!

[Zherog]

A thread of all of us Giant ITP'ers to discuss World of Warcraft.

Lets hear about your success and failures!
Lore discussions, class discussions, faction discussions.

Also, ask questions. Crowd source those problems.

Obligatory Linkages:
www.worldofwarcraft.com --official site
mmo-champion.com --news site
www.wowpedia.org --encylopedia of the Warcraft Universe
www.wowhead.com --search engine for pretty much anything in the game. Items, quests, achievements, enemies, everything.
www.tankspot.com --strategy guides, class guides and videos, forums. PST and The Weekly Marmot are posted on this site.

Previous Thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=260258)

[Traab]

I hate patch days. I have always hated them. For the last 14 years of online gaming, patch days have been the single most obnoxious feature ever included on them. I know, I KNOW they are needed. It doesnt make them suck less. I ESPECIALLY hate them now though. I cant play diablo 3, starcraft 2, OR world of warcraft for about half the damn day. The servers go down literally, the moment my alarm clock goes off in the morning. I dont even have time to say, log in for 5 minutes to see if I got my brawlers ticket first. And for the next 8 hours or so, sometimes longer, pretty much every game I like playing is unavailable to me.

[MCerberus]

I hate patch days. I have always hated them. For the last 14 years of online gaming, patch days have been the single most obnoxious feature ever included on them. I know, I KNOW they are needed. It doesnt make them suck less. I ESPECIALLY hate them now though. I cant play diablo 3, starcraft 2, OR world of warcraft for about half the damn day. The servers go down literally, the moment my alarm clock goes off in the morning. I dont even have time to say, log in for 5 minutes to see if I got my brawlers ticket first. And for the next 8 hours or so, sometimes longer, pretty much every game I like playing is unavailable to me.

You might want to look specifically for a game that doesn't have down-time at the same time frame. There's a long tradition of this, going back to when ut2004 was a popular diversion.

Turbine does their maintenance on Mondays, so DDO may be a good one to look at. There's always some Steam game f2p like TF2, Spiral Knights, or Super Monday Night Combat. League loves to pull Tuesday patches, and they usually hit the NA server around 6 AM eastern... so yah.

[Antonok]

So servers are up now. And the first thing I decided to do was hit Krol and Scritch for the elixir and pipe respectively. Well, Krol dropped the elixir, but Scritch decided to be stingy. Which got me thinking, I've killed scritch almost 3x as much as Krol, but I've gotten around 6 elixirs so far but only 1 pipe. Why is it so hard to get that gorram pipe to drop?

[Traab]

Like he said, servers are up, and I got me my brawler invite! Woohoo! Time to go see how far I can make it. Wait, do you guys hear the rocky theme, or is it just me?

[Zherog]

Another five or so Strat runs last night with no mount. I've taken to vendoring everything except cloth, spider silk, and the occassional aquamarine gem that drops. I've found that DE'ing the stuff gives me less money, so I just vendor trash all the drops.

With the raid reset, I can take another shot at Midnight. Generally, even though Attumen is so close to the entrance, I hit as much of Kara as possible so I can rack up some Violet Eye rep. I'll also do my weekly MC run in the next couple of days, to rack up Waterlord rep. I intend to get back up to the tournament grounds in the near future so I can work on getitng the mounts and pets up there as well. Once I get either the baron's mount or Midnight, I'll find another mount that I can try and farm.

[Karoht]

Speaking of the Thunder King...

So we went in last night with just the Thunder King left to kill. And he has usually been a pain in the butt. All of our kills have been rather sloppy, but we've killed it. So we were all mentally prepared for a dozen wipes kind of thing.

Last night? One shot. Boo yeah.
Of course, it's back to Heroic Jin'rohk tonight. I won't be streaming because my Xsplit license has run out, I should have that back next week for streaming though.

So I took my fiance through Ulduar last night. We managed to get up to Yogg, but he was too much annoyance for two people to deal with. Still, I managed to score her 30 different acheivements, and she helped me get some of the non-meta's I was missing. I picked up 6 achievements last night.

[Seerow]

Speaking of the Thunder King...

So we went in last night with just the Thunder King left to kill. And he has usually been a pain in the butt. All of our kills have been rather sloppy, but we've killed it. So we were all mentally prepared for a dozen wipes kind of thing.

Last night? One shot. Boo yeah.
Of course, it's back to Heroic Jin'rohk tonight. I won't be streaming because my Xsplit license has run out, I should have that back next week for streaming though.

So I took my fiance through Ulduar last night. We managed to get up to Yogg, but he was too much annoyance for two people to deal with. Still, I managed to score her 30 different acheivements, and she helped me get some of the non-meta's I was missing. I picked up 6 achievements last night.

I had the same problem with Yogg. Around 4 people seems to be the sweet spot where it goes from impossible even with 3 lights, to doable with no lights. With 2 you just get too much insanity from random crap you can't even defend against. More people seems to spread it out more and slow it down some.

This reminds me, time to compile a list of wrath achievements I still need:

Dungeon Achieves:
Actually have most of these.

-Share the Love (requires full party of 5 to sit there and wait to get impaled. This one will be the hardest, just finding 4 others willing to help)
-Zombiefest (I have tried this one several times but always seem to end up short on zombies, and no idea why)
-The Faceroller (ToC is a pain solo. I've done it, but the horse fight took literally 30 minutes. And then this boss shows up only randomly, and the timing for the kill shot has to be perfect... I may just skip this one. It's not even part of the meta)
-Soul Power (tried this one solo a while ago, only to find out the soul fragment doesn't spawn if there's only one person fighting. Go figure.

Raid Achieves
Mostly missing 25man achieves on early dungeons, plus a scattering of others.

Missing 10man:

Onyxia
-Missing "Many Whelps, Handle it!"
Flame Leviathan
-Missing "Dwarfageddon"
Ulduar Dragon
-Missing "Iron Dwarf, Medium Rare"
XT-Deconstructor
-Missing "Nerf Scrapbots"
Dark Iron Council
-Missing "But I'm on your side!"
-Missing "Can't Do That while you're stunned"
Kologarn
-Missing "If looks could kill"
-Missing "Rubble and Roll"
Auriyaya
-Missing "Nine Lives"
Hodir
-Missing "Getting Cold In Here"
-Missing "Staying Buffed all winter"
Thorim
-Missing "Who needs bloodlust?"
Freya
-Missing "Lumberjacked"
-Missing "Deforestation"
Mimiron
-Missing "Not so Friendly Fire"
General Vizax
-Missing "Shadowdodger"
-Missing "I love the smell of Saronite in the morning"
Yogg-Saron
-Missing "Kiss and Make Up"
-Missing "Drive me Crazy"
-Missing "They're coming out of the walls"
Algalon
-Missing "Supermassive"
Northrend Creatures
-Missing "Upper Back Pain"
Jaraxxus
-Missing "360 pain spike"
Anub'Arak
-Missing "The Traitor King"
Archovon Vaults
-Missing "Earth, Wind and Fire"
Lich King
-Missing "Been Waiting a Long Time for This"
Halion
-Missing Heroic Kill

Wow that was a lot more than I thought. Almost all of them came from Ulduar, but I've gotten like 1-2 achieves from every ulduar boss already, so I was surprised to see I was still missing a whole extra achieve for pretty much every boss in there.

By my count that's 280 points worth of achievements missing, with an extra 50 points from the Ulduar and ICC metas, so 330 achievement points total missing there.

Adding in 40 more for dungeon achieves, plus 25 for the meta, that's up to just shy of 400 achieve points from wrath 5+10man content.

I've probably got another 500 points in 25man achieves I'm missing. I got all of ICC except for Sindragosa's achieve, Lich King's second achieve (ironically the one I already have on 10man), and the Heroic Lich King Kill... but those 3 achieves are triggers for a couple of meta achieves, and worth probably ~100 points by themselves. Then add in all of the Naxx, Ulduar, and ToC stuff I only did maybe half of on 25 man... and you've got a pretty huge chunk of achieves to pick up there.


Then I get to go working on cata stuff. blegh. (Though for normal mode all I need is a kill on Al'Akir, and a run through Dragonsoul which I hear is cake... pretty much all of the fights are foreign to me. I quit right around the time 4.1 dropped, as at that point I'd given raiding a good go for about 6 months or so and was getting sick of the time sink. But given I left right as we were getting into our first few heroic bosses, and didn't come back until 5.0... this whole expansion is a mystery to me, and unlike wrath or BC I can't just go solo my way through most of it. These bosses hit hard enough you want at least a full 5 man group judging by my attempt a while back at BWD)

[Togath]

For Zombie fest, if you can handle the elites, there are exactly 100 zombies in the flaming alley.

[Karoht]

Do a week on normal to clear out the metas. Truthfully they aren't that complicated.
Do a week to clear out the heroics. Truthfully they are still challenging, you will not be able to just burn the boss down.
This applies to all Cata raids, trust me.

Here is a handy breakdown by raid as to the concerns you may have.

ToT4W-Timing checks for the achievements, Heroics are just output checks, enjoy.
BoT-Mostly distractions, easy enough to do while on normal mode, don't bother trying them on Heroic.
BWD-Mechanics checks with a twist. Omnitron Defence System is probably the hardest. The rest are all pretty simple.
Firelands-Out of all of them I would say that Baleroc's and Ragnaros's meta achievements are the most complicated, with Rhyolith taking 3rd place. Alysrazor's isn't hard, it's just a mechanics check, and you can do it over multiple runs. If you have someone who is really good at flying and DPSing, you can kill her before Tornados happen, everything else is painfully easy to avoid.
Dragon Soul-Mostly, the Metas here are all things designed to make the fight much harder. Like a mini-heroic really. Madness had the most variation really, Morchok is a coordination check (easier to get the meta on heroic actually), Zonozz was a temporary difficulty check, same with Yorsahj, Hagara is a coordination check and probably the hardest one to get because it is finicky and needs a very precise set of conditions to accomplish.

Seriously, do the meta's one day and the heroics the next. You'll be better prepared either way.

And if you're going, hit me with an invite. Battletag karoht#1505

[Seerow]

For Zombie fest, if you can handle the elites, there are exactly 100 zombies in the flaming alley.

Thanks for the tip. I spent about 20 minutes trying to round up all of the zombies in the main section, and the closest I got was 80. Not sure what was happening there, but never got all the zombies.

Went into the flaming alley, got it first try. Nearly missed it because I skipped one zombie (I almost died seeing the 99/100 after killing all I had rounded up), but ran back and found it with seconds to spare.


Do a week on normal to clear out the metas. Truthfully they aren't that complicated.
Do a week to clear out the heroics. Truthfully they are still challenging, you will not be able to just burn the boss down.
This applies to all Cata raids, trust me.

Here is a handy breakdown by raid as to the concerns you may have.

ToT4W-Timing checks for the achievements, Heroics are just output checks, enjoy.
BoT-Mostly distractions, easy enough to do while on normal mode, don't bother trying them on Heroic.
BWD-Mechanics checks with a twist. Omnitron Defence System is probably the hardest. The rest are all pretty simple.
Firelands-Out of all of them I would say that Baleroc's and Ragnaros's meta achievements are the most complicated, with Rhyolith taking 3rd place. Alysrazor's isn't hard, it's just a mechanics check, and you can do it over multiple runs. If you have someone who is really good at flying and DPSing, you can kill her before Tornados happen, everything else is painfully easy to avoid.
Dragon Soul-Mostly, the Metas here are all things designed to make the fight much harder. Like a mini-heroic really. Madness had the most variation really, Morchok is a coordination check (easier to get the meta on heroic actually), Zonozz was a temporary difficulty check, same with Yorsahj, Hagara is a coordination check and probably the hardest one to get because it is finicky and needs a very precise set of conditions to accomplish.

Seriously, do the meta's one day and the heroics the next. You'll be better prepared either way.

Yeah some of those metas seem really rough. I remember the Firelands pug I got into for some xmog gear decided to try for some of the metas and just gave up on half of them. Alysrazor for example was just a case of "This obviously won't happen".

But thanks for the tips. Omnitron I've actually already got 3/4 of the things on it (apparently the achieve can be done one at a time), so just need to finish without anyone getting hit by one of the things, rather than all, to get that achieve.

The Heroics just being output checks makes me feel better about it though. That means any decent group of 90s should be able to do them without too much trouble. Might go for that before the metas. Or do you think the Metas are easier?


And if you're going, hit me with an invite. Battletag karoht#1505

I would but we've previously established we run opposite factions. Unless you have some alliance alts you want run with. I'll add you either way (mine is Oshi#1354)

[Sajiri]

Last night while I was doing isle of thunder dailies I managed to run straight into what I assume was some rare in that room with the electric squares you jump across, and got a key to the palace of lei shen off him.

I've been kind of out of the loop on the last two patches and only just started doing them, I guess this is that solo scenario with the treasure chests? Anything I should know before I get home from work and run in blindly?

[The Glyphstone]

Watch youtube videos. They explain it better than any text can.

[Seerow]

Last night while I was doing isle of thunder dailies I managed to run straight into what I assume was some rare in that room with the electric squares you jump across, and got a key to the palace of lei shen off him.

I've been kind of out of the loop on the last two patches and only just started doing them, I guess this is that solo scenario with the treasure chests? Anything I should know before I get home from work and run in blindly?

Yeah all rares have a chance of dropping that key. The key is to the solo scenario as you thought, talk to I think Taoshi (in the cave with the SPA QM) to go.

You can look up information on the scenario, and it probably will help. But it might be more fun to go in blind. It really is just a fun bonus, so screwing it up won't hurt you any. But if you want to go as optimally as possible then just search "Trove of the Thunderking"

Also note: If you have a bunch of Elder Charms (the ones from 5.0) that you don't want/need anymore, you can trade those in for items that help in the scenario. Keys that help you get through faster, a levitation potion to help avoid traps, a rock to set traps off, that sort of thing.

[Sajiri]

I dont actually know what elder charms are even for *fail* bonus rolls in raids or something? I JUST managed to get my ilvl up high enough for LFR last night so Im planning to try that out soon too...I've been incredibly slack this expansion and wasting all my time with transmogging and pet hunting, until I finally found a guild and start doing stuff.

[Karoht]

The Heroics just being output checks makes me feel better about it though. That means any decent group of 90s should be able to do them without too much trouble. Might go for that before the metas. Or do you think the Metas are easier?With a competent group, communicating properly, chances are that the metas will still be harder than the heroics, just due to their execution issues like specific timing and whatnot. With the exception of Spine of Deathwing.
Truthfully I am still unsure how and what a tank should be doing and when, or what the DPS order is. I remember Spine of Deathwing to be one of the hardest things I've honestly ever done in the game. It was difficult to heal, it was difficult to manage my mana, it was hard to decide on healing cooldowns outside of very specific conditions. That whole fight was just a brutal test of output, along with combining some very specific execution as well.
I see H Spine possibly being harder than any of the metas, but that really is just a guess.
The rest of the heroics (for all of Cataclysm) will just be output differences, mostly. If you can execute normal, you can execute heroic, just don't be derps and you will probably win.



I would but we've previously established we run opposite factions. Unless you have some alliance alts you want run with. I'll add you either way (mine is Oshi#1354)
I should probably faction transfer my Pally or DK or Warrior at some point, along with server transfering them. They've been parked at 80 on Kul Tiras for all of Cataclysm. It might be time to dust one of them off, and give them a fair shake.

[Antonok]

I dont actually know what elder charms are even for *fail* bonus rolls in raids or something? I JUST managed to get my ilvl up high enough for LFR last night so Im planning to try that out soon too...I've been incredibly slack this expansion and wasting all my time with transmogging and pet hunting, until I finally found a guild and start doing stuff.

Elder charms are used for bonus rolls on loot from Sha of Anger/Galleon world bosses, raid bosses up to throne of thunder, and used to buy stuff from the Kirin Tor quarter master on Isle of Thunder. Mostly the stuff you buy there is for the vault scenario you need the key for. With the increased loot drop chance in pre ToT raids, its rather easy to get a 480+ ilvl from just one run thru the old raids if you have enough charms.

[The Glyphstone]

Speaking of the vault, I finally managed to kill the treasure saurok, and am now The Stormbreaker!

[Sajiri]

What's the 'average' dps for someone around 460 ilvl? My dps was pretty abysmal going between 12k-30k (if I was lucky) on my hunter at first, but I attributed that to me relearning how to play and doing silly things like spamming arcane shot and using up all my focus, or using cobra shot too much and forgetting to use my other abilities.

I've been reading noxxic and icy veins and spent the last few days working on my gear and remembering my rotation, I can do around 35k pretty consistently now, sometimes going up to 40k+, but then I hear about people doing 150k and I'm just thinking whut? Although someone said my dps is normal for where I'm at, doesnt feel like it should be that big of a difference within the same expansion :s anyone able to help me out here?

Edit: During cata I wouldn't say I was a great player, but I could certainly hold my own on the dps meters, so I feel like I'm doing something wrong here..

[Alarra]

I need the achievement off the first boss in Ulduar to get that meta, because we somehow always manage to screw it up. Have to make a run in there sometime. We really want to get back into Firelands and finish up those achievs too, Zeb's really close to having his staff, but it's a huge pain to find people that will go.

Raiding's been going better lately. We got down two new bosses last week, admittedly we're still in Heart, but still feels good to at least feel like we're making progress. Raid leader asked that we all make sure we have a second spec so I've been playing around with Shadow, which really, I should have had a long time ago, I just don't like doing anything but healing. I don't really relish the idea of needing two sets of gear though, I have enough bag space issues as it is.

[Seerow]

What's the 'average' dps for someone around 460 ilvl? My dps was pretty abysmal going between 12k-30k (if I was lucky) on my hunter at first, but I attributed that to me relearning how to play and doing silly things like spamming arcane shot and using up all my focus, or using cobra shot too much and forgetting to use my other abilities.

I've been reading noxxic and icy veins and spent the last few days working on my gear and remembering my rotation, I can do around 35k pretty consistently now, sometimes going up to 40k+, but then I hear about people doing 150k and I'm just thinking whut? Although someone said my dps is normal for where I'm at, doesnt feel like it should be that big of a difference within the same expansion :s anyone able to help me out here?

Edit: During cata I wouldn't say I was a great player, but I could certainly hold my own on the dps meters, so I feel like I'm doing something wrong here..

35-40k is pretty normal for 463 ilvl. Every tier jump in gear represents a massive increase in capability. Going from 463 to 496 gear is basically going to double your dps. The gap between 496 geared players and 535 geared players basically doubles the DPS again dps.

So you see something like:
463-40k
496-80k
535-160k

Except the actual growth numbers are probably actually a little higher even than that.

Basically don't worry too much about what kind of DPS you're doing unless comparing with another player using the same class/spec and in similar gear.



If you'd like, what I can do is run your character through Simcraft to give you a ballpark estimate of where your DPS should be. Just link your character profile (or give name/server).

[Sajiri]

35-40k is pretty normal for 463 ilvl. Every tier jump in gear represents a massive increase in capability. Going from 463 to 496 gear is basically going to double your dps. The gap between 496 geared players and 535 geared players basically doubles the DPS again dps.

So you see something like:
463-40k
496-80k
535-160k

Except the actual growth numbers are probably actually a little higher even than that.

Basically don't worry too much about what kind of DPS you're doing unless comparing with another player using the same class/spec and in similar gear.



If you'd like, what I can do is run your character through Simcraft to give you a ballpark estimate of where your DPS should be. Just link your character profile (or give name/server).

Whew, thats a relief, I was worried to go into lfr or dungeons that I might get booted for being way below what I should be. Anyway, here's my hunter http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/wyrmrest-accord/Asterei/simple anything you could say would be helpful :) Yes I know I have some gear that seriously needs to be replaced >_>; Also been meaning to fix some of my talents, I just keep forgetting everytime I'm online

[Seerow]

Whew, thats a relief, I was worried to go into lfr or dungeons that I might get booted for being way below what I should be. Anyway, here's my hunter http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/wyrmrest-accord/Asterei/simple anything you could say would be helpful :) Yes I know I have some gear that seriously needs to be replaced >_>; Also been meaning to fix some of my talents, I just keep forgetting everytime I'm online

Your gear doesn't seem too terrible. The green bracer needs replaced (seriously find a PVP piece to replace it if nothing else), but the big things (Weapon and Trinket) are good. You're a bit over Hit cap and a little under expertise cap, I'd recommend using wowreforge.com or askmrrobot.com to hit your caps a little better.

Aside from that I'm not too familiar with hunter stat priorities, so I can't really talk about your reforging. I will however say you should work on gemming/enchanting. I understand not wanting to waste the gold on gear you'll replace soon, but anything you have 463 or higher at least you should gem/enchant. Trust me, it will help a lot.

Anyway, I went ahead and ran you through simcraft. The number I got was 55k with full raid buffs (including Heroism, Skull Banner, etc), then I ran it again just using Attack Power and Crit Buffs (I think those are the ones Hunters get, like I said not a hunter player. If you have different buffs while solo or others I'm not aware of let me know and I'll adjust), and that brought the value down to 41k, which is right around the range where you said you are (being a bit below is normal, there's usually other factors that will impact dps, both in terms of movement/fight mechanics, and in terms of latency/fps etc).

So yeah, doesn't seem like you're doing too terribly with your rotation.

[Sajiri]

I actually used askmrrobot and this is what it put me at for hit and exp. I get attack buff and a mastery buff from my spirit beast. I havent gone in any dungeons or raids since coming back yet so I haven't played with any other buffs, just solo. Now that I'm home I'm about to turn in that lei shan key and try to find some new bracers.

[Togath]

Might as well ask how my hunter's and mage's dps should be as well.
Link to stats (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/shuhalo/Moranus/simple)
mage (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/shuhalo/Ilara/simple)
edit; err.. nevermind about the mage.. just realized I forgot to un-equip the gloves I found in Stratholme(since I wanted to see what they looked like..)

[Krazzman]

Ok, a few things:

with that iLevel there should be more dmg. Assuming fullbuffed in a raid you should do around 50k dps with 365 gear. Starting MoguShanVaults with my shadow I was around 70k in singletarget which was rather bad for shadows back then. But this could be because of optimal gear. As such I would start to aim for around 40k to 45k without raidbuffs (but don't feel bad if you don't get it, I think hunter have some serious issues in dps with what specc they play...).

My advice would be: ReforgeLite. Download it. It is nice, "easy" once you know how it works and quite cool. Feed him your statweighs: set EWxpertise and Hit until cap and then bam: one click reforging.

About our Raid:
We killed Iron Qon. No he didn't drop anything for shadows... yes even the bonusroll...
Got a good hour for twin consorts... and failed terribly. Lu'lin either kills us with Tidal Waves or at least the reason why we didn't kill her in our second pull was: suddenly and out of nowhere: 300k dmg. frigging 4 % wipe because I died right after killing Suen...

[Karoht]

edit; err.. nevermind about the mage.. just realized I forgot to un-equip the gloves I found in Stratholme(since I wanted to see what they looked like..)Tip: You don't have to equip things to view them on your character. Simply hold down the control key and right click. It will pop open a preview window with your character showing the item equiped. Sometimes you need to click more than once though, so if you don't see the item try again.


Got a good hour for twin consorts... and failed terribly. Lu'lin either kills us with Tidal Waves or at least the reason why we didn't kill her in our second pull was: suddenly and out of nowhere: 300k dmg. frigging 4 % wipe because I died right after killing Suen...Tidal Waves you can deal with in 4 ways.
1-Activate Tiger Buff-Easy as heck to dodge.
2-Have the tank drag her to a far corner. Grats, you'll only have to dodge about 25%-30% of the waves you normally would have had to. The extra distance also makes it easier to dodge the waves, even without the Tiger Buff.
3-Pop a healing CD (Tranquility, Hymm, Spirit Link, PW: Barrier, etc)
4-Combinations of the above.

