Some Questions About the Duskblade

[AzureNightshade]

If I as a Duskblade use Chill Touch and Channel it through my sword, would my familiar also gain that number of Chill Touch attacks, as long as what it is Chill Touching is with in 5 Feet of me?
Due to Share Spells.

Same Question for Produce Flame and Flame Blade

Can Duskblade's channel spells through the Flame Blade (just to know if it's worth getting on my spell list)?

What are some good combat Alterself forms for an Outsider Duskblade?

Thanks!

[Urpriest]

To use Share Spells, the spell involved must target you. Chill Touch, Produce Flame, and Flame Blade do not, so you can't share them.

Since you wield the Flame Blade as if it were a Scimitar, it should work for Arcane Channeling.

I've heard Advespa is nice for an Outsider Alter Self form. Dwarf Ancestor is another one that's often mentioned.

[AzureNightshade]

Oh well, And I was hoping for something a little less...demonic then the Advespa, my character has a deep hatred for Demons and Devils being an Eladrin who worships Gwynharwyf, and probably wouldn't want to demean theirself with such a form.

[Urpriest]

Oh well, And I was hoping for something a little less...demonic then the Advespa, my character has a deep hatred for Demons and Devils being an Eladrin who worships Gwynharwyf, and probably wouldn't want to demean theirself with such a form.

Hmm, looking through the list (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=2811.0)...

Dwarf Ancestor still might be viable, though as an Eladrin it's kind of on the "other side".

Cervidals get three natural attacks and some natural armor.

A Minor Xorn is a little out of theme, but not opposed, and has lots of attacks and potentially rather snazzy movement modes.

Various Mephits could be amusing.

Bariaur gets you some Centaur-ish abilities.

Bacchae are decent, and very human-looking when that becomes important.

[AzureNightshade]

Wind and Fire based Mephits are cool thematically

I've been looking at the Ramadeen, Protectar and Silver Celestial (Moonfire wings? lol) as Alterself forms, but I was hoping to find a large humanoid celestial with flyspeed and under 5 HD, maybe in a Dragon Magazine or something.

[AzureNightshade]

It honestly feels like Wizards hated Celestials when they were creating material on them, there isn't much.

Edit: Also nitpicking but Produce Flame has the effect of "Flame in YOUR palm"
wouldn't share spells mean a flame in your familiar's palm (or equivalent) as well?

[gorfnab]

Edit: Also nitpicking but Produce Flame has the effect of "Flame in YOUR palm"
wouldn't share spells mean a flame in your familiar's palm (or equivalent) as well?
Rules of the Game: Familiars (Part Two) (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20050913a)


The master decides when spells are shared. To be shared, the master must cast the spell and the spell must have the master as its target. The spell must have a target entry; effect and area spells cannot be shared. See Rules of the Game: Reading Spell Descriptions (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20040824a) for a discussion of targets, effects, and areas. Spells with touch range cannot be shared unless the master targets himself with the touch.
Produce Flame does not have a Target entry heading (ie. Target: Creature touched, Target: You, Target: One creature) so it can't be shared.

[AzureNightshade]

Alllllllright then.

I cant even find a large creature with a natural flyspeed under 5HD that i could throw the celestial or radiant template on and argue that its legit lol

The closest I've come is the Radiant Eagle in DR321 Which can speak and is large with a fly speed but i question its ability to cast spells, much less wield a large greatsword.

Looks like its down to Ramadeen and casting fly or silver celestial and having the wizard Enlarge me, bummer.

[gorfnab]

Looks like its down to Ramadeen and casting fly or silver celestial and having the wizard Enlarge me, bummer.
Enlarge Person does not work on Outsiders because they are not Humanoids. You could use the psionic power Expansion to increase your size but that would require levels in a psionic class (ie. Psion, Psychic Warrior) or the use of a psionic item.

[AzureNightshade]

Enlarge Person does not work on Outsiders because they are not Humanoids. You could use the psionic power Expansion to increase your size but that would require levels in a psionic class (ie. Psion, Psychic Warrior) or the use of a psionic item.

