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Kiero
2013-05-24, 09:37 AM
This is a collection of my various tweaks, amendments and changes to Adventurer, Conqueror, King, for my upcoming game. It's titled Mercenary, Liberator, Tyrant, three terms more appropriate for the period, or alternatively Misthophoroi, Strategos, Basileus (guess which one everyone will use...).

The way I'll present this is references against the bits that are different, and some commentary as to why it's different. Once things have been discussed, I'll put the final draft on the wiki.

As a preface to this and to explain the design goals, this is for a historical game, set in the bowl of the world (ie the Mediterranean) in 300BC. This is the early Hellenistic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellenistic_period) era, the time when the marshals and other hangers-on of Alexander the Great battled it out to claim mastery of his empire. It's a historical game, couched very much in the bits and pieces we know about the period (with added license), and without magic, monsters or anything overtly supernatural. That obviously necessitates cutting out various bits, and changes the focus somewhat. Furthermore, there are no dungeons. None. Sure there's kurgans around and maybe the odd abandoned settlement, but there isn't anything like level after level of underground environments with their own bizarre ecosystems.

The main draw for ACKS doing this is the domain management and mass combat. I hope to make much use of both later on, but for the moment the PCs will be mostly responsible for themselves and their retinue, earning various things like a ship and territory to call their own.

We'll be podcasting on our site (http://insanitywetrust.wordpress.com/) as usual, once things get up and running.



Chapter 2: Characters


Ability scores (p16)

No 3d6 in order. Instead we use the following scheme, which generates an array: Roll 1d6+12, 2d6+6 twice and 3d6 four times. Drop the lowest result from these seven rolls.

You may choose to use either your array, or that of anyone else at the table. Once you have your array, you may arrange them however you like.


Design note: My group aren't wildly keen on random rolls, but 3d6 in order is the worst sort of random, giving no choice whatsoever over what character you play. We don't do "work out what you have from the rolls", we come up with a concept then build a character. The players are happy to use this skewed sort of random, but with the proviso that they can allocate to taste. Furthermore, restricting everyone to whatever they personally roll creates unnecessary rancor, the solution to this was to treat everyone's rolls as an array, freely available for anyone else to use. Thus no one can luck out and get a "good roll", nor suck with a "bad roll".

I'll probably use a weaker one, without the 1d6+12 for henchmen, and straight 3d6, allocate at will for hirelings.


Classes (p18)

Choose a class from the following options: Aristocrat, Assassin, Bard, Diplomat, Explorer, Fighter, Thief.

Some classes have been altered to equalise XP (because XP will not be tracked using points). The following changes are applied to those classes:

Assassin: Add Skirmishing Proficiency as class power.
Bard: Add Performance (Rhetoric) and one additional Performance Proficiency as class powers, may wear medium armour and use shields.
Thief: Raise HD to d6, may use shields.


If desired, I’ll allow people to use Bard as a frame for an Expert-type class, by trading out the three Performance Proficiencies for three others and a level-linked bonus to particular Proficiency throws in place of the inspiration ability. They can also trade down their armour for another Proficiency.

There are two new classes, taken from the Autarch site, and modified. They are thus:

Aristocrat (http://www.autarch.co/forums/house-rules/aristocrat):

Aristocrats are minor aristocrats who have chosen the path of a warrior to make their way in the world.

Prime Requisite: STR and CHA.
Requirements: None.
Hit Dice: 1d6.
Maximum Level: 14.

At first level, aristocrats hit an unarmored foe (AC 0) with an attack throw of 10+. They advance in attack throws and saving throws by two points every three levels of experience (i.e., as fast as fighters), and use the saving throws of fighters. They may fight with all melee and missile weapons, and may fight with a weapon in each hand, weapon and shield, or two-handed weapon. They can wear any kind of armor, and use shields.

Aristocrats start with the Command proficiency, plus one of Diplomacy, Intimidate, or Seduction.

When hiring people (employees, mercenaries, henchmen, contracting a sage, and so on), aristocrats treat the market class of the city as one better (Class I markets remain Class I).

At third level, aristocrats automatically gain a second choice from Diplomacy, Intimidate, and Seduction.

At fifth level, battlefield prowess inspires followers. Any henchmen and mercenaries hired by the aristocrat gain a +1 bonus to their morale score whenever the aristocrat personally leads them. This bonus stacks with any modifiers from the Charisma or proficiencies.

At seventh level, aristocrats become immune to all natural and magical fear effects.

At ninth level, aristocrats can build a castle in the same fashion as a fighter. In addition, the aristocrat gains the Leadership proficiency automatically.

At 11th level, aristocrats gain the last choice from Diplomacy, Intimidate, and Seduction.

The 13th level, aristocrats are masters of their domain: increase the Land Value of their personal domain by +1 while they rule it.

Proficiency list: Alertness, Animal Training, Blind Fighting, Combat Reflexes, Combat Trickery (disarm, force back, knock down, overrun, sunder), Command, Diplomacy, Endurance, Fighting Style, Intimidation, Land Surveying, Leadership, Manual of Arms, Military Strategy, Performance (Rhetoric), Precise Shooting, Riding, Running, Seafaring, Siege Engineering, Skirmishing, Survival, Wakefulness, Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus.

Diplomat (http://www.autarch.co/forums/house-rules/diplomat):

Diplomats are minor aristocrats who have chosen the path of diplomacy and intrigue to make their way in the world.

Prime Requisite: CHA.
Requirements: None.
Hit Dice: 1d6.
Maximum Level: 14.

At first level, diplomats hit an unarmored foe (AC 0) with an attack throw of 10+. They advance in attack throws and saving throws by two points every three levels of experience (i.e., as fast as fighters), but use the saving throws of thieves. They may fight with all weapons, and may fight with a weapon in each hand, weapon and shield, or two-handed. They can wear any kind of armor, and use shields.

When hiring people (employees, mercenaries, henchmen, contracting a sage, and so on), diplomats treat the market class of the city as one better (Class I markets remain Class I).

Diplomats start with an additional Language, Performance (Rhetoric) and one of Diplomacy, Intimidate, or Seduction.

At third level, diplomats gain the ability to Move Silently and Hear Noise as a thief of the same level; and a second choice from Diplomacy, Intimidate, or Seduction.

At fifth level, the diplomat gains the third choice from Diplomacy, Intimidate, or Seduction. In addition, any henchmen and mercenaries hired by the diplomat gain a +1 bonus to their morale score if the character is there to witness and talk about their deeds.

At seventh level, the diplomat gains command of voice: The diplomat gains a +2 bonus to reaction rolls when speaking. If this bonus results in a total of 12 or more, the subjects act as if charmed while they remain in the diplomat's presence. Creatures with a WIS greater than the diplomat's CHA are immune to this power (the diplomat will know they are immune).

Diplomats at seventh level are immune to non-spell charm effects, including those of other diplomats.

Also at seventh level, diplomats learn to Hide in Shadows.

At ninth level, diplomats can build a castle in the same fashion as a fighter.

Also at ninth level, the diplomat gains the ability to perceive intentions: The diplomat always knows the exact reaction result (Hostile, Unfriendly, etc.) of creatures, even if the creatures attempt to lie or conceal their reactions. Creatures with a CHA greater than the diplomat's WIS are immune to this power (and the diplomat will know they are immune).

At 12th level, the diplomat gains Leadership.

Proficiency list: Acrobatics, Art, Bargaining, Bribery, Combat Trickery (disarm), Eavesdropping, Fighting Style, Gambling, Healing, Knowledge, Language, Lip Reading, Performance, Precise Shooting, Profession (advocate, merchant), Riding, Running, Seafaring, Skirmishing, Swashbuckling, Theology, Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus

All characters start at 5th level, and have 8,000dr with which to purchase equipment, hirelings and henchmen, mounts and pack animals and possibly club together for a ship.

As 5th level characters, they will have an expected standard of living of dr/month. If they wish to establish some investments to begin to cover this, any money invested has a return of 3% per month for relatively secure investments, and d10%-d4% for riskier investments (which may make a loss).


Design note: Obviously without magic half of the standard classes make no sense. There were also some gaps, thus the addition of the two new classes. There was also a small job of equalising the XP of all the classes, to facilitate dropping XP tracking altogether, in favour of an alternative method of levelling.