As for that 300K, I am reasonably sure that you didn't hit the enrage timer or anything. I'm not entirely sure what that was. But, to shorten down the fight, are you using the Crane and Serpent abilities? They help tremendously. You can use those two twice each. The Tiger I would only activate in the last phase, about 30-45 seconds into the phase, followed directly by the other two once Tidal Waves is over.


Anyway, I went ahead and ran you through simcraft.Can I ask a favor? Can you check out my fiance? She's doing 60K (upwards of 65, then drops back to 60, probably just crits and such being averaged out) with no CD's and only self-buffed with attack power. I think she's at an ilevel 488. Could you check her out and see if that is in the ballpark? Puumpkhym-Area 52-US-Horde


Raid Update:
Killed Jin'rohk. With only the tanks alive. But we got him. Our warlock got a 541 Heroic Thunderforged ring.
Supposedly, we are trying heroic Ji-Kun tonight. I think the only differences we have to worry about is more puddles on the platform, and we need 2 groups flying to nests, with tanks sporadically being involved in those nests. It sounds mostly like a coordination check really. I am reasonably confident we can deal with it.
After Ji-Kun I hear that our next heroic is probably Iron Qon. Followed by Horridon and Tortos. I look forward to Iron Qon, but not Horridon and Tortos.

[Zherog]

Another Kara run last night; no mount (not too surprising). Did get my rep with Violet Eye up to reverred. So that's something.

[The Glyphstone]

I'm curious - for H-Horridon, does the entire raid get their own hallucinatory pink direhorn to deal with, or is it only select people?

[Karoht]

I'm curious - for H-Horridon, does the entire raid get their own hallucinatory pink direhorn to deal with, or is it only select people?Pretty sure that eventually it is everyone. I haven't watched the Fatboss guide on that just yet.
Come to think of it, I don't think Horridon is going to be THAT bad really. We damn near kill him directly after the 4th door. We have to stop DPS and wait for the other guy to drop down. We two heal it and barely go below 66% of our mana by the end of the fight. I'd say our output is in an excellent place, so if it is just a matter of execution, I'm feeling pretty good about H Horridon.

Randomly:
In another DnD campaign I'm going to play an (half?) Orc Druid. Named Billy. Billy is a nickname he got. His real name is D'Chuka D'amaste Horridon. He will spend most of his time in the form of a blue Triceratops (just like Horridon)
Points if one can identify both references OTHER than Horridon himself.

[Seerow]

I actually used askmrrobot and this is what it put me at for hit and exp. I get attack buff and a mastery buff from my spirit beast. I havent gone in any dungeons or raids since coming back yet so I haven't played with any other buffs, just solo. Now that I'm home I'm about to turn in that lei shan key and try to find some new bracers.


Fair enough regarding the reforging.

Anyway, recalculating with the mastery buff instead of crit buff, the expected dps dropped to 40k.



Might as well ask how my hunter's and mage's dps should be as well.
Link to stats (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/shuhalo/Moranus/simple)
mage (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/shuhalo/Ilara/simple)
edit; err.. nevermind about the mage.. just realized I forgot to un-equip the gloves I found in Stratholme(since I wanted to see what they looked like..)

You can update the armory just by logging in, changing the gear, and logging back out. But okay.

The hunter fully raid buffed has an expected DPS of ~51k. Self buffed, (using the AP/Mastery buffs as Sajiri indicated), has an expected DPS of 36.6kk.


Note: It may seem weird that your expected DPS is lower despite having a higher ilvl than Sajiri, but note that your trinkets and weapon are lower ilvl. Like I said when first looking at their gear, that's by far the most important 3 pieces. Upgrade those 3 slots to 463 and you'll probably see somewhere along the lines of a 10k increase.


with that iLevel there should be more dmg. Assuming fullbuffed in a raid you should do around 50k dps with 365 gear. Starting MoguShanVaults with my shadow I was around 70k in singletarget which was rather bad for shadows back then. But this could be because of optimal gear. As such I would start to aim for around 40k to 45k without raidbuffs (but don't feel bad if you don't get it, I think hunter have some serious issues in dps with what specc they play...).


Different classes scale differently with gear. It could be that Shadow has a shallower gear progression curve, where their dps starts out high, but doesn't scale as quickly as other specs, similar to how Arms works.

Also remember Sajiri said that their numbers were solo/not raid buffed. Which really does make a pretty big difference. (roughly a 15k difference in this case)


Can I ask a favor? Can you check out my fiance? She's doing 60K (upwards of 65, then drops back to 60, probably just crits and such being averaged out) with no CD's and only self-buffed with attack power. I think she's at an ilevel 488. Could you check her out and see if that is in the ballpark? Puumpkhym-Area 52-US-Horde


No problem.
Full Buffed-102.9k DPS
Self Buffed Only (so Physical Vulnerability, Weakened Armor, and Attack Power)-85.6k DPS.


Oh wait, no cooldowns? Why would you even measure DPS that way. Okay modifying the profile to remove cooldown usage gets 73.3k


So yeah, if she's pulling 60-65k, she is on the low end, and is probably messing the rotation up somewhere. What's her general action priority?

[[Edit: I just realized you said she was testing on a Dummy. So no execute! That probably makes a 5-10k difference, give me a minute and I'll update accounting for that]]
[[Edit2: Okay, taking out Execute, and Dragon's Roar (which I had missed last time because I was looking at buff cooldowns, and DR is an attack), the DPS drops down to 58k, right in the range you say.

So she's likely not doing anything very wrong rotationally, it's just really weird to measure DPS without cooldowns so it makes the DPS look much lower than it should]]
[[Edit3: So apparently there are a few actions in the list, primarily HS/Slam that are tied to "Only use this above 80%", so me just removing execute caused a big drop in DPS once the simulated target HP dropped below 20%, as those abilities stopped being used properly. Just fixed that, simmed it again, it jumped back up to 63k

As an aside, this post + 3 edits is a prime example for everybody of why Dummy DPS doesn't matter. By continuing to narrow the restrictions we've gotten from 102k dps to 60kish DPS as the norm.]]

Anyway aside from rotation issues, general things I notice (sorry pickier here because I play an Arms Warrior):
-Warbringer is the worst talent on the mobility tier. Either of the other two is good, but Warbringer gives up the ability to charge more often in exchange for giving you a longer stun that then puts any other stuns you might have on DR (normal charge stun is not on the same DR).

-She should probably have Glyph of Unending Rage, and Glyph of Death from Above. Unending Rage gives you a little more wiggle room on the rage meter, which is good, especially in situations like execute phase where you want to pool rage while CS is down (trying to hover as close to cap as you can without wasting rage), then spam 4 executes inside of a CS. Glyph of Death from above is both a mobility boost (faster HL), and damage boost (HL is off the GCD, and should be used as part of the rotation in any situation where the mobility isn't going to be needed. Preferably during a CS window).

-I'm pretty sure the Elemental Force enchantment is actually better for Arms than Windsong. Remember Arms secondaries that aren't crit are crap, so Windsong is proccing a mostly useless buff 2/3 of the time. That said, dancing steel is definitely the best if you can afford it.

-She's like a full 1% below expertise cap. This is something you probably want to fix.

-The blue sockets in both the weapon and gloves can be ignored safely. She's well over hit cap, so in the sword you are trading 160 crit for 60 strength (bad). In the gloves you are trading 160 crit for 60 haste (even worse). If she was sitting right at hit cap and gaining full benefit out of those gems, it'd be different, but as is, ignore the blue sockets, just take the extra crit.

As an aside, why does she not have any SPA pieces yet? I see she's made 19 kills in ToT, which should put her right around Friend/Honored if I'm not mistaken. She should have the 522 neck and 522 trinket.

Also using wowreforge, I managed to pick up an extra 300 or so crit rating, and hit expertise cap. Reforges in the spoiler:

Helm: Hit->Crit
Amulet: Hit->Expertise
Shoulders: Hit->Expertise
Cloak: Hit->Expertise
Belt: Haste->Crit
Sword: Hit->Expertise

Other slots: Leave as is

[Karoht]

-No SPA pieces due to lack of VP. She doesn't play often, VP capping doesn't happen with her.
-Coulda swore we fixed the expertise thing, we'll deal with that when we get home tonight.
-Dummy DPS is in fact becoming less and less important, except that it is really the only standard metric we have right now. They really need to make better dummies, or hurry up with that Proving Grounds feature they keep talking about.
-I'll talk with her about Warbringer and Death from Above. She's been having mobility issues, this could help. She is very fond of her improved self-healing Glyphs, though I'm sure I can talk her into changing one of them for DFA.
-I think I can afford to buy her a Dancing Steel for her current weapon. Chances are good that she won't see an upgrade for quite a while.

Otherwise glad to hear that she is more or less on target.

[Traab]

Yay! Finally broke the 4k achieve mark! rofl. 4005 baby. FEAR MY AWESOMENESS! Or feel ashamed that I am even trying to brag about a score that freaking low. /cry

[Sajiri]

I did that scenario with the chests last night. I think I wasted a good amount of time since I stepped on a tile trap, which disoriented me so I couldn't get off and ended up dying. Then I had a brain fart and sat there for a bit thinking 'damn I wasted that key' before I realised it would probably just send me back to the start of the scenario rather than kick me out.

Now that I know that my dps is normal for my gear at the moment, I don't feel so terrified to do dungeons and LFR. I have to get into that soon.

Also, I hate Illidan. I need his bow to drop to finish my transmog ;_; I've never seen it drop on any character I've done BT on, yet I've seen him drop the MH legendary several times. I'm starting to wonder if it even exists.

[Karoht]

Also, I hate Illidan. I need his bow to drop to finish my transmog ;_; I've never seen it drop on any character I've done BT on, yet I've seen him drop the MH legendary several times. I'm starting to wonder if it even exists.Illi-beans drops a bow? Are you sure the item you are looking for comes from Black Temple and not Sunwell? You may want to double check that.
This is not sarcasm by the way.

[Sajiri]

(using the AP/Mastery buffs as Sajiri indicated),

I will just point out that that mastery buff would change depending on which pet is used. Hunter would have crit if they used a wolf? I think it was. Spirit beasts and cats I think are the ones that get mastery. Other pets give different buffs..or a debuff, or an ability, so I guess if you're going to be calculating for other hunters might be worth it to have it mentioned which pet/buff they have. I just like using spirit beasts because they have a heal and dammit, I spent a week doing nothing but circling sholazar for loque, I'm gonna use him.

And yes, Illidan does drop a bow http://www.wowhead.com/item=32336

I have both the legendary bow and the one from those twin npcs in sunwell already (I'm actually using that one in my transmog already). Illidan's bow I just want so badly >_<

[MCerberus]

Reroll diary part 1:

Alright, so we have Professor Paperkuts, gnome rogue. Despite not being on an RP realm, let's decide she has a BS in Stabbing People that Call Her Professorship Into Question with a minor in blackmail, masters in experimental horticulture, and a doctorate in stabbing.

The first thing I notice is that I really miss the old schedule of giving abilities. I look down the list and the kit... it's just missing a lot of stuff until level 30. Alright then, gnome starting zone is crazy. Not as funny as the gobbos though.

Pre-10 sucks without heirlooms for a rogue. I actually die twice because I'm not a one gnome army of pointy doom. I mean this really really *hits 10, gets poisons, multilate*... I'm okay with this.

I've managed to sell off some of my expensive farmable battle pets. I never really liked the naxx ones anyway. This means that I can power level leatherworking instead of something less... awful to grind. Nobody in Ironforge seems to sell gold teeth and pimp hats though. Speaking of Ironforge... wow I missed seeing actual people in cities. Trade chat is actually full of people selling and forming groups.

Low level dungeons are still a joke I see. Ever since the cata patch tanks at low level have been silly.

Alright... so fast forward a few levels and let's do some PvP. Tanks suck. Priests suck. People keep forgetting to make sure there isn't a rogue murdering the casters and ranged. Thanks to the heroics of our 3 man rogue squad of death we pull of a 1-1 win off a tiebreaker.

Up next: The Professor Hits Contested Territory

[Sajiri]

Okay, I have another question. Do resto shamans, or healers in general, go through periods where they just...stop being good? Even temporarily?

Before I stopped playing last, I rolled a shaman as my first healer ever (in any mmo) and I was actually having a ton of fun with it. I was getting complimented for doing well by both guild members and randoms in dungeons.

I only got to about lvl 50 because suddenly I had a string of dungeons (often with the same few people) across one weekend where I just could not keep people alive. The party (particularly the tanks) were intent on blaming it on me being a bad healer, even though I was doing everything I possibly could, and eventually those same people started booting me from groups or dropping as soon as the dungeon started.

Personally, I thought a good portion of it rested on the tank wearing very bad gear and pulling way more than he should have, and the dps for running off different directions to attack different groups, but I got so fed up I just never played it again. I kind of want to try it again, but I dont know if it was me, if shammy was just bad at that lvl, or I really did just get bad luck with groups, because I'd been doing perfectly fine up to that point and to quote one random I was with only days before that weekend 'I like this healer, she keeps everyone alive great and never runs out of mana'

[Seerow]

Were those dungeons by chance the dire maul series?

I've recently leveled two healers (A Priest and a Monk) and when I hit that set of dungeons (usually around 40-50 range) the tanks start getting hit really hard. Like harder by a significant factor than anything before it.

Either way, don't give up. Check to see if you got any new spells in the last few levels that help out (I know on my monk I had picked up a few that significantly impacted healing without realizing it. As soon as I started using those it got easier), and if all else fails, just persevere to level 60, get a shiny new weapon, and everything will be nice and easy again.

[Sajiri]

Were those dungeons by chance the dire maul series?

I've recently leveled two healers (A Priest and a Monk) and when I hit that set of dungeons (usually around 40-50 range) the tanks start getting hit really hard. Like harder by a significant factor than anything before it.

Either way, don't give up. Check to see if you got any new spells in the last few levels that help out (I know on my monk I had picked up a few that significantly impacted healing without realizing it. As soon as I started using those it got easier), and if all else fails, just persevere to level 60, get a shiny new weapon, and everything will be nice and easy again.

Actually, yes, it was the Dire Maul dungeons. I think it was actually right after Mists came out too (or it's patch anyway) which changed shaman totems I think. Forget exactly what happened, I just remember my healing totem was considerably less useful then.

I know the tank was just taking more damage than I could heal, I guess if I get back into it (unsure if I want to lvl my healer or tank next) I could always switch to elemental and solo for 10 lvls or so....but then I'd be at BC, and I love soloing those zones >_<

[Sajiri]

Okay now I'm pretty mad, I used to solo BT a bit, the council fight right before Illidan always gave me a bit of trouble but I could do it without dying (just)..the last few times I've done it I've been with at least one other person, I've been doing it just now solo again though. I had 0 problems with any other boss since I improved my gear a bit, which was a first, but now I've just died 4x in a row on this one fight. I can't figure out what I'm doing wrong, they just keep turning to wail on me instead of my pet now even if I dont hit them, misdirect is doing nothing for me to get them off, I have to just rely on feign death and spirit beast heal a bunch but then they come and stun me and I die.

Gah!

Edit: I figured it out...everyone was telling me to switch spirit bond talent with iron hawk because SB was useless...I switched back and suddenly the fight was a breeze

Edit 2: And further proving to myself that if you complain about something not dropping in an MMO, it will immediately drop....FINALLY got Illidan's bow

[Zherog]

Edit 2: And further proving to myself that if you complain about something not dropping in an MMO, it will immediately drop....FINALLY got Illidan's bow

Nah, that doesn't work. I've been complaining about the mount not dropping off Baron in Stratholme for a while now. Five more runs last night...

[pendell]

So just read this article (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22464058). Evidently Activision is concerned about losing the Chinese market. So they added an entire new area to WOW featuring martial arts-using pandas.

Didn't help. They're continuing to lose subscribers.

Call me an ignorant westerner, but I can't imagine martial arts using pandas being that great a draw for a game. What are eastern gamers leaving WoW for? What's the appeal?

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[Karoht]

Bad news chaps. Under Spoiler

So my friend Englishdude recently moved from LA to NY for a career gig. And the timezone difference means that he is up until 4am raiding with us, and then up for school/work 8am. He's not handling this very well, so he is now actively looking for another guild to raid with. And he literally gave us last night as notice. Luckily we have a DPS on deck so we can finish out the week, but this is bad news.
I've been raiding with English since Firelands. He's been one of the nicest players I've ever met. During Dragon Soul Heroic progression, he hit up the auction house and bought two very expensive pets and gifted them to me during raid. He has done nothing but speak well of me, he calls me the best healer he knows.

So, if he finds a guild that runs a good raiding time for me, chances are good that I'm going to join them too. As such my stream times are probably going to adjust, sharply. I may also have to accept the reality that my server just isn't very good for late night raiding anymore (we are literally one of two guilds that runs past 9pm) and start much earlier.
But, I may be in the market for a server (not faction) change. Area 52 is one of the top 10 US servers according to wowprogress.com
I might also be able to convince the guild to start earlier. We'll see how that goes.

But yes, change is in the air.


@Sub Loss
I'm a stockholder in Activision Blizzard for a reason. I get annual prospectus, AGM notes, and other financial info, all sent to my doorstep. No internet speculation required.
It is important to understand that the 'subscription' model in the US is different to that of Asia. Vastly different. It is also important to understand that the MMO market of Asia is vastly different as well.

1-Most asian gaming happens in gaming cafes. You don't buy the game, you don't really have a subscription. You pay the gaming cafe directly, they pay the distributor (IE-Blizzard or their duely appointed representative).
2-The gaming cafes still have to buy something similar to a subscription in order to offer the game. Since most of Asia is being swept up by eSports games rather than MMOs, it stands to reason that less players are interested, ergo less cafes are maintaining the subscriptions on an active basis and instead are doing things piecemeal. Piecemeal purchases are not tracked as subscriptions, which I will get into later.
3-WoW got less grindy. WoW got less luck based. Asian MMO's are typically built around grinding and luck. They value time input more than player skill in MMOs. Having 10 max level characters is seen as more important/prestigeous than killing top tier hardcore content.
Side Note-Remember when mages were the top DPS if they lucked out on procs, but were crap DPS if they didn't luck out? Or when Seal of Command had a chance to multi-proc and one shot people? Guess which classes were most popular in Asia back then?
4-To qualify as an active subscription in the US markets, the subscription has to be held for 9 months or longer, and the account has to be in good standing. Despite all the rumors to the contrary, trial accounts are not counted. Nor is any time purchased with game cards, regardless of if it is cumulative or not. It has to be a subscriber plan offered through Blizzard to be counted as an active subscription. A person who has bought game cards since the beginning of WoW and hasn't missed a single month is not counted as a subscriber. Note that these are regulations for counting subs which were put in place by Vivendi back before the Activision merger. These rules may or may not apply to other game companies and their games.

Number 4 is important. Consider that at the same time Blizzard started offering 1 month game time cards directly on their site, subs when down about 9 months later. Why? Places like gamestop and walmart used to be able to charge whatever they wanted on game time cards. I saw one game stop trying to charge $60 for a 2 month game card. 2 months of game time is $30 bucks. So when Blizzard offered a shorter time for vastly cheaper, people started to jump on it.
Consider also that the content of WoW is easier to pick up, put down, pick up again? There are loads of people who only activate their account for a month or two, put it back to sleep, wait for new content, reactivate. This is why Blizzard is trying to focus on bringing forth more content more often, and have been delivering content faster than they've ever done before.

Lastly, revenues from World of Warcraft are up. Not down. Where is the money coming from? Time cards mostly. Vanity Pets/Mounts and Server Transfers/Other account services only make them about 20 million a year, a drop in the bucket compaired to 8 million subscribers (120 million a month), according to the AGM info they sent me for the last 4 years. Game card sales are up dramatically though. Overall their revenue just from WoW is still increasing, not decreasing. Not bad for a nearly decade old property.

So why does lowered sub numbers spell doom for WoW?
Same reason people get twitchy when they hear the words 'server mergers'
It's the only metric people have to measure things, mostly because the financials aren't entirely accessable or easily understood.

I remember when someone said that there were only 40,000 users of (insert name of some online gaming service which I'd never heard of prior to the announcement) playin Diablo 3, ergo Diablo 3 was 'dead.'
I remember one time I was watching a Starcraft II player streaming (I think it was Leenok but it might have been SlayersBoxer), and his APM was a little low. He was winning, handily. Crushing his opponent even. And yet people were asking what was wrong with his APM. Is he sick? Is he quitting the game? Will he be pulling out of MLG next month? And other absurd questions, all because of a tunnel vision based on a metric. The same thing happens, with sub numbers in MMO's.

TL:DR-WoW is making Activision Blizzard more money than WoW has ever made them, despite what the sub numbers tell you. The game is fine, it is not in decline, subscriber habits change and the guidelines for the metric have not adapted to reflect that.

[Sajiri]

Nah, that doesn't work. I've been complaining about the mount not dropping off Baron in Stratholme for a while now. Five more runs last night...

I complained about it not dropping when a friend wanted it and it dropped for them...of course whatever I was in the zone for which was considerably less rare didn't drop...maybe its a once per day/group thing.

The extra rule is, if anyone ever points out how lucky you are at drops, you will NEVER get anything rare again in that game. I have learned that from experience.

[Icewraith]

So we have a newish hunter we ran through the back half of msv lfr and front half of hof lfr.

My wife? Sharded sixish epics. The newbie who needs gear? 0 for 6 drops. I vendored three pieces and didn't bother using charms. Now granted, the newbie is in fact so new they don't have a backlog of elder charms to drop on pre TT content, but still.

[Seerow]

So we have a newish hunter we ran through the back half of msv lfr and front half of hof lfr.

My wife? Sharded sixish epics. The newbie who needs gear? 0 for 6 drops. I vendored three pieces and didn't bother using charms. Now granted, the newbie is in fact so new they don't have a backlog of elder charms to drop on pre TT content, but still.

Yeah RNG sucks.

Ran ToT today, the two bosses I didn't need anything from, I dropped gear off of (gear worth less than the back of gold would have given me at that), and the boss I wanted loot off of and coined got double gold.

[Krazzman]

The main problem about the loot in lfr is: You personally have a chance at loot. There can be whole LFR's without anyone getting any piece of gear. Additionally in that damned blue bag of gold... can be epics. My GF got agility shoes out of it.

I've been doing Nalak since he "came out" and nothing. always gold only. In raid IF I use my Bonusroll: Gold. Luckily I have some gear already... but sadly nothing near "BiS" or anything like that.
I plan for Saturday to ask in the How2Priest Forum on what T-setpieces I should focus right now and where even the LFR part is going to be better than what I have atm.

LMG is still 6 secrets away and I have nearly no time this weekend for LFR. Maybe going into it without my fiancee but maybe I'll finally try to push my paladin to 89...

EDIT:
@Karoth:
We ran into Enrage once. Suen was dead, and Lu'lin was at 5% then enraged. Mainly because our Shaman, Shadow and Rogue were all dead already. The "BIG-HIT" I got was from her falling star ability where she propells them. They normally hit for around 150k. And no we don't use the Statues, I asked it once but they don't want to for soem reason. I actually thought we woulb be biting a bit longer on Iron Qon and didn't had the time to watch a guide for them. In LFR at least I didn't really get what you have to do with the statues...

