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View Full Version : PP: Iron Kingdoms - Like the setting, but is the system any good?



banjo1985
2013-05-30, 03:02 AM
For a while I've been a fan of Privateer Presses War Machine/Hordes setting, though the miniature game itself really doesn't float my boat. But, with the not-so-recent reboot of their Iron Kingdoms rpg setting, I've suddenly got the opportunity to do something with setting that doesn't involve £100 metal man-dollies and over the top combos.

My worry is that, because I didn't really like the War Machine or Hordes rules, the Iron Kingdoms ruleset might be equally poor to me. I'm not willing to drop £40 for a book that I'll only read the fluff from, and if need be I have adequate ability to convert the setting to Pathfinder or WoD or something. Does anyone have any experience with the rpg, and if so, what rpg system does it most resemble/play like?

Thanks in advance! :smallbiggrin:

Altair_the_Vexed
2013-05-30, 03:10 AM
Just been playing it last night!

It is the same set of rules as War Machine and Hordes, effectively - a few tweaks here and there, maybe a bit of streamlining...

But if you already don't like WM&H, then I expect you won't like IKRPG.

banjo1985
2013-05-30, 03:27 AM
Well, streamlining is a positive at least. My main issue with War Machine isn't that it doesn't work, but that it's all about exploiting combos and a higher level of competitiveness than I'm comfortable with. If the system doesn't rely on that then it might still be okay for me.

caden_varn
2013-05-30, 06:01 AM
Your best bet to get a feel for the system is to download the free 'Fools rush in' Scenario from Privateer's website. It comes with an abbreviated set of rules and 4 sample characters to play through a short adventure, so will give you a decent taste of the system.

I've run it and a short follow-on I wrote, and it works Ok - the players certainly seemed to enjoy it. I haven't done enough to see how balanced the various options are, but it seems OK from what I have seen so far. Some options are more combat focused than others, but that is to be expected.

Since it is an RPG, you should not have such an issue with competitiveness compared to a wargame - the players are all on the same side (in theory at least). May depend on your groups dynamic I guess.

ShadowFighter15
2013-05-31, 07:08 AM
Well, streamlining is a positive at least. My main issue with War Machine isn't that it doesn't work, but that it's all about exploiting combos and a higher level of competitiveness than I'm comfortable with. If the system doesn't rely on that then it might still be okay for me.

Quick question - are you referring to Warmachine Mk1 or the current Mk2? Mk1 I've heard had balance issues and I don't recall Mk2 being combo-exploitative to the degree you're suggesting.

Tangent
Only combos I know of that see a lot of use are things like the Gun Mage officer 'jack marshalling a Defender so it can use the Officer's rune shots and similar tricks. Only big ones that spring to mind might be the Karchev Powerslide (http://battlecollege.wikispaces.com/mkiiKarchev) (described at the bottom of that page) and a trick with Vlad3 (http://battlecollege.wikispaces.com/Vladimir3) of using his speed-boosting spells and feat to turn a Berserker into a suicide missile.

Easy way to tell which version you're thinking of is points cost. Mk1 had stuff costing hundreds of points, while Mk2 brought it down. