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sarid
2013-05-14, 03:48 AM
So in my group, we have a huge campaign running that spans almost the entirety of the in game world. At the same time, I decided I really wanted to run something, and our usual GM gave the go ahead.
The only area of the world that's been left open is the Asia analogue, though, and I have a reputation for liking japanese culture (mainly due to a love of anime and the fact that I play kendo). I would like to run on the continent that is a Europe analogue, but the main campaign is a world ending, giant armies marching style of game, so it wouldn't be easy to set something there.
This means that a lot of the time, my players make fun of me, especially our usual GM, who is also my older brother.
Does anyone have any ideas how to make them take me seriously, rather than always addressing their questions to the usual GM and making pokemon jokes in session?

Hyena
2013-05-14, 04:10 AM
Easy. Make the campaign dark, gritty and take every thing about the East people don't usually like to talk about.

Rhynn
2013-05-14, 04:18 AM
Run your own game in your own setting using a system you've chosen. That way, you're the authority on both the setting and the mechanics.

Check out my signature for many free, simple, easy, D&D-based games. They're grrrrreat.

Campaign settings do not need to start big. All you need to start with is a town or a village and a nearby dungeon (or other adventure locale, like a forest full of forest orc tribes, etc., whatever). Then you can grow it bigger as the PCs start to explore their surroundings, following plot hooks from the dungeon or the settlement to other dungeons and settlements, etc.

GnomeFighter
2013-05-14, 04:22 AM
Asia dose not have to be Japan.

How much of the area has details and mapping out?

By Asia do you meen the far east, or has someone just hand waived and said "This bit it like Europe. This bit is like Asia. We won't be going there"?

Also, ye, you could just start your own thing.

The other choice, get yourself a small nurf gun. Use it to keep players in line :smallbiggrin:

sarid
2013-05-14, 04:27 AM
We play Runequest, in the Glorantha setting. The only part of he world the main campaign doesn't effect is Vormain- which is kind of based on Japan. It has a really outdated splat book called VORMAIN: LAND OF NINJA. Obviously I want to try and rework it a bit so I'm kind of making it Japan with bits of Malaysia, Indonesia and the rest of SEA rather than straight Japan.

Rhynn
2013-05-14, 04:34 AM
What about Vithela (the Eastern Isles, past Vormain)? It's got sort of an Indian flavor, and I've always found it awesome. There's also the entire continent of Pamaltela, unless the campaign touches there, too. Alternatively, run a game set in a different time period - if it's not enormous and world-changing, you can run it in the past. Even just a 5-10 years before the start of the other campaign.

Vormain is probably about as poorly-detailed as Vithela. Pamaltela at least got 'zine love (there's a Tales of the Reaching Moon issue on it). I think Vithela is covered in one of Greg Stafford's published unfinished works, The Missing Lands. The Gloranthan Prosopaedia (http://moondesignpublications.com/library/prosopaedia/index.html) also covers some Vithelan deities, I think (or at least the one in the old Cults of Glorantha does).

I still think you should run a game (even using the same system) in your own setting, so that the players won't consider the other GM the setting authority. Which RQ, btw? Mongoose 1 or 2, RQ6, or one of the old ones (Chaosium's 1-2, Avalon Hill's 3) ?

Edit: Land of Ninja isn't a Glorantha supplement at all, and doesn't deal with Vormain. It's a somewhat fantastical Japan. The cover even says "Samurai Roleplaying in Feudal Japan."

GnomeFighter
2013-05-14, 04:38 AM
Bah. I don't know much about the setting, but I guess it is fleshed our and stereotyped. How about something that takes you away from that like seafairin? Or perhaps a very gritty campain?

sarid
2013-05-14, 04:39 AM
Unfortunately, the campaign has been to pamaltela several times, as well as the god learner ruins, Balazar, even valinds glacier.
We run mostly Avalon hill's three, with bits of flavour from chaosium's two and old wyrm's footnotes for ideas.
EDIT: we've done seafaring in the campaign as well. Every idea I've had has somehow ended up in the main campaign before I could realise it...my fault for thinking just like the GM I guess. What sort of gritty do you mean?

prufock
2013-05-14, 07:03 AM
The only area of the world that's been left open is the Asia analogue, though, and I have a reputation for liking japanese culture (mainly due to a love of anime and the fact that I play kendo). I would like to run on the continent that is a Europe analogue, but the main campaign is a world ending, giant armies marching style of game, so it wouldn't be easy to set something there.
This means that a lot of the time, my players make fun of me, especially our usual GM, who is also my older brother.

What. I think I'm missing something. I don't see the link between the information you provided and "this means they make fun of me."

