monstrous humanoid class skills?

[pyromanser244]

I'm looking to play an anthropomorphic giant octopus (2HD) and I can't find where the class skill for the HD are. anybody know how to figure this out?

[nedz]

Working this out is always tricky, lets try shall we.

Str 20, Dex 15, Con 13, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 3
Skills: Escape Artist +12, Hide +12, Listen +4, Spot +6, Swim +13

Skills

A giant octopus can change colors, giving it a +4 racial bonus on Hide checks. A giant octopus also can squeeze and contort its body, giving it a +10 racial bonus on Escape Artist checks. A giant octopus has a +8 racial bonus on any Swim check to perform some special action or avoid a hazard. It can always choose to take 10 on a Swim check, even if distracted or endangered. It can use the run action while swimming, provided it swims in a straight line.


Escape Artist (Racial +10 Dex +2) = +12 => 0 Skill points
Hide (Racial +4 Dex +2) = +12 => 6 Skill points
Listen (Wis +1) = +4 => 3 Skill points
Spot (Wis +1) = +6 => 5 Skill points
Swim (Racial +8 Str +5) +13 => 0 Skill points


With Int 1 and 8 HD we had 11 skill points to play with, of which we have spent 14. Now if Listen and Spot were CC we would have spent 22 skill points and I'm guessing Int was ignored here (Yet another Dysfunctional Stat Block).

So Hide is a Class skill.

I would say Escape Artist and Swim are likely, but you need to talk to your DM since the rules are silent.

[Yora]

Apparently it seems that in 3.5e, creature types don't have class skill lists. It only says "All listed skills are class skills, unless the creature has a character class (noted in the entry)."

Since there is no regular antropomorhic octopus anywhere written down, the class skills would be everything you put skill ranks in at the racial Hit Dice levels.

Or you take the class skills of the already existing octopus creature. Which would be the same that nedz listed.

[nedz]

Since there is no regular anthropomorphic octopus anywhere written down, the class skills would be everything you put skill ranks in at the racial Hit Dice levels.

This would be an awesome exploit.

Get yourself lots of skill-points.
Put one into each of a number of skills.
Suddenly lots of class skills

[Urpriest]

This would be an awesome exploit.

Get yourself lots of skill-points.
Put one into each of a number of skills.
Suddenly lots of class skills


"You" here means the DM, not the player.

Anyway, skills are explicitly same as the base creature, so you keep the same class skills. For an Octopus these are Escape Artist, Hide, Listen, Spot, and Swim. A creature gets skills as class skills if they are mentioned in its entry, they don't need to have ranks in them. (Though in practice synergy bonuses will only sometimes work. Racial bonuses always work, though, so the Octopus is fine).

By the way, a Giant Octopus has Skill Focus(Hide) and Alertness, which should account for your extra skill points (as well as the -4 to Hide from being Large).

[nedz]

By the way, a Giant Octopus has Skill Focus(Hide) and Alertness, which should account for your extra skill points (as well as the -4 to Hide from being Large).

Aahh, that's what I missed — I did say that it was tricky.

Lets try again


Escape Artist (Racial +10 Dex +2) = +12 => 0 Skill points
Hide (Racial +4 Dex +2 Skill Focus +3 Large -4) = +12 => 7 Skill points
Listen (Wis +1 Alertness +2) = +4 => 1 Skill point
Spot (Wis +1 Alertness +2) = +6 => 3 Skill points
Swim (Racial +8 Str +5) +13 => 0 Skill points

Total 11 Skill points

[pyromanser244]

so reverse engineer the base creature to figure out where they put the skill points. thanks for the help. you guys are awesome!:smallcool:

[Urpriest]

so reverse engineer the base creature to figure out where they put the skill points. thanks for the help. you guys are awesome!:smallcool:

It's not just that, though. You get Swim and Escape Artist as class skills, even though a typical Giant Octopus has no ranks in them, because you have a racial bonus and thus it's listed in the statblock. Relevant rule:


Level Adjustment and Effective Character Level

To determine the effective character level (ECL) of a monster character, add its level adjustment to its racial Hit Dice and character class levels.

Use ECL instead of character level to determine how many experience points a monster character needs to reach its next level. Also use ECL to determine starting wealth for a monster character.

Monster characters treat skills mentioned in their monster entry as class skills.

If a monster has 1 Hit Die or less, or if it is a template creature, it must start the game with one or more class levels, like a regular character. If a monster has 2 or more Hit Dice, it can start with no class levels (though it can gain them later).

Even if the creature is of a kind that normally advances by Hit Dice rather than class levels a PC can gain class levels rather than Hit Dice.

There are a bunch of examples discussed in the posts following my Monster Handbook if you're curious.

[nedz]

It's not just that, though. You get Swim and Escape Artist as class skills, even though a typical Giant Octopus has no ranks in them, because you have a racial bonus and thus it's listed in the statblock. Relevant rule:.

Yes, I was wrong on that point. It's also in the Monster Section:Reading The Monster Entries


Skills[/B]]

... All listed skills are class skills, unless the creature has a character class (noted in the entry). A creature’s type and Intelligence score determine the number of skill points it has.