This is a game intended to start with the PCs as experienced, capable people, thus we just straight to 5th level and skip the early incompetence. It also means they're at the stage of gathering their own individual retinues, which is perfect for this game. Four people wandering about unattended would look like vagabonds or bandits, not potential players in the great political games of the age.

I'm not yet sure about starting wealth in terms of monthly incomes that make sense.


Chapter 3: Equipment


Coins and Money (p39)

All economies are based on the silver standard. Halve all values quoted. Multiply all quoted gold piece values by 5 to arrive at a roughly accurate value in silver drachmae for all goods, services and living costs.

In ancient Greece, these were the main currencies:
8 chalkoi = 1 obolus
6 oboloi = 1 drachma
100 drachmae = 1 mina (or mnai)
60 minae = 1 Athenian Talent

1 Athenian talent is about 60lb of silver. In ACKS, there are 100 coins per pound, so 1 Athenian talent is 6000 coins. There are (100 x 60) 6,000 drachma per Athenian talent. Gold is worth ten times as much as silver (it was as much as 27 times as much, but the glut of Persian gold in the market has devalued it).

The only gold coins in wide circulation at this time are Persian gold darics, which are about four times the size of a silver drachma. Thus each one is worth 40 drachmae. Gold staters are twice the size of a silver drachma (thus are worth 20 each), and are beginning to be minted.


Standard of living (p39) – Income and investments

Assume that any investment of a lump sum generates on average a 3% monthly return. This assumes something relatively low risk like land, providing a steady stream of rents and a share of harvests. For riskier investments random return is d10%-d4%.


Design note: Conversion of money to the silver standard and period-appropriate coinage, based on discussion with Alex Macris.


Armour (p41)

The following items are removed from the table on p41: Chain Barding and Plate Barding.

The list is reworked as follows:
AC Armour
1 Hides, linen corselet (worn under breastplate)
2 Leather, quilted linen
3 Lamellar/scale corselet
4 Celtic mail
5 Full lamellar/scale, hoplite panoply
6 Hoplite panoply with thigh and arm plates
+1 Adding metal helm and greaves to no/light/medium armour (AC4 or lighter)

Adding greaves and a metal helm to anything lighter than mail adds +1AC (and count as two Items in calculating Encumbrance); it costs 25dr

Double the price of mail.


Design note: Rejigging the armour to fit what was available in the period. Mail was not common at all outside of a handful of rich Keltoi warlords and possibly some wealthy Etruscans.


Shields

Shields are amended as follows:

Cloak-wrapped forearm +1 AC vs one-handed melee
Buckler – Cost: 5dr +1 AC vs melee and thrown Enc: Item
Small shield – Cost: 10dr +1 AC vs melee and thrown, +2 AC vs missiles Enc: 1 stone
Medium shield – Cost: 50dr +2 AC vs melee and thrown, +3 AC vs missiles, -1 to athletic checks Enc: 2 stone
Large shield – Cost: 100dr +3 AC vs melee and thrown, +5 AC vs missiles, -2 to athletic checks Enc: 3 stone


The Persian cheires functions as a buckler.

In mass combat, small/medium shields give +1AC and large shields +2AC. When closing up, in addition to the usual +2AC in melee and +4AC vs missiles, troops uniformly armed with an aspis get an additional +1AC.


Design note: This is a major change from the flat +1AC shields usually give. In this period the shield was much more important than armour as a pieces defensive equipment. Traditional notions of Greek honour were attached to retaining your shield. Lots of warriors had little more than a shield, armour being both expensive and fatiguing to wear for long periods (heat especially). Bigger shields like the bronze-faced Greek aspis covered a warrior from eye to knee with a mobile barrier, making them all but immune to arrows and slings from the front. In close formation these gave coverage to the man to the left as well as their wielder. D&D is based in a lot of medieval assumptions, and in that period armour was more important and shields almost disposable. Thus shields aren't very effective where in antiquity they were.


Weapons (p41)

The following items are removed from the table: Arbalest, Morning Star, Silver Dagger, Two-handed Sword.

The following items are amended: Sling – damage 1d6.


Design note: Minor changes, removing weapons that didn't exist and increasing the damage of the sling, which was a much deadlier weapon than D&D implies. If a stone is used rather than a cast bullet, use the old damage/range stats.


Encumbrance (p48) - Increase (or decrease) Encumbrance values by the lower of a character’s Strength or Constitution.


Design note: I wanted to give stronger, fitter characters a boost here, but making it the lower of the two stops it becoming a free-for-all where having high Strength is a no-brainer for a warrior-type and having decent Constitution matters as well. Even with this change, you don't get full, unencumbered movement in the heaviest armour with Str 18 and Con 18.


Mercenary Troop Types (p52)

{table won't show...]

Unless otherwise specified, Availability is the same as their equivalent type in the book.


Design note: Mine is a much simpler table than the standard, since there's only humans. But I also needed to augment for the period and its assumptions about arms and armour. There's a much more detailed version for mass combat here (http://www.autarch.co/comment/12398#comment-12398).


Chapter 4: Proficiencies


Starting Proficiencies (p56)

The Adventuring Proficiency is renamed Seasoned Campaigner. Characters start with two General and one Class Proficiency.


Gaining Proficiencies

All characters use the same progression, gaining a General Proficiency every even-numbered level, and one from the Class Proficiency list every odd-numbered level.

Languages: All characters start with their native tongue and koine Greek for free. If they are already a native Greek speaker, they get their native dialect and another language of their choice.

Available languages are: Arabian, Aramaic, Armenian, Dacian, Egyptian, Etruscan, Greek, Illyrian, Keltic, Latin, Libyan, Lydian, Nubian, Persian, Phrygian, Phoenician, Scythian, Thracian.

Phoenician and Aramaic are similar, as are Thracian and Phrygian.


New Proficiency: Pankration

This covers the Greek style of unarmed combat, which is also integrated into armed combat at higher levels of training. If taken once, it functions as Combat Trickery (Wrestling) and also gives Combat Trickery (Force Back, Incapacitate and Knock Down) with unarmed attacks only.

Taken a second time, the character may do lethal damage with unarmed attacks and may damage targets in metal armour. Kick attacks suffer only a -1 penalty to hit.


Remove the following Proficiencies: Apostasy, Arcane Dabbling, Battle Magic, Black Lore of Zahar, Collegiate Wizardry, Divine Blessing, Divine Health, Dungeon Bashing, Elementalism, Elven Bloodline, Familiar, Goblin-Slaying, Illusion Resistance, Laying on Hands, Magical Engineering, Magical Music, Martial Training, Mystic Aura, Quiet Magic, Righteous Turning, Sensing Evil, Sensing Power, Transmogrification, Unflappable Casting.


Design note: I wanted a lot more differentiation between characters than is assumed, especially with the absence of magic and non-human species. The easy way to do this was to simply give everyone more Proficiencies. I also needed to be specific about languages. The retention of the prophecy-related Proficiencies is intentional. It's not magic, but it's entirely genre-appropriate and prophecies can have a way of becoming self-fulfilling.


Chapter 5: Spells – CUT!


Chapter 6: Adventures


Time and Wilderness Movement (p93)

Remounts - if the party has two mounts per character (including hirelings), they may move at double the long-distance movement rates shown. This is double the speed of the slowest mount in the group. If the party has three mounts per character, they may move at 2.5 times long-distance rates. If the party has four or more mounts per character, they may move at triple the long-distance rates.


Design note: It's not often considered in dungeon-based games, but if you have more than one mount (which you should; you don't ride your warhorse for general travel, and you don't use a riding horse in battle) you can travel much faster than if you're keeping one mount relatively fresh.


Sea Vessels (p95)

Apply the following amendments:
Galley, large: Sailors: 10, Marines: 15
Galley, small: Sailors: 5, Marines: 5
Galley, war renamed to Galley, pentere.

Add
Galley, medium: Sailors: 5, Rowers: 120, Marines: 10. Ft per Round: 60’/135’, Mi per Day 90/55. Cargo: 3000 stone. AC 1. Shp: 80-105. Cost: 20,000gp (100,000dr)
Galley, tetrere: Sailors: 15, Rowers: 230, Marines: 30. Ft per Round 50’/120’, Mi per Day 75/50. Cargo: 5000 stone. AC 2. Shp 115-140. Cost: 45,000gp (225,000dr)


Design note: The ships listed broadly fit for the period, though most have far too many marines as standard. Space and weight were at a premium, and too many non-essential bodies aboard threatened the seaworthiness of the ship. I also needed to separate two of the most common war galleys, fours and fives from each other, and add a new category of medium galley.


Initiative (p100) – add Dexterity and Wisdom bonuses/penalties to 1d6. Roll at the start of an encounter.


Design note: I'm giving characters with good Wisdom something here. Plus rolling every turn would slow things down too much.


How to attack (p102)

On an roll of 1, roll d20 on the mishap table. If using a spear, polearm or javelin, take -4 to the roll.

1 - Weapon breaks
2-5 - Sunder attack on weapon; Reflex save to avoid breaking.
6-7 - Disarm; Reflex save to avoid losing your weapon.
8-9 - Slip; Reflex save to avoid falling prone.
10+ Nothing additional


Design note: Weapon breakage/loss is a thematically appropriate thing to happen, so here it might do 2.5% of the time.


Missile Attacks (p103)

Amendment: Javelin range 40’/80’/120’
Amendment: Sling range 50'/100'/200'


Design note: Once again, two weapons criminally undervalued by D&D, made more appropriate to the period.


Effects of Damage (p104)
If you go below ½ your maximum hit points, you are Bloodied and suffer a -1 penalty to attack throws and saving throws.

Healing (p105)
Natural healing is equal to your level in hp per day. This is halved if a character is Bloodied (once you are above ½ maximum you return to the normal rate). This is doubled if under the care of someone with the Healing Proficiency.


Design note: Dual-pronged change here. One turning hit points into actual measure of health - though you aren't meaningfully injured until you get to 0, and improving natural healing rates unless you've dropped into incapacitated.

I still need to think about healing rates for incapacitated characters, who have actual injuries rather than cuts and bruises.


Saving Throw Categories (p108)
Only three saving throws are used, translated as follows:
Petrification & Paralysis becomes Reflex. In certain circumstances, apply your Dexterity bonus/penalty to the roll.
Poison & Death becomes Fortitude. In certain circumstances, apply your Constitution bonus/penalty to the roll.
Staffs & Wands becomes Will. In certain circumstances, apply your Wisdom bonus/penalty to the roll.


Design note: My group much prefers the simpler three-save approach of D20, which is what we've done here.


Sunder (p109)
There is only a -2 penalty to sunder javelins, which suffer a -6 penalty to their save against breaking.


Design note: What javelins have gained in range, they've lost in durability.


Mounted Attacks (p112)

If hit by a mounted charge, fixed spear, or struck with a natural 20, a mounted character must make a Reflex save to avoid being unhorsed, taking 1d6 damage in the process. Knock Down attacks against mounted characters are treated the same way. Characters with the Riding Proficiency get a +2 bonus to this roll.


Design note: Simple addition here, it didn't feel like the standard rules had really considered how a character might be involuntarily unhorsed.


Experience (p113)

No award or tracking of experience points (XP). All classes have had their XP tables equalised by addition of class features, and instead we progress levels by achievement of Milestones. These act as prompts for things the players should be doing, and when the group collects enough of them, the PCs all gain a level.

[More later]

Design note: This is still a work in progress, my group are happy to ditch tracking experience points, but instead we'll have a milestone system (http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?686956-ACKS-XD-amp-D-Milestones-as-an-alternative-to-XP).


Chapter 9: Treasure

Only use pages 204-210, ie the non-magical stuff.


Masterwork armour and weapons.

There are two better-than-normal qualities for weapons and armour (but not shields or ammunition), good and exceptional. Good items cost four times the listed price, have one special property and give +2 against Sunder maneuvers. Exceptional items cost ten times the listed price, have two properties, and give +4 against being Sundered.

The other mechanical impacts are as follows:

Good weapons: +1 initiative or +1 damage.
Exceptional weapons: +1 to hit and with either +1 initiative or +1 damage.
Good armour: Reduce Encumbrance by one stone.
Exceptional armour: Reduce Encumbrance by one stone and +1AC.



Design note: While there's no magic items, there is still well-crafted gear, available for a price. Thus as both loot and stuff to get, I've included them here. I do wonder if x4 and x10 might be too cheap, but on the other hand how would anyone afford it if they were too expensive.


Chapter 10: Secrets

Aging and Death (p248)

Aging is not a fixed property. Instead the time in which penalties start to apply depends on a number of factors, which together are called Prime. To calculate Prime age, roll your hit die, add or subtract your Strength and Constitution modifiers and add/subtract this result to 35. This gives your Prime. This will range from 30 to 49.

Prime= 35 + (HD roll +/- Str and Con modifiers)

The reworked aging chart is thus:

Youth: 13-17
Adult: 18 - Prime
Middle Aged: (Prime +1) - (Prime +20)
Old: (Prime +21) - (Prime +40)
Ancient (Prime +41) - (Prime +60)

Furthermore, the effects of Middle and Old age are ameliorated somewhat. Those new ability score adjustments are as follows:

Modifier for Middle Aged: -1 Dex, -1 Con
Modifier for Old: -1 Str, -1 Dex, -1 Con, -1 Cha

Design note: Maybe it's that I'll be 35 next year, and I have two parents who will be 60 at the same time, but both the hurdle ages and the adjustments seem far too severe to me. People who are in good health, look after themselves and got lucky with their genes don't show the effects of aging the same as others less fortunate do.

Not only that, this is the era in which you had veteran phalangites still fighting in their 60s and even 70s, and commanders dying in battle in their 80s and 90s. These were not frail people with one foot in the grave, but still vital even into what we'd normally consider to be elderly. Not only that, strength doesn't drop off that much, it's fitness and flexibility that go with age.

This also inserts some variety into aging, and allows for premature aging as well as extended longevity.

SiuiS
2013-05-24, 01:24 PM
Subscribed for later digestion.

The monetary system; it looks like you have a complete system but left out a connecting thought. Like you explained steps 1, 2, 3, 5, and 6 and it follows in your memory but not on paper. This may be because I am going to sleep, however. So items cost five times as much (because they are silver coins not gold) but how many coins do the players get? Is it 1 GP = 1 DR now?

Reading it, it's actually halve all prices, then multiply by five? Wouldn't multiply by 2.5 do the same thing without the ambiguity? Uh. It's too late for math. >_<

Love the shield stuff. Need to find a way to make use of it.

Kiero
2013-05-24, 02:47 PM
Subscribed for later digestion.

The monetary system; it looks like you have a complete system but left out a connecting thought. Like you explained steps 1, 2, 3, 5, and 6 and it follows in your memory but not on paper. This may be because I am going to sleep, however. So items cost five times as much (because they are silver coins not gold) but how many coins do the players get? Is it 1 GP = 1 DR now?

Reading it, it's actually halve all prices, then multiply by five? Wouldn't multiply by 2.5 do the same thing without the ambiguity? Uh. It's too late for math. >_<

Love the shield stuff. Need to find a way to make use of it.

I'm not sure I could have tried to make that more confusing!

It's an either/or - all prices are halved, regardless of denomination. Gold is restated in silver values. If you want to read existing gp values and convert directly into drachmae, multiply by five.

SiuiS
2013-05-25, 02:57 AM
It's saying either or that confuses me, I suppose. I'm going to assume its my language parsing skills, and take the Filly's Route;

Say a piece of artwork is worth 500 gold coins standard. Would it cost 2,500 drachmae, 250 drachmae or 1,250 drachmae?

Oh, wait. Okay I missed a sentence there. Half value for everything (so that 500gp art piece is 250gp), but you represent everything in sp, not gp. Since it would be both half value and also ten times more (because you're using dimes not dollars) multiplying by 5 is the shorthand. So the item in question would cost 1,250dr.

Kiero
2013-05-25, 08:13 AM
It's saying either or that confuses me, I suppose. I'm going to assume its my language parsing skills, and take the Filly's Route;

Say a piece of artwork is worth 500 gold coins standard. Would it cost 2,500 drachmae, 250 drachmae or 1,250 drachmae?

Oh, wait. Okay I missed a sentence there. Half value for everything (so that 500gp art piece is 250gp), but you represent everything in sp, not gp. Since it would be both half value and also ten times more (because you're using dimes not dollars) multiplying by 5 is the shorthand. So the item in question would cost 1,250dr.

It should be 2,500dr. In the book it's 500gp. So either you halve and multiply by 10 for the (silver) drachma value, or you multiply by 5 to get to it directly.

SiuiS
2013-05-25, 08:42 AM
It should be 2,500dr. In the book it's 500gp. So either you halve and multiply by 10 for the (silver) drachma value, or you multiply by 5 to get to it directly.

I reversed my steps again, didn't I? :smallsigh:
Well, my explanation was spot on, whether or not I actually checked my math.

How do you handle treasure? If the system would give a gold coin, do you give 1, 5 or 10 drachmae?

Rhynn
2013-05-25, 09:05 AM
I'm pondering currency conversion myself... for Dark Sun, the main unit of currency is going to be the ceramic piece (which can be broken into ten "bits"), issued by the various city-states of the Sorcerer-Kings. Each will be recognizable as a ceramic piece of that city-state. They'll have some limited use across cities, which means that at higher levels, PCs will prefer products (from gemstones to iron ingots to wine) for their trade vessels. I've pretty much setted on just converting all uses of "gp" to "cp," whether for equipment prices, hireling wages, magic research, or gaining XP. Actual silver, electrum, gold, and platinum coins will be more valuable than ceramic at the usual ratio (so each gold coin is actually worth 100 "gp" and nets you 100 XP, etc.).

Copper coins will be worth the same as ceramic pieces, I guess (although I actually think copper might be considered more valuable than silver; but I suppose tin may be the rare component of bronze?). Basically, Dark Sun IMO doesn't actually differentiate between bronze and iron/steel weapons, it's all just "metal" - which makes sense. In a world of obsidian and bone swords, a bronze sword is going to be pretty much as impressive and valuable as an iron sword.

Anyway, I'm left with one big question...

The value of the ceramic pieces issued by a city is backed by water. That is, a ceramic piece is ultimately a "water token/chit" that lets you draw X amount of water from a city well (all heavily guarded by templars). But how many gallons of water for a ceramic piece (ACKS standard gp)? Rice would also have a theoretical "standard" exchange value (but both of these values could be adjusted, either to preserve city stores for war etc., or because of a dry season or bad harvest).

Going off the AD&D 2E Dark Sun revised campaign setting, it's 25 gallons per 1 ceramic piece (or 5 lbs. of rice for 1 cp). However, if you break that down... on a regular day on Athas, a human needs 1 gallon of water if active or doing labor. You can halve that if you're inactive, and halve it again if spending the day in the shade (i.e. nobles and templars). That comes out to 1/25th of a ceramic piece per day for water (that's 0.4 bits). Unskilled laborers are paid 2 bits per week or 1 ceramic per month; that means they are short 2 bits per month just to have enough water not to be dehydrates, never mind food! Light footmen have the same pay, and militia footmen only get paid half, but at least with mercenaries you might assume the employer has to feed and water them (not sure off-hand if ACKS separates paying and supplying your mercenaries).

So, given ACKS's precisely crafted economic balances, what's the right exchange rate of water to ceramic pieces (ACKS gold pieces) ?


As a sidenote, I'm also left with trying to decide a smooth, easy way to represent the superiority of metal weapons. My current AD&D rules idea just feels clunky: basically, you can reroll a missed attack or make an opponent reroll a hit, but your weapon has a chance of breaking (actual numbers still up in the air; say, 5/6 chance for non-metal, 3/6 for metal). Is there some simpler approach I could take? I don't want to adjust attack throws or damage based on weapon material. Basically, IMO, metal weapons should be able to break bone, wood, and stone/obsidian weapons (AFAIK steel swords pretty much destroyed obsidian-bladed macahuitls), and need to have a mechanical edge to justify the 10,000% (x100) price hike Dark Sun gives them by default.

Kiero
2013-05-25, 09:35 AM
I reversed my steps again, didn't I? :smallsigh:
Well, my explanation was spot on, whether or not I actually checked my math.

How do you handle treasure? If the system would give a gold coin, do you give 1, 5 or 10 drachmae?

If the system says 1gp, automatically translate that to 5 drachmae.

Exactly what form that would take would depend where they were discovering the treasure. If it's taken off a Thracian warband, say, it'll be 5 drachmae in silver. If it's taken off some Persian aristocratic cavalry, it might be in gold darics (each of which are 40 drachmae due to their size).


I'm pondering currency conversion myself... for Dark Sun, the main unit of currency is going to be the ceramic piece (which can be broken into ten "bits"), issued by the various city-states of the Sorcerer-Kings. Each will be recognizable as a ceramic piece of that city-state. They'll have some limited use across cities, which means that at higher levels, PCs will prefer products (from gemstones to iron ingots to wine) for their trade vessels. I've pretty much setted on just converting all uses of "gp" to "cp," whether for equipment prices, hireling wages, magic research, or gaining XP. Actual silver, electrum, gold, and platinum coins will be more valuable than ceramic at the usual ratio (so each gold coin is actually worth 100 "gp" and nets you 100 XP, etc.).

Trade goods is a valid point, that's one thing I'm still not sure on, and am struggling with sources to tell me what they're worth. I could handwave it, after all we have nothing like perfectly efficient markets at work, but having some evidence will mean I might be out by the right order of magnitude, at least.


Copper coins will be worth the same as ceramic pieces, I guess (although I actually think copper might be considered more valuable than silver; but I suppose tin may be the rare component of bronze?). Basically, Dark Sun IMO doesn't actually differentiate between bronze and iron/steel weapons, it's all just "metal" - which makes sense. In a world of obsidian and bone swords, a bronze sword is going to be pretty much as impressive and valuable as an iron sword.

On Earth, tin is the rare element comprising bronze (copper is all over the place), which is why bronze fell out of use. Iron and coal/charcoal are much easier to find.

I should note, the idea that bronze is inferior to iron is one of those myths. Well-worked bronze is better than iron and low-grade steel. The reason it was eventually supplanted was the availability of tin, not intrinsic superiority of iron/steel. Middle Republican Roman officers often had bronze swords, while their men had cheap iron and low-grade steel ones (much easier to mass produce).

The only downside of bronze is that it's about 10% heavier than the same volume of iron/steel.


Anyway, I'm left with one big question...

The value of the ceramic pieces issued by a city is backed by water. That is, a ceramic piece is ultimately a "water token/chit" that lets you draw X amount of water from a city well (all heavily guarded by templars). But how many gallons of water for a ceramic piece (ACKS standard gp)? Rice would also have a theoretical "standard" exchange value (but both of these values could be adjusted, either to preserve city stores for war etc., or because of a dry season or bad harvest).

Going off the AD&D 2E Dark Sun revised campaign setting, it's 25 gallons per 1 ceramic piece (or 5 lbs. of rice for 1 cp). However, if you break that down... on a regular day on Athas, a human needs 1 gallon of water if active or doing labor. You can halve that if you're inactive, and halve it again if spending the day in the shade (i.e. nobles and templars). That comes out to 1/25th of a ceramic piece per day for water (that's 0.4 bits). Unskilled laborers are paid 2 bits per week or 1 ceramic per month; that means they are short 2 bits per month just to have enough water not to be dehydrates, never mind food! Light footmen have the same pay, and militia footmen only get paid half, but at least with mercenaries you might assume the employer has to feed and water them (not sure off-hand if ACKS separates paying and supplying your mercenaries).

So, given ACKS's precisely crafted economic balances, what's the right exchange rate of water to ceramic pieces (ACKS gold pieces) ?

