Defending one's base from zombies

[NM020110]

Alright, for an upcoming zombie survival game my group will be located in a warehouse. The enemies will be l4d style zombies, led by a thinker.

We are level 3. I will be an artificer, focusing a fair bit on item crafting and terrain improvement. It looks like we will have a barbarian, a warlock, and an unknown as the other members of the party. After crafting everlasting rations for the party, my craft reserve is nearly empty.

Given the circumstances, what would the playground suggest be brought to aid survival?

[Juntao112]

Lots of slippery oil.

[zlefin]

a turning specialist cleric? In anti-undead campaigns turning specialized clerics just blow the undead to pieces quite well; even the stronger ones.

[ArcturusV]

Yeah, barring Cleric? I'd say a Handy Skill Monkey. Someone who has ranks in Disable Device and various Craftings. Use it to alter the warehouse lay out, make traps, etc. Battlefield control of a mundane variety (And with typically more endurance at 3rd level).

[NM020110]

I suspect that is what the fourth player will bring, but I am unsure.

Unfortunately, slippery oil looks to be from the dragon magazine, so I'm not too certain of its availability. I'll be sure to ask, though.

Thank you for the suggestions. I look forward to hearing more.

Edit@ArcturusV: That's basically my job. I've got that covered fairly well, I hope.

[Emperor Tippy]

Some scrolls of Wall of Stone (at minimum CL it gives you 45 squares) to wall you in nice and safe?

[Gildedragon]

An magic item of consecrate

[SciChronic]

A Decanter of Endless water, but make it holy water? that would prove very hilarious as an undead fighting weapon.

But in all seriousness, as a level 3, controlling the terrain will be the most important part. Being able to create a reliable bottleneck will play a huge factor. because if you do second is a way to patch up the PCs reliably, cause if they act L4D style you guys are going to take hits. Have everyone get a Healing Belt (MIC) its only 750GP and has the potential to heal 6d8 every day.

[llamamushroom]

While not the most practical of methods for you, I believe that this may be relevant to your interests: the SilverClawShift Campaign Archives (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=116836?), specifically the first tale.

On topic, though, it looks like you guys have got yourselves sorted. How long do you expect to be holed up in there, though? Will wear and tear on weapons become an issue?

[Waitingnomad]

Seconded on the healing belt, those things are invaluable. Provided you are allowed time to wonder around a bit and buy provisions, you can acquire holy water for free (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Holy_Water) from good-aligned temples, as they hand it out to help the fight against evil. If this option is available, stock up on as much free holy water as you can carry.

Protection from Evil is a 1st level spell, and Disrupt Undead is a cantrip, so any party casters should have these. Items that increase turning for your party cleric/paladin like the Ephod of Authority, Knowledge: Religion Synergy etc. will also be helpful, and Clerics/Paladins can Destroy Undead (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Turn_or_Rebuke_Undead#Destroying_Undead) with good turn attempts.

[Lord Vukodlak]

At third level there isn't a lot you can do except built fortifications and whack them down. Now as these are Left 4 Dead style zombies they aren't actually undead right? so there would be no resistances to piercing and slashing weapons. So trying to identify the thinker and taking him down with a ranged weapon should be a high priority.

Presuming these actually are Left 4 Dead style zombies then we're dealing with infected humans so hopefully the majority of the horde is going to be commoners which should be fairly easy to take out in mass especially if the Barbarian has great cleave.(he'd have to be human and have spent all his feats but in this situation it be worth it).

You'll want your walls smooth and at least ten feet tall so they don't easily climb over. At the bottom I'd have spikes sticking out so hopefully a few will impale themselves before even starting to climb over. But that set up depends on how much time you have to build this fortification.

Intentionally creating a bottleneck littered with crap to make the terrain difficult could also be useful. Let them funnel themselves into a narrow corridor where the Barbarian can chop them down one or two at a time. With the cleric at his side or directly behind wielding a reach weapon.

Beware of any NPC's with you, in most zombie films its the infighting between the survivors that leads to every one's downfall.


Provided you are allowed time to wonder around a bit and buy provisions, you can acquire holy water for free from good-aligned temples at cost not free. And the damage isn't high enough to justify its use on a zombie. Its best for undead you'd otherwise have trouble damaging at all. But of course these are Left 4 Dead creatures so they might not be undead at all.

[supermonkeyjoe]

Lots of illusions of the figment and glamer type, these are not mind affecting so effect the zombies as normal, being mindless they have no capacity to disbelieve the illusions.

Assuming they work as normal normal zombies but faster, otherwise your DM could easily nix this tactic.