[Karoht]

EDIT:
@Karoth:
We ran into Enrage once. Suen was dead, and Lu'lin was at 5% then enraged. Mainly because our Shaman, Shadow and Rogue were all dead already. The "BIG-HIT" I got was from her falling star ability where she propells them. They normally hit for around 150k. And no we don't use the Statues, I asked it once but they don't want to for soem reason. I actually thought we woulb be biting a bit longer on Iron Qon and didn't had the time to watch a guide for them. In LFR at least I didn't really get what you have to do with the statues...

K, the 4 statues are pretty useful. You can only have one effect active at a time, to my knowlege, but here are the effects.
Crane-Crane spirits charge across the room. Each one that the bad guys get hit with takes 5 million damage. If your tanks are clever about kiting, you can easily pound off 30 million damage on each of them with that up. There might be a damage boost with it as well, I don't remember.
Serpent-Healing and Mana buff. Really useful.
Ox-Max hit point buff. We usually don't use it.
Tiger-Activate bullet time. Well, not really, but certain effects you can't normally dodge you can now dodge. Like those stars that killed you for example.
Activating them is easy. Click. You'll be phased into a version of the room that has a collection of stars. You'll see a shape flashing on the screen. Run through the stars in that pattern to activate the buff. Basically, you are drawing a constellation with your character. The 4 shapes are the same every time, to my knowledge.

As for those stars, spread out. Two should never target you at once if you spread.


So yeah, I may have found another guild to run with. Earlier raid times so I'll get more rest. They might have room for Englishdude, so that is a plus. I'm going to fill out an app tonight, make contact with them in game, see whats what.

[Zherog]

5 moe Strat runs, 5 more cases of no mount from Rivendare. I looked it up, and the mount has a drop rate of 0.9%. So if I run it 100 times or so, in theory I should get it once. I've gotta be getting close to that 100 by now!

This weekend I should get some time to hit up LFR once or twice and see if I can get my weapon upgrade...

[The Glyphstone]

So just read this article (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22464058). Evidently Activision is concerned about losing the Chinese market. So they added an entire new area to WOW featuring martial arts-using pandas.

Didn't help. They're continuing to lose subscribers.

Call me an ignorant westerner, but I can't imagine martial arts using pandas being that great a draw for a game. What are eastern gamers leaving WoW for? What's the appeal?

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Karoht said lots of smart things about the money and Eastern attitudes, but as far as the martial-arts Pandas..they've been an enshrined (if somewhat silly and occasionally mocked) part of the Warcraft universe since Warcraft III, they're hardly something new dreamed up to try and 'recapture' the Asian market. And if that was their goal, they wouldn't have originally had said pandas wearing blatantly stylized samurai armor. China flipped its lid at the original artwork/models putting their sacred national animal in Japanese warrior garb.

AKA the people who wrote that article are idiots. They also quoted Bobby Kotik and took him seriously.

[Traab]

5 moe Strat runs, 5 more cases of no mount from Rivendare. I looked it up, and the mount has a drop rate of 0.9%. So if I run it 100 times or so, in theory I should get it once. I've gotta be getting close to that 100 by now!

This weekend I should get some time to hit up LFR once or twice and see if I can get my weapon upgrade...

I wish it worked that way, but a 1 in 100 chance doesnt mean if you run it 100 times it will drop once, it just means that over a large enough sample it averages out that way. So you may not see it for 300 runs then suddenly it drops the next 4 fights in a row. I hate these ultra rare drop rates.

[Zherog]

Oh, I know. I was being optimistic. Something I'm not used to doing. ;)

[Traab]

Oh, I know. I was being optimistic. Something I'm not used to doing. ;)

Ah sorry. :smalltongue: Its a holdover from my old days in everquest when you couldnt visit a message board without seeing yet another crackpot theory about how to "make" a rare item drop or rare mob spawn or to complain that "I have killed this guy over 100 times and it has a 1% drop rate. Why dont I have it yet?!" Because they dont understand how that whole thing works. Ah, it was a more innocent time, when much like ancient man, superstition ruled us, and those who sought truth and science were burned at the stake for our heathen ways.

[Seerow]

Oh, I know. I was being optimistic. Something I'm not used to doing. ;)

Every now and then, these things work out better than you hope.


For example, with my transmog set, each piece is the set drops at like a .01% chance from random mobs. I had found a set of mobs that respawn instantly, so I figured I'd camp them until I got my set. Only catch? Those mobs drop the whole set except the chest piece, which only drops from a couple of other higher level mobs, which didn't have a similar infinite respawn point. So I just gave up the chest for a loss, found a replacement I could live with...

and then the damn thing drops when I least expect it. I go through the rest of the dungeon one day on a whim and it just happens to show up. 6 kills on mobs that were capable of dropping the item, with a .01% drop rate, a 6 in 10,000 chance of getting it, and got it. I was shocked.

[Karoht]

Karoht said lots of smart things about the money and Eastern attitudes, but as far as the martial-arts Pandas..they've been an enshrined (if somewhat silly and occasionally mocked) part of the Warcraft universe since Warcraft III, they're hardly something new dreamed up to try and 'recapture' the Asian market. And if that was their goal, they wouldn't have originally had said pandas wearing blatantly stylized samurai armor. China flipped its lid at the original artwork/models putting their sacred national animal in Japanese warrior garb.

AKA the people who wrote that article are idiots. They also quoted Bobby Kotik and took him seriously.
Ever since the quibble over battle.net (yes, it went to court because Vivendi refused to intervene, Blizzard won), Bobby Kotik has been told to more or less butt out of Blizzard affairs and has nothing to do with the game design decisions of Blizzard Entertainment. Anyone going to Bobby for a quote about Blizzard doesn't deserve to call themselves a journalist.

It would be like me asking a moderator a question about the OotS comic.

Another reason why anyone claiming that they made Mists of Pandaria to reclaim the asian market also doesn't deserve to call themselves journalists?
Blizzard outright came out and said why they made this expansion, why they included Pandarens, on several occasions.

Re: Panda's and Pokemon
The number one requested race to be added to world of warcraft, via exit surveys, forum posts, and publicly stated requests at blizzcon? For 6 years prior to Mists going into development? Pandarens.
The number one requested feature? Something to do with the vanity pets. They tried doing things like including pet accessories, such as leashes, toys, etc, but they mostly went unused. Then people started asking if they could make their pets fight one another. Guess what, pet battles was in development since Wrath of the Lich King.

So anyone saying otherwise is silly. They did it because the fans requested it.

[Sajiri]

Finally just got back on my DK for the first time since Mists came out. My dps is horrible, my rotation is just as bad, but damn did I forget how much I love this class. Time to relearn how to play this one too...if I can just make it through these two hated zones of mine to get to lvl 90 >_<

[Traab]

I agree, my dk is my favorite class. I have to get my monk up there, (he just hit 60) too be sure, but I am enjoying him as well so far.

[Sajiri]

I agree, my dk is my favorite class. I have to get my monk up there, (he just hit 60) too be sure, but I am enjoying him as well so far.

Always seems like the classes I hate at first end up as my favourites. I tried to make a DK a few times because people kept telling me they were good and could never make it out of the starting zone. This is my 4th one I tried, just to see the starting area, by the time I finally got out of there and started doing BC quests I fell in love with it.

[Traab]

Always seems like the classes I hate at first end up as my favourites. I tried to make a DK a few times because people kept telling me they were good and could never make it out of the starting zone. This is my 4th one I tried, just to see the starting area, by the time I finally got out of there and started doing BC quests I fell in love with it.

For me, speaking as a blood spec, it really got good when mastery came into the picture. I turned overnight into this virtually unkillable juggernaut of implacable wrath.

[The Glyphstone]

Yeah, the change from a 79 blood DK to an 80 blood DK is startling.

[Seerow]

Yeah, the change from a 79 blood DK to an 80 blood DK is startling.

Meanwhile my DK is languishing at level 68.

Or did I get it leveled with RAF? I can't even remember. But I think I put those levels on my shaman instead.

[Traab]

Meanwhile my DK is languishing at level 68.

Or did I get it leveled with RAF? I can't even remember. But I think I put those levels on my shaman instead.

Meh, its still far from bad in the 60-79 range, its just, that mastery ability is freaking huge. At least so far as blood is concerned. I honestly never got into frost or unholy so I am not even entirely sure what their mastery DOES.

[Zherog]

Twelve more runs at Rivendare, still no mount.

Also, three more LFR runs at Lei Shi but no staff.Got three robes and a shoulder that I don't need, though. And DE'ing the robes didn't give me a single Haunted Spirit, so I'm no closer to being able to make my boots.

I hate the RNG...

[The Glyphstone]

Twelve more runs at Rivendare, still no mount.

Also, three more LFR runs at Lei Shi but no staff.Got three robes and a shoulder that I don't need, though. And DE'ing the robes didn't give me a single Haunted Spirit, so I'm no closer to being able to make my boots.

I hate the RNG...

Can you get Haunting Spirits from LFR? I thought they only drop/DE out of Normal+gear.

[Seerow]

Can you get Haunting Spirits from LFR? I thought they only drop/DE out of Normal+gear.

You are correct.


Speaking of, I just bought 10 more haunting spirits the other day for 65k gold. Hoping to be able to turn 15k profit off that, either from crafting or reselling.

Also finished my Lionheart Executioner, and sold that for 35k.

Overall my finances are looking up, may break 100k gold for the first time soon. Then I just wait until haunting spirits are a reasonable enough price for me to be willing to craft boots/helm for myself (seriously those items are horribly itemized for a warrior, but they are the only items for those slots you can get without raiding so Im most likely going to be blowing a bunch of money on them anyway).

[Zherog]

Can you get Haunting Spirits from LFR? I thought they only drop/DE out of Normal+gear.

Ah, that explains that at least...

None currently on my AH, and when they are there I can't afford enough of them - they currently go for about 10-12K each on my server.

[Sajiri]

If you do your dailies each day approximately how long does it take to get to exalted? Or at least revered. I've been focusing on Golden Lotus, Dominance and Sunreavers, each at honored and I feel like I'm getting nowhere, starting to seriously lose interest in dailies again. Doesn't help that I usually only get a short amount of time to play each day and it's all spent doing dailies.

Are there any factions I should really focus on getting up? I only got cloud serpents to exalted so far because I wanted the mount, even though I never use it anymore because everyone had them. Also, anyone know when the next patch is supposed to be out?

[Traab]

You are correct.


Speaking of, I just bought 10 more haunting spirits the other day for 65k gold. Hoping to be able to turn 15k profit off that, either from crafting or reselling.

Also finished my Lionheart Executioner, and sold that for 35k.

Overall my finances are looking up, may break 100k gold for the first time soon. Then I just wait until haunting spirits are a reasonable enough price for me to be willing to craft boots/helm for myself (seriously those items are horribly itemized for a warrior, but they are the only items for those slots you can get without raiding so Im most likely going to be blowing a bunch of money on them anyway).

I bought one of those craftable weapons. Best 9k gold I ever spent. It wasnt the biggest upgrade possible, but I didnt feel like saving up another 15k gold to get the best weapon. A solid 835 dps upgrade is more than enough to make me happy.

[Seerow]

I bought one of those craftable weapons. Best 9k gold I ever spent. It wasnt the biggest upgrade possible, but I didnt feel like saving up another 15k gold to get the best weapon. A solid 835 dps upgrade is more than enough to make me happy.

Honestly saving for the 502 weapon probably would have been worth it. But as long as you're happy with what you got...

Also, pretty much all of the models for the new craftables are pretty awesome. They're throwbacks to the old BC Weapon Specialization weapons.


If you do your dailies each day approximately how long does it take to get to exalted? Or at least revered. I've been focusing on Golden Lotus, Dominance and Sunreavers, each at honored and I feel like I'm getting nowhere, starting to seriously lose interest in dailies again. Doesn't help that I usually only get a short amount of time to play each day and it's all spent doing dailies.

Are there any factions I should really focus on getting up? I only got cloud serpents to exalted so far because I wanted the mount, even though I never use it anymore because everyone had them. Also, anyone know when the next patch is supposed to be out?

First, for how long a faction takes to hit exalted, it depends on the faction. Shieldwall takes around a week. Golden Lotus is more like 3-4 weeks. Klaxxi is more like 1-2 weeks. I don't think any faction takes more than a month of dailies to hit exalted.

As for where to focus, it depends on what you want them for. Almost every faction in Pandaria gets a mount at exalted, so if you're in the "gotta collect em all!" mindset for mounts, well you're probably going to do most of the factions eventually.

If you're looking for something different, then I'd only really suggest the Tillers, the farm thing is different (not something I personally enjoy, but it's definitely different from anything else out there), and a moderately decent source of income. Worth checking out at least.

If you're after gear, most of the 5.0 factions are outdated now. Out of them the only one I'd really recommend focusing on is Domination Offensive/Operation Shieldwall (depending on faction), the gear from there is 496, and there's a bunch of story elements that give bonus rep, which makes finishing it up faster. I hit Exalted with Shieldwall in just over a week, and that was before the ability to get rep from Dungeons/Scenarios, so should be doable in under a week now if you try. This rep will probably be where you spend your valor while trying to hit 480 for LFR ToT (at which point you can start getting SPA rep and have much better things to spend your valor on).

Other than that, getting up to Honored with the Kirrin Tor/Sun Reavers gets you a free epic item (ie gold cost rather than valor), belt I think, so going at least that far into that rep is a good idea.

If you really wanted to, Golden Lotus and Klaxxi both have an epic item reward with no valor associated (a neck and ring), but Golden Lotus is a ridiculous slog to get through. Klaxxi isn't too bad as just questing through Dread Wastes gets you most of the way to revered anyway, at which point you get double rep to exalted. But I wouldn't recommend spending any valor on their gear.

[otakuryoga]

kirin tor gets you a 522 neck

[The Glyphstone]

kirin tor gets you a 522 neck

It's the Shado-Pan Assault that gets you the 522 neck for valor at Neutral. Kirin Tor Offensive/Sunreaver Offensive gets you a 476 belt for gold at Honored.

[Sajiri]

I've got my gear from the dominance/sunreaver/golden lotus at honored, just going further is such a pain. Think I got something from Klaxxi at honored too, I just...really hate dread wastes.

[otakuryoga]

It's the Shado-Pan Assault that gets you the 522 neck for valor at Neutral. Kirin Tor Offensive/Sunreaver Offensive gets you a 476 belt for gold at Honored.

right right...i aint done much with either of those yet so have a tough time remembering which is which

[Traab]

I've got my gear from the dominance/sunreaver/golden lotus at honored, just going further is such a pain. Think I got something from Klaxxi at honored too, I just...really hate dread wastes.

Really? I found the klaxxi dailies to be fairly easy and straightforward to run. I only stopped at revered because I didnt see anything worth snagging for my dk at the time. One of these days I am going to get around to grinding out my various factions in the vale, I am just currently dealing with a pronounced lack of enthusiasm for the game right now. I am fiddling with my 60 priest and monk but not really enthused about grinding out the levels. Meh, when is the next expansion due? :smalltongue:

[Sajiri]

Really? I found the klaxxi dailies to be fairly easy and straightforward to run. I only stopped at revered because I didnt see anything worth snagging for my dk at the time. One of these days I am going to get around to grinding out my various factions in the vale, I am just currently dealing with a pronounced lack of enthusiasm for the game right now. I am fiddling with my 60 priest and monk but not really enthused about grinding out the levels. Meh, when is the next expansion due? :smalltongue:

They may be easy, but I just hate being in that zone. Everything is too blue. For some reason I have serious troubles seeing anything there and just walk into groups of monsters and manage to aggro half the zone.

[The Glyphstone]

Leveling my new Forsaken rogue, now I understand why Welcome To The Machine is acclaimed as one of the best quests in the game.

[Krazzman]

Finally had time to play again.

Killed a Raremob with my Paladin (the Fish-guys are super easy or am I mistaken?) but he still sits there at level 88...

Killed Nalak again with Krazzman: no loot.
Raiding: Managed to get Shado-Pan Assault to revered: bought belt because the warlock got the hit/haste belt from ji-kun. Got Robes with Haste, regemmed to haste: now 30,44%. Got 3 Secrets... 3 secrets to go. Raided for 3 and a half hours: killed jinrokh through dark animus. Tuesday we will kill Iron Qon and then hopefully the Twins.
So far my Bonuslootrolls: nothing. Used one on Megaera and one on Durumu.

Got 1 reply so far in the H2P forums but still have a hard time to do more dmg than the guardian tank...

[PrinceOfThieves]

It's been a good week for me in Azeroth. Taking a break from MoP to grind rep & transmog stuff from Burning Crusade and Lich king. Got promoted to High Officer in my guild, finally hit exalted with Netherwing, and got all the drakes, got all the heroic dungeon achievements for Lich King, except the damn Oculus, which I can't figure out how to solo the last boss. Got 5 different reps to exalted, and got the blue proto drake on the first try. And finally, made close to 5k on the auction house making bags & selling enchanting materials. Now I just need to figure out how to up the DPS of a protection paladin...
Speaking of transmog, can anyone recommend a shield that is primarily red and black in color? I've tried filtering things thru wowhead, but for some reason the site doesn't want to work on my computer too well.

[Traab]

Finally had time to play again.

Killed a Raremob with my Paladin (the Fish-guys are super easy or am I mistaken?) but he still sits there at level 88...

Killed Nalak again with Krazzman: no loot.
Raiding: Managed to get Shado-Pan Assault to revered: bought belt because the warlock got the hit/haste belt from ji-kun. Got Robes with Haste, regemmed to haste: now 30,44%. Got 3 Secrets... 3 secrets to go. Raided for 3 and a half hours: killed jinrokh through dark animus. Tuesday we will kill Iron Qon and then hopefully the Twins.
So far my Bonuslootrolls: nothing. Used one on Megaera and one on Durumu.

Got 1 reply so far in the H2P forums but still have a hard time to do more dmg than the guardian tank...

Meh, I dunno if I would say super easy, to me they are probably the second toughest of the rare spawns, but that doesnt mean they are that tough. The mogu/cow people are easy as hell. The jinyu and pandaren are annoying as hell if only because it takes so long to finish them off and all it takes is screwing up your timing once to get slaughtered. Maybe its easier for a paladin with an OH CRAP button or three. So you didnt get out of range of the crane kick in time, /bubble. So you took a rain dance to the face, /lay on hands. There, problem solved. If I take a rain dance to the face, I have to pray I live long enough to death strike him a couple times to regain my hp. If I dont get out of range of crane kick, I die. Period. Maybe if I had full raid gear and buffs I would have enough hp to tank it once, I dunno, im not sure what hp totals I could hit with end game gear.

[Krazzman]

Meh, I dunno if I would say super easy, to me they are probably the second toughest of the rare spawns, but that doesnt mean they are that tough. The mogu/cow people are easy as hell. The jinyu and pandaren are annoying as hell if only because it takes so long to finish them off and all it takes is screwing up your timing once to get slaughtered. Maybe its easier for a paladin with an OH CRAP button or three. So you didnt get out of range of the crane kick in time, /bubble. So you took a rain dance to the face, /lay on hands. There, problem solved. If I take a rain dance to the face, I have to pray I live long enough to death strike him a couple times to regain my hp. If I dont get out of range of crane kick, I die. Period. Maybe if I had full raid gear and buffs I would have enough hp to tank it once, I dunno, im not sure what hp totals I could hit with end game gear.

Nah, Jinyu's are totally pushovers, never used LoH or Bubble against the two I have killed so far. Raindance is easily countered by: Oh he casts it: RUN. At least for my Ret. Sure my Stun every 30 seconds makes killing them easier and else the only selfheal comes from Sanctified Wrath (? Dunno the Wings man) or Selfless Healer every third Judgement.

[Karoht]

@Dailies
My advice is focus on two factions at a time. No more. Doing 50+ dailies in a single day is how you burn out. Run a dungeon and a scenario per day for the faction you want to spend the least time working on. Trust me.


@Jinyu
Yeah, running away is more or less what trivializes the encounter. That and successfully interrupting his cast of that channeled beam of his. Knockbacks and Stuns work to interrupt that, so long as you wait until the cast is done and interrupt once the channel begins.


So, I might be joining another guild. Found one with better raid times and what looks already like a better environment. I'm trying to convince them to take Englishdude with me, but odds of that are looking not good.
I am sad. English might have to server transfer to find a better guild. I'm not sure if I would transfer with him or not.

[delphinae]

Speaking of transmog, can anyone recommend a shield that is primarily red and black in color? I've tried filtering things thru wowhead, but for some reason the site doesn't want to work on my computer too well.
It's not filtered to only red-and-black shields, but I like Icy Veins' graphical tables of available models by slot. Here are shield models available to paladins:

http://icy-veins.com/transmogrification-paladin-shield-armor-item-model-list-wow

[Krazzman]

@Transmog:

Have you tried out MogIT? It's an ingame addon where you can put together a set of equipment, you see which mob drops the same item/the item with the same style) and you can sort after colors (I think even certain color combinations).

@Jinyu:

Odd, I interrupted them directly when he tried torrent. He didn't try to cast it again.

@Guildchange:

I knew the problems of switching a guild to be able to play with a certain person and not finding anything that fits. In avoid we have the problem: 2 Paladins, 1 Druid, 1 Shaman as healers in our pool. Our DK-Tank doesn't really want to tank anymore and through that my GF has had the mad idea of leveling her old old old level 81 Paladin up to 90 and try out tanking.

My advice is: Speak with English, speak with the guild and try to get them to negotiate. Else try again to find something where you can be together with english (and your wife obviously).

[Traab]

For me what made it easy was brain freeze and death grip. I could spell intterupt torrent, then run back a couple yards and death grip him to break rain dance, usually before he got a single shot off. As I said, they arent hard, just annoying because unless you have high dps, chances are good you are going to go through many cycles of this routine, and there isnt that much margin for error.

[Karoht]

@Transmog
I like wowhead's transmog search tool better, but you have to be willing to sift through things.


@Guildchange
It will really depend on if this guild takes English or not. If he server transfers, I don't know if I will follow him, unless he contacts me and explains how awesome his new guild is.


@Patch 5.3
Is the current PvP season ending soon? They usually time patches to coincide with those seasons, usually within a week after the season ends the patch will drop.
Also, more stuff is hitting PTR currently, so that means more testing for yet more features for 5.3. Supposedly a new spectator mode is being added to Brawlers Guild, not sure why but that will likely take 2 weeks of testing/feedback right there. And as I hear it, they are still toying with some of the PvP changes.
I'm greatly looking forward to 5.3, as new scenarios and heroic scenarios look awesome, and they are giving a serious buff to Resto Druid healing with Wild Mushroom Bloom. They are effectively doubling it's healing capacity and scaling.


@Random Bizare Thought of the Day
Imagine a class that used Stamina as it's main stat. And treated things like Strength, Intellect, and Agility, more or less the same way one treats secondary stats currently.
Postulate.

[Krazzman]

@Patch 5.3
Is the current PvP season ending soon? They usually time patches to coincide with those seasons, usually within a week after the season ends the patch will drop.
Also, more stuff is hitting PTR currently, so that means more testing for yet more features for 5.3. Supposedly a new spectator mode is being added to Brawlers Guild, not sure why but that will likely take 2 weeks of testing/feedback right there. And as I hear it, they are still toying with some of the PvP changes.
I'm greatly looking forward to 5.3, as new scenarios and heroic scenarios look awesome, and they are giving a serious buff to Resto Druid healing with Wild Mushroom Bloom. They are effectively doubling it's healing capacity and scaling.