You'll have to ask someone with a more mathematically-inclined brain! :smalltongue:


As a sidenote, I'm also left with trying to decide a smooth, easy way to represent the superiority of metal weapons. My current AD&D rules idea just feels clunky: basically, you can reroll a missed attack or make an opponent reroll a hit, but your weapon has a chance of breaking (actual numbers still up in the air; say, 5/6 chance for non-metal, 3/6 for metal). Is there some simpler approach I could take? I don't want to adjust attack throws or damage based on weapon material. Basically, IMO, metal weapons should be able to break bone, wood, and stone/obsidian weapons (AFAIK steel swords pretty much destroyed obsidian-bladed macahuitls), and need to have a mechanical edge to justify the 10,000% (x100) price hike Dark Sun gives them by default.

ACKS has the Sunder maneuver for weapon breakage. I've also added a "mishaps" rule which can result in Sundering. So here's an easy fix on the basis of those two: give non-metal weapons a penalty to the saving throw for Sundering. If you want to make it even more likely, make them roll on a 20 as well as a 1, if used against metal.

Kiero
2013-05-25, 09:51 AM
I've got a new alteration to the rules for my game: this time it's aging.

Aging and Death (p248)

Aging is not a fixed property. Instead the time in which penalties start to apply depends on a number of factors, which together are called Prime. To calculate Prime age, roll your hit die, add or subtract your Strength and Constitution modifiers and add/subtract this result to 35. This gives your Prime. This will range from 30 to 49.

Prime= 35 + (HD roll +/- Str and Con modifiers)

The reworked aging chart is thus:

Youth: 13-17
Adult: 18 - Prime
Middle Aged: (Prime +1) - (Prime +20)
Old: (Prime +21) - (Prime +40)
Ancient (Prime +41) - (Prime +60)

Furthermore, the effects of Middle and Old age are ameliorated somewhat. Those new ability score adjustments are as follows:

Modifier for Middle Aged: -1 Dex, -1 Con
Modifier for Old: -1 Str, -1 Dex, -1 Con, -1 Cha

Design note: Maybe it's that I'll be 35 next year, and I have two parents who will be 60 at the same time, but both the hurdle ages and the adjustments seem far too severe to me. People who are in good health, look after themselves and got lucky with their genes don't show the effects of aging the same as others less fortunate do.

Not only that, this is the era in which you had veteran phalangites still fighting in their 60s and even 70s, and commanders dying in battle in their 80s and 90s. These were not frail people with one foot in the grave, but still vital even into what we'd normally consider to be elderly. Not only that, strength doesn't drop off that much, it's fitness and flexibility that go with age.

This also inserts some variety into aging, and allows for premature aging as well as extended longevity.

Kiero
2013-05-30, 09:36 AM
I've now started putting my material up on the wiki (http://wiki.rpg.net/index.php/Tyche%27s_Favourites).

Kiero
2013-06-08, 08:30 AM
I know I like seeing this sort of thing, so here's the stat-blocks for the characters in my game. I'll also spoiler-block their retinues so we don't end up with an impenetrable wall of text.


Rhyanidd

A princess of the Lugii, from the most northerly fringes of Keltoi influence bordering with Germania, she is an experienced warrior and warleader. Like many aristocrats amongst her people, she is an excellent horsewoman and has served in the role of mercenary cavalry since her mid-teens in the wars of the Greeks. She was on the winning side at Ipsus, seizing much plunder. Her bodyguard are devoted to her, they have earned wealth, status and renown following her (and in some cases, freedom).

Warlord 5, Move 120’, AC 7/8, HD 5, hp , Att 4*+/7+, Saves: Fort 9+ Ref 12+ Will 13+, Init +1
Dmg: 1d6+4 (sword), 1d6+3 (spear), 1d4+3 (dagger), 1d6+2 (javelin)
Str +2, Con +2, Int +2, Cha +2.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Combat Reflexes, Command, Diplomacy, Fighting Style (weapon and shield), Intimidation, Leadership, Military Strategy, Performance (Rhetoric), Prophecy, Riding, Theology (Druidic), Weapon Focus (Swords and daggers).
Languages: Celtic, Germanic, Koine Greek
Equipment: Scale thorax (exceptional), medium shield, longsword (exceptional)*, spear (exceptional)*, dagger, javelins (3). Enc 6/7 stone.


Several interesting points to note about Rhyanidd. The original concept was "warrior princess". When I told the player that was a perfectly valid and appropriate concept, she smiled. She's not just a princess (Celtic warriors are generally aristocrats anyway, but she's a prominent one), she's also a priest, having been trained by a famous ovate and given to visions in her dreams. To her people, she's the real deal, a proper druid touched by the gods. She's also had instruction in Greek rhetoric, which should be amusing the first few times she addresses bodies of Greeks and surprises them by being able to speak, gesture and structure arguments in a persuasive way. And of course she's a warleader and a skilled combatant and commander.

She spent quite a lot of her starting money on improving her retinue's gear, which is one of the reasons they have near-fanatical Morale scores.


Her bodyguard:

Sabra - One of Rhyanidd's closest friends from childhood, the two of them grew up together sharing the same training, competing for the same boys and sharing the spoils of the same raids. Strangers could be forgiven for thinking them sisters in a certain light. She is a thoughtful and serious warrior, not one given to boastfulness, but quietly confident in her own prowess.

Bisalkes - A Gallo-Thracian who was originally a slave taken after a skirmish with the Boii. He is the bodyguard's scout.

Tasciovanus - a bard in the old tradition, he went to study with the ovates of Alba. He is composing an ever-expanding epic based on the exploits of the band. Handsome, charming, but also impulsive.

Liath - A Boii warrior taken in the same skirmish as Bisalkes. Left for dead by her comrades and tended back to health, on waking and discovering she had not been made a slave, she swore her life and her sword to Rhyanidd.

Esselt - younger cousin to Rhyanidd, tall, athletic, attractive but headstrong and eager for glory. She believes herself more capable than she really is.

Berdic - the youngest warrior in the band who often ends up being co-opted to do all the menial chores around camp for the bodyguard.

Saskia - originally one of Rhyanidd's tenant farmers from home, the group's groom and the closest thing to the princess' valet.

Sabra. Fighter 3. Move 90’, AC 7/8, HD 3+3, hp 19, Att 6*+/9+, Saves: Fort 12+ Ref 14+ Will 14+, Init +2, Mor +7
Dmg: 1d6+6 (spear), 1d6+4 (sword), 1d6+4 (javelin)
Str+2, Int+1, Wis+1, Con+1, Cha-1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Animal Training (horse), Intimidation, Combat Reflexes, Fighting Style (Weapon and Shield), Riding, Signalling (cavalry trumpets), Weapon Focus (spear).
Languages: Celtic, Koine Greek.
Equipment: Mail (good), medium shield, spear (exceptional)*, longsword, dagger, javelins (3), light riding horse, medium war horse . Enc 8/8 stone.


Bisalkes. Explorer 2. Move 120’, AC 7/8, HD 2+2, hp 11, Att 9+/7+, Saves: Fort 9+ Ref 11+ Will 12+, Init +4, Mor +6
Dmg: 1d6+2 (spear), 1d6+2 (javelin)
Str+1, Wis+1, Dex+2, Con+1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Beast Friendship, Riding, Survival, Tracking.
Languages: Celtic, Thracian
Equipment: Leather (exceptional), medium shield, spear, dagger, javelins (3). light riding horse, light war horse . Enc 5/6 stone.


Tasciovanus. Bard 2. Move 90’, AC 7/8, HD 2, hp 9, Att 8+/8+, Saves: Fort 13+ Ref 11+ Will 15+, Init +1, Mor +6
Dmg: 1d6+1 (spear), 1d6 (axe), 1d6 (javelin)
Int+1, Wis-1, Dex+2, Cha+2.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Knowledge (History), Performance (Singing) II, Performance (Storytelling), Profession (advocate), Riding, Seduction, Weapon Finesse.
Languages: Belgic, Celtic, Koine Greek
Equipment: Scale thorax (good), medium shield, spear (good), hand axe, dagger, javelins (3), light riding horse, medium war horse. Enc 6/7 stone.


