View Full Version : A Song of Ice and Wi-fi: Westeros + 1000 yrs

Malachi Lemont
2013-05-14, 06:05 PM
If you think this is the most ridiculous idea ever, well, isn't that what this forum is all about? Well, here goes.

I'm a huge Game of Thrones fan, and I was thinking Westeros doesn't have to stay in medieval times forever, does it? If we extrapolate beyond the end of the series (even though we don't know how it ends) they might eventually get to modern times. I was thinking of building a setting so that we could write a story in it. Here's what I predict will happen to the Lands of Ice and Fire:

- They will map out the whole world. There are only 3 continents: Westeros which is already mapped, Essos which is mostly mapped, and Sothoryos which is mostly unmapped.

- Sothoryos turns out to not be that big. The northern part is a jungle and the southern half has mountains, hills, and grasslands. It is sparsely populated.

- Once steamships are invented and travel becomes easier, millions of people from Westeros will migrate to Essos and Sothoryos to avoid the long winters.

- There will be many developments in geothermal heating and indoor farms to help people survive the long winters.

- The Others will be mostly exterminated by machine-gun wielding marines with dragonglass bullets. However, there might be a few still lurking toward the North Pole.

- Westeros will divide into many nations. They will start out as kingdoms, and some will remain that way. Other nations will become democratic over time.

- The Riverlands will not be a single nation, but will divide into a dozen or so small republics: Frey, Tully, Dondarrion, etc. They will be economically tied but will each have their own governments.

- Dorne will grow in power, prestige, and population. Especially after they invent air conditioning.

- Southern companies will travel to the North to drill for oil, but Northerners will get angry over their homeland being exploited.

- The Wolfwood will be a wildlife preserve.

- The Wildlings will reject technology and stay mostly the same, but some modern necessities will find their way across the Wall.

- The Night's Watch will be well-maintained, although less necessary as the Others disappear and the Wildlings settle down.

- Professional sports, other than jousting, will take off in Westeros.
Highgarden United will be the reigning football (soccer) champions.

- The Pyke Krakens get at least 2 red cards per game.

- Dragons will grow in numbers, but never to more than a few hundred. They will keep to themselves in the ruins of Old Valyria, which will be a popular but dangerous tourist attraction.

Even though Essos will be a huge part of the equation, I'm more interested in the future of Westeros. What do you all think?

2013-05-15, 09:30 AM
This is the most ridiculous idea I've ever heard in my life. And that's what makes it awesome.

Godspeed, you mad bastard :smallbiggrin:

Malachi Lemont
2013-05-15, 08:36 PM
This is the most ridiculous idea I've ever heard in my life. And that's what makes it awesome.

Godspeed, you mad bastard :smallbiggrin:

Thank you, good Ser. Will you help me write the great history of modern Westeros?

2013-05-17, 06:18 PM
I might be able to pitch in here and there :smallamused:

I'll have to be careful about spoilers, though, since I'm only about halfway through A Feast for Crows at the moment.

2013-05-21, 03:16 AM
I see one crucial flaw in this outlay; Winter.

THough it's not really pointed at in the HBO series, the Stark words, "Winter is Coming" is actually the core conflict of the world. The planet has a seasonal variance where winters and summers each last for years on end. And the Winter that is coming in the series, is predicted to be a particularly long one.

This is what makes the War of Three Kings such a big deal, beyond the obvious. It's happening in the late summer and brief autumn of the world; harvest season. Fields are burned, larders are ransacked, armies eat all the provisions, refugees pack into cities and fight for bread crusts... and when winter sets in, nothing grows. The epilogue to the series is going to be a Westeros where half the population that survived the wars ends up starving through the winter.

Essentially, every couple of years, the entire world - so far as we know - undergoes a drastic and long-term climate shift that results in population crashes, abandonment, and eventually conflict over resources before Summer begins anew. It's like the Dark Ages happening every generation or so.

I have no ideas on how they could overcome this in order to build, much less maintain a "modern" society. Maybe if magic were more common, but ASoIf's "flavor" really relies on magic being strange and more than a little frightening; it's more of a Conan approach to magic than an Eberron one, for sure.

Malachi Lemont
2013-05-21, 04:11 PM
I agree that the long winters are a defining element of Westeros, and these will persist even up to modern times. Because many people starve each winter and it is difficult to generate a surplus of food, this will slow down the rate of technological development.

But technology will progress. Wildfire, Valyrian steel, crossbows, and trebuchets have been developed recently, and it seems like Wildfire, with all its explosive power, could be used for other things - industrial heating, steam power, welding - besides just a weapon of mass destruction.

Also, the severe winters might actually encourage people to develop better technology - geothermal heating, greenhouses, insulation -to protect them from the cold climate. Or perhaps because of the inherent danger of living in the North, more people will move to Dorne where the weather is on the warm side - and they will develop better techniques for irrigation and mining, so they can make the most out of the desert climate.