@Random Bizare Thought of the Day
Imagine a class that used Stamina as it's main stat. And treated things like Strength, Intellect, and Agility, more or less the same way one treats secondary stats currently.
Postulate.

According to my guildies: 5.3 will hit this Patchday. But I don't really believe in it right now.

@Your Random thought:
Mail wearing to be sure. 3 Tanks with Plate, 2 Tanks with Leather and 1 with mail. Or giving us yet another leather wearing tank.
Probably trying to stack Stamina and get abilities like: "Everytime you are hit you regain 1% HP" with some limitations and stuff.

[Seerow]

According to my guildies: 5.3 will hit this Patchday. But I don't really believe in it right now.

They haven't made any announcement, and they've said they'll let us know in advance when it's coming.

I'm expecting at least one more week. (which means I'm buying two blood spirits this week just to keep from wasting too much valor while waiting for upgrades to roll in)

[Karoht]

@Patch
I'm totally guessing it will be the patch day after long weekend, or the patch day a week later.

@Stamina Based Character
Another Mail wearer is what I pictured too.

[Psyren]

I just had the rather sublime experience of watching the monk healer in my heroic outdps everyone else by a pretty wide margin, while keeping everyone alive.

Granted, 100k dps is probably to be expected when you're rocking gear like this (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/stormreaver/Valspara/simple), but it did give me something amusing to look forward to when I get around to picking my own monk up again.

[Krazzman]

I just had the rather sublime experience of watching the monk healer in my heroic outdps everyone else by a pretty wide margin, while keeping everyone alive.

Granted, 100k dps is probably to be expected when you're rocking gear like this (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/stormreaver/Valspara/simple), but it did give me something amusing to look forward to when I get around to picking my own monk up again.

Jeah this is something that annoys me in our raid right now... our guardian Druid often is 2nd or even 1st in dmg... Horridon: Krazzman: 199k dps, Ashore: 165k dps.

Did some stuff yesterday but not that much. Wanted to get into an instance with my Paladin but... invite took too long and as such I stayed at 30%. (Didn't get a Sha Raid too...)

[Seerow]

I just had the rather sublime experience of watching the monk healer in my heroic outdps everyone else by a pretty wide margin, while keeping everyone alive.

Granted, 100k dps is probably to be expected when you're rocking gear like this (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/stormreaver/Valspara/simple), but it did give me something amusing to look forward to when I get around to picking my own monk up again.

I was going to say 100k dps is pretty low for that gear level (I've reliably pulled 100k in randoms since ilvl500)... and then I realized you said it was a healer.

I am impressed. I've been helping a friend with his RAF leveling (in return for him running with mine) so I just finished leveling a MW to 80. I never got fistweaving down right, I was regularly able to beat the tank in DPS, but most DPS would double me (in the 60-80 range of course. Pre-60 tank wins everything always).



Jeah this is something that annoys me in our raid right now... our guardian Druid often is 2nd or even 1st in dmg... Horridon: Krazzman: 199k dps, Ashore: 165k dps.


Tank has two advantages going for him:

1) He's probably on Horridon the whole fight. Meaning he gets a massive DPS boost from hitting Horridon while others are swapping for adds
2) Vengeance. Horridon probably hits pretty hard, that gives lots of damage
3) If he actually cares about his damage he may be using the DPS meta instead of the tank meta. I hear a lot of tanks are doing this and getting ridiculous numbers because of it (it has great interaction with vengeance)

[Zherog]

A bunch more Strat runs, a few more LFR runs and still no drops I'm looking for. In fact, in the last three runs Lei Shi only gave me money 5 of the 6 roles (the sixth being robes I don't need, again).

In the last run, the tank pulled all the sha at the start of the fight into one big pile. I loved it - I generally can do very well with large piles of mobs that stand there in a "tank and spank" fight. Rotate my DoT onto four-six mobs; pick a big guy, run a few rotations; rinse and repeat. My DPS for the trash was 91K, way above what I normally can pull off in LFR, which is currently between 52 and 65, depending on the fight.

As for haunting spirits, I'm still out of luck. They still go solidly between 10-12k on my server, which makes buying the 14 I need for head and boots impossible.

Installed NPCScan this weekend. There are a few mounts that drop from rare spawns, so I figure I can sweep for those every now and again. While doing some Pandaland archeology, it went off so I dove in and attacked the panda. And thoroughly go my ass kicked. Twice. Oh well. I had no problems with the Hozen and Mogu elites I had found prior to installing the add-on. So I guess I'll blame the add-on for my failure. :smallcool:

[The Glyphstone]

The Panda rares are definitely the most prone to spontaneous ass-kicking.

[Psyren]

I was going to say 100k dps is pretty low for that gear level (I've reliably pulled 100k in randoms since ilvl500)... and then I realized you said it was a healer.

Yep - I was getting 20-30k heals just from her eminence, which meant I was getting those heals constantly thanks to her statue repeating everything. I saw a couple disc priests last night that were pulling 40-60k dps as well.

See, in terms of showing off your purples, that beats the hell out of afk-ing in front of the bank in my mind. I'm not sure if the other healers can do it though, at least I've never seen the others try to dps much.

[Seerow]

Yep - I was getting 20-30k heals just from her eminence, which meant I was getting those heals constantly thanks to her statue repeating everything. I saw a couple disc priests last night that were pulling 40-60k dps as well.

See, in terms of showing off your purples, that beats the hell out of afk-ing in front of the bank in my mind. I'm not sure if the other healers can do it though, at least I've never seen the others try to dps much.


I'm sure a Disc priest geared to that level will pull at least as much, if not more DPS. My friend's disc pulls 60-80k and is only 495 geared. Throw on set bonuses (he never got his 4piece t14, which is amazing for Atonement, before changing characters) and 30 ilvls, and I'm sure that 100-120k is perfectly doable.

Other healers... most likely not. Certainly not while still healing. Right now Fistweavers and Atonement Priests are the designated quasi-healing specs, who get to deal decent damage at the expense of reduced healing (compared to other specs, or even the same spec focusing exclusively on healing, in similar gear). I do hope we get to see more specs like that in the future (Paladin going the mistweaver route and having to go into melee to deal damage but still heal would be great. Not so sure about Shaman/Druid, but I'm sure something could be done), but right now those are probably the only two that will pull impressive numbers while keeping a group healed.

[Karoht]

So, I finally scored my T15 helmet, and am now rocking my legendary meta gem. I just need to set up a weak auras warning about the proc and I'm good.
Combined with also finally switching to a 522 chest piece (valor) now that my T14 2pc set is broken...
OMG the output difference is awesome.
After my reforge/regemming, I'm up 2% crit, a noticeable jump in spellpower and spirit, my mastery is unchanged, my haste is a little over the breakpoint/softcap.
Time to consider reforging away some spirit into mastery. I have WAAAY more than I need.

As for Flasks, I use Spirit flasks most of the time, unless output feels like a problem. 1000 INT is only a minor boost to spellpower and crit, but 1000 spirit means I need 1000 spirit less on my gear, so I can reforge it away.

Weapon enchant. I've been using Windsong for quite a while, maybe I should at last switch to Jade Spirit. Windsong proc's rather often while Jade Spirit supposedly doesn't proc as often. Also, I'm a resto druid, so I get decent output boosts from Mastery, Haste, and Crit (50K and higher crit ticks on Rejuv is awesome).

[Traab]

Speaking of weapon enchants, should my dk stick with his runeforging? Or get an actual enchant put on? If so, what enchant should I go for?

[Shishnarfne]

Speaking of weapon enchants, should my dk stick with his runeforging? Or get an actual enchant put on? If so, what enchant should I go for?

A Death Knight never enchants his weapon. There just isn't anything comparable.

Can anything match the 15% Strength from the Fallen Crusader proc for DPS? (Feel free to criticize me if it's only 10%, I'm going on memory.)

Is there a tank enchant that can match the Stam +Armor from Stoneskin Gargoyle for Effective Health? Or +4% parry (without diminishing!) from Swordshattering for avoidance? Or the Spell Damage taken reduction from Spellshattering?
(There are arguments about which tank reforge is best for specific fights, but it's always reforges versus reforges, never compared to enchants).

Basically, Death Knights are balanced around having a class-specific weapon enchant that scales very nicely with level, and which outstrips (by a wide margin) anything on the market. I don't think I've ever seen anyone seriously suggest any enchant as even being in the same league as a reforge in terms of quality. And the reforge is even free.

Also, my 10-man guild just downed Durumu for the first time last week. Fun fight, but very unforgiving. This seems to be a trend in this expansion. Here's hoping we can get the people together to knock out Primordius soon (we've had some attendance issues this tier).

[Traab]

A Death Knight never enchants his weapon. There just isn't anything comparable.

Can anything match the 15% Strength from the Fallen Crusader proc for DPS? (Feel free to criticize me if it's only 10%, I'm going on memory.)

Is there a tank enchant that can match the Stam +Armor from Stoneskin Gargoyle for Effective Health? Or +4% parry (without diminishing!) from Swordshattering for avoidance? Or the Spell Damage taken reduction from Spellshattering?
(There are arguments about which tank reforge is best for specific fights, but it's always reforges versus reforges, never compared to enchants).

Basically, Death Knights are balanced around having a class-specific weapon enchant that scales very nicely with level, and which outstrips (by a wide margin) anything on the market. I don't think I've ever seen anyone seriously suggest any enchant as even being in the same league as a reforge in terms of quality. And the reforge is even free.

Also, my 10-man guild just downed Durumu for the first time last week. Fun fight, but very unforgiving. This seems to be a trend in this expansion. Here's hoping we can get the people together to knock out Primordius soon (we've had some attendance issues this tier).

See thats the thing, I dont know. I have no idea what weapon enchants there are. I never really cared enough to get a weapon worth putting one on. I just figured it was worth asking because for all I know while good at low to mid game, at high end there are amazing enchants of wondrous magnitude. Weapon enchants that boggle the mind and obliterate the enemy. Or even if thats not the case, then still enchants worth replacing due to extensive parsing showing them to be .0076% better than fallen crusader or whatever.

[Icewraith]

Attendance issues suck.
We've been raiding the start of the prior tier with another small guild with limited raiding experience, it's been interesting.

For the last expansion or so we've been a bunch of ex-raiders who still have decent skills but too much real life to get a coherent raid group together, at least for long. Some of these other guys aren't very good... but they do show up regularly. I'm having to teach the other tank how to play a Paladin. I am a Warrior by trade. Prot pallys look like they have most of their stuff by 40ish, so my alt has been instructive at least.

The main issue with attendance seems to be that the server has been dying for a long time, and most people are locked into little guilds they leveled to 25 and don't want to leave because of the work they put in (including us). I finally gave up on recruiting and just tried to find a guild with people who would show up and we could form a reasonable schedule with. Still very hard to replace those who slowly stop playing though.

Note: when I say decent skills I mean that I was able to hop into a Heroic Dragon Soul run last expansion, pull middle-of-the-pack dps on my seldom-used shadow offspec priest alt with Raid Finder gear, and be alive at the end of the Ultraxion kill. That might say more about the difficulty of the H Ultraxion fight than it does about my playing, mainly because there's little movement in Ultrax and it's a healer check and a raid cooldown coordination check instead of something harder on ranged dps. But the point is someone who sucks would have just wiped them a bunch by missing their turn taking the explosion hit or mis-timing their little encounter cooldown button, or had crappy dps because they had to devote too much time to the raid mechanics.

[Shishnarfne]

I think that the best weapon enchants out there for plate DPS/tanks (correct me if I'm wrong, anyone with a warrior or paladin) are Enchant Weapon Colossus (http://www.wowhead.com/item=74727) or River's Song (http://www.wowhead.com/item=74728) for tanking: either a 7500 absorb shield proc on 6 real ppm incoming swings (3 sec internal cooldown) or 1650 dodge for 7 seconds at 4 real ppm incoming, respectively. They just don't stack up.

The best DPS enchant appears to be Dancing Steel (http://www.wowhead.com/item=74726) which gives 1650 Strength (Agi for non-plate users) with a 2.3 real ppm rate on hits that land, with apparently a 12 second duration. I can't find a post on wowhead listing the proc rate for Fallen Crusader, but it's a 3% heal with +15% strength for 15 seconds. I guess the real edge is that it scales. Besides, you'd need to be running only 10k Strength for Dancing Steel to be comparable, which I suspect would mean you wouldn't be using cutting edge enchants on it.

I've never seen any suggestion in a serious context not to use FC as a DPS DK. I can't find specific proc info, though... My unscientific look at SimCraft suggests FC has a higher uptime for 2-handed DKs than Dancing Steel does for Arms warriors, so the superior benefit plus apparently superior uptime would make this a no-brainer. Even if it weren't free.

Edit: It looks like it might be possible at low gear levels for Dancing Steel to provide a larger buff, which might make it a superior choice for people with below roughly 11k strength buffed (if uptime is sufficiently close). However, I don't see the logic in buying a pricey enchant that won't scale as well as a free class feature simply because it might be slightly better at low AP levels.
Also, the buffs will be of equal size at 11k Strength, according to my napkin math, while Fallen Crusader gives a small heal. With apparently similar proc rates (FC may have slightly better uptime), it's probably not worth considering Dancing Steel unless you have significantly less than 11k Strength. Maybe level 85 DK twinks might still have low enough strength totals to get away with slapping Dancing Steel on their H Gurthulak. Maybe.
I'll just leave it with the thought that Elitist Jerks doesn't even list Dancing Steel for consideration on any of their DPS guides for Death Knights.

Edit the second:
WoW forum post on use of enchants as DK (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/6934726491), which lists out some math suggesting that, based on proc rates as of that time, the breakpoint for Dancing Steel outperforming Fallen Crusader is actually 9240 Strength, which is, of course, quite low for level 90.

Also, sorry for being so stubborn about this. I remember telling a guildmate back in Wrath that his weapon chain was greatly inferior to Fallen Crusader. He seemed surprised that the two were mutually exclusive.

[Sajiri]

I think I have the worst luck with guilds. I started getting back into wow because I found a guild I THOUGHT was good, and it was nice not to be solo in dead guilds again. They were new, looking to form raid group soon for friday/saturday night runs which are the only two days I could even do that, and were looking for all the classes I just happen to play.

Was great at first, the guild leader seems like a genuinely good person but isn't around much. Unfortunately he seems more interested in quantity over quality. Spam invites people without so much as a whisper, gave everyone invite priviledges so they can invite whoever, and hasnt set up any site or forum or anything. Promoted some guy who seemed suitable to officer, and he immediately changed his attitude and started insulting and promoting/demoting/kicking whoever he wanted. Then left himself. But now I check the guild log, each day 10 new people join and just as many leave. And despite their recruitment post still saying friday/saturday raiding, one of the raiders scheduled it on the calendar for the next 4 thursdays as raid day. Whoever meets ilvl can come.

Getting real tired of the guild hunting >:I do decent ones with active people even exist anymore?

[Icewraith]

Several of the well-known "progression" guilds server transferred, I don't know how it is on your server. I'm pretty sure there is still quality raiding going on my server but we've still got a few friends in guild and I have to convince my GM wife to move too.

The one big guild that I'm sure we could both get into is big enough I'm not sure we could both get a raid spot, or if any are available. It's been my experience that there are tons of perfectly nice people still playing, some of them skilled, some of them not, many of them not-so-active as they would like to be. Our other thing is we're usually limited to pick 2-3 days between mon and thurs as we tend to have family stuff on weekends.

[Sajiri]

I'm not even looking for a big progression guild. Just a nice sense of community at least who are decently competent.

I've been in guilds with friendly people but they all go the same way. Generally they just don't get enough people and it dies. Some have nice members but their focus is on a specific thing (ie. pvp) and anyone who doesn't pvp, or whatever, gets ignored. Then, there's drama explosions. The best guild I was ever in was just last year, I even got the leader an interview with 15 mins of fame on wow insider, then he went nuts with the ego and the guild imploded. These days they only have 1 or 2 people online at a time, as opposed to the 30 or so it was in the 'good' days.

[Icewraith]

A 25 man guild (if you can find one) might be more resistant to this sort of thing, since by maintaining the larger roster you have more people on at a time and it's easier to keep the community going.

However, now there are now more potential schedule conflicts so you need even more people to cover for schedule variability and then you have to start leaving people, it goes wrong and your guild splits into two ten-man groups anyways. Or some subgroup decides "hey we keep on having attendance problems, let's just make our own guild!" then they raid for 3-4 months and then have attendance problems.

[Traab]

Hmm, I am actually only at 9k strength unbuffed. Of course, I havent really been running any heroic dungeons so my gear is an odd mix of scenario, faction gear, and ah stuff. Toss on any sort of str buff though and I am well over the cap. One of these days I will start running heroics.

[Krazzman]

About the enchants:
As far as I know Prot pally, and Guard Drood both take the bonus Str/Agi enchant on their weapon. Or I believe the Paladin even takes windsong over that to get more haste to get more holy power...

Collossus isn't worth crap. Takes too long to proc, doesn't do anything worthwhile when it proccs.


About our Raid:
Downed Twins and Iron Qon yesterday (I got a nice T-Set Shoulder piece. Now I need another piece for my set bonus...). Lei Shen wasn't that "hard" but we made mistakes we shouldn't do...

[Karoht]

See thats the thing, I dont know. I have no idea what weapon enchants there are.
www.wowhead.com
www.wowpedia.org
www.icy-veins.com <-- will give you spec specific advice


@Krazz
So you guys are 11/12 or 12/12?
Grats either way.


@Guilds
If you want a sense of community, guilds just are not the way to go these days, unless you hit upon a very special group of people. What you are asking is to have a collection of people 'always on' as it were. Typically, most players will log on for their specific activity, and log off when they are done. PvP or Raids or whatever. Hardly anyone these days logs on just to sit there just to talk with people, even in social guilds. My alts are all in social or leveling guilds. Some started with 40 people on average 'always online' but once people hit max level, they start looking elsewhere for things they want to do and leave.

If you want a guild to be more social, you need to take initiative. If people aren't talking, waiting for them to say something isn't going to work, you need to make conversation. If you want an event to occur, you need to organize it. I apologize if this sounds patronizing, it's just that I've seen so many people come and go from guilds, all with the same complaint that no one talks with them. Yet they never seem to start conversation themselves, or ignore conversations in guild to have arguements with morons in trade channel.

Take my Imaginary Bloodlust for a moment. Love it or hate it, it starts people talking. Same thing back when I was in Insomniac I wrote a guild theme song. Which I would copy/paste into /g usually once a week. Stuff like that keeps people engaged or gets conversation going. Heck, just bug people to team up for dailies or scenarios or whatever. Get on vent an TALK with people, even if raid or other serious stuff isn't happening. Go rare spawn hunting/camping if people are bored. Most 'inactive' or 'nonsocial' guilds are actually quite active and social, once someone starts the ball rolling. General rule of thumb, if you are talking in whispers to guildies chances are good you are doing it wrong.

Best of luck.

[Zherog]

Did my weekly Kara and MC runs last night. Still no mount from Midnight (again, not surprising). However, I'm only one more full run from hitting exalted with Violet Eye. Once that happens, it'll become a quick run, kill midnight and Atty, hope for the mount, leave. (And to be clear, I'm not quite doing a "full" run. I can't quite figure out how to do the chess game solo. So I stop there.)

For MC, I hit Reverred with Hydraxian Waterlords. That gives me the "benefit" of no longer getting rep from trash, only bosses. Yay! I need somewhere between 15 and 18 more runs on MC to hit Exalted. Woohoo!

[Karoht]

I managed to solo Kara chess once. Here is how I did it.
1-Move all three pawns in front of king out two steps.
2-Move King into a position behind the pawns.
3-Move Bishop to a position where he can heal king and assist in DPS.
4-Possibly move Knights in to support, take up the slack when pawns fall.
5-Constantly jump between King, Bishop, and Knights.
-King uses Bloodlust constantly and attack.
-Bishop heals or attacks as available
-Knights attack, move to flank.
-Always move the king out of the fire.

*Note*
Bishop can heal through the damage of the King VS King exchange, with one or two other units hitting the king. Your knights need to either 'draw aggro' by attacking anything else attacking the king, or assist in killing the enemy king. The Bishop can also assist in killing the enemy king if positioned correctly. And if possible, move your second bishop into play. This should leave you with enough room to get people out of fire if you arrange them carefully enough.

*Also Note*
Traveling time between the respawn point and the chess pieces is a big deal. The faster you can get to a piece and get in and do something, the better chance you have of being effective. Movement powers when possible is a must.

[Sajiri]

www.wowhead.com


If you want a guild to be more social, you need to take initiative. If people aren't talking, waiting for them to say something isn't going to work, you need to make conversation. If you want an event to occur, you need to organize it. I apologize if this sounds patronizing, it's just that I've seen so many people come and go from guilds, all with the same complaint that no one talks with them. Yet they never seem to start conversation themselves, or ignore conversations in guild to have arguements with morons in trade channel.

Take my Imaginary Bloodlust for a moment. Love it or hate it, it starts people talking. Same thing back when I was in Insomniac I wrote a guild theme song. Which I would copy/paste into /g usually once a week. Stuff like that keeps people engaged or gets conversation going. Heck, just bug people to team up for dailies or scenarios or whatever. Get on vent an TALK with people, even if raid or other serious stuff isn't happening. Go rare spawn hunting/camping if people are bored. Most 'inactive' or 'nonsocial' guilds are actually quite active and social, once someone starts the ball rolling. General rule of thumb, if you are talking in whispers to guildies chances are good you are doing it wrong.

Best of luck.

Believe me I'm aware of taking initiative. In the last big guild I was in, nothing ever happened til I started organising weekly runs of old raids, then mount runs, then other people started running things as well and it got more lively. We'd say hello when we logged in, others would respond. We had it posted in the forums directly if you don't say anything yourself people won't know you're there.

I want a social group, but I don't expect people to be always on, or to just come and talk. An example of the guild I'm in currently, people talk, but most of what's said is just sexist insults or the same few people calling each other ****. I see others, and myself, occasionally ask in gchat 'anyone up for xxxx?' and nobody responds. I say hello/goodbye/whatever when I log on or off, a few others too, generally the only person who responds is the leader if he's on. I get in a guild, and I try to stay a few weeks to test it out. I just logged onto wow and noticed this guild has lost about 40 members since the other day despite having more join as well.

In other news, gonna try LFR for the first time today :s

[Zherog]

In other news, gonna try LFR for the first time today :s

As someone who relatively recently - within the last six weeks or so - hit LFR for the first, I can honestly say that I so wish I had done so sooner. It's nice to see the content, it's fun to get the rewards (even if my damn weapon won't drop of Lei Shi), and it's a fun challenge. Don't let the ocassional jerkface that you'll run into deter you from going again. In my experience, at least, they're few and far between. I see many more jerks in random heroics than LFR.

[The Glyphstone]

Had a bit of an introspective moment yesterday while tanking on my DK - ran Stonecore, cleared the place without issue. On the run to the final boss, the shadowpriest DPS whispers me and says "you're a good tank :)".

It took me by surprise at first, which was the first half of the introspection - the state of the game and 'community' at this point where being complimented by a stranger is surprising enough to warrant a double take.

Then I got to thinking about how it used to be 'back in the day', when we climbed uphill both ways to get to our 5mans (and liked it). Back when the Friends list was used as much as the Ignore list is now, to mark and remember strangers you ran in groups with who you enjoyed the experience enough to want to specifically run with them again. In the modern era, unless you queue with someone from your own server, it's quite possible you will never run two 5-mans in your character's lifetime with the same randomly assigned person.