Liath. Fighter 1. Move 90’, AC 7/8, HD 1+1, hp 9, Att 9+/9+, Saves: Fort 13+ Ref 14+ Will 16+, Init +1, Mor +6
Dmg: 1d6+4 (spear), 1d6+2 (sword), 1d6+3 (javelin)
Str +1, Con +1, Dex +1, Chr -1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Endurance, Fighting Style (Weapon and Shield), Riding, Weapon Focus (spears).
Languages: Celtic, Koine Greek
Equipment: Scale thorax (good), medium shield, spear (good), longsword, dagger, javelins (3), light riding horse, medium war horse. Enc 6/8 stone.


Esselt. Fighter 1. Move 120’, AC 6/7, HD 1+1, hp 9, Att 7*+/10+, Saves: Fort 13+ Ref 15+ Will 16+, Init +0, Mor +5
Dmg: 1d6+4 (spear), 1d6+5 (sword), 1d6+3 (javelin)
Str+2, Con+1, Cha+1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Fighting Style (Weapon and Shield), Riding, Survival, Weapon Focus (swords and daggers).
Languages: Celtic, Koine Greek
Equipment: Scale thorax (good), medium shield, spear (exceptional)*, longsword (good), dagger, javelins (3), light riding horse, medium war horse. Enc 6/6 stone.


Berdic. Fighter 1. Move 90’, AC 6/7, HD 1+1, hp 9, Att 9+/9+, Saves: Fort 13+ Ref 14+ Will 16+, Init +1, Mor +5
Dmg: 1d6+3 (spear), 1d6+3 (axe), 1d6+2 (javelin)
Str+1, Dex+1, Con+1 .
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Combat Trickery (Wrestling), Performance (poetry), Riding, Weapon Focus (axes).
Languages: Celtic, Koine Greek
Equipment: Scale thorax (good), medium shield, spear, battle axe, dagger, javelins (3), light riding horse, medium war horse. Enc 6/8 stone.


Saskia. Fighter 1. Move 120’, AC 4/5, HD 1+1, hp 9, Att 9+/10+, Saves: Fort 13+ Ref 15+ Will 16+, Init +0, Mor +5
Dmg: 1d6+3 (spear), 1d4+2 (dagger), 1d6+3 (javelin)
Str+1, Con+1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Animal Husbandry, Survival, Riding, Weapon Focus (spear).
Languages: Celtic, Germanic
Equipment: Leather (good), medium shield, spear, dagger, javelins (3), light riding horse, light war horse. Enc 5/6 stone.



Meshullum

An Alexandrian Jew originally from Tyre (evacuated as a child from the siege that resulted in its destruction at the hands of Alexander), perhaps it was that early dislocation that led him to his wandering lifestyle. He is a mercenary captain of archers, having been involved in all the major conflicts, since the Gaza campaign, and changed sides more than once. His retinue is comprised of his most loyal archers, and his nephew, a doctor from the Alexandrian school.

Explorer 5, Move 120’, AC 5, HD 5, hp 18, Att 6+/1*+, Saves: Fort 12+ Ref 10+ Will 13+, Init +4
Dmg: 1d6+5 (bow), 1d6+3 (sword), 1d4+3 (dagger), 1d6+3 (spear)
Str+1, Dex +3, Int+2, Cha+2.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Fighting Style (Bow), Gambling, Intimidation, Manual of Arms, Navigation, Precise Shooting, Riding, Skirmishing, Weapon Focus (bow).
Languages: Koine Greek, Aramaic, Egyptian, Libyan
Equipment: Composite Bow (exceptional)*, leather armour (good), short sword, small shield, dagger, spear. Light warhorses (2), ten light riding horses. Enc 3/5 stone.


Meshullum is very much a man of his times. A Hellenised Jew who mostly pays lip service to his faith (his native tongue is Greek!) and matured in one of the most modern cities in the world, Alexandria. What's ironic there is that he was born in Tyre, and it was Alexander's siege of that city when he was a small boy that led to him leaving when the civilians were evacuated. Only to then eventually reside in a city built by that same man who destroyed his old one. He's very much the mercenary, money is what motivates him and he doesn't really care who he works for as long as he and his men are paid. He's changed sides more times than he can count, but that's the prerogative of a valuable person like a captain of archers.

You'll also note he is hideously good with a bow, and is an accomplished horse-archer as well as foot-archer. Though his archers are all of the foot variety, some of whom have served on ships. He's also a trainer of archers, and has a little bow-making craft workshop amongst his retinue. Give them the raw materials to work with, and they can churn out units of archers.


Meshullum's retinue:

Talamenes of Krete - a grizzled, hot-tempered, foul-mouthed native of that isle famous for its archers. As ready with an insult as with his sword, and a teller of tall tales, many of which are embellishments of his times with Meshullum.

Abraham - Meshullum's nephew is an accomplished man in his own right, a skilled doctor educated at the renowned Alexandrian school. He is knowledgeable about poisons, herbs and tonics, and is an inducted priest of Asklepios.

Gelon of Krete - an excellent archer and athlete, Gelon is a handsome youth with idealistic dreams of owning his own ship one day. He loves the sea and has served with distinction in a number of naval actions. He has a tempestuous on-again, off-again relationship with Talamenes.

Zeteres - a Numidian hunter turned bandit when his hunting grounds were stripped of game by a passing Carthaginian army. With nothing left to feed his family, he hunted the mercenaries instead, waging a one-man guerilla campaign for several weeks and raiding their supply dumps. When a band of trackers led by Meshulam finally caught up to him, he offered him a job instead of killing him.

Juba - a Libyan mercenary who first sold his skills in Alexandria and served in the Gaza campaign. There he crossed paths with Talamenes, and was one of the first people they looked up when forming this band of archers.

Nefermenu - a native Aegyptian who escaped the crushing poverty of life in his rural village after demonstrating his skill to Meshullum when the captain's unit was passing through. Using a humble self bow he hit five targets dead centre with five arrows. This new life is a grand adventure for him, every day offers many wonders and more regular meals than his old life.


Talamenes. Explorer 3. Move 120’, AC 5/4, HD 3+6, hp 18, Att 7+/6+, Saves: Fort 11+ Ref 12+ Will 15+, Init +3, Mor +4 Dmg: 1d6+6 (bow), 1d6+4 (sword), 1d4+4 (dagger)
Str+2, Int+1, Dex+2, Con+2, Cha+1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Manual of Arms, Precise Shooting, Seafaring, Survival, Tracking, Weapon Focus (bows).
Languages: Doric Greek, Persian, Phoenician.
Equipment: Quilted armour (good), composite bow (good), short sword, dagger, buckler. Enc 3/7 stone.


Abraham. Expert 2. Move 120’, AC 1, HD 2, hp 9, Att 10+/9+, Saves: Fort 13+ Ref 12+ Will 14+, Init +1, Mor +3
Dmg: 1d4 (dagger)
Int+2, Dex+1.
Proficiencies: Alchemy II, Healing* III, Knowledge (philosophy), Knowledge (natural philosophy), Profession (scribe), Theology (priest of Asklepios), Wakefulness.
Languages: Aegyptian, Aramaic, Koine Greek, Hebrew.
Equipment: Well-cut clothing, dagger, medical tools. Enc 2/5 stone.


Gelon of Krete. Fighter 2. Move 150’, AC 5/4, HD 2+2, hp 14, Att 8+/6+, Saves: Fort 12+ Ref 12+ Will 16+, Init +1, Mor +3
Dmg: 1d6+2 (sword), 1d6+2 (bow), 1d4+2 (dagger)
Str+1, Wis-1, Dex+2, Con+1, Cha+1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Craft (bowyer), Fighting Style (missile), Precise Shooting, Running, Seafaring.
Languages: Doric Greek, Phoenician.
Equipment: Quilted armour, composite bow, short sword, dagger, buckler. Enc 4/6 stone.


Zeteres. Explorer 1. Move 120’, AC 2, HD 1+1, hp 7, Att 9+/7+, Saves: Fort 9+ Ref 11+ Will 13+, Init +3, Mor +2
Dmg: 1d6+2 (axe), 1d4+2 (dagger), 1d6+1 (longbow)
Str+1, Dex+2, Con+1, Cha-1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Ambushing, Survival, Tracking.
Languages: Numidian, Koine Greek
Equipment: Longbow, hand axe, dagger. Enc 2/6 stone.