So even if it takes Westeros 1000 or 2000 years to reach the digital age, I think they can still do it. Hey - they built the Wall, and that's a lot more impressive than most cultures on Earth could do.

Anyway, thanks for commenting.

2013-05-22, 09:11 AM
- Dragons will grow in numbers, but never to more than a few hundred. They will keep to themselves in the ruins of Old Valyria, which will be a popular but dangerous tourist attraction.

But a single dragon is enough to terrorize a countryside . . . a hundred? Especially if they make the burning sea their home (i.e. an island no one can get close to, hell even in modern times if there is a constantly active volcano no one will go near it) why would anyone ever live alongside that coast, let alone a tourist attraction? Then if people don't live along that coast, then dragon would spread out searching for food.

Also . . . obsidian bullets? The hammer in a pistol would explode obsidian. It's just sharp glass. I think you're underestimating the Others. Think zombie apolocalypse - even in world war Z - most of the human population died before they were stopped.. . .

Also Lets say someone wins the war - whats to prevent another 700 + year old dynasty of the 7 kingdoms?

Malachi Lemont
2013-05-22, 11:22 AM
We could just say that magic faded out of the world... for real this time.
And I was wrong about Valyria being a "popular" tourist attraction. Maybe the Arbor, but not the burning sea. I guess it would only attract people like the ones who climb Mount Everest.

You brought up a lot of points that this world might never reach modern capabilities. It's all speculation, anyway, but in my mind, the reign of Joffrey has proved that a hereditary monarchy simply doesn't work in any way. The commoners will realize this, and slowly, after many revolutions, democracy will start to appear. Maybe first in Dorne, where people seem more egalitarian. The North and the Vale seem unlikely to adopt democracy, but with all the chaos going on the North, it could happen.

Dragons... well, I'm just not sure what to do with dragons. I just wanted to get them out of the mainstream but not have them go extinct, because, well, dragons are cool but they're not THAT cool.

2013-05-22, 12:11 PM
In my mind the big players in westeros are not the individuals long term

they are: Old Town, The Faith, and the Iron Bank.

People will move away from monarchy, but I see them moving towards theocracy instead. Old town seems like its up to something Plus it controls most of the information - They can set up a sort of Geniocracy/Aristocracy mix. After the wars, and the deaths of millions by the white walkers and winter. I can see them gaining control of various portions of westeros - funded by the Bank and eventually the bank gaining control. In the end I see it alot like Russia - a Bankocracy/Kleptocracy.

Magic won't fade as long as there are dragons in this world, and the more dragons the more powerful magic would get:

This means Old Town; the white walkers; the red priests and the necromancers become more than just fringe players.

Old town wil deffenitely try to advance technologically - but with magic present any advancement will propabably be towards mage-tech type things instead of technology as we know it.

The Faith and the future theocracy will probably be against them - and there will be probably be another war between them. Old town should probably win with technology and magic behind them.

So I see Westeros in a 1000 years as an enforced aethistic Aristocracy ruled by Wizard Scientists.

Trade will spread to the other two countries in the world. A country ruled by Fire and the Red god, full of super slave soldiers - why super? the technology used to make whatever that white knight at the end of book 5 giant and strong will be used to slaves liek the unsullied. The other country wil be similar but ruled by the necromancers.

So basically I see a magic-tech version of 1984 :smalleek:. A stalemate between what is essentially magic USSR replacing communist leaders with Wizard Scientist, a magic America which still practices slavery, is obsessed with fire and has SUPER soldiers, and what would essentially be the middle east united under necromancers.

The dragon horn will be copied, and Dragons used in the place of Nukes. Hell White walkers can probably be captured and sent to other countries as well.

Also everything will be controlled by the secret cabal of banks in bravos which will remain neutral.

Malachi Lemont
2013-05-22, 12:43 PM
Wow. I appreciate your insight, mystic1110. The world you describes sounds even more frightening than present day medieval Westeros (which is already quite terrifying). But it sounds like it would make an awesome game. Maybe this could be a good setting for the morality system (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=284613) I'm working on. Take a look.

My goal is for each of us to create a multifaceted character with various backstories and abilities, much like the amazing characters of GRRM himself. But this way, we won't have to be tied down to the plot of A Song of Ice and Fire. Instead, we can spin our own plot. Whatever happens, happens.

Also, I'd rather have most of our characters live in the same city or region, so there can be lots of interaction without so much journeying. So let's think about what region(s) we especially want to flesh out. You mentioned Oldtown. We could also do the Iron Islands, King's Landing, Winterfell...There are so many options. Thanks for all your input. Keep it up.

2013-05-22, 01:23 PM
I would love to collaborate on a "modern" SOIAF. But warning my vision of the future will resemble the above :smallwink:.