"The community sense has deteriorated" is hardly a shocking revelation, but this was the first time I can remember it really sort of hit home.

[Karoht]

I want a social group, but I don't expect people to be always on, or to just come and talk. An example of the guild I'm in currently, people talk, but most of what's said is just sexist insults or the same few people calling each other ****. I see others, and myself, occasionally ask in gchat 'anyone up for xxxx?' and nobody responds.
Well, at least you have a firm grasp of what is NOT a community.


In other news, gonna try LFR for the first time today :s
Best of luck.

@Community
Relying on others at one point a major source of complaint. Now the existance of content that negates that reliance (while still having content that absolutely requires it), and mainstream access to that content, is a major source of complaint.

[Sajiri]

In the modern era, unless you queue with someone from your own server, it's quite possible you will never run two 5-mans in your character's lifetime with the same randomly assigned person.


I remember when I was lvling my warlock, from 20 to 50ish I ended up with the same paladin tank/healer duo in just about every dungeon across a few days, good thing we liked each other.

[Icewraith]

I always like getting compliments on my tanking in the random dungeon finder. It's definitely not like the BC days, where once I got myself established as a decent tank I sometimes had to turn 2 or 3 people down a day as I was already doing something else. Back then a good tank was a rare and valuable resource.

Regarding guilds, I know that we had a sense of community, but people just stop logging on due to work, kids etc.

Sajiri, if all that's in your guild chat is sexist insults and name-calling, I'm sure you can do better. If you're guild hopping you can probably do a search, find the big guilds on your server, then look at their activity and roster on the wow site. It gives you an idea of how many people are actually active in the guild vs. how many never log on (I found a guild with 400 members and 8 active yesterday). Also, since you know who's in the guild, if there are annoying trade people you can scratch that guild off.

Hell I'd recruit you if you weren't, you know, in the wrong time zone on the wrong side of the world and almost certainly not on my server. The server limitation I'm discovering is one of the biggest issues in WoW, odds are if you find a new group of people who play it's 50/50 they're the wrong faction and 99/100 not on your server. Crossrealm helps if you want to run alts or 5 mans, but last I checked you couldn't pull cross-realm people into current raids? Also if you're trying for guild mounts and whatnot someone who can't or won't join your guild is going to be unable to help.

[Sajiri]

Hell I'd recruit you if you weren't, you know, in the wrong time zone on the wrong side of the world and almost certainly not on my server.

Ha well, I tend to play on US servers anyway because I don't like playing during what would be oceanic prime time and tend to get on at like...6am here.

And I could do better for a guild >_> I've been searching realm and recruitment forums, just trying to find one I'm sure is good this time because I don't like to guild hop.

Anyway, just did LFR finally. But I got thrown in right after they'd downed the first boss...so I guess that means I have to go back and do it again before I can go on to the next part?

[Icewraith]

Yes, but if you get dropped in after the first boss in LFR the next time you queue for that LFR you are guaranteed to get in at first boss to finish it up. (It won't keep on dropping you in at 2nd boss if you already killed 2nd and third boss for example) This is in the code somewhere, there's an official blizzard post on it and everything.

[Sajiri]

Just went back and finished that first boss, now Im queing for the next part. Trying to read over strats for the next set of bosses....this is a lot to take in @_@ especially elegon

[otakuryoga]

Just went back and finished that first boss, now Im queing for the next part. Trying to read over strats for the next set of bosses....this is a lot to take in @_@ especially elegon

just remember there is a chest with epic loot at the bottom of the pit..but only for 1 player per raid
no, there isn't. hope you didnt actually jump in 8p
1st time i went in there someone said that in raid chat and 3 people charged forward and jumped in.....

[Sajiri]

Well, I fell through the floor on elegon since I wasnt quite sure where I was meant to go, and was just a few steps away from making it..now the rest of the raid is yelling at me and the tank that fell that we suck and have ruined the fight.

I have learned something today. And that something is not to fall ):

[Seerow]

Yes, but if you get dropped in after the first boss in LFR the next time you queue for that LFR you are guaranteed to get in at first boss to finish it up. (It won't keep on dropping you in at 2nd boss if you already killed 2nd and third boss for example) This is in the code somewhere, there's an official blizzard post on it and everything.

This is not true. The official blizzard post says you are "far more likely" to get into a fresh run, but I have been dropped into in progress instances 3 times in a row before. (ToT3 for example I'm pretty sure I did 3rd boss twice, then got queued in on 2nd boss, before finally getting in to the first boss on my 4th try for the week. It was ridiculous)

[Seerow]

Well, I fell through the floor on elegon since I wasnt quite sure where I was meant to go, and was just a few steps away from making it..now the rest of the raid is yelling at me and the tank that fell that we suck and have ruined the fight.

I have learned something today. And that something is not to fall ):

Elegon is my favorite boss.

A few months back I was at LFR Elegon, and before the fight people were making their usual "Bet how many people are going to fall in jokes". At one point someone makes a bet to the effect of "500 gold says that nobody falls in".

So boss starts, first transition phase hits, floor drops out... and nobody falls. I say "Nope, not gonna lose that bet. Geronimo!" and jump into the pit. After that I start up a running commentary of how cool everything looks from inside the pit, how I can see everyone running around above me, how the sparkly orbs look....

Then one of the tanks goes "Really? I've never been down there before." so I insist "Really? Well you should jump in and join me, it's pretty great". So sure enough, second transition I get one of the tanks jumping in to join me, and we just chill out watching the end of the fight play out.

Probably one of my best LFR experiences to date.

[Sajiri]

Whew, 4 attempts on that final fight of mogu'shan..I have never seen such an angry whiny raid group in my life. Didnt help they yelled at the tanks so much that one of them decided to drop mid fight.

On the plus side, I got a new bow, so yay.

[Icewraith]

Niice. Everything after weapon is gravy.

[Karoht]

One rare spawn evades me now. Sele'na, in Valley of the Four Winds. Oh well, I guess I'm just going to have to log out on the spawn point every night for a while.
Also, finally finished Scenario achievements. 16010 achievement points. Boo yeah.

@LFR
Most bosses are pretty easy in LFR. I'll cover off some trouble spots you may run into for the remaining bosses you have left. If I don't mention a boss, don't worry about it. I recommend watching videos for these guys.

Heart of Fear:
-Garalon sometimes stalls groups, usually because no one knows how to kite him.
-Wind Lord problems are usually attributed to poor CC of the adds. Video unlikely to be required here.
-Amber Shaper involves a vehicle mechanic, and it confuses people tremendously.
-Emperess has two things you need to get right. Having the debuffed people step into the sonic rings, and not standing in the purple cone that does the fear effect. Ace those two things and you don't need a video.

Terrace of the Endless Spring:
-Lei Shi is only hard if tanks don't swap. Video not entirely recommended.
-Sha of Fear has two things that screw everyone up. The fear effect, and the platforms. Worth watching a video for.

Throne of Thunder:
-Watch them all. Serious.

[Seerow]

Throne of Thunder:
-Watch them all. Serious.

That's really not necessary.

Wing 1 is a breeze.
Jin'Rokh-Stand in puddle, win
Horridon-Dinomancer > Other Adds > Boss, don't stand in stuff (unless you feel like being a ****, then just sit on Horridon the whole time and let others deal with it, and enjoy the big numbers on your DPS meter for fun. I've gotten 220k on him doing that)
Council-4 bosses, one will turn shadowy, which one is shadowy will switch occasionally. Hit the one that's shadowy, don't stand in stuff. Easy

Wing 2:
Tortos-As long as at least one person in this fight knows what they're doing, all you need to know is kill bats before boss, and don't stand in stuff.
Maegara-Attack the same head everyone else is attacking, stack up with the other ranged, win.
Jin'Rokh-Don't volunteer to be in the egg group, and it's basically tank and spank. With an added extra of "Stand in stuff to clear the stuff off the floor". Easy.

Wing 3:
Dumuru-Yeah, watch the video for this one. You can get away with going in without watching, but you will die on the maze.
Primordius-Kill the slimes, if they drop a red puddle, run through it. If they drop a purple puddle, avoid it. After collecting 5 red puddles, you'll transform, at which point you switch to the boss. Easy.
Dark Animus-Just don't AoE, regardless of how tempting it is with all of the little mobs, and you'll be fine here.

Wing 4:
Iron Qon-Probably worth watching the video for this one.
Twin Consorts-DPS whichever boss is up. This fight is dead easy on LFR, and probably even easier as ranged.
Lei Shen-Watch the video for this one. But the short version is someone will assign every group to one quadrant. During the phase change (when Lei Shen teleports to the middle), run to your quadrant. Stack up with the others in your group, and stand in swirly things to stop adds from spawning. Aside from that don't stand in lightning whip, don't let him push you off the edge with the wind, remember to AoE when he uses ball lightning to help kill adds, run away from Thundering Crash or whatever it's called, and don't stand in purple stuff (Yeah there's a lot going on in this one, like I said, best to watch the video. By far the most complex fight of the tier)

[Zherog]

Terrace of the Endless Spring:
-Lei Shi is only hard if tanks don't swap. Video not entirely recommended.

I've seen people die on Lei Shi during her "get away" phase because they don't push back against the bubbles.

On Tsolong, I've seen people die because they don't stand in the sunbeam. Yeah, I know. Basic. But just about every run, somebody dies from that.

Also during Tsolong, if you're a DPS class, make sure you focus on the "little" sha during the daylight phase.

[Sajiri]

I appreciate the advice on other bosses. I got a headache from people's behaviour during that last fight yesterday but I got both a bow and a cape which got me from ilvl 460 to 465. I guess I need to be 470 to do the next raid? If only I could get a shoulders recipe from magnificence of leather.

Anyway, how often can you que for LFR? I thought it would be once a week but I qued for the same one twice in a row yesterday. I wasnt sure if thats how it was meant to be or if it was because I was missing one of the bosses from it.

Edit: since I have the skill, mats and recipe already, is it worth it to make this http://www.wowhead.com/item=85787/chestguard-of-earthen-harmony
when the chest I'm already using is this http://www.wowhead.com/item=81110 ?

Not sure if I should make this for bit of an ilvl boost to get to 470 or try to find it all elsewhere and save my mats.

[The Glyphstone]

You can queue for LFR as many time as you like, but unless you use Elder Charms of Good Fortune, you can only receive loot from any specific boss once per week.

[Sajiri]

O___O I was struggling to do above 35k before. After upgrading just a few pieces and getting gems and enchants on my gear, I was shocked to see I just did 77k on a quest elite.

I need to do more LFR!

[Krazzman]

We are at 11/12.

Raided yesterday: got Mainhand (2-hand staff with hit/haste) from horridon and T-Set Trousers from Ji-Kun. We got to Dark Animus, and will kill him and Iron Qon + Twins this Monday or Tuesday depending on time we have. Else Tuesday either DA, Iron Qon and Twins + Lei Shen or just Lei shen and hopefully not failing as much as last time.

I have exactly 1 Item below 500 (the 496 Ring from Dominance offensive). And all the secrets for my metagem but no time to farm it yet.

About this quest:
So to get a Legendary they now force you to: do dailies, do pvp, do raids and scenarios? Yeah imagine my joy... I don't like pvp and I don't like being forced to do this. My fiancee is exaclty at this point. Do PvP to get the next quest.
And well this aggravates her. She disliked the scenarios in Isle of Thunder because we couldn't do them together and she was forced to go into her Ele-specc because as healer this would take long. She dislikes scenarios because they don't need healers.
She doesn't want to do PvP with her shaman because it's no fun for her. With her hunter? Might be no problem but her shaman: no-go.

In the end it will probably be that I do it for her or something like that. I was a dead weight in those bg's with my shadow too so it shouldn't be that much of a problem.

[Sajiri]

I got my ilvl up to 470 tonight so tomorrow morning I'm going to try the next raid in LFR. I hope there are no places to fall down again :s

[Krazzman]

I hope there are no places to fall down again :s

There is one. Terrace of Endless Spring: Lei Shi. She pulls a move where she screams "Get away from me" and then pushed you away. You "just" fall into the water and can run back up but this might mean death to you.

Otherwise on Ji-Kun in Throne of Thunder (2nd Part - Forgotten Dephts) he has the ability Down Draft. either pick up a feather somewhere and just start flying everytime he uses downdraft or run against it. If you fall down you will "slowly" fly up again but again this could mean death depending on the healers/how topped off you are and if the boss uses another ability.

I hope this helps.

[The Glyphstone]

O___O I was struggling to do above 35k before. After upgrading just a few pieces and getting gems and enchants on my gear, I was shocked to see I just did 77k on a quest elite.

I need to do more LFR!

LFR is also a great place to practice/finetune your rotation and get your DPS up. Target dummies are nice, but since they're completely distraction-free, they're a bit limited - and also never drop below 20%, so you can't test Execute phase DPS. LFR is so easy it's basically a mobile target dummy, but there are still things to dodge and fire to get out of, so it's a more realistic simulator of an environment for you to hone your skills in.


EDIT: Don't forget the bridge between Jin'Rok and Horridon on the list of 'place you can fall off'. Even without the soul flayer ghosts to do knockbacks, the sideways-blowing wind can take a few tries to figure out.

[Zherog]

Nabbed two more rares last night (a mogu and a monkey), and picked up a few more treasures of Pandaland as well. I only have a few treasures left to find at this point.

I'm amazed how easily I can handle the mogu and hozen rares, yet the panda chick I encountered gave me such fits. Oh well. It gives me something to keep striding for.

[Krazzman]

LFR is also a great place to practice/finetune your rotation and get your DPS up. Target dummies are nice, but since they're completely distraction-free, they're a bit limited - and also never drop below 20%, so you can't test Execute phase DPS. LFR is so easy it's basically a mobile target dummy, but there are still things to dodge and fire to get out of, so it's a more realistic simulator of an environment for you to hone your skills in.

Jumping on this train: this doesn't count for every fight. Example Horridon.
In normal 10 man mode I get about 200k dps. In lfr I have a hard time scratching 140k without making the encounter end in an Wipe due to warchief butting into the fight when the fourth door is opened.

[Shishnarfne]

Apparently this was a good week for raid progression. After downing Durumu for the first time last week (on something like our second/third night of attempts), we knocked off Primordius and Dark Animus on consecutive nights, not having pulled either one previously.

Now I need to actually run LFR for the last wing so that I can see the fights firsthand, and to make progress on the legendary quest chain... At least the legendary tank meta gem is quite nice.

Yeah, my least favorite part of the chain was the two battlegrounds. I didn't really have a PvP set, so I went in there with my best available gear: all raid tanking gear. I resigned myself to hitting like a wet noodle, but was confident that it'd take a lot of work to knock me down. I did have to add one person to my ignore list to make the last battleground palatable (he understandably didn't like that I was in his random group as a tank with no PvP gear, but decided to be aggravating about it).

After getting my two wins (in three total attempts, somehow), I haven't been back in battlegrounds.

I'll go so far as to say that while the legendary quest chain benefits are nice, they are a lot of work for people trying to catch up now, and are probably not mandatory. Yes, your performance will be worse, but it's probably not worth spending time on the chain over Isle of Thunder dailies and LFR. If you don't mind doing both, or are really determined to squeeze that extra bit out, go for it! It'll just take a LONG time and a LOT of work.

[Icewraith]

I forget how common this is with a group that's learning to raid: healers that don't have good raid awareness. They can make the bars go up, but as soon as there's adds or bad stuff on the ground, or adds and bad stuff on the ground a la elegon phase 3, they aren't familiar with the escape mechanisms and cc their class has because they've never had to use those in leveling/5-man content or rf, or if an add gets on them they just try to heal through it.

However, the tank we've been running with the past couple weeks is from a different guild, and is significantly-more-competent than the tank from the learning guild. It turns out they too have been having attendance problems and they normally raid on the nights we blocked out to try to run as our own guild (that everyone said they could make and then got busy and couldn't show up).

So hopefully I'll get a peak into some of the later last tier content or even real ToT instead of raid finder. Hope springs eternal. Is average ilevel in the 490s-500s good enough to start thinking about ToT? Assume correct gearing/reforging and people who know what they're doing in a raid.

[Psyren]

Well, I fell through the floor on elegon since I wasnt quite sure where I was meant to go, and was just a few steps away from making it..now the rest of the raid is yelling at me and the tank that fell that we suck and have ruined the fight.

I have learned something today. And that something is not to fall ):

My first time on that fight, even with all the chaos, I never once fell thanks to DBM's nonstop yelling.

So... I suggest DBM if you don't have it yet.

[Karoht]

@ToT Normal
490's is fine. Skill notwithstanding of course. LFR gear goes a long way too.

@Derp Healers
Oh man. The stories I could tell you.
Moving and healing is actually quite hard unless you are a class with lots of instant effects. I find the ones that don't are the ones who tend to tunnel vision the most. Or if they don't have an obvious movement power
Sometimes the solution is simple. Get them to change their talents for a different movement power, and get them in the habit of using it all the time.
I should probably update my moving and healing video some time soon.

Oh, and I have a trial with the new guild next week.

Cheers!

[Icewraith]

I've spent a bit of time on alt healers, haven't done anything this expansion but I did quite a bit with a disc priest last expansion. All the instants you have there are renew (which was pretty weak last expansion for Disc) and PW:S, which sucks mana if you spam it.

Maybe movement comes more naturally because I'm used to kiting as a tank and forced movement as a melee class, but I didn't find movement as a healer to be that difficult.... if there is a void zone under you, MOVE! Drop whatever spell you're casting and GTFO. Throw out whatever instants you have, CD the tank if you think he will die from your lack of heals. But move.

For adds, learn what short-term cc and survivability cooldowns you have (fears, stuns, slows, knockbacks, threat drops) and make sure you have it somewhere you can get at it. If adds get on you and the tank is supposed to pick them up, run to the tank. If you're putting out a lot of healing and there's a tank assigned to add duty, stand ON the tank whenever possible so the adds are running towards him even if they're targeting you (unless encounter mechanics dictate otherwise).

The only healers who ever profit from their deaths are holy priests with the angel form after death ability. I've seen a couple smart holy priests purposefully suicide themselves for angel form on a last couple %s, big damage, things are going terribly wrong and people are dying and the priest is oom situation. That buys you a few seconds of super flash heal and one less person for the other healers to cover. Everything else the approach is just like current tank gearing strategy- survive FIRST, worry about the damage later.

[Karoht]

It used to be that watching the raid frames was how you understood who and how to heal. Nowadays, a healer has to be doing so much more.
In addition to staying alive and focusing on one's own survival, healers have to be able to 'read the play' as it were. You get so much more info on who to heal if you are watching and interpreting what you see into healing decisions.
After a while of reading the play, I swear I don't even see my healbot frames anymore.
Wanna break the healer tunnel vision? Give them responsibilities to watch for and call for certain things. Treat them almost like raid leaders (though not nearly as stressfully), and they'll eventually develop that awareness.

[Zherog]

If adds get on you and the tank is supposed to pick them up, run to the tank.

This is true for DPS, too. Playing a mage (as opposed to the rogue I used to play as my main), I get to see a lot more now. And I can't tell you how many times I've seen a hunter or mage or warlock grab aggro - typically on an add - and run away. Yeah, and guess who dies shortly after that?

[Alarra]

I've spent a bit of time on alt healers, haven't done anything this expansion but I did quite a bit with a disc priest last expansion. All the instants you have there are renew (which was pretty weak last expansion for Disc) and PW:S, which sucks mana if you spam it.

Disc have a lot of instants right now and mobile healing is pretty easy. Especially if you have the glyph to be able to cast penance while moving, and there's no reason not to have that. But between penance, shields, PoM, cascade and solace, you can heal really well without having to stop moving at all.

[Sajiri]

My first time on that fight, even with all the chaos, I never once fell thanks to DBM's nonstop yelling.

So... I suggest DBM if you don't have it yet.

I have DBM, but I was a little confused by the layout in that fight. I think it looked like there were 2 sections to the glass or something? I remember seeing the message so I started running back, and a bunch of people had stopped while still on the glass, so I thought only the centre fell through and then at the last moment they all moved. I tried to run and just missed making it to safety. Did fine the next time though.

I'm glad how much more helpful people are on this forum with the advice.

[Seerow]

This is true for DPS, too. Playing a mage (as opposed to the rogue I used to play as my main), I get to see a lot more now. And I can't tell you how many times I've seen a hunter or mage or warlock grab aggro - typically on an add - and run away. Yeah, and guess who dies shortly after that?

Pfft, I pick up an add, pop DBTS, and kill the add. Don't need no stinkin' tank.

[Zherog]

I'm a squishy mage. I need a tank...

[Icewraith]

I've stopped a RF from wiping by taunting off the tank, popping dbts, and living long enough for his stacks to fall off on Shek'zeer. Other tank wasn't taunting and I didn't want to wipe again.

Mages? You don't need no stinkin' tank if you get an add on you.

Frost nova
Mirror Images
Blink
Iceblock <------------!!!!!!
Polymorph
Invisibility
and that's just off the top of my head.

Quite often my wife (mage) is the last person to die on a wipe, goes invisible to reset the encounter, and mass rezzes us.

[Sajiri]

I managed to reconnect with an old friend today whom I haven't talked to in months, thanks to old guild drama I left from where he stayed. Even though he's staying in the guild he's in, we've come to the decision that when looking for a non/light RP PVE guild hordeside, Wyrmrest really is not a good server for it. I've been scrolling through the forums all morning looking for a new guild to apply to and no luck.

Methinks I might have to broaden my search and potentially drop some money on a server/faction change :/

[Traab]

This is an open comment to level 90s that think its amusing to go to places like goldshire and slaughter the quest givers over and over again. #%@$ YOU. You are not funny, you are not clever, you are not trying to get pvp. You are griefing the hell out of lowbies just trying to play their damn alts. You have absolutely no need to target the 3-4 main quest givers in the town to get a fight, there are already a dozen or more 90s hanging out there more than willing to play.

Thank you for making my play time miserable. All I want to do is level up a new alt. And as if it isnt annoying enough dealing with a half dozen people from as many servers running the exact same quests as me, now I have to wait 10 minutes for quest npcs to respawn so I can hurry through the hand in before the 90s show back up to insta gib them, then vanish, so they have time to pleasure themselves over how cool and awesome they are before they repeat the cycle.

Blizzard, for gods sake, make the quest givers unattackable. How hard is that? Or, if you must make them attackable, make them hit like effing raid bosses with hp to match. Maybe then the asshats out there will stick with slaughtering 50 guards at once so everyone in the zones defense chat spam fills the screen. I can live with that.

[Sajiri]

So I think I might have found a keeper guild this time. I like everything I see from them, and they have rules AGAINST all the things I dislike in my current guild. The even have plenty of people active during my screwy timezone. The best part is it's on my own server and the GL actually approached me to recruit me just when I had thought I'd have to pay for a transfer elsewhere.

Now for that anxious wait before they look at my app tomorrow, because I do not want to have to change servers. If only their website hadn't decided to not let me create an account for 30 minutes >_<

In other news, just as I was a day or two away from getting revered with golden lotus, I read the patch notes that shado pan won't need it as a prereq come tuesday. I just got revered with sunreaver assault though and now I just need to work up some more VP.

I also finally did the Dagger in the Dark scenario. Wow! Too bad I will not be making my goal of trying everything at least once before patch day :/ Busy weekend irl I haven't got to try heart of fear LFR yet. Maybe I can rush through tomorrow after work.