Juba. Fighter 1. Move 120’, AC 3, HD 1, hp 8, Att 9+/8+, Saves: Fort 10+ Ref 12+ Will 14+, Init +0, Mor +2
Dmg: 1d6+2 (sword), 1d4+2 (dagger), 1d6+2 (bow)
Str+1, Wis-1, Dex+1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Craft (bowyer) II, Fighting Style (bow), Precise Shooting.
Languages: Libyan, Koine Greek
Equipment: Leather armour, longbow (good), shortsword, dagger. Enc 4/6 stone.


Nefermenu. Explorer 1. Move 120’, AC n, HD 1+1, hp 7, Att 9+/7+, Saves: Fort 9+ Ref 12+ Will 14+, Init +2, Mor +2
Dmg: 1d6+2 (mace), 1d4+2 (dagger), 1d6+1 (longbow)
Str+1, Int-1, Dex+1, Con+1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Craft (bowyer), Fighting Style (bow), Survival.
Languages: Aegyptian, Koine Greek
Equipment: Longbow, mace, dagger. Enc 2/6 stone.



Septimus

A Latin from central Italia, he is an enterprising man who considers himself the foremost merchant of war in the Hellenistic world. He provided Demetrios with siege equipment during his famous siege of Rhodes. But he is no idealist allied to the Antigonid cause, he goes where the profit is. His retinue comprises agents, savants and a trio of Cilician pirates.

Diplomat 5, Move 120’, AC 7/8, HD 5, hp 18, Att 7+/6+, Saves: Fort 11+ Ref 11+ Will 12+, Init +2, Dmg: 1d6+1 (sword), 1d6+1 (spear), 1d4 (dagger)
Dex+1, Int+3, Wis+1, Cha+3.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Bargaining, Bribery, Diplomacy, Intimidate, Military Strategy, Navigation, Performance (Rhetoric), Profession (Merchant), Riding, Seafaring II, Seduction, Siege Engineering II.
Languages: Latin, Aramaic, Celtic, Iberian, Koine Greek, Phoenican,
Equipment: Scale thorax (exceptional), medium shield, shortsword (exceptional), spear (exceptional), daggers (3). Three light riding horses. Enc 5/5 stone.


Septimus is the means by which the other PCs are pulled into the starting scenario; he's a "merchant of war" (another product of the age) and in that capacity has procured the PCs for Menesthios, a Massalian aristocrat. He's using one of the homebrewed classes, which is built on a Fighter frame, but with Thief-like bits and a load of extra Proficiencies. I think the end result is quite satisfying; he's not a frontline combatant, but nor is he a non-combatant. He relies on his gear (but even moreso his people) to get him through a fight. More than that, though, as we've already seen in the game, he relies on his intellect and silver tongue to negotiate trouble.

His people are a bit of a strange mix. He's got two of the foremost savants, a pair of assassins and a trio of "independent mariners". The latter three are mostly combatant, though they're also useful if he's captaining a ship, since they're a trained sailor and two trained oarsmen. The youngest can even repair ships.


His retinue:

Nyssa - a beautiful Persian woman with the grace of a dancer, many assume she is a courtesan, few suspect she is a killer. Her education and bearing suggest an aristocratic upbringing.

Nikeratos of Kyrene - a half-Libyan philosopher with interests in a wide range of topics, he was a contemporary of Hegesias and Anniceris in the Cyrenaic School, and recently studied under Epicurius in Athens. He claims to hold no allegiance to any particular school of thought, finding both merits and flaws in all. He's one of the few men [Chris' character] has ever met who is able to match wits with him.

Cleandros of Syrakousai - A multi-talented engineer, smith and miner, his large build belies a shining intellect and shrewd appreciation of form, function and value. He and Nikeratos are regular sparring partners in debating the value of a strong body amongst other well-trod areas of contention between them.

Isokrates of Samos - a bland and softly spoken Ionian with a faintly sinister bearing. He has dead eyes that never smile, and while he rarely appears to be armed, he always has at least a couple of daggers secreted away somewhere.

The Cilician Brothers - Actually a trio of cousins from that rugged district in the spurs of the Tauros mountains, they call themselves "independent mariners" though that really means they are pirates.

Kyros - the eldest of the three and the muscle. Not the brightest but more than makes up for it with animal cunning.

Marsyas - the thinker of the trio and the ringleader. A certifiable sneaky bastard and master of doing as little as possible.

Pollio - the youngest "brother" and a natural born follower. Happiest when given easy tasks to complete. Was once apprenticed to a shipwright before falling into crime and piracy with his cousins.


Nyssa. Assassin 3. Move 120’, AC 2 (4), HD 3+3, hp 15, Att 7+, Saves: Fort 12+ Ref 12+ Will 15+, Init +2, Mor +5
Dmg: 1d4+3 (dagger), 1d6+3 (bow)
Str+1, Int+2, Dex+2, Con+1 Cha+2.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Acrobat, Diplomacy, Knowledge (politics), Performance (dancing), Riding, Seduction, Weapon Finesse.
Languages: Aramaic, Ionic Greek, Median, Persian
Equipment: Expensive clothing, quilted linen (good), daggers (2), composite bow. Light warhorse, light riding horse. Enc 2/6 (3/6) stone.


Nikeratos of Kyrene. Expert 2. Move 120’, AC -1, HD 2, hp 6, Att 11+, Saves: Fort 13+ Ref 14+ Will 13+, Init +0, Mor +4
Dmg: 1d3-1 (fist)
Str-1, Int+3, Wis+1, Dex-1.
Proficiencies: Healing II, Knowledge (architecture), Knowledge (astrology), Knowledge (mathematics) II, Knowledge (natural philosophy) II, Knowledge* (philosophy) II, Navigation, Theology.
Languages: Aegyptian, Aramaic, Libyan, Koine Greek, Nubian.
Equipment: Clothing, scrolls, various implements and tools. Enc 1/4 stone.


Cleandros of Syrakousai. Expert 2. Move 120’, AC 1, HD 2, hp 9, Att 8+/10+, Saves: Fort 13+ Ref 13+ Will 13+, Init +1, Mor +4
Dmg: 1d6+2 (hammer)
Str+2, Int+2, Wis+1.
Proficiencies: Craft (smith) II, Engineering* IV, Knowledge (mathematics), Labour (miner), Land Surveying, Siege Engineering II.
Languages: Doric Greek, Iberian, Oscan, Sicel.
Equipment: Leather work vest, tools, big hammer. Enc 2/5 stone.


Isokrates of Samos. Assassin 1. Move 120’, AC 3, HD 1, hp 6, Att 8+, Saves: Fort 14+ Ref 13+ Will 16+, Init +2, Mor +3
Dmg: 1d4+3 (dagger), 1d6+1 (sling)
Str+2, Int+1, Dex+2.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Bribery, Climbing, Disguise, Mimicry.
Languages: Aramaic, Ionic Greek, Persian
Equipment: Common clothing, bronze pectoral, daggers (2), sling. Enc 2/5 stone.


Kyros. Fighter 1. Move 120’, AC 5/6, HD 1+1, hp 9, Att 8+/9+, Saves: Fort 13+ Ref 14+ Will 15+, Init +2, Mor +3
Dmg: 1d6+4 (sword), 1d4+4 (dagger), 1d6+2 (javelin), 1d6+1 (sling).
Str+2, Int-1, Wis+1, Dex+1, Con+1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Fighting Style (weapon and shield), Intimidation, Labour (oarsman), Weapon Focus (swords and daggers).
Languages: Cilician, Koine Greek
Equipment: Quilted linen, small shield, shortsword, dagger, javelins (3), sling. Enc 4/6 stone.


Marsyas. Fighter 1. Move 120’, AC 6/7, HD 1, hp 8, Att 9+, Saves: Fort 14+ Ref 14+ Will 16+, Init +1, Mor +3
Dmg: 1d6+2 (sword), 1d4+2 (dagger), 1d6+1 (javelin), 1d6+1 (sling).
Str+1, Int+2, Dex+1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Diplomacy, Gambling, Fighting Style (weapon and shield), Seafaring, Signalling (naval flags), Swashbuckling.
Languages: Cilician, Koine Greek, Phoenician, Phrygian.
Equipment: Quilted linen, small shield, shortsword, dagger, javelins (3), sling. Enc 4/5 stone.