Anyway, you might find some use out of the following: "Would you guys rather continue being jackasses or get on with the campaign? It's up to you, but we're not doing both."

Sidmen
2013-05-14, 07:17 AM
My suggestion would be to set your campaign 400 years (or so) before the big one began. Plan out the campaign to be lower-level, not world-shattering, so that you can do anything without worry of affecting the main game.

On that, why are the players not listening to you?

sarid
2013-05-14, 07:31 AM
Mainly because most of the players have only played with one GM, who is now playing. Because he spends so much time running, when he plays, he goofs off a bit. This normally wouldn't be a problem, but because the players are used to listening to him, they follow his example and all goof off, all the time. Despite the fact that they were interested in the idea for the setting, since our usual GM has decided he doesn't like it, none of them do anymore. They just completely reject the fact that I'm running, not him, so I've had one session completely devolve into jokes and chatting until I just gave up completely, whereupon I was told 'sorry, sorry, we'll be good.'
Our usual GM always argues that I'm not running properly, too.
I just want to figure out why they aren't listening to me, and how to engage their attention!

Yondu
2013-05-14, 08:26 AM
If you want them to listen, scare them....
I mean, speak low and soft, do not repeat what you have said, especially if they are joking in a dramatic moment...
No gifts, no way to be saved if they do not follow the link you want them to follow....
After few critical situations they had to manage, they will no longer joke...
Be mean, be ruthless first and after, soften your way of DMing...

BWR
2013-05-14, 08:30 AM
Have you tried talking about it?
Not just saying "Come on" and letting things go, but before a session just sit down and voice your problems and your goal for the campaign and ask if they can please go along with it?
Most people are surprisingly cooperative if they are asked nicely and seriously. If they still screw around, abandon the game. Trying to push it through uncooperative players is a recipe for unfun.

When it comes to the know-it-all, I've often played that role in other games, pointing out what does and doesn't conform to canon setting/story, and really all it does is annoy everybody, especially the DM. Pointing out the odd detail is one thing, clarification is fine. Continually complaining about how the game deviates from the established setting just makes everyone annoyed and the DM miserable. Explain to your GM->Player that this is your version, it does not follow the established stuff exactly, you are making these changes deliberately and could he please not make a big deal about it.
As long as the changes you make don't impact much on the GMs plans, there really shouldn't be a problem.

Alejandro
2013-05-14, 09:17 AM
First, ask the regular GM to cut it out. If that doesn't work, ask the others to cut it out. If neither of those work, then they may not be interested in your game and you should ask them if they are.

Water_Bear
2013-05-14, 09:34 AM
Ask your brother to stop being such a huge ****.

He's goofing off in a way which makes the other Players not take the game seriously and worse than that he's complaining about how you run the game openly. If he's willing to help, either by getting the other Players to be less obnoxious or by helping you tighten up whatever weaknesses he sees in your game-style, he could be an asset. As is though he's just being disruptive.

As for the Japan thing, I wouldn't worry too much. As long as you don't go full Weeaboo (http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Katanas_are_Underpowered_in_d20) you should be fine.

sarid
2013-05-14, 09:46 AM
I'll try this stuff out next session I run, thanks! ...just hope it works...

OverdrivePrime
2013-05-14, 02:40 PM
I would definitely talk to your brother outside of the game. Get him to understand the fairly basic idea that if you get to run your game, that means he gets to play. If he, as defacto group leader, undermines you and generally makes life unpleasant, that means you're not going to run your game and he doesn't get a break from DMing.

I don't know a single DM who doesn't appreciate a break now and again. If he agrees, just ask him to direct your group's questions to you. "Ask her, it's her game," would be a fine response from him.

Also, I'm not sure what sort of stage presence you have, but make sure you physically command the table. Make sure your players are sitting down. You should be standing up. Don't be afraid to loom over them when appropriate. Speak clearly and get into your roles. Have fun with it, and don't let their dickery slow you down. Try dressing in colors that make you stand out from the rest of the room. Don't wear black - it makes you look smaller. Go with reds and bright colors if you can stand it.

And finally, study, study, study. Know your game rules inside and out. Be able to rattle off an answer to a rules question as fast or faster than your brother. Study your corner of the game world too! Have answers about the environment and it's people quickly at hand, and don't let yourself go in unprepared until you feel like you know the game environment as well as you know your own city. Maybe better. Don't forget to make some personal changes. If someone complains that what you're running isn't exactly like a printed resource , let them know it's because you intentionally changed up some elements to better fit your vision.