[Waitingnomad]

You could pick up the Chain Spell metamagic feat and cast Chain Disrupt Undead using 2nd Level slots? The Undead aren't known for their reflex saves.
That said, in terms of save-or-X spells, the undead are immune to anything requiring a fort save, have no Con score to be damaged and usually have high Will saves, so bear that in mind when your party selects their spells.
You may also wish to purchase some wands of CLW to use as shotguns and call them your boom sticks. Undead are harmed by positive energy and its too cool to pass up- not to mention you can heal party members with them.

You could also consider arranging your fortifications to 'funnel' the zombies into a specific area and bottleneck them, as discussed before. To build on this, trap the area, surround it with murder holes and other fortification designs intended to maximise your ability to rain death on the undead while limiting their ability to attack all but your tank/s. On the subject of traps, one of your party members could consider picking up the Craft Wondrous Item feat, and building traps of CLW cost (500gp x CL) + (40XP x CL) +500 (for the trap to be automatically resetting), with the creator deciding the CL he casts the spell at (providing it isn't lower than 1, the CL of CLW). Furthermore, according to RAW, you can construct Disrupt Undead traps at no cost, as the rules for magical traps are cost = 500gp x CL x Spell Level + 40XP x CL x Spell Level, and Disrupt Undead is 0th level. This isn't including the 500gp cost for a resetting trap, of course, but for non-resetting traps the formula is the same, but with 50gp and 4XP instead of 500 and 40, so the logic is the same.


at cost not free. And the damage isn't high enough to justify its use on a zombie sorry, didn't read the page thoroughly. You're right, it's not really a cost-effective solution.

[NM020110]

Wall of stone looks good, though expensive. I'll see if one can be afforded.

I expect us to be holed up for a long, long time. Food and water have an indefinite solution in place, so it is a question of how long it takes the zombies to drive us out. I'm trying to make the base so fortified that they never will.

If equipment wear becomes an issue, I'll deal with it.

Heavily noted on the healing belt. I'll be suggesting that party members buy them immediately.

Unfortunately, I rather doubt that there will be anyone other than the occasional wanderer to buy from. I intend to deconstruct nearby buildings for materials, and most items will likely be made by me.

I'm fairly sure the barbarian went human and spent all his feats on armor, so no go there. I should be able to stick him in front of a bottleneck filled with barbed wire, caltrops, and marbles just fine if it comes to that.

I'll see about testing illusions, if the opportunity comes. If it does, a few permanent illusions will be in order.

I'm fairly sure that disrupt undead will be treated as a .5 level spell for that purpose, sadly.

Thank you all for your help! Hopefully we can hold out...

[Lord Vukodlak]

I'm fairly sure that disrupt undead will be treated as a .5 level spell for that purpose, sadly.

You are correct sir, 0-level spells are treated as .5 for item creation purposes. That aside you said these are Left 4 Dead style zombies right? Doesn't that mean they aren't actually undead.

However presuming they are "undead" the cost of the trap is only 250gp.

[Waitingnomad]

Hmm must have missed that bit. I'm off form today:smallbiggrin: Nonetheless, its still a useful and relatively inexpensive trap.

I'm unfamiliar with the L4D style zombies though- is there a special homebrew template for this, or is it custom for your game? I gather they don't have normal undead traits if they're just infected/mutated humans- does this mean that they don't have the same fort save immunities, or lack of Con score?

[NM020110]

Reading back through for the quote, it was:

...a mix of walking dead, left4dead,and dead space.

I'm guessing that they're going to be homebrewed.

[Renen]

Wasn't there some Prc that could just sanctify areas for turning attempt or something?

[Coidzor]

So 2/3 undead... Possibly something like an undead equivalent to a warforged then.

Bottlenecks causing them to clump together for burst damage effects and to let your meatshield 300 them and some kind of puzzling situation that would force the thinker to show its hand so that you can ID it and take it out before it can mess with your plans and fortifications too much.

[Maginomicon]

Lock and bar the door, board up the windows, put large heavy objects in front of everything you've barred/boarded up.


Because of their utter lack of intelligence, the instructions given to a newly created zombie must be very simple.

Even with a "thinker", zombies have no intelligence score. They may scrabble to clamber up walls, but if it's a warehouse you've probably got crates to spare. Any of the above-mentioned impenetrable defenses will be infinitely-effective on choke points. Picking out the thinker would be pretty obvious then wouldn't it? It's the guy that's not doing the same thing as all the mindless zombies.

[Slipperychicken]

If they can't climb ladders, just get higher ground so they can't reach.

If you can make Bear Traps (they have stats in Pathfinder), those things are brutal. Swing at +10 for 2d6+3, AND lockdown for only 2gp?! And zombies aren't exactly known for thwarting traps either. Stuff a bunch of those in your bottleneck along with the marbles and caltrops, and laugh.