[Togath]

This is an open comment to level 90s that think its amusing to go to places like goldshire and slaughter the quest givers over and over again. #%@$ YOU. You are not funny, you are not clever, you are not trying to get pvp. You are griefing the hell out of lowbies just trying to play their damn alts. You have absolutely no need to target the 3-4 main quest givers in the town to get a fight, there are already a dozen or more 90s hanging out there more than willing to play.

Thank you for making my play time miserable. All I want to do is level up a new alt. And as if it isnt annoying enough dealing with a half dozen people from as many servers running the exact same quests as me, now I have to wait 10 minutes for quest npcs to respawn so I can hurry through the hand in before the 90s show back up to insta gib them, then vanish, so they have time to pleasure themselves over how cool and awesome they are before they repeat the cycle.

Blizzard, for gods sake, make the quest givers unattackable. How hard is that? Or, if you must make them attackable, make them hit like effing raid bosses with hp to match. Maybe then the asshats out there will stick with slaughtering 50 guards at once so everyone in the zones defense chat spam fills the screen. I can live with that.

Do you mean literally Goldshire, or elsewhere as well?(attacking Goldshire itself is understandable[int he sense that the people might have some non-griefing motivation for it specifically], as it has a reputation as being home to ERPers, even though that's not that common there regardless of server nowadays)

[Traab]

Do you mean literally Goldshire, or elsewhere as well?(attacking Goldshire itself is understandable[int he sense that the people might have some non-griefing motivation for it specifically], as it has a reputation as being home to ERPers, even though that's not that common there regardless of server nowadays)

I mean goldshire literally. Its like watching an attack on the capitol city. They will literally bum rush the town, take down the quest givers and ONLY the quest givers, even up to forcing their way into the inn to take down the guys in there before being killed. Then if they survived, they run off and wait for them to respawn. If they died they sneak back, rezz then fly off to safety. They are doing this with over a dozen level 90 alliance players there fighting back. They arent interested in pvp, they just want to kill off the quest givers. I just dont understand why blizzard does that. There are quest givers that are unattackable, why not make them all like that? There are still dozens of guards and even merchants that could get wiped out by players wanting to start a pvp fight, and leaving them vulnerable is just an open invite to griefing.

[Zherog]

Got a chance to do my first Lei Shi run of the week in last night. Nothing but gold. Again. *sigh*

[Antonok]

So I've been tanking LFD since the reward Satchels were implemented, but I never got anything good. Until today. I opened one expecting another gem or flask and saw the purple color of a Reins of the Green Proto-Drake! (http://www.wowhead.com/item=44707)

Just goes to show persistence does pay off, even if it would of been faster to farm the rep and egg(s).

[Sajiri]

I mean goldshire literally. Its like watching an attack on the capitol city. They will literally bum rush the town, take down the quest givers and ONLY the quest givers, even up to forcing their way into the inn to take down the guys in there before being killed. Then if they survived, they run off and wait for them to respawn. If they died they sneak back, rezz then fly off to safety. They are doing this with over a dozen level 90 alliance players there fighting back. They arent interested in pvp, they just want to kill off the quest givers. I just dont understand why blizzard does that. There are quest givers that are unattackable, why not make them all like that? There are still dozens of guards and even merchants that could get wiped out by players wanting to start a pvp fight, and leaving them vulnerable is just an open invite to griefing.

I had an alli guy follow me around in the blasted lands once killing every single npc I approached, and then aoeing quest mobs before I could reach them when I was lvling an alt last year. At least that was just one guy and the guild I was at the time in sent out a dozen 85s to come camp the guy's body til he left.

I always thought questgivers should be unnattackable too, or at the least, be difficult to kill out in the world or have stronger guards in towns.

[Traab]

I had an alli guy follow me around in the blasted lands once killing every single npc I approached, and then aoeing quest mobs before I could reach them when I was lvling an alt last year. At least that was just one guy and the guild I was at the time in sent out a dozen 85s to come camp the guy's body til he left.

I always thought questgivers should be unnattackable too, or at the least, be difficult to kill out in the world or have stronger guards in towns.

Actually, im ok with the guards as they are. They are mostly there for defense spam to let everyone know an attack is happening, plus they are JUST tough enough that they can help out their faction in a full scale brawl. But yeah, make all quest givers a combo of pandarian and jinyu rares. /nod :smallbiggrin:

*EDIT* As for the stalker, yeah, I had stuff like that be done to me as well. My favorite was this one high level rogue that followed me everywhere, and kept stealthing his way in between me and whatever I was attacking trying to force me to flag for pvp. I mean really, how pathetic can you be? The people who do that on pve servers are the lowest, worst layer of losers in the game. They want all the "fun" of corpse camping and ganking lowbies, but they were too pathetic to level up on a pvp server. So their only solution is to try and force flag lowbies so they can pretend they are awesome and force them to log out until they get bored and find someone else to stalk.

[Sajiri]

It just occured to me that many years ago (vanilla? BC?) back when I played a night elf, I was bored of lvling one day and trekked into horde territory and found myself at the tauren starter village (or I assume that's what it was). I didn't actually do anything, just sat there while some newbie taurens came out and started rudely emoting at me, with the exception of the one guy who was trying really hard to flirt. Until one of the guards got too close and attacked me and I got pvp flagged.

Again, I did not attack any players, nor did I attack any questgivers. But the lvl 5 taurens decided if they teamed up maybe they could take down the lvl 50 something. They all died, and yet I still did not attack a single one of them. My pet was on auto and decided to go on a killing spree in revenge for anyone who tried to shoot me. I just sat back and watched my wolf running wild through the village as everyone tried to take it down. Until some max lvl undead guy came riding down the road at me and I promptly hearthed out of there /laughing.


But yeah, make all quest givers a combo of pandarian and jinyu rares. /nod :smallbiggrin:

Make them ALL monks

[Traab]

My personal favorite time was back in vanilla as well. Myself, a low 50s shaman at the time, plus a few guildies went to astrannar to pick a fight. So there we are, beating up guards and having a grand old time, when every night elf in the zone flagged and decided to take us on. There were at least 2-3 groups worth and they swarmed us. It was actually a really good fight. I got attacked by a full group that decided the best way to kill me was to range me to death. So one druid kept chain rooting me, while everyone else did their best to nuke from range while every 6 seconds or so, I would earth shock one to the brink of death, and sometimes manage to land a few shots as well. It actually got down to the druid and me at the end. I was low on mana and health, but everyone else was dead. I kept charging for him and he kept running back trying to root and nuke me. Right at the end of my hp I resisted his last root and proceeded to cave in his skull with a windfury blast of my twig of the world tree. Much cheering was had by all. Then a larger group of mid 50s showed up and chased us off. /cry

[Sajiri]

My personal favorite time was back in vanilla as well. Myself, a low 50s shaman at the time, plus a few guildies went to astrannar to pick a fight. So there we are, beating up guards and having a grand old time, when every night elf in the zone flagged and decided to take us on. There were at least 2-3 groups worth and they swarmed us. It was actually a really good fight. I got attacked by a full group that decided the best way to kill me was to range me to death. So one druid kept chain rooting me, while everyone else did their best to nuke from range while every 6 seconds or so, I would earth shock one to the brink of death, and sometimes manage to land a few shots as well. It actually got down to the druid and me at the end. I was low on mana and health, but everyone else was dead. I kept charging for him and he kept running back trying to root and nuke me. Right at the end of my hp I resisted his last root and proceeded to cave in his skull with a windfury blast of my twig of the world tree. Much cheering was had by all. Then a larger group of mid 50s showed up and chased us off. /cry

This makes me want to finish lvling my shaman.

I think my best memories in wow were from the first time I played and I just pvp'd all the time. Probably helped that back then I happened to know the guild leader of one of the most hardcore endgame guilds on that server irl, and he let me into his guild as a social member..so any time someone tried to pick a fight with me I had a bunch of buddies who were bored enough to rush over.

Although these days I can't bring myself to pvp at all. I had a friend who started dragging me to tol barad at the end of cata, but that didnt last long.

[Traab]

This makes me want to finish lvling my shaman.

I think my best memories in wow were from the first time I played and I just pvp'd all the time. Probably helped that back then I happened to know the guild leader of one of the most hardcore endgame guilds on that server irl, and he let me into his guild as a social member..so any time someone tried to pick a fight with me I had a bunch of buddies who were bored enough to rush over.

Although these days I can't bring myself to pvp at all. I had a friend who started dragging me to tol barad at the end of cata, but that didnt last long.


Well remember, this was vanilla, when enhance shaman were gods among men, and only horde got them. A lot has changed since then. Im pretty sure this was done before molten core was opened. As far as pvp is concerned, I dont do it much. I played dark age of camelot before wow, so I was pretty seriously burned out on pvp and only did it every once in a great while for quick fun.

[Sajiri]

Well remember, this was vanilla, when enhance shaman were gods among men, and only horde got them. A lot has changed since then. Im pretty sure this was done before molten core was opened. As far as pvp is concerned, I dont do it much. I played dark age of camelot before wow, so I was pretty seriously burned out on pvp and only did it every once in a great while for quick fun.

I still want to finish my shaman anyway. Granted I was playing resto, but once I reach cata lvls or so I want to start playing enhance or elemental as well...just can't decide which.

Edit: Okay, I have more. 1. I was thinking about how I went back to playing alli for a bit briefly before I stopped playing, then decided I missed the horde too much. I was taking my time with quests and finishing each zone before moving on and realised I was having oh so much fun.

I've never actually done that with horde characters. I just move on as soon as Im high enough lvl or lvled through dungeons. I feel like rolling a new alt soon to actually experience this (and because I actually have fun questing) but I don't know which class/race to try? Already have hunter(s), warlock and DK, a resto shaman at 50, and some other alts I created but yet to play.

2. Roleplay. I'm on a RP server but never did any RP. I dunno, for something different I kinda want to get into it but don't know where to start. I think I've been scarred too many times as well by what my friend dubbed as a curse- if I spend any amount of time in any inn (hearth and dont immediately run out) without fail people will come in and start ERPing next to me. Nobody else seems to have it happen to them, just me ._.

[Karoht]

This is an open comment to level 90s that think its amusing to go to places like goldshire and slaughter the quest givers over and over again. #%@$ YOU. You are not funny, you are not clever, you are not trying to get pvp. You are griefing the hell out of lowbies just trying to play their damn alts. You have absolutely no need to target the 3-4 main quest givers in the town to get a fight, there are already a dozen or more 90s hanging out there more than willing to play.

Thank you for making my play time miserable. All I want to do is level up a new alt.
Was it you, or was it someone else who was complaining about level 90 guards popping out of no where while attempting to gank low level quest givers along with players in the starting areas? Shortly after the expansion launched. Was it you? Or am I thinking of someone else? I should go check.
It was funny because whoever it was made out as though they were incredibly angry, how dare someone come and stop them from being a douche.


A quick note, I hope everyone here is valor capped. Get all the valor you can, because with the VP upgrade system reinstated, it only costs 500 points to fully upgrade something. If you have the full 3K VP on you currently, that's 6 items you can just upgrade to max, right now.
Top 3 choices are Weapon, Chest, and Legs, in that order. After that it is helm, shoulder, belt, after that it's gloves, bracers, neck and rings. Trinkets are dead last.

If anyone has ANY questions about the patch tomorrow, I highly urge you to read the full write-up on mmo-champion.com on their front page. It has literally EVERYTHING, including info on the new scenarios, how heroic scenarios work, and many other important changes.
Heck, go read it even if you THINK you know what you need to know about the patch tomorrow.
www.mmo-champion.com

[Seerow]

Trinkets are dead last.


uhh...for DPS trinkets are pretty much top priority after weapons. Unless you have one of those niche trinkets that has a weird unique effect (like the Rune of Reorigination, or whatever the one that gives 100% crit rate is called), rather than a proc that can scale with ilvl (because the trinkets with those procs have their proc rate scaled with ilvl instead of the proc, making it a weaker improvement than it might be otherwise)

[Karoht]

uhh...for DPS trinkets are pretty much top priority after weapons. Unless you have one of those niche trinkets that has a weird unique effect (like the Rune of Reorigination, or whatever the one that gives 100% crit rate is called), rather than a proc that can scale with ilvl (because the trinkets with those procs have their proc rate scaled with ilvl instead of the proc, making it a weaker improvement than it might be otherwise)Arguably yes, but it was a general guideline based on the amount of stats on an item. The stat differences on most trinkets aren't really enought to call it your best upgrade.
Lets say someone only had 1500 points, enough to fully upgrade 3 items.
Chest, Legs, and Weapon have the largest stat pools, therefore will net the largest increases per item level.
On top of that, it will be increasing ALL of those stats, not just one or two.
You're an Arms Warrior?
Increasing your Strength and Crit at the same time is going to be a bigger net increase over a boss fight, than boosting just the Strength OR Crit on a trinket, never mind the proc. Always hit for a little bit more, or sometimes hit for a heck of a lot more?
Mind you I have not checked out the upgrade versions of the T15 trinkets, but the T14 trinkets upgraded rather poorly. For example, on my chest I easily net over 100 int (along with other perks like improved spell power (due to improved int as well as just a static improvement for upgrading the item), improved secondary ratings, and improved stamina), but on the Trinket I barely got a 40 int upgrade, and the proc difference was almost negligable. I think I got 3662 haste rather than 3430 haste on a proc? Not really that big a difference, even over a long fight like heroic elegon. Especially as procs can be wasted (trigger at non-optimal times). On an on-use trinket, that might be more relevant.

But, this is also coming from a healing perspective primarily.

[Seerow]

Dammit I need to remember to stop hitting Refresh while in the middle of writing a post. It's a bad habit I have (tabbing between multiple pages and refreshing automatically, I forget in one of those tabs I'm actually writing something).

Will edit this later.



Edit: Okay here we go. I decided rather than arguing senselessly about it, I'd go test it instead, making for round 2 of "Seerow plays with Simcraft on GitP".

Testing methodology was taking my own character (Secondwind on Shadowsong), and running a 10,000 iteration sim on him. I then picked one item, upgraded it, simmed again. Went back, changed the upgraded item (so as to only have one upgraded at a time) and simmed again. I did this for Weapon, Chest, Legs, and both trinkets. Then decided to check a ring just to see how much the lower itemization affects things.

Note on my gear: 522 trinket is SPA trinket, 502 trinket is Feather of Ji-kun.

DPS Test Results:
Baseline: 127,627
Weapon: 132,075 (+4448)
Chest: 127,996 (+369)
Legs: 128,237 (+610)
522 Trinket: 128,160 (+533)
502 Trinket: 128,303 (+676)
Ring: 128,002 (+375)


Weapon is obviously top priority. Chest/Legs are not actually significantly better than trinkets. In fact, the Legs (which are closest to the Trinkets) have no stats wasted on Hit/Expertise, while both trinkets and the chest all do. The actual item level of the base gear seems to have some impact on the value of the upgrade, as well, but the itemization seems to be the bigger factor. The ring I checked does show that Karoht is right in principle that slots with a higher itemization budget are more valuable to upgrade, because the ring that only gets +375 is both 522 and perfectly itemized.

So what does this tell us? Honestly it tells us that the answer to what is optimal is going to be "it depends". It definitely shows that Trinkets are at least on par with, if not better than, the higher budget items. It also shows that itemization is important, and upgrading something with good stats is better than upgrading something with a bunch of hit/expertise that isn't going to be used.


On the specific subject of trinkets, I really think it is just a difference of heals vs DPS. I don't heal very much, but I do know that a lot of the time, extra burst throughput just turns into overhealing, especially if it is uncontrollable. Healers very much prize being very consistent over bursty. On the other hand, DPS specs tend to like bursty cooldowns because there is no overkill dps on bosses. At least as long as you're smart enough to not be blowing your cooldowns in the last 5 seconds of the fight. DPS tend to stack all of their burst cooldowns (including trinkets as much as possible) into the same time frame, to take advantage of the multiplicitive returns of stacking (ie popping 2 20% cooldowns for the same 20 seconds gets you more damage than popping them back to back and riding it out for 40 seconds). This tends to make trinkets very valuable for DPS because if you have the proc running during that burst window, having 3000 strength right then means way more than having 500 for the rest of the fight outside that window, even before you consider it proccing other times outside your big burst.

[Traab]

Was it you, or was it someone else who was complaining about level 90 guards popping out of no where while attempting to gank low level quest givers along with players in the starting areas? Shortly after the expansion launched. Was it you? Or am I thinking of someone else? I should go check.
It was funny because whoever it was made out as though they were incredibly angry, how dare someone come and stop them from being a douche.


A quick note, I hope everyone here is valor capped. Get all the valor you can, because with the VP upgrade system reinstated, it only costs 500 points to fully upgrade something. If you have the full 3K VP on you currently, that's 6 items you can just upgrade to max, right now.
Top 3 choices are Weapon, Chest, and Legs, in that order. After that it is helm, shoulder, belt, after that it's gloves, bracers, neck and rings. Trinkets are dead last.

If anyone has ANY questions about the patch tomorrow, I highly urge you to read the full write-up on mmo-champion.com on their front page. It has literally EVERYTHING, including info on the new scenarios, how heroic scenarios work, and many other important changes.
Heck, go read it even if you THINK you know what you need to know about the patch tomorrow.
www.mmo-champion.com

I dont. . . THINK that was me. Besides, doesnt blizzard upgrade the guards every expansion? So complaining that they are 90 now would be silly, as it would have been just as "unfair" in cata when the guards were all 85. Or wotlk when they were all 80. etc etc etc.

[otakuryoga]

so a question for thoe that have done more LFR..
the once per week/boss loot limit..is that per character or per specialty?
can you get loot as prot and ret same week or only as one?

(and i know you will be able to pick on each boss after patch tomorrow..which actually makes it more confusing..will you be able to tank a boss twice and get prot loot once and ret loot once?)

i am at work ATM so cannot read that mmochampion preview..and have not seen this covered in any other patch preview i have read

[The Glyphstone]

Nope, it's just per character. No getting double or triple the loot by running as Prot and choosing Ret loot, then running again as Ret and choosing Holy loot (or Prot loot), then running a third time as Holy and choosing whatever loot you haven't selected yet.

[otakuryoga]

Nope, it's just per character. No getting double or triple the loot by running as Prot and choosing Ret loot, then running again as Ret and choosing Holy loot (or Prot loot), then running a third time as Holy and choosing whatever loot you haven't selected yet.

i dont believe anyone could think it would work that way
but you should be able to get loot for both specs once a week

are they worried about the economy? cause the loot pieces usually sell for less than the gold bags.....

[Seerow]

So today I dropped JC because it wasn't making me any money, wasn't really optimal for DPS, and wasn't any fun.

So decided to instead pick up Engineering for all the fun perks.



And now here I am stuck at 300 because my server's AH has no fel iron ore and no motes of fire on the AH.

QQ

[Icewraith]

No mining?

Edit: NVM, that's definitely sub-optimal for dps. No mining alts?

Also, if players are repeatedly rendering a zone unquestable by ganking npcs and only npcs, you could try reporting it if you're on a PVE server. Escort quest mobs they gave some sort of advantage to last I checked, there was one mage on our server who would occasionally hang out in Westfall and one-shot the escort npc right before you could complete the quest. The respawn timer on the npc and the death timer were close enough, and it was a mage, so even with a team of max-level characters you couldn't stop him before he instakilled the npc from invisibility, even if you could smoke him in three seconds with the characters you had available.

Also, LFR finally decided that I could have some loot! I got a 502 neck that is far worse than the 522 neck I picked up the week the patch dropped. The tier token off twin consorts (the other item I could have gotten) would have been really nice...

><

[Vaynor]

So I've been tanking LFD since the reward Satchels were implemented, but I never got anything good. Until today. I opened one expecting another gem or flask and saw the purple color of a Reins of the Green Proto-Drake! (http://www.wowhead.com/item=44707)

Just goes to show persistence does pay off, even if it would of been faster to farm the rep and egg(s).

My girlfriend just got the Reins of the Raven Lord from a tanking satchel. I'm a very weird mix of happy for her and extremely annoyed at her good luck.


A quick note, I hope everyone here is valor capped. Get all the valor you can, because with the VP upgrade system reinstated, it only costs 500 points to fully upgrade something. If you have the full 3K VP on you currently, that's 6 items you can just upgrade to max, right now.
Top 3 choices are Weapon, Chest, and Legs, in that order. After that it is helm, shoulder, belt, after that it's gloves, bracers, neck and rings. Trinkets are dead last.

Yup! I'm VP/JP capped (JP for the new shields, I guess, I capped by accident). On a side note, I feel bad for your boots! They don't even get listed. :smallbiggrin:

Also, I wouldn't tell people to upgrade their trinkets last since that's heavily spec related. As a blood DK, for example, they're a very high priority for me since they have the largest amount of mastery on their upgradeable stats compared to all of my other gear, so I get the most mastery per upgrade out of them. I'll still be doing my weapon, chest, legs, and shoulders first, though, and then trinkets. Of course, I'll be doing all of these at the same time so I suppose it doesn't matter much. I might hold off on the shoulders because I'll be replacing them with tier as soon as possible. Definitely not doing my helm until I get tier.

[Traab]

No mining?

Edit: NVM, that's definitely sub-optimal for dps. No mining alts?

Also, if players are repeatedly rendering a zone unquestable by ganking npcs and only npcs, you could try reporting it if you're on a PVE server. Escort quest mobs they gave some sort of advantage to last I checked, there was one mage on our server who would occasionally hang out in Westfall and one-shot the escort npc right before you could complete the quest. The respawn timer on the npc and the death timer were close enough, and it was a mage, so even with a team of max-level characters you couldn't stop him before he instakilled the npc from invisibility, even if you could smoke him in three seconds with the characters you had available.

Also, LFR finally decided that I could have some loot! I got a 502 neck that is far worse than the 522 neck I picked up the week the patch dropped. The tier token off twin consorts (the other item I could have gotten) would have been really nice...

><

Oh god, escort snipers. I remember having that happen on a horde mission in ashenvale. You joind a group of orcs assaulting some night elf building. Pretty cool fight, lots of stuff to keep track of. But all it took was a single high level mage dropping a blizzard or whatever on top of the npcs to force a quest fail. There was no reason for him to be there, no alliance quests, not even a vendor, he just wanted to ruin the quest for people.

And you know what? The canned blizzard response at the time of, "there is a pvp solution" is both true and irrelevant. If I wanted a pvp solution, I would be playing on a pvp SERVER. I dont care that he gets flagged for pvp upon ganking my quest npcs. Thats not the point. The point is, I am playing on a pve server to avoid dealing with this kind of crap and I shouldnt be forced to convince a couple of high level players on my side to run down and corpse camp this guy till he logs off in tears just so I can complete my quest!

[Seerow]

No mining?

Edit: NVM, that's definitely sub-optimal for dps. No mining alts?

I do have a mining alt. I hate mining with a passion though. I prefer buying my mats whenever possible.

I did go ahead and mine up some fel iron though. Spent about an hour, got 3 or 4 stacks of fel iron bars, and that was thankfully enough to get me out of that range.

Then I hit cobalt, where you need many more bars. There was about 100 on the AH, I bought it out, and by my best guess/calculation, I'm still 60 short of hitting the Obsidium tier.

I also went ahead and preemptively bought out all the obsidium on the market, hoping by the time I get there someone will have listed more. Because that tier takes a crapton of stuff.

Luckily once I hit 525 it should be smooth sailing, as ghost iron is plentiful.

[Sajiri]

I guess it was a good thing I was looking for a new guild o_o I just got home and logged on to find I'd been kicked from the one I was in, checked the database and it seems the leader booted all 200 from the guild except himself and his alts.

