An Optimizer Is You! [3.5]

[WhatThePhysics]

Removed by author.

[thethird]

Are we talking about practical optimization or theoretical optimization? Because candles of invocation are core and if the party is formed by at least 4 people affordable without tricks. With one candle one can create an infinite loop of wishes and of gates...

[eggynack]

It seems pretty obvious to me that the answer is druid. They operate perfectly fine in core, and they're not really overtaken by wizards until after level 10. I'd probably use the classic combination of some summoning, some metamagic, and maybe a craft wondrous item if there's room. The feat list would probably look something like 1:spell focus conjuration, 3:augment summoning, 6:natural spell, 9:extend spell, and maybe human: craft wondrous item.

Edit: Thethird is correct though, that in the realm of TO candles of invocation would just win the game. Challenge complete. If we're sticking to practical optimization, that druid build should work fine.

[eggynack]

I don't see the difference between the two.

Candles of Invocation are not available, since they require a crafter with an ECL above 10.
The difference between the two is that in TO you can rely on crazy combos and ridiculousness of that kind. It's the kind of stuff that you'd never actually play in a game, although the line is probably different for everyone. Pun-pun is the classic example of TO. There's other TO stuff in core too, like dust of sneezing and choking, and probably some other stuff I'm not thinking about. Tippy probably knows a bunch of ways to utterly break the game within these parameters.

[thethird]

Some tricks can be found here (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19862850/The_Final_3.5_Project:_Destroying_the_Core). Alternatively focus on core skills, handle animal and diplomacy are SO broken.

[eggynack]

Some tricks can be found here (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19862850/The_Final_3.5_Project:_Destroying_the_Core). Alternatively focus on core skills, handle animal and diplomacy are SO broken.
Ooh, druids have handle animal and diplomacy on their list. I think the only other classes that have both are paladins and experts, and there's certainly no better class in core with both. Druids are so frigging sweet.

[ahenobarbi]

Human Wizard 5/ Red Wizard 5. Safely accumulate XP till I hit level 10 and get to abuse Leadership + Circle magic.

[eggynack]

Human Wizard 5/ Red Wizard 5. Safely accumulate XP till I hit level 10 and get to abuse Leadership + Circle magic.
Huh. I did not know that was in core. Well, there ya go. Crazy circle magic shenanigans ahoy.

[ahenobarbi]

Huh. I did not know that was in core. Well, there ya go. Crazy circle magic shenanigans ahoy.

Only problem is I forgot I can't do this as generalist. So

Diviner Wizard 5/Red Wizard 5

I'd drop enchantment (because everyone and their grandma will have Protection from Evil 24/7) and illusion ("ban" - I just need to get spells I want from that school before becoming Red Wizard. And Illusion seems to have fewest good core spells at levels 4&5).

[Vaz]

Rule number 7 seems inexplicably harsh.

[eggynack]

Rule number 7 seems inexplicably harsh.
I agree. It's a great game, but it's not worth murdering someone over.

[ahenobarbi]

Rule number 7 seems inexplicably harsh.

I hope there is a real world player, who controls in-game "player" who plays a game by controlling a "character" and rule 7 means that in-game "player" dies.

[SouthpawSoldier]

Rule number 7 seems inexplicably harsh.

I can see the reason behind rule &, but I agree. Maybe instead of dying outright, their psyche snaps a bit. Turn them into a character that's a hodgepodge of A Scanner Darkly, Vanellope von Schweetz from Wreckit Ralph, and if the're still a ghost, make em a poltergheist. Just a suggestion, but I really like the concept.

[olentu]

I agree. It's a great game, but it's not worth murdering someone over.

Yeah that's taking the whole trapped in the game thing a little bit too far.

[Sith_Happens]

@OP
I think Vaz and eggynack are jokingly interpreting rule 7 to be that the (OOC) players die in real life, not that the (IC) "players" die in "real life."

Speaking of which, how does rule 7 interact with resurrection magic? Is the "spirit"/ghost in this case treated as the soul for the purpose of whether it's willing/able to return (in which case you can be brought back as long as you're still "alive" in ghost form)?

[ahenobarbi]

@OP
I think Vaz and eggynack are jokingly interpreting rule 7 to be that the (OOC) players die in real life, not that the (IC) "players" die in "real life."

Speaking of which, how does rule 7 interact with resurrection magic? Is the "spirit"/ghost in this case treated as the soul for the purpose of whether it's willing/able to return (in which case you can be brought back as long as you're still "alive" in ghost form)?

Guessing from how it worked in the show referenced in the OP you resurrect-series spells would work normally when cast on folks who dies and remained in "etheral", wouldn't work on those who died again after returning from "etheral" as ghosts and died again. I'm not sure about those who returned from "etheral" as ghosts but didn't die after that.