Juvenile Monsters

[Regitnui]

Is there anywhere, internet, Dragon magazine, Wizards.com or sourcebook, that I could find stats of or a method for creating baby or juvenile monsters? I'm specifically interested in the stats for a griffin pup (is that the right word?), if any such thing exists.

Thanks in advance, Playgrounders.

[yougi]

Not sure if that helps, but I usually use another, smaller creature's stats. For a griffon's cubs, I'd use an eagle.

Officially, I don't know if it exists for 3.5, but PF has the young template: link (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/templates/simple-template-young-cr-1). I personally have never tried it though.

[Regitnui]

Using an eagle's stats may be worth considering, but the griffon is a Large creature. Applying the young template would get me an adolescent Medium griffin rather than a Small cub. (I think griffin cubs are small. Not much bigger than housecats at least.)

[Sgt. Cookie]

Perhaps you could use Dungeonbred (Dungonscape), ignoring the size requirement?

[Cog]

griffin pup (is that the right word?).
Well, baby birds are chicks, and baby felines are kittens, so you just have to find a middle ground...

I can imagine Gygax running an encounter now, saying the party finds a bunch of chick-ens. The party, of course, thinks they've found decent meat, until the mother of those chick-ens returns...

[Regitnui]

...baby felines are kittens...

Baby housecats are kittens. Baby panthers, which lions are, are cubs. Therefore they're chicubs, if anything.

[Sulphuricbear]

As it stands I am fairly sure that there are no 3.5 rules. I have seen a homebrew rule in which a child of human maturity 12-16 would lose 1 size category would roll 2D6 for everything but CON (average 7). 6-12 human maturity would lose another and would roll 1d6 for everything but CON and 2D6 for con. 2-5 would roll 1D6 for everything. Anyone younger would have 1 in everything but CON and would be a further 1 size category smaller.

Teenage Griffon: Str15 Con15 Dex13 Int1 Wis9 Cha5 Medium
Young Griffon: Str12 Con11 Dex10 Int1 Wis6 Cha 2 Small
Child Griffon: Str12 Con9 Dex10 Int1 Wis6 Cha2 Small
Baby Griffon: Str9 Con7 Dex7 Int1 Wis3 Cha1 Tiny

Probably not what you were looking for though.

[Greymane]

The only thing that comes to mind is the stat card to that Young Minotaur miniature. Probably only useful if you want a juvenile minotaur. :smalltongue:

[Cog]

Baby housecats are kittens. Baby panthers, which lions are, are cubs. Therefore they're chicubs, if anything.
That can't be right. "Chicub" doesn't sound anything at all like "chicken".

[Zombimode]

Perhaps you could use Dungeonbred (Dungonscape), ignoring the size requirement?

The point of the Dungeonbred template is to make a big monster more suited for cramped environments without sacrificing much of its power. Therefore the template is probably ill-suited to represent younger and thus probably less powerful members of a species.

[Miranius]

Savage Species has a level-like breakdown on many monsters as if they were classes.
Maybe try to do this with your target-creature and treat the levels you come up with as age-categories.

[unseenmage]

If applying the Young template didn't quite do the trick maybe you need a younger version of that Young monster...

Just apply the Young template again.

I mean, by the time you train it not to run from combat (Handle Animal training times vary) it should have grown into that next category anyway.

[dascarletm]

Thinking about it I'd take the stats of the creature full-grown and go based off of that.

Using the srd griffon.
Ability Scores

For a simple way of increasing the ability scores I'd have them uniformly grow with age, based off Hit dice and make a savage type progression, that unlocks with time instead of XP.

The griffon has 7HD so I'd make somewhere from 3-7 age categories or levels, and have it start with 1HD and increase either uniformly or backloaded on HD.

For Ability scores I'd see which would increase through life, and increase as it ages. For strength I'd start at something like 1-2 for a human newborn and increase from there, with animals though, maybe something like 1/8-1/4 the ending stat. Since lioncubs are on the upper end and eagles are on the lower, I'd go with 1/6th. Dexterity would be similar to strength, but would stay lower as it grows into it's new body. Constitution would be maybe half and increase from there. Intelligence I would argue is the same at all levels, since it measures your ability to learn, and not really your knowledge base (skill ranks). Wisdom would grow uniformly. Charisma starts at almost 1 and goes from there?
Example:
Adult Griffon
HD: 7d10
STR 18
DEX 15
CON 16
INT 5
WIS 13
CHA 8

Aging:
0-6months: Newborn

Size Tiny
HD 1d10
STR 3
DEX 5
CON 8
INT 5
WIS 5
CHA 1


6months-1year: Cub

Size Small
HD 2d10
STR 6
DEX 8
CON 10
INT 5
WIS 7
CHA 4

1year-2years: Young

Size Medium
HD 3d10
STR 9
DEX 12
CON 12
INT 5
WIS 9
CHA 6

2-3years: Juvenile

HD 5d10
STR 12
DEX 15
CON 14
INT 5
WIS 11
CHA 8

3-4 years: Young Adult

Size Large
HD 6d10
STR 16
DEX 15
CON 16
INT 5
WIS 12
CHA 8


Have skills and feats go with HD.

Flavor to fit Griffon Lore as I am not an expert, but this should help as a starting point.

[Regitnui]

That's actually pretty well done there. dacarletm. I think I'll use your cub stats for 'Puppy'. Now I just need to keep track of time in this story, and the PCs might have a griffon mascot. :smallbiggrin:

Where would I go to find out how feats relate to HD? or is it a 1-to-1 thing for creatures?

[dascarletm]

That's actually pretty well done there. dacarletm. I think I'll use your cub stats for 'Puppy'. Now I just need to keep track of time in this story, and the PCs might have a griffon mascot. :smallbiggrin:

Where would I go to find out how feats relate to HD? or is it a 1-to-1 thing for creatures?

HD are just like character levels, you get a feat at lvl 1 and every third HD, so the griffon will get one at 1,3,6. If it has more than 3 (which they don't) then some are bonus feats which you'll get from the start most likely.