I mean, I applied to a new guild anyway and just waiting to hear back, and there's an RP guild that said they would take me in as well, but damn now I have to play without my guild perks until I get accepted to a new guild D:

[Krazzman]

Killed DA, Iron Qon and Twins yesterday. Krazzman is still at 520 and only has 2053 Valor points. So Weapon, Trousers, Shoulders and another item I don't know yet.

Tonight we will try Lei Shen again, got him near the second transition phase with 1 dead healer and 1 dead dps. And I hope that tonight in the transition they don't fail. In every transitionphase so far our Resto druid and our Ele Shaman died. Suprisingly shortly after that the Warlock on that quarter died...

Got my Paladin to 89 with 59%. I-Level of around 440, raising once he hits 90 due to a few pvp crafted items.

[Traab]

I do have a mining alt. I hate mining with a passion though. I prefer buying my mats whenever possible.

I did go ahead and mine up some fel iron though. Spent about an hour, got 3 or 4 stacks of fel iron bars, and that was thankfully enough to get me out of that range.

Then I hit cobalt, where you need many more bars. There was about 100 on the AH, I bought it out, and by my best guess/calculation, I'm still 60 short of hitting the Obsidium tier.

I also went ahead and preemptively bought out all the obsidium on the market, hoping by the time I get there someone will have listed more. Because that tier takes a crapton of stuff.

Luckily once I hit 525 it should be smooth sailing, as ghost iron is plentiful.

I dont mind mining certain things, ghost iron is stupidly easy to farm. After an hour or so of running laps between halfhill and that hidden master area down to the last nessingwary quest hub I managed to snag around 19 stacks of ore. Obsidium/elementium isnt THAT common but its still pretty easy to loot mass quantities of. I honestly never really paid much attention to cobalt but I know fel iron is a bit of a pita at the zones I tend to level in when grinding another alt out of the 60s.

[Zherog]

Three more Lei Shi runs last night. One bag of money and two shoulder tokens. Beginning to think I'm never going to get a weapon upgrade.

[Seerow]

Three more Lei Shi runs last night. One bag of money and two shoulder tokens. Beginning to think I'm never going to get a weapon upgrade.

My friend is in the exact opposite situation on the same boss. He's dropped 4 or 5 of the weapons, but never managed to get the shoulders.

[Zherog]

Heh. I've DE'ed at least a half-dozen shoulders now. Maybe more.

Also, I don't get to play on Tuesdays very often. But it sure as heck seems that whenever I do, it's a patch day. Obviously, it's a case of confirmation bias, but still...

[Icewraith]

You can get tons of mats (including lots of cobalt bars) from engineering the mechanical ulduar bosses, but you might need to be skilled first in order to do so. You should probably do it anyways as they have a high chance to drop Jeeves.

Also, ran more raid finders last night. 2 more 502 tanking necks, nothing else. *sigh*

[Draken]

So today I dropped JC because it wasn't making me any money, wasn't really optimal for DPS, and wasn't any fun.

So decided to instead pick up Engineering for all the fun perks.



And now here I am stuck at 300 because my server's AH has no fel iron ore and no motes of fire on the AH.

QQ

Did you check the engineering trainer in the Vale of Eternal Blossoms? From what I read they put some gray ghost iron recipes avaiable at various levels of the profession for the explicit purpose of leveling it.

I know for a fact that they did that for blacksmithing and read that they also did it for engineering.

[otakuryoga]

Did you check the engineering trainer in the Vale of Eternal Blossoms? From what I read they put some gray ghost iron recipes avaiable at various levels of the profession for the explicit purpose of leveling it.

I know for a fact that they did that for blacksmithing and read that they also did it for engineering.

most of those take STUPID amounts of mats though...some are 90 ghost iron bars

[Sajiri]

I just had a wonderful revelation. The first friend I made in wow after I started playing horde, whom I haven't seen in a very long time, is in the guild I just applied for. I thought he quit and left for GW2, he thought I was still on Runetotem. Small world. Now if only this game of cat and mouse with the GL would end and we could both be online at the same time so I can get an invite.

I didn't make my goal of experiencing everything before 5.3 (not that I thought I would, but it was worth a try), at least now I dont have to finish golden lotus for the other reps, but Im only 1-2 days away from getting revered I'm thinking to myself I might as well do it anyway.

[Zherog]

Another Lei Shi run. Robe and shoulders. A dude in the group tried to give me the staff, but of course it can't be traded. Very kind of him, though, I thought.

[PrinceOfThieves]

Three more Lei Shi runs last night. One bag of money and two shoulder tokens. Beginning to think I'm never going to get a weapon upgrade.

I sympathize completely. I need a helm & a trinket for mystically epic on my paladin. I have run every raid that drops those two items multiple times per week and have blown through a ton of tokens for about a month now
and nothing. Dropped everything else, and I'm burnt out on dailies, otherwise I'd shot for Revered with Shado Pan and just buy the dang things. Shoot, the main reason I go to Isle of Thunder is so I can loot a key for the solo scenario strictly to loot Elder charms.

[Seerow]

Did you check the engineering trainer in the Vale of Eternal Blossoms? From what I read they put some gray ghost iron recipes avaiable at various levels of the profession for the explicit purpose of leveling it.

I know for a fact that they did that for blacksmithing and read that they also did it for engineering.

I am 99% sure that was only for blacksmithing. But even if it weren't, the blacksmithing leveling items are so ridiculously expensive (or at least they were when first introduced, they might have been fixed since I saw them, but I doubt it), it's better to get the old world mats anyway unless you're stuck for days not able to find anything.

Speaking of servers are probably back up by now. I should hop on and see what's going on.

[Icewraith]

If you need one trinket for mystically epic (that is, you have a trinket that qualifies already) just swap your trinket slots.

[PrinceOfThieves]

If you need one trinket for mystically epic (that is, you have a trinket that qualifies already) just swap your trinket slots.

I know I can do that for the achievement, I just want to look at my character profile and see nothing but enchanted purples. Plus, I'm trying to hold off enchanting & reforging until I've got everything I need. The better my gear is, the easier it is for me to steamroll old content to satisfy my collecting spree.
On a different note, does anyone have any tips for leveling Archeology? I finally started playing with it last night and got it up to about 15 in an hour. I tried seeing if their was an advantage in waiting to solve artifacts, but wowhead had very little to say on the matter. Plus, all I can seem to find are night elf pieces, and would love some diversity in my finds.

[Seerow]

I know I can do that for the achievement, I just want to look at my character profile and see nothing but enchanted purples. Plus, I'm trying to hold off enchanting & reforging until I've got everything I need. The better my gear is, the easier it is for me to steamroll old content to satisfy my collecting spree.
On a different note, does anyone have any tips for leveling Archeology? I finally started playing with it last night and got it up to about 15 in an hour. I tried seeing if their was an advantage in waiting to solve artifacts, but wowhead had very little to say on the matter. Plus, all I can seem to find are night elf pieces, and would love some diversity in my finds.

Just solve as often as you can, there's no advantage to stockpiling.

I used to love archeology... I should probably get back to it and finish up the achieves. But some of those later achieves are just a ridiculous RNG grind :(





Anyway, tonight was actually a really good WoW night for me. I got on and finished up my Engineering, had 60 cobalt waiting in the mail from someone who had read me spamming for cobalt CoD, which was enough to get me out of that stretch. Hit obsidium, found out I had bought about 80 more than I needed, overestimated how much those recipies were going to run me. So blew through those and got to 600 in about an hour. Now have my DPS glove tinker, my rocket boot belt tinker, and the badass goblin cloak tinker.

Question: Is it even worth doing the quest chain to get goblin or gnome specialization? If so which is better?

btw end cost? About 7k spent on leveling engineering. With about 2k worth of stuff I had leftover or crafted that wasn't garbage, and could remarket. So net cost of 5k. Given power leveling first aid took me 2k, twice that for a real profession isn't too bad IMO.


Anyway, after I finished leveling engineering, I went and blew all my valor on upgrades, reforged/regemmed some,

I grabbed the lock from my guild and a random tank from trade and ran a Heroic Scenario. We failed the timer due to a wipe on the last boss, but given it was the first time any of us had entered that scenario (we got the new Battle on High Seas scenario) it wasn't too bad. (Aside: That scenario was really cool. I liked it a lot). So I open my cache at the end of that, and have a 516 belt. Unfortunately I already had a 2/2 upgraded 522 belt, so that was getting vended anyway. But cool that I got an item out of my first cache ever, that implies the drop rate is not as terrible as I was fearing (or my luck has been on fire tonight).

So after that, I get reminded that there was a Heroic Scenario quest, I rush to turn that in to get my guaranteed random 516 item reward... and bam, perfectly itemized (str/crit/haste) 516 Strength Polearm. Like seriously, I couldn't have asked for a better drop from that cache. The only complaint I have is it came literally an hour after I had dropped 500 valor into upgrading my sword which was now going to get replaced (and all 2500 of the rest of my valor onto other assorted gear), but I can deal with that. So now by this time tomorrow I'll have a 524 weapon, and ready to rock all sorts of face. Very happy with that drop, I had given up on seeing another weapon upgrade pre-5.4.

Btw sidenote: For anyone else lucky enough to get a weapon from the cache-Don't waste your money picking up an eye of the black prince. Liable to just be a waste of 1600g.


Oh, also queued into a ToT4, got in right at Lei Shen, no loot, but did get my first Titan Stone or whatever they're called. 11 to go!

[The Glyphstone]

Eye of the Prince doesn't work on the heroic cache weapons, then?

[Seerow]

Eye of the Prince doesn't work on the heroic cache weapons, then?

Correct.

Not sure if it's intended or a bug. I tweeted GC, hopefully he'll respond to it.


Otherwise I might have to venture into the bug report forum, and nobody likes that :(

[The Glyphstone]

Probably intentional, since I expect the drop rate of weapons from the 1/day bags to be very low. The Eye does specify Sha-Touched or Thunder King weapons in its tooltip.

It's very frustrating, though, to have 'legendary' rewards you spend weeks or months grinding to get be invalidated the same week or the week after you receive them by upgrades.

[Seerow]

Probably intentional, since I expect the drop rate of weapons from the 1/day bags to be very low. The Eye does specify Sha-Touched or Thunder King weapons in its tooltip.

I would have gone with this reasoning except they literally just fixed it so you can add the gem slot to the crafted 502 weapons. I guess they might be justifying them as ToT weapons because you make them at the Thunderforge, but seriously they're not Thunderking Armaments anymore than the item out of a bag is.


It's very frustrating, though, to have 'legendary' rewards you spend weeks or months grinding to get be invalidated the same week or the week after you receive them by upgrades.

Agree. At the start I actually thought it was really cool that they seemed to be setting us up to get a bunch of different upgrades that could be used simultaneously. That we're being restricted to 1-2 at a given time is sort of a letdown, and definitely an annoyance.

On the other hand, each reward is so "ooh shiny!" that you kind of forget about it. Like I'm really looking forward to the ilvl 600 cloak.

[The Glyphstone]

I just started the Secrets of the Empire stage. Knowing my luck and patch pacing, I'll get the cloak when the raids are handing out il605 gear.

[Krazzman]

We wiped again on Lei Shen.

Our best tries were: 20%, 12%, 10% and last try with 15%. Either one or two guys die everytime. Mostly in those transition phases. Annoying.

Patch today is gonna get missed by me because we have our Pathfinder Game today and well I only have 2053 Valor anyway so Staff, Trousers, Shoulders, ???.

About the LMG: OMFG. This is amazing. Mindflays in under 1 second. Now if there were a possibility to farm shadow orbs before pulling lei shen... MF:Insanity in under 1 second = awesome.

[Skios]

Has anyone gone after the new Karazhan/Serpentshrine Cavern/Tempest Keep pets yet? For those that don't know, they've added raid pets to the Big Bad Wolf (Karazhan opera event), The Curator, Terestrian Illhoof, Melchazaar, Hydross the Unstable, Morogrin Tidewalker, Lady Vashj, Al'ar, High Astromancer Solarian and the Void Reaver. The reward for collecting all ten is Tito, the terrier that appears with Dorothy in the Wizard of Oz opera event in Karazhan.

So far I've only managed to get the pets from The Big Bad Wolf, The Curator and Vashj, but two of those are probably the most annoying to farm with Big Bad Wolf only spawning a third of the time to begin with and Vashj still being quite a drag to solo even with the slight nerfs in 5.3.

[Zherog]

I just started the Secrets of the Empire stage. Knowing my luck and patch pacing, I'll get the cloak when the raids are handing out il605 gear.

I'm still collecting sigils of wisdom and power. The RNG hates me; with the increased drop rate from the patch, I now have 8 of one and 3 of the other.


Has anyone gone after the new Karazhan/Serpentshrine Cavern/Tempest Keep pets yet? For those that don't know, they've added raid pets to the Big Bad Wolf (Karazhan opera event), The Curator, Terestrian Illhoof, Melchazaar, Hydross the Unstable, Morogrin Tidewalker, Lady Vashj, Al'ar, High Astromancer Solarian and the Void Reaver. The reward for collecting all ten is Tito, the terrier that appears with Dorothy in the Wizard of Oz opera event in Karazhan.

So far I've only managed to get the pets from The Big Bad Wolf, The Curator and Vashj, but two of those are probably the most annoying to farm with Big Bad Wolf only spawning a third of the time to begin with and Vashj still being quite a drag to solo even with the slight nerfs in 5.3.


Hmmm.... I may have to hop back into my Kara run that I started last night. I hopped out as soon as I hit Exalted with Violet eye, which came while clearing out the ballroom.

edit: just went back into Kara. I had Romeo and Juliette this time (first time I've seen that play, actually), so no pet there. And no pet dropped from Curator either. Going forward now in Kara, I'll just put those two on farm along with Midnight.

I may try Serpentshire after the rolling restarts, see if the nerfs make it any easier.

edit2: Huh. All these times I've blown through Kara for the rep, and never noticed Terestrian Illhoof. Guess I'll hop back in there and kill him too. I'm not gonna be able to get Melchy until I feel like taking the time to figure out the chess game...

edit 3: How hard is solo'ing The Eye? I've never been in there.

[Skios]

Vashj is still quite a chore to solo because there's only so many elementals you can block on your own. I was sitting at about 400% extra damage. Nothing a WW monk can't heal off but the extra damage plus all the mobs that were up did make it a bit hairy. With that being said, it's a lot easier now to kill the stalkers inbetween the fears. I'd also recommend keybinding a macro to target the tainted elementals to quickly find them on the minimap.

[Karoht]

5.3 Patch
In a word, awesome.
Barrens Chat is back baby!
The event/s are excellent. Story is good. Rewards are reachable and worthwhile. It achieves what they set out for, namely getting people back out into the world, without using daily quests. Truthfully, I expect to see more weekly quests in future, especially blended into daily quest hubs. But overall, this event is excellent and well thought out.

Upgraded some gears immediately. I stockpiled my valors (I told you guys to do so as well, don't give me that look) and the upgrade is very noticeable. It is safe to say I no longer need anything from normal mode, and I'm only doing one section of LFR for part of the Legendary chain. I am the only person in my guild to be completely normal mode geared. My only upgrades are the trinket from Horridon and the trinket from Lei Shen. And truthfully, those are just 'nice to have' things at this point.

Also, I reforged completely. I did some research, resto druids in fact only really need that first haste breakpoint, the second only affects Wild Growth and Lifebloom. Extra ticks of Lifebloom are questionably useful, extra ticks of Wild Growth are also questionable. My reforge took me from 26% raid buffed to 36% raid buffed. Dropping nearly 12% haste will do that I guess. Also, through my testing, I have found an excellent sweetspot for Spirit. Askmrrobbot.com is excellent for reforging if you know what you are looking for. So for any Resto Druids out there, I recommend 3043 haste and 11500 spirit to 12500 spirit as softcaps. After that, start reforging your spirit into MOAR mastery where possible.
Also, due to changes in the patch, Treeform is now questionably useful as compaired to the other two talents of that tier. Treants are now on a shorter cooldown and heal MUCH better than before, and are extremely mana efficient. You can have 1 treant up 75% of the fight if you use them on cooldown, or save up and burn them on burst healing phases. The other talent of that tier, Soul of the Forest, is extremely good if you understand how haste actually works and how it interacts with the rest of your heals. BUT it has to be timed well for optimal use, and people need to be in range of your Wild Growth for optimal usage. Fights like Heroic Jin-Rohk make SotF nearly useless. Still, if you want to dump your haste to the floor and boost the heck out of your mastery, it can be a pretty noticable boost.

So... my application to another guild.
I chickened out.
No really. This is a guild that is incredibly serious. Serious to the point where it highlighed the fact that for the last few weeks of raiding with my current guild, I have mostly just been going through the motions. So my plan is, stick things out in my current guild for a while, hopefully a healer spot will open up in Englishdude's guild and I will join that. Or I will find another guild that runs earlier in the day.
I'm basically looking for Mon-Thurs 8pm-12pm est, give or take about 1 hour.

[Sajiri]

I only got to do the 2 new scenarios lorewalker cho sends you on last night, and then helped Vol'jin up to taking over razor hill. Everyone I'm running into keeps saying they finished everything this patch had to offer already and they're done until 5.4 is out. Is there really that little to do? Doesnt matter to me much since I'm still catching up on everything else I haven't done this expansion, but I find it hard to believe these people could be done with an entire patch in a few hours, unless they mean 'I'm done with the few things in this patch I wanted to do right away, and the stuff I don't like is non existant to me'

[Karoht]

I only got to do the 2 new scenarios lorewalker cho sends you on last night, and then helped Vol'jin up to taking over razor hill. Everyone I'm running into keeps saying they finished everything this patch had to offer already and they're done until 5.4 is out. Is there really that little to do? Doesnt matter to me much since I'm still catching up on everything else I haven't done this expansion, but I find it hard to believe these people could be done with an entire patch in a few hours, unless they mean 'I'm done with the few things in this patch I wanted to do right away, and the stuff I don't like is non existant to me'
1-Go to mmo-champion.com and see all there is to offer.
2-The patch is an addition to existing features. It is a mid-tier patch, not a major one. People say the same thing every time we have these mid-tier patches. Pay them no mind.
3-There are 4 new scenarios, as well as 6 heroic scenarios. All with achievements. Chances are good that none of these people have touched the heroic stuff or the achievements.

[Sajiri]

1-Go to mmo-champion.com and see all there is to offer.
2-The patch is an addition to existing features. It is a mid-tier patch, not a major one. People say the same thing every time we have these mid-tier patches. Pay them no mind.
3-There are 4 new scenarios, as well as 6 heroic scenarios. All with achievements. Chances are good that none of these people have touched the heroic stuff or the achievements.

I did go to mmo-champion and looked at it all already, which is why I was surprised. It LOOKED like there was a lot more to do than what they were making it sound like. Either way, what I got to do last nigth I really enjoyed. And it was nice to do those scenarios with people who were also doing them for the first time, and were also listening to the npc's talk instead of barging through.

Damn my job, I want to stay home and play more >_<

[Icewraith]

Argh.

Forgot to set my specialization and was in dps spec when I opened the auto-drop lootbag you get from completing your first heroic scenario.

Of course, I got a 510 ilevel two-handed axe. And of course it turns out they added a shield that would be a monstrous upgrade from the one I have now, that I might have gotten if I had remembered the loot specialization thing. Or a one-handed weapon.

I'm currently single-minded fury (prefer one-handed swords for the gnome racial, can use hit/exp swords to tank and dps) in dps spec, and I don't have a good enough 2h offhand to justify going titan's grip (I have a 463 klaxxi rep 2h sword in my bags and that's it for 2hs this expansion. I spend a fair amount of time in RF queued as dps as well, so it's not like I didn't have the opportunity...).

So... how's arms looking these days? I know they overhauled some of how it works because of pvp, I know I liked fury much better before they made the changes.

[Zherog]

Rivendare's Deathcharger. I has it. Finally!

[Sajiri]

Rivendare's Deathcharger. I has it. Finally!

Complain about it and it works! (eventually)

Either way, congratulations.

[Krazzman]

Grats.

Couldn't really play yesterday. Brought my Paladin to 90 since he only needed 12% and did those through Klaxxi Dailies.

Else I just made my Fieldwork to get more ore and trying to get revered with Dominance offensive.

Gonna see what comes next but it looks awesome... maybe I get my GF to try szenarios out with us but I doubt it since she really dislikes them (this could change if you need a healer in the heroic ones).

Tonight is raid, upgraded my Staff, Shoulders and Trousers. Don't know what to upgrade next so... I'm going to wait for more points to come (have around 553 ;D).
Tested out the Dropchance for Lesser Charms of Good Fortune... didn't seem like much. I now have the Quest to speak with loremaster cho.

Since I am going to do this with my GF... anything annoying in the new questthing? Any solo szenarios? Pvp?
And how are the new Heroic Szenarios "structured". Do you need a healer? Would you advice taking a healer with you?

[Karoht]

@Heroic Scenarios
If you are clever, you don't need a healer.
If you want to bring a healer, it isn't a terrible idea.
If you bring a tank, a healer, and a DPS, prepare for a very long, slow slog through the scenario.


@Treants
The change they made to Druid treants is awesome. Especially for healing.


@Raiding
Hooooo kay.
My guild more or less imploded yesterday. I am feeling very silly for chickening out of that other guilds offer. This is exactly how I felt when I turned down an invite from Refined (a server first guild since Wrath), only to have Insomniac turn toxic back in T11.
Seriously, here is the list of issues facing my current guild. Rant under spoiler tag.

-Hunter, GM's GF, her DPS is LOOOOOOOW. 70K on fights like Jin'rohk (where it should be MUCH higher, like 120K minimum). If she lives.
-We just lost our top DPS, a shadow priest who was pulling over 90K on most fights. Yeah, that was our top. She got booted last night for annoying everyone, not being on time, constant AFK'ing during raid with no notice, etc.
-We just picked up a Deathknight for DPS. He is mostly wearing tank gear. He wants to tank, but he's WORSE at tanking. Currently he is doing less DPS than either of our tanks.
-Our shaman (supposedly played by an older fellow) finds new and creative ways to die on every pull. It is like he has to re-learn every fight every week. His DPS is slightly better than the tanks, his healing is 16-20K while the other two pull 50K and up.
-Our Disc Priest who moonlights as Shadow. Doesn't want to heal really, does nothing but smack talk the other healers. If he is healing, god help you if you are out of his range for Spirit Shell, even if you are assigned to that spot. Freaks out that the nest team isn't in range on Ji-Kun during Quills. His Shadow DPS is about 70K which isn't astounding, talks like he's gods gift to DPS as well.
-Other Druid healer. Great guy, his gear has become a serious handicap.
-Nobody talks on vent. Except me and the raid leader. The minute either of us stops talking, people die to mechanics that they knew 30 pulls ago would kill them. Everyone else refuses to talk. I mean outright refuses. They all have mics and headsets. Some of them intentionally mumble so they won't be asked to talk.
-We aren't even full-clearing normal mode anymore. We wiped 4 times on normal Megaera last night. And killing it was like pulling teeth. We managed to kill 2 bosses in 3 hours, normally we get 6 in the first night, 5 on the second.
-Apparently, while I was gone for a week, they completely stalled on Primordious. Yeah.


So yeah. No cold feet this time. Guild change. Right now. Hang out until I either get into Englishdudes guild, or apply again to Seraphim/Nidhogg and hope they don't hold my cold feet against me.