Pollio. Fighter 1. Move 120’, AC 5/6, HD 1, hp 8, Att 9+, Saves: Fort 14+ Ref 14+ Will 16+, Init +1, Mor +3
Dmg: 1d6+3 (sword), 1d4+3 (dagger), 1d6+1 (javelin), 1d6+1 (sling).
Str+1, Dex+1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Craft (shipwright), Fighting Style (weapon and shield), Labour (oarsman), Weapon Focus (swords and daggers).
Languages: Cilician, Koine Greek
Equipment: Quilted linen, small shield, shortsword, dagger, javelins (3), sling. Enc 4/5 stone.



Philipos

A giant of a man from Macedon, he was a hypaspist like his father before him, wearing a fortune in heirloom armour purchased with Persian plunder. On the battlefield he is bronze god of war, almost impervious to harm. He was on the losing side at Ipsus, but came away with his honour intact. His retinue comprises his closest companions; Greek officers, a dubious Ionian, his valet and his nephew.

Fighter 5, Move 90’, AC 10/12, HD 5, hp 39, Att 3*+/7+, Saves: Fort 8+ Ref 12+ Will 13+, Init +0
Dmg: 1d6+7 (spear), 1d6+6 (battleaxe), 1d4+5 (dagger), sling (1d6+2).
Str+3, Con+3, Int +1, Cha +1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Alertness, Command, Endurance, Fighting Style (Weapon and Shield), Manual of Arms II, Military Strategy, Riding, Weapon Focus (Spear).
Languages: Attic Greek, Koine Greek, Thracian
Equipment: Hoplite panoply (exceptional), spear (exceptional)*, large shield, battleaxe (Exceptional)*, dagger, sling. Enc 9/10 stone.


There's a double-joke in this character's name. Firstly, that it's also the player's name. Secondly, that it was a ridiculously common name for Macedonians (along with Alexandros and Amyntas) which we might highlight as our own bit of in-game humour from time to time. He's the brick, the frontline fighter who kicks ass and takes names, and for the player it's a rare opportunity not to play a missile-/magic-focused sort (Angran Meithelas, Kane, Hafunail, et al). He's another aristocrat with a sense of honour, so along with Rhyanidd balance out the more amoral tendencies of Meshullum and Septimus.

His people (barring Lysagoras, of course) are the heavy infantry of the group, they'd make up the core of any recruited phalanx, with Philipos himself in the centre of the front rank. They could also serve as heavy cavalry in a pinch.


His retinue:

Eumenes of Athens - An exile who spent most of the last two decades serving Antigonous, he is a learned and cultured man. As an aristocrat he strives to be a gentleman and maintain a decorous and proper bearing. In keeping with the oldest tradition of the cradle of Hellas, he is also a fearsome warrior who dedicates a great deal of time to keeping his skills honed. He stands on Philipos' right in the battle line.

Deon of Miletos - Bastard son of a Milesian aristocrat with one of his house slaves, Deon was raised with his half-brothers and freed when they went off to fight in the many wars raging across Asia Minor. He survived the campaiging, they did not, and unable to face going home to Miletus chose to sell his services instead. Philipos dragged him out the bottom of a bowl of wine and gave him a reason to live. He stands on Philipos' left in the battle line.

Lysagoras of Ephesus - An enterprising Ionian with a talent for the nefarious and illicit, Lysagoras attached himself to Philip early on and realised he would prosper if he continued to make himself useful. He can be totally unassuming and has a talent for getting information and goods no matter where he is. While nominally the quartermaster for the retinue, he also turns his hand to spymaster, fence, interrogator and schemer-in-chief.

Herakleides - A Thessalian mercenary taken captive when Philip was a boy, he served as a groom and riding instructor. With advancing age and the trust of the family, he became Philip's valet and body slave, though the years haven't weakened his spear arm. He fights in the second rank.

Anaxiteles - A youth of sixteen years, he is already bigger than most fully-grown men and promises one day to be of a size with his uncle Philip. He serves as shieldbearer and fights in the second rank.


Eumenes of Athens. Fighter 3. Move 90’, AC 10/12, HD 3+6, hp 22, Att 7+/8+, Saves: Fort 11+ Ref 13+ Will 15+, Init +1, Mor +5
Dmg: 1d6+6 (spear), 1d6+5 (sword), 1d4+4 (dagger), 1d6+5 (javelin)
Str+2, Int+1, Dex+1, Con+2, Cha+1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Diplomacy, Fighting Style (weapon and shield), Knowledge (philosophy), Pankration, Performance (rhetoric), Riding, Weapon Focus (spear).
Languages: Attic Greek, Persian, Phrygian
Equipment: Hoplite panoply (good), large shield, spear (good), short sword (good), dagger, javelins (2). Medium war horse, light riding horse. Enc 9/9 stone.


Deon of Miletos. Fighter 2. Move 90’, AC 7/9, HD 2+2, hp 14, Att 7+/9+, Saves: Fort 12+ Ref 14+ Will 14+, Init +1, Mor +4
Dmg: 1d6+3 (spear), 1d6+3 (sword), 1d4+3 (dagger), 1d6+3 (javelin)
Str+2, Wis+1, Con+1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Endurance, Intimidation, Pankration, Riding, Weapon Focus (spear).
Languages: Ionic Greek, Aramaic
Equipment: Scale thorax (good), greaves and helmet, large shield, spear, short sword, dagger, javelins (2). Enc 8/8 stone.


Lysagoras of Ephesus. Expert 2. Move 120’, AC n, HD 2, hp 9, Att 10+/9+, Saves: Fort 13+ Ref 12+ Will 14+, Init +1, Mor +4
Dmg: 1d4+1 (dagger)
Int+2, Dex+1, Cha+1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Bargaining, Bribery, Diplomacy, Disguise, Eavesdropping, Knowledge (political economy), Lip Reading, Mimicry, Profession (steward) II.
Languages: Ionic Greek, Persian, Phoenician, Phrygian
Equipment: Fine clothes, hidden dagger (good). Enc 1/5 stone.


Herakleides. Fighter 1. Move 120’, AC 6/7, HD 1+1, hp 9, Att 8+/10+, Saves: Fort 13+ Ref 15+ Will 15+, Init +1, Mor +3
Dmg: 1d6+4 (spear), 1d4+3 (dagger), 1d6+3 (javelin)
Str+2, Wis+1, Con+1.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Animal Husbandry, Fighting Style (weapon and shield), Riding, Weapon Focus (spear).
Languages: Aeolic Greek, Thracian.
Equipment: Quilted armour, greaves and helmet, medium shield, spear, javelin, dagger. Enc 6/6 stone.


Anaxiteles. Fighter 1. Move 90’, AC 8/10, HD 1+2, hp 10, Att 8+/10+, Saves: Fort 12+ Ref 15+ Will 16+, Init +0, Mor +3
Dmg: 1d6+3 (spear/sword), 1d4+3 (dagger)
Str+2, Con+2.
Proficiencies: Seasoned Campaigner, Endurance, Fighting Style (Weapon and shield), Pankration, Riding.
Languages: Koine Greek, Thracian.
Equipment: Scale thorax, greaves and helmet, large shield, spear, shortsword, dagger. Enc 8/9 stone.

SiuiS
2013-06-08, 08:44 AM
Interesting. What is a Warlord? I also note she has 13 proficiencies. How many Re class based? And were you not the one who allowed training in proficiencies via time and money with a tutor?

Kiero
2013-06-08, 08:51 AM
Interesting. What is a Warlord? I also note she has 13 proficiencies. How many Re class based? And were you not the one who allowed training in proficiencies via time and money with a tutor?

The Warlord is a custom class (http://wiki.rpg.net/index.php/Tyche%27s_Favourites/New_Classes) based mostly on the Aristocrat (http://www.autarch.co/forums/house-rules/aristocrat).

Yes; she has high Int, gets a bunch free from her class, and in my game everyone gets a Proficiency every level (alternating General/Class). She got Command and three Class Proficiencies of her choice.

No, I've got no rule about training with time and money.