Flying Ramadeens it is then... :( unless some mutation of giant radiant avariels (Aellars?) exists

(particularly tall elves who breed with huge radiant giant eagles resulting in large offspring, Lawls)

[AzureNightshade]

On that note how does chill touch work? Do I get 1/CL charges to touch people with or do i have to find a way to touch 5+ people in one turn? The spell never made sense to me.

[TuggyNE]

On that note how does chill touch work? Do I get 1/CL charges to touch people with or do i have to find a way to touch 5+ people in one turn? The spell never made sense to me.

The former, for reasons that I seem to recall are a bit involved. Also, I don't feel like reconstructing the whole line of argument from scratch. :smalltongue:

[AzureNightshade]

The former, for reasons that I seem to recall are a bit involved. Also, I don't feel like reconstructing the whole line of argument from scratch. :smalltongue:

That's what i thought, the spell seemed pointless otherwise lol. Thank you.

[NeoPhoenix0]

Touch Spells and Holding the Charge

In most cases, if you don’t discharge a touch spell on the round you cast it, you can hold the charge (postpone the discharge of the spell) indefinitely. You can make touch attacks round after round. If you cast another spell, the touch spell dissipates.

Some touch spells allow you to touch multiple targets as part of the spell. You can’t hold the charge of such a spell; you must touch all targets of the spell in the same round that you finish casting the spell.

Since the spell itself doesn't allow you to touch multiple creatures the round you cast it, if you don't find a way to use all of the touch spells in one round you can hold the charge indefinitely until you touch enough people (accidentally or otherwise) or you cast another spell. I don't think you can stop holding it once you start though.

I believe that is a sufficient argument even for RAW.

[Vaz]

If you are looking for any build, Alter Self shenanigans (on a none Charisma based chassis) are strictly better with Aberration and Arcane Disciple; Outsider only gaining traction on polymorph abuse.

If you can get yourself an LA0 Aberration with claws (memory escapes me), you can qualify for Rapidstrike and Improved Rapid Strike, and Alter Self into a horrifically good full attack channeller, doubly so with Metamorphic Transfer (One word; Tsochar).

[AzureNightshade]

If you are looking for any build, Alter Self shenanigans (on a none Charisma based chassis) are strictly better with Aberration and Arcane Disciple; Outsider only gaining traction on polymorph abuse.

If you can get yourself an LA0 Aberration with claws (memory escapes me), you can qualify for Rapidstrike and Improved Rapid Strike, and Alter Self into a horrifically good full attack channeller, doubly so with Metamorphic Transfer (One word; Tsochar).

Not really looking for anything broken, just fun and flavor lol

[AzureNightshade]

Ok say for whatever reason I gave my Tiny Coure Eladrin Familiar a Tiny Glaive, what reach would it have? Still 10 feet? Or would it simply upgrade it to a 5ft reach?

[Vaz]

It would double its reach; 2x0 = 0.

It's not Broken. At the end of the day, you're still a Duskblade with the same spells known making you purely a beat stick. Arcane Disciple increases your Mad. Metamorphic Transfer "Wear Flesh". Getting lesser restoration is a must. It gives you the ability to (arguably) bypass the Hit Dice requirement, the lack of ability to choose Outsiders as forms to Polymorph into, and as the rules of Polymorph supercede those of the Alter Self, you are now a Tsochar until you choose to leave the Worn Flesh. Find a Sleeping Great Wyrm Time Dragon lying around? Boo-yah.

Even without that (ab)use, however, you are capable of taking better melee forms; common combat brutes your DM sends against you; Ogres, Minotaurs, etc are suddenly used back at your nature. Ever feel the need to infiltrate an enemy castle? Capture a guard, and then wear his flesh.

[AzureNightshade]

Already using Arcane Disciple. While all that stuff does sound interesting, I already have a whole theme in mind for my character, which being a flesh stealing necromantic nightmare does not go along with at all. :)