[Sajiri]

I finally got an invite to the guild I applied for. I like what I see from them. Unfortunately they have 2 raid teams that run when I'm at work, but I will settle with LFR I suppose.

I was going to try Heart of Fear lfr last night finally with a friend, but it was a 40 minute wait, and I started to get really ill =_= Gonna try again tonight hopefully.

Im confused by the new Barrens stuff. Is it actual pvp there? I'm on an RP-pve server so I didn't think so, but then I see people saying in general things like 'watch yourselves, alliance looking to pick off lonely horde'. I've only got to play for about an hour each day since the patch was out so far so I havent spent that much time there.

[Karoht]

It means 'do not flag if you do not want to fight'
Unless you are already on a pvp server.

[Sajiri]

It means 'do not flag if you do not want to fight'
Unless you are already on a pvp server.

I would think that would be pretty obvious, but fair enough. Just seemed to be a lot of people saying it last night, then people pointing out not a pvp server. Was seriously confused if it was auto flagged or what (It's not particularly obvious on the UI I use since I never pvp)

[Icewraith]

Hunters are godly in heroic scenarios. I imagine locks with tank pets are as well. The kiting and trap utility is handy, and the hunter has been lucky on gear drops, but what makes more of a difference than anything else on hard-hitting mobs is the pet. Just the presence of a durable, self healing, taunting bag of hit points is a pretty big factor when you only have three people and no healer. I suspect pocket-heal specs like shadow, ret, enhancement, and druid will be popular as well, although I know the healing capability of at least some of those classes have taken some recent hits.

We've been running fury warrior, arcane mage, holy pally and then replaced him with his hunter, and overall heroic scenarios are much more enjoyable with three dps. We also made one of the bonus timers, although I forget which one. Goblin one with the big lantern-prison thingy and all the elemental trash at the start perhaps?

It seems like they may be onto a good thing here. It's really nice to have the bonus timer, it's pushing me back into the warrior toolbox to get more performance. Even though it's a fairly trivial clear, the fact that the timer is there at all gives me a reason to push harder and dig out some of the more pvp-oriented tools I've neglected since.. patch 4.1? 4.2? Challenge modes didn't really work out for us with attendance issues, so it's probably scratching a similar sort of itch. Considering we're only moderately geared and already making timers doesn't bode well for the sustainability of the content though.

[otakuryoga]

finished 1st half of heart of fear LFR this morning
1st go was a wipe on Garalon since we had about 12-14 crushes and pheremone pools all through the middle area 8(
2nd went sooooo much smoother after tellin people "its more a marathon than a sprint...staying out of the purple >>>> than getting a few more hits in before moving" we had just 3 crushes..and 2 of those were the other tank



so tonight will try the second half(after checkin through the fights in dungeon journal) and hopefully get a tier piece or two

[Seerow]

Tried another Heroic Scenario today. Got the same one. Seriously there's like 20 different scenarios now, and I still get the same one back to back :(.

We almost got the bonus challenge on this one (last boss was at 20% with 45 seconds out of 2 minutes to go), but then I miss-stepped into a bomb, got killed, neither other person in the group picked up the rapier, and we wiped. It was very sad.

I am also now 2 for 2 on items out of those caches. It seems the drop rates are higher than I had expected going in. I expected something more like the epics from regular scenarios (ie in 100 scenarios, I've gotten maybe 2 or 3 epics), but either I'm really lucky or the drop rate on the epic caches is much better. Possibly both.

Unfortunately the new item there was one I already had. On the bright side, I got enough valor for my weapon upgrade, and dropped the Crit/Haste helm off Dark Animus. Considering my other helm was Hit/Mastery (arms' worst stat), I felt pretty good about that.




Still haven't had a chance to make it over to the Barrens. It just seems like such an out of the way place for Alliance players to go. Anyone know if there's an easier way to get there, like a portal or something I'm missing?

[Sajiri]

Hunters are godly in heroic scenarios. I imagine locks with tank pets are as well. The kiting and trap utility is handy, and the hunter has been lucky on gear drops, but what makes more of a difference than anything else on hard-hitting mobs is the pet. Just the presence of a durable, self healing, taunting bag of hit points is a pretty big factor when you only have three people and no healer.

This makes me happy to know. I still have yet to do heroic scenarios, but when i've done the regular ones this week I've been top dps (thats a first for me O_o), the tank, and the healer all rolled into one (yay spirit beasts).

[The Glyphstone]

There's 20 scenarios, but only 4 Heroic Scenarios.

[Seerow]

There's 20 scenarios, but only 4 Heroic Scenarios.


Oh I thought all of the old scenarios got a heroic mode as well as the new ones. That's moderately disappointing.


Edit: Unrelated note, found a polearm xmog I really like with my set. Check it out: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/shadowsong/Secondwind/simple

[Sajiri]

Oh I thought all of the old scenarios got a heroic mode as well as the new ones. That's moderately disappointing.


Edit: Unrelated note, found a polearm xmog I really like with my set. Check it out: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/shadowsong/Secondwind/simple

I have to say, I really like that transmog o:

[Seerow]

I have to say, I really like that transmog o:

Thanks. I put way too much effort into getting it, but I really do like how it turned out.


Now if only I could stop compulsively farming alternative xmog sets that I am unlikely to use, I'd be in a good place. (Seriously, my void storage is straight up full with 4 full extra sets and a dozen or so cloaks and weapons, and I'm trying to talk myself out of going out and farming a set to go with the one-handed ice sword I dropped in Malygos a few weeks back, since I don't do either prot or fury)

[Sajiri]

I am way too into transmog. I just finished my new(ish) one finally then decided I didnt like it, shows too much skin for my taste. Used some different pants but now it doesnt have the same effect and Im thinking of going back to my old shamany looking one...which is kind of a downer considering how long it too me to make my current one.

[The Glyphstone]

The only new pet I got this week from BC instances was the Lesser Voidcaller...but it's so awesome I'm actually going to keep it instead of selling it like I was for all the other ones. I'm naming it Yaril Jr, to match the name WoW assigned to my Voidlord, and I'll keep them both out at all times when I can.

[Karoht]

Karoht's Transmog Stuff!

I'm going for just matching colors so far.
Currently I'm in my Blue Phase. So I'm rocking T11 set with a blue staff from EoE. Swanky.
Prior to that I was all about Green. So I was in Dreamwalker with Terrok's Staff. Green and Yellow with a big green staff. Looked amazing. Or a very green dagger and my Terrok's Saga (book with green fel energy dripping out) as accessories. Very pretty looking set, one of my absolute favorites.
I was working on a purple set using the non-green version of Dreamwalker, but it sort of stalled. Purple colored weapons are actually kind of... tacky for the most part.
I'm currently working on a Gold set. Parts of T14 and T8 actually. And I found the perfect main hand item for it, I just need a solid off-hand and the look is complete.
As for the Druid challenge mode set, the only things I need (once I earn gold in all the Challenge Modes that is) is to win the heroic lightning claw from heroic zandalari council. It's kind of a brown/orange that should go well with the brown/green of the set.


Oh, I'm in a much better mood BTW. I just joined an awesome guild.
First off, they had seen my blue and green transmogs and had complimented me on them before.
Second, they had heard of my Imaginary Bloodlust from a former Insomniac guild member, so they asked me for that.
So I did Imaginary Bloodlust right?
"...okay G-Invite him now, I think I just had an orgasm."
I went and goofed off with these guys clearing down ToT and then we did some heroic ToES. I picked up a handful of achievements in the process, I showed rather well, completely skipped their application process.
And best of all, they want to rotate healers in and out, so I will probably be sitting once every few weeks. Nice to get some rest once in a while, so I'm game with that.

Streaming times are changing. I should be back on streaming Tues-Thurs next week, starting 8pm EST/6PM MST/5PM PST and going for about 4 hours a night. Monday nights are an optional day for us, I probably won't be streaming that.

Yep, definitely in a better mood. Cheers folks.

[Krazzman]

Gratulation.

On another note: did you ever finish your "Shroom-queuing" video?
I remembered what you said and told our Druid of it.

On another note: yesterday sucked and was awesome at the same time.
I got a 528 neckpiece of the trash and am now rocking 13500 Haste. But we killed the first 2 bosses with 9 people, our warlock had a Parents-meet-teacher day at the school his daughter attends and they asked really stupid questions which dragged that a bit in length. Rocked 243k dps on Horridon and 240k dps on Tortos. 400k Burstdps is awesome, even our shaman said jokingly that they should take my gear away...

But now the sucky part. Blizzard ruined my evening plans.

7:20 pm we get home. Plan was around 7:30 golden lotus dailies and 8 pm raid (a bit more time since we would've waited for our warlock).
This couldn't be done since my Wife's account got "hacked" and locked up with a 202 error apparently she is accused of buying gold and something about unpaid chartransfer. Support was offline and the new in-game support tool is sucking monkey balls. And yes I even reported this as a bug that the Ticket-tool sucks monkey balls. Due to starting later and having only 9 guys we only got to durumu (wiped once on jin-rokh and twice on durumu as well as once on tortos).

[Vaynor]

If we're showing off transmogs...

Here's my dk, just got her to 528 ilvl:

http://i.imgur.com/EBv2zGS.jpg?1

And my DK's dps set, went for a T14 look:

http://i.imgur.com/xL9XjpO.jpg?1

For my priest, I decided to go for the ridiculous look:

http://i.imgur.com/sjpXDAO.jpg?1

Oh, you thought that was ridiculous? Here's my priest's pvp transmog:

http://i.imgur.com/ZJI1PHF.jpg?1

[Zherog]

Still haven't had a chance to make it over to the Barrens. It just seems like such an out of the way place for Alliance players to go. Anyone know if there's an easier way to get there, like a portal or something I'm missing?

There is a portal / transporter. When you do Cho's quest chain, he'll send you to talk to a gnome in the Shrine of Seven Stars (or whatever the Alliance hotel there is called - no coffee yet). The first trip - the one that's part of Cho's quest chain - is free. After that it costs 10g.

I had a blast last night running around with a bunch of other alliance players killing the elites and protecting caravans. Got my "Horde Breaker" title too.

[otakuryoga]

well since we seem to have so many xmog addicts here lemme ask a question or two

do you xmog a piece of gear or the slot? i.e if i upgrade a piece do i have to go xmog the new piece?(and if so what is the cost?)
is there any way to wear a tabard and not have it showing thus ruining the xmog look?

[Seerow]

well since we seem to have so many xmog addicts here lemme ask a question or two

do you xmog a piece of gear or the slot? i.e if i upgrade a piece do i have to go xmog the new piece?(and if so what is the cost?)
is there any way to wear a tabard and not have it showing thus ruining the xmog look?


xmog applies to the piece of gear, not the slot. Honestly not sure what the cost is, anything under a hundred gold I just ignore. I think it's between 10 and 25.

And no, you can't wear a tabard and have it not showing. For the most part (ie barring tabards for WotLK and Cata reps) tabards are vanity items anyway. So only wear one if you have one that fits your xmog look. (I personally feel that tabards are criminally underutilized in transmog but *shrug*)



There is a portal / transporter. When you do Cho's quest chain, he'll send you to talk to a gnome in the Shrine of Seven Stars (or whatever the Alliance hotel there is called - no coffee yet). The first trip - the one that's part of Cho's quest chain - is free. After that it costs 10g.

I had a blast last night running around with a bunch of other alliance players killing the elites and protecting caravans. Got my "Horde Breaker" title too.

Okay thanks, that's good to know. I had got the quest but was procrastinating on doing the Blood in the Snow scenario (I think that's what it was called), hoping I'd hit it randomly eventually.

[Karoht]

Gratulation.
On another note: did you ever finish your "Shroom-queuing" video?
I remembered what you said and told our Druid of it.Yeah, that. No, I did not finish the video, mostly because the technique was rendered moot for the most part.
Back when druids had to maximize shrooms, swiftmend, and wild growth on cooldown, Shroom-queing was much more important. Now it mostly isn't, as squeezing out the GCD's isn't that hard anymore. The technique of Shroom-queing still provides some advantage, albeit not much of one anymore.
What is important (for resto druids) is using weak auras or power auras and setting up a counter for your mushrooms, and making solid use of it.

Point of Interest-On Heroic Tsu Long last night, my shrooms crit for 10m each on day phase.

Random thought: If I'm going to be sitting for a week out of every 4, maybe I should start doing a monthly show in that time. And/or more guide videos.
This could work out really well.



Blizzard ruined my evening plans.
My Wife's account got "hacked" and locked up with a 202 error apparently she is accused of buying gold and something about unpaid chartransfer.Blame the hackers not blizzard?


Support was offline and the new in-game support tool is sucking monkey balls. And yes I even reported this as a bug that the Ticket-tool sucks monkey balls. Due to starting later and having only 9 guys we only got to durumu (wiped once on jin-rokh and twice on durumu as well as once on tortos).Even if they were online, it would unlikely be restored same day. Grats on 9-manning some bosses though.

[Kaustic]

After a hefty amount of time away from WoW, I am jumping in again. I only played 1 month into MoP, enough to get my Shaman to 90. Levling up my Warlock now. After that much time away, it almost does feel like a new game. Having to relearn a bunch.

How quickly do you think it takes from the time of hitting 90 to actually be able to handle Raiding again?

[Karoht]

After a hefty amount of time away from WoW, I am jumping in again. I only played 1 month into MoP, enough to get my Shaman to 90. Levling up my Warlock now. After that much time away, it almost does feel like a new game. Having to relearn a bunch.

How quickly do you think it takes from the time of hitting 90 to actually be able to handle Raiding again?A few weeks at best. Two if you are lucky with drops, three or four if you aren't.
Scenario spam (a day)
Dungeon spam (a few days, maybe a full week)
And get some rep with Dominance/Shieldwall and Shado-Pan Assault (good rewards past friendly on both, quite easy to reach in a day or two, let alone a week)
460 ilevel-LFR T14 Spam with T14 Normals (pugs are still around for T14)
480 ilevel-LFR T15 Spam with T15 Normals
3 Weeks of gearing to get into progression raiding is a reasonable estimate.

[Krazzman]

Random thought: If I'm going to be sitting for a week out of every 4, maybe I should start doing a monthly show in that time. And/or more guide videos.
This could work out really well.

Yes do that, but please not in live so I can watch them too.


Blame the hackers not blizzard?

Nope not really. Blizzard had a 24hour support and together with their now monkey balls sucktastic supporttool this made things a lot worse. She got her account back at 11:55 am today but had to spam the hotline a few times (took about 25 minutes).

The hackers might be the bad guys (they even wanted to sell Yuvati apparently and then when that failed emptied her account).

Additionally a few times she tried to log in from my PC in her account and then instant account block or when she switched to her new laptop: same thing. But now it does nothing? Seems highly unlikely.



Even if they were online, it would unlikely be restored same day. Grats on 9-manning some bosses though.

It is restored but might take till this evening to get her stuff back.

Plan for this evening: trying out the new content already and finishing up some dailies for the runes... not that I need them anymore or anything... (only Megaera Lei Shen and Durumu can give me an upgrade) and I killed two of them already...

And I have quite some feels of Schadenfreude. acute, the guild we left gloriously(...NOT) extended their ID for Lei Shen while members still need loot from other bosses and well wiped the last two evenings. Don't know if they killed him yesterday evening but jeah they apparently lost their shadows again and now have only one...

[Karoht]

Why not live? Note that I will be playing much earlier now, as per the new guild. Moreover, everything I've ever streamed is still viewable on my page at twitch.tv/karoht_IV

But, chances are good that this show will be recorded local (though I might stream the recording process), and edited properly, and then presented to the internet all nice and neat like.

Now I just need an idea or two for what I want to produce. Hmmm.
A weekly show, something about gaming. Probably involving heavy amounts of World of Warcraft but might involve other stuff. Maybe something involving... I dunno, playing with all mah cool friends from Giant and other such stuff?
I'll figure something out.

[The Glyphstone]

I'm a lazy transmog...I just wear T4, because the T4 Warlock helm is the coolest thing ever, and the rest of it is color-coordinated.

[Kaustic]

I'm a lazy transmog...I just wear T4, because the T4 Warlock helm is the coolest thing ever, and the rest of it is color-coordinated.

I've always loved some of the Warlock sets, sadly I never raided with mine. I was always tanking on my DK/Pally or DPS'n with my Rogue/Mage.

[Karoht]

I've been trying to come up with a 'red' set for a druid transmog. Anything that isn't Heroic T13 and isn't recolored rogue gear if possible.
So far, no luck.

And I'm really not a fan of the look of T15 for Druids. It's going for the look of that old creepy grove but that just doesn't fit the feel of The Thunder King and his fortress to me. And it looks aweful on Tauren.

@otakuryoga and transmog
Item not slot. Cost is trivial. Also, if you are a class that wears robes (druids) or a race that doesn't really show off footwear (tauren) you really only need to be concerned with cloak, gloves, chest, shoulders, belt, and occasionally bracers.

Tabbards you don't transmog because you just wear another tabbard. Same with shirts.

Best way to learn is to try it out.

Also, a little birdy (who works at Blizzard) told me that they are working on a way to have one be able to transmog an item directly from void storage without having to go to the annoyance of removing it from storage, using it for transmog, and placing it back in storage. Possibly ready for 5.4 if not for sure ready for next xpac.
And... estimated time on next patch is 8-12 weeks at the earliest.

[Vaynor]

Also, a little birdy (who works at Blizzard) told me that they are working on a way to have one be able to transmog an item directly from void storage without having to go to the annoyance of removing it from storage, using it for transmog, and placing it back in storage. Possibly ready for 5.4 if not for sure ready for next xpac.
And... estimated time on next patch is 8-12 weeks at the earliest.

Your little birdy has informed you of something that is currently in the game. :smalltongue:

[Seerow]

Your little birdy has informed you of something that is currently in the game. :smalltongue:

Yeah. It was even available last patch with an add-on.

[Karoht]

Yeah. It was even available last patch with an add-on.
Well, it was a while back. Just wasn't really relevant until now.
Totally missed that in the patch notes. I'm going to have to try that out.

EDIT:
I need to write a new Guild Theme Song.
What on earth rhymes with Still Thirsty?

[Sajiri]

Finally just did HoF lfr, gotta say I dont particularly like that raid >:I Although I was one of the few that didnt die, and I got some upgrades.

[Seerow]

Finally just did HoF lfr, gotta say I dont particularly like that raid >:I Although I was one of the few that didnt die, and I got some upgrades.

It's okay, I hated HoF as well. Well at least part 1. Part 2 isn't bad. First boss can suck, but is great if you had a decent tank (being able to AoE down all of the enemies at once for massive DPS numbers is nice. It's not often you get a sustained 10 target DPS scenario), second boss is mostly tank and spank unless you get turned into a vehicle, and the last boss is tunnel vision for melee.


Anyway, I dropped the 502 boots from a coin on the Twins today, so I'm pretty sure the only items I need from LFR now are a tier helm or shoulders (and I'd rather use the 522 shoulders once I hit exalted with SPA), so switched up my loot specialization to Tank. And then turned around and picked up the 1 handed sword from Jin'Rokh. That worked out well.

[Karoht]

What I disliked about HoF
-While the klaxxi all have a distinct look, you can only tell from up close, and with brighter lighting.
-The place is dark. It is actually sometimes surprisingly hard to see the klaxxi if they have their backs to a wall, beyond seeing them due to movement of course.
-Amber amber amber amber amber (Fatboss raid guides joke)
-Garalon was a failsauce MAGNET. If anyone could do anything wrong on that fight, chances are they would, and would do so multiple times.

What I liked about HoF
-First boss was interesting.
-Wind tunnel was interesting enough
-Garalon was a great change of pace. The kiting mechanic was cool. The fight was actually easier on heroic IMO.
-Amber amber amber amber amber (see above)

[Sajiri]

Died on tsulong! And I was doing so well for first time fights this morning :/ hopefully I get another gear upgrade in here since Im at 479 ilvl..think I need 480 to qualify for the rest of lfr?

[otakuryoga]

well...didnt do part 2 of HoF LFR
went and played around in barrens instead
--got me a latent boot(hear they are a bit rare as a drop..so that saves me having to collect a bunch of supplies)((though its the weekly funky cold mojo thats the bottleneck of course....)) while doing the collect 50 of each for the troll part so now just need to do the weekly for a nice lil 502 boot

[Sajiri]

For my early death in tsulong, I got the sha touched gun and a trinket off lei shen, so now Im 481 ilvl...I'd say yay but Im ready to pass out

[Seerow]

well...didnt do part 2 of HoF LFR
went and played around in barrens instead
--got me a latent boot(hear they are a bit rare as a drop..so that saves me having to collect a bunch of supplies)((though its the weekly funky cold mojo thats the bottleneck of course....)) while doing the collect 50 of each for the troll part so now just need to do the weekly for a nice lil 502 boot

It's only a 489 boot, not 502.


Which brings me to my complaint about the barrens: How completely pointless the whole zone update is for anyone who is focused on rewards as opposed to just messing around. This is going to get to be a bit of a rant.

I actually like the idea of the event driven zone over the normal daily grind. As far as I can tell there's not even any achievements for taking part in the Barrens. And on top of all that, for Alliance it's way out of the way (And I did take that teleporter, it takes you to Ratchet, which is close, but not quite there. And given I got the Bloodsail admiral title, I am hated with the Goblins and died instantly after teleporting in. I then rezzed, figuring it was lag that caused it, and nope, died instantly again. Had to go into the water under the dock and rez just so I could get anywhere), which makes something like swinging by to take part for a few minutes while waiting on a queue not particularly enticing.

But seriously, the gear rewards are literally 33 item levels, effectively 3 full tiers behind current content. I don't even know if I want it for transmog, because the way they have it set up is you don't even get to see the gear until after you already have it, so I have no idea what any of it looks like or if it's unique models. There's a few random toys, but my bank is already suffering from wasted space of the 200 toys I picked up leveling to 90, and half of those only work in the Barrens (which is a place I don't have any desire to be in) anyway.

When the Isle of Thunder opened up, it was a big thing. Participation in the daily quests helped towards unlocking things like the Thunder Forge and Nalak faster. There were a bunch of new achievements, the rare spawns dropped both the summoning stones and Lei Shen's key (the stones being good for an easy source of valor, and the keys being great to get extra charms, gold, and the occasional 502 item, plus some more achievements!), and also gave you 15 valor for each kill. The first full month after 5.2 hit, there were big groups on my server wandering around the Isle killing Rares as they spawned, it was a fun community thing, and a lot like what I expected the Barrens to end up being....

Only it wasn't. Because the incentives aren't there. The achievements aren't there. The gear is meh. The valor takes much more grinding to get (150 of each resource vs find a couple of other people with 3 stones and run around killing these summonable bosses. Pick different bosses if you'd prefer!). And there's no real incentive for realm participation. Having the whole realm out there isn't going to accomplish any more than one person going out there.

Overall, The Barrens gets a big thumbs down. I expected great things after Thunder Isle. While there's some good concepts there, a lot of things seem like a step backwards. I just hope this doesn't discourage them from continuing to pursue non-daily, event driven zones. Because if something closer to these lines was what we got at the start for Golden Lotus, rather than 350-400 daily quests, I think it would have been a lot more bearable. I just think this particular implementation leads to a zone that feels utterly useless to me, and I am not even a raider.

[Draken]

Well, there is Shaohao's boot. That one is 502.

[Sajiri]

I just did oondasta with my guild for the first time. Had no idea what was going on when everyone was yelling about being drunk and aggroing stuff around us, but he died and I got a 522 chestpiece which was something I really needed to upgrade. Im going to try the rest of the lfr raids I havent done today