Best of luck to you!

imaloony
2013-05-14, 02:57 PM
The way my DM does it is that he will sit and stare at us until we're ready to play. When we complain that he hasn't done anything he just says "This is your story, not mine. If you want to sit around bickering with each other, I'm happy to oblige."
Essentially, make them progress the story. Make it boring if they ignore you or make fun of you. Eventually they'll get sick of it and start gaming.

Icewraith
2013-05-14, 03:03 PM
There isn't a single area or even shady patch on the map that isn't in this one asia-themed area that you could hijack and run your own thing?

Kyberwulf
2013-05-14, 03:49 PM
How do you play Kendo?

OverdrivePrime
2013-05-14, 04:07 PM
How do you play Kendo?

You probably have to blow on the cartridge. (http://redrobotblog.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/kendo-rage-usa.png)

Jay R
2013-05-14, 06:47 PM
Our usual GM always argues that I'm not running properly, too.

I just want to figure out why they aren't listening to me, and how to engage their attention!

Your regular DM is right - you're not running it properly. Specifically, you are counting on your players to impose structure on the game. That's the DM's job.

Just because they are goofing off and ignoring the world doesn't mean that the world is ignoring them.

Player1: <tells a joke>
DM: The door opens. Roll for surprise.
Player 2: <tells a joke>
DM: OK, everyone's surprised. Three ogres walk in and attack.
Player3: <tells a joke>
DM: (rolls) OK, Fred, you take 11 points of damage.

This should get them back on the game.

The crucial idea is this: They are offering distractions, but you are the one stopping the game. Don't get distracted by the goofing off, and they can't.

Kaun
2013-05-14, 08:23 PM
Yeah the trick is to be entertaining.

Don't force them to listen to you, make them want to listen to you.

How you do this is a whole other question.

Play to your strengths, make the game fast paced. If your group likes combat then make the combat awesome and over the top.

My advice is DON"T play anything horror or overly serious. Those type of games require a good level of commitment from your players to work properly. If your already struggling to get their attention then these kinds of sessions wont work well.

Stick to stuff you know they like. Keep the energy up. Don't get baited into petty arguments. Don't stress the rules to much. Have fun yourself.

Don't let yourself get frustrated.

Your brother is probably going to want you to fail a little bit. If he is your usual GM he isn't going to want his little brother to be a better GM then he is.

Don't let any hazing they throw at you get you down, roll with it and keep moving. You don't want the game to turn from rp to picking on the GM.

hehe this post is a bit of a rambler.

Concentrate on having fun, and let the rest work itself out.

Malak'ai
2013-05-14, 11:36 PM
Asia dose not have to be Japan.

How much of the area has details and mapping out?

By Asia do you meen the far east, or has someone just hand waived and said "This bit it like Europe. This bit is like Asia. We won't be going there"?

Also, ye, you could just start your own thing.

The other choice, get yourself a small nurf gun. Use it to keep players in line :smallbiggrin:

I find a little water pistol to be more effective :smallwink:.

magwaaf
2013-05-15, 12:32 AM
don't hold back and let them die. or throw them into ridiculous situations

Mr Beer
2013-05-15, 01:48 AM
All of the above stuff.

- talking to ringleader problem players (out of game of course).

- penalties for goofing off e.g. "Geoff, your turn...2 seconds later...Geoff you have 10 seconds to tell me what you do...2, 1...Geoff missed his go." This can be extended to Geoff being a static target in combat, with all that entails.

- whatever the player says, their character says. You need to warn the player before doing this, once should be sufficient.

DM: "The warlord says 'Who are you?'".
Geoff "LOL, Pokeman LOL such a Japanophile!"
DM: "The warlord gestures to his bodyguards, who proceed to brutally kill you."

You will get plenty of bitching when you lay the smackdown(s), shrug it off. If they carry on whining post game, just tell them nothing was happening and you wanted to get the campaign going. If they want you to run the game, you're running it and that's how it works, if they don't...cool, stop GM-ing.

Darth Smoke
2013-05-15, 03:24 AM
Hey, first of all i sincerely believe that the problem is not so much your brother, but the inability to convey your passion to your players. Having tried many DMs i can honestly say that even though i put my 100% into every character i play, sometimes the DM has not trained some essential skills to holding the group's attention with a firm grip, and this results in goofy behavior from most members, who cannot take things seriously enough.
While it is true that you can never avoid the jokes and the general goofiness around the table, even in my Carrion Crown Horror Campaign i run at the moment where it is very rare but existent, you need to ponder on what it is that makes you and the rest of the players focus so much when your brother DMs.
Find the certain qualities that pin you down on the table, and employ them to your cause when you don the DM mantle, and you will find that you will have gained the group's attention not by asking it, but by luring them into it.