[Waitingnomad]

You could try turning the ground of the bottleneck to thick mud, and/or making it go uphill to mimic greased terrain?


If they can't climb ladders, just get higher ground so they can't reach.
This. Either situate your base a story up and use retractable rope ladders or designate higher levels as secondary and tertiary fallbacks once initial defences fail. That way you can thin the hoarde out in the bottleneck, putting your melee party members to good use whilst the ranged team attack from above, then if the melee team are getting pushed back they can retreat to the higher levels and pull up the ladder.

Maybe include a secondary method of sealing off the bottleneck, like a portcullis, to either lure the zombies into a 'killzone' then shutting the rest of the hoarde off whilst you deal with them in manageable sections (perhaps with one or more of the ranged group keeping the larger hoarde at bay). The portcullis(es?) could also be dropped during a retreat to keep the hoarde from killing off your melee team as they escape to the higher levels. A portcullis or series of portcullises may also be a viable method for melee members to engage the hoarde without incurring significant risk, as they can attack the zombies with spears and other long weapons through the gaps in the portcullis. Whilst the others attack from above with spells/ arrows/ holy water etc.

[SciChronic]

keep in mind that if you guys are going to be fighting for days, even with shifts, your party is going to likely become exhausted or fatigued due to constant fear of your defenses failing while you sleep.

[JaronK]

The Unseen Crafter spell (level 2) gives you craftsmen that work tirelessly for your class level in days. Cast it a few times in preparation and have them build up fortifications such as earthwork berms, barricades, and so on.

JaronK

[NM020110]

I'm not aware of that prc. I'll look into it.

I'll keep a heavy crossbow handy to try and take out the thinker. About our luck, though, the DM will give them a mile range hive mind...

If we were facing bog standard zombies exclusively, we'd be on the roof with crossbows and call it a day, I think. Given that, I'd call it a safe assumption that we'll be facing a lot more than that.

I'll look into various falling wall type traps for breaking up the horde. With any luck, the warehouse will have a fairly large door that can be put in working order to use.

As for fatigue, with a rotating watch, a few traps that make plenty of noise, and a reasonably secure sleeping space, we should be good.

[Waitingnomad]

keep in mind that if you guys are going to be fighting for days, even with shifts, your party is going to likely become exhausted or fatigued due to constant fear of your defenses failing while you sleep.

Very good point- do you have any idea how your DM is going to handle this? Not being able to get decent rest in will completely cripple the spellcaster classes. That said, I can't recommend Rope Trick enough. Casting Alarm or Magic Mouth on potential breach points might also be a good idea to give you enough warning to prepare in the event of a breach of your fortifications. This could be the difference between life and death if you're caught sleeping.

[Phelix-Mu]

If at least some of the zombies are as stupid as the typical zombies, then I always find highly reflective surfaces amusing ways to distract zombies. Nothing quite so humourous as a series of polished metal surfaces creating a hall of mirrors effect, and having zombies try to use target discrimination while operating on a negligible number of brain cells.

Really, any tricks that might work on animals should have excellent results on zombies, even if the zombies have limited learning abilities. Decoy bodies that conceal traps, covered pit traps, blind corners with slippery terrain, walls/curtain effects that block line of sight, etc.

Fill some ditches with tripping obstacles (or green slime/other deadly critters), and then force the zombies to stand in the ditch while they try to climb a wall immediately beyond the ditch. The first zombies tumble/climb down into the ditch, and while they are attempting to climb the wall, other zombies come forward and attempt to stand on the zombies in the ditch. Antics follow. Toss vials of burning oil over the wall (or have the ditch have a bit of oil in it; once the zombies are crawling all over each other and marinating in lamp oil, light it up).

Might also be worth investing in caltrops, or that item that is a bag that always has more caltrops in it.

[DMVerdandi]

Here is another tip, Try to invest in trapsmith spells. Most of them are in the PHB, but they cast at lower levels. For example, wall of stone is level 3 for them, and level 5 for wiz/sor. Fabricate is also a good spell for making something out of something else.

Also, the spell "rope trick" will definitely come in handy.

Unfortunately, the Artificer's crafting cannot really shine at level 3.

For it's Infusions, Spell storing item, and Weapon Augmentation are your friends.
Bane(Zed-words) will keep you doing really high damage to them.

[NM020110]

Bear traps were approved, and I have enough craft skills to get them at 1/3rd price. Thank you for the suggestion.

I'll probably bring a few-hundred pounds of caltrops. Against a horde of (hopefully) low hp enemies, a field of caltrops will be a daunting challenge while the barbed wire goes up.

I'll definitely be looking for trapsmith spells. That sounds like just the thing needed to level the playing field a bit.

I'm not sure how well we can access rope trick, since it doesn't look like there'll be a wizard with us.

For infusions, the DM agreed that I could make the material components using craft(alchemy), which should help costs.

[Fyermind]

use thrown weapons for ranged attackers so you don't run out of arrows. The best bottle necks aren't the kind that funnel enemies to you with solid objects, but the ones that funnel enemies to you do to lack of objects. If you can fight from catwalks, that would be ideal.

Using that, traps are your best friend. If you can flip a 10' section of catwalk over when it is holding zombies causing them to fall to the ground, you are doing the right thing.

Resetting or resetable traps are probably some of the better investments.

Edit: try to make sure the zombies don't just try to break your structure by dealing damage to it. usually leaving a path that will get to you is enough to avoid this.

[Mithril Leaf]

Make sure you've got a warforged party member. Warforged in a zombie apocalypse are quite likely the best possible situation. No need to eat or sleep, can work indefinitely, immune to disease. If you are a warforged, you get another 8 hours of working time for crafting. Warforged scouts are also pretty great for scouting types.

[Slipperychicken]

Bear traps were approved, and I have enough craft skills to get them at 1/3rd price. Thank you for the suggestion.


Apply auto-reset and put it somewhere zombies like to stand or smash your barricades.

Not exactly broken. The things are still 10 pounds each (good luck carrying it to the next base) and they only hit the walkers, but they're cheap and you can plausibly make them out of scraps.

[Norin]

Hmm, insted of destroying them, have a dread necro in the party an just control all the zombies instead!! Muahahaaa! :smalltongue:

[Kaeso]

You're defending a base, aren't you? That should be easier in the Middle Ages (or a setting like that) than in the modern day world actually. Unless your zombies work differently from what is usually considered mainstream, zombies can neither swim nor climb. A fortress with a moat and high walls should be enough to keep the zombies outside and the good folk inside. Once in a while the cavalry (the PC's) can ride out to mop up some of the zombies that have gathered outside or get supplies (though if you have a cleric, you can get food and water through magical means. Sprinkle a bit of prestidigation over it for flavor) and you should be able to outlast the zombies.

EDIT: Oh, and you can get a few bored peasants on the walls plinking away at the zombies with their crossbows. Crossbows are simple weapons and there's zero risk for the peasants involved as long as they stay on the walls. After a while they might actually start seeing it as a game!

[AWiz_Abroad]

Heck, get yourself a warlock. Infinite blasting potential, and doesn't need no pesky 8 hrs to recover, and 1 to prepare spells. (Fatigue and exhaustion of course are a different story).

[Slipperychicken]

EDIT: Oh, and you can get a few bored peasants on the walls plinking away at the zombies with their crossbows. Crossbows are simple weapons and there's zero risk for the peasants involved as long as they stay on the walls. After a while they might actually start seeing it as a game!

Spending all day doing a repetitive task involving death can numb a person's emotions and inflict psychological damage after a while. Hopefully you can get other forms of amusement and give them regular breaks or days off.

You can find real-world accounts from/about guys in the early 20th century who's job was to run down a line smashing cows' heads in with a sledgehammer all day. This was long before workplace reforms like lunch breaks, safety codes, and the 8-hour workday, so it would reflect the kinds of conditions the PCs would impose.

[Lord Vukodlak]

You're defending a base, aren't you? That should be easier in the Middle Ages (or a setting like that) than in the modern day world actually. Unless your zombies work differently from what is usually considered mainstream, zombies can neither swim nor climb.

The zombies can both swim and climb.

[Gavinfoxx]

Left 4 Dead zombies aren't just good climbers, they have a climb speed...

[SciChronic]

You're defending a base, aren't you? That should be easier in the Middle Ages (or a setting like that) than in the modern day world actually. Unless your zombies work differently from what is usually considered mainstream, zombies can neither swim nor climb. A fortress with a moat and high walls should be enough to keep the zombies outside and the good folk inside. Once in a while the cavalry (the PC's) can ride out to mop up some of the zombies that have gathered outside or get supplies (though if you have a cleric, you can get food and water through magical means. Sprinkle a bit of prestidigation over it for flavor) and you should be able to outlast the zombies.

if you had read the original post, they are defending a warehouse, not a medieval castle.

[Tvtyrant]

Alright, for an upcoming zombie survival game my group will be located in a warehouse. The enemies will be l4d style zombies, led by a thinker.

We are level 3. I will be an artificer, focusing a fair bit on item crafting and terrain improvement. It looks like we will have a barbarian, a warlock, and an unknown as the other members of the party. After crafting everlasting rations for the party, my craft reserve is nearly empty.

Given the circumstances, what would the playground suggest be brought to aid survival?

Magical Circle against Evil on the entrance to the building. Halt Undead on the zombies in the first line of attackers, let them block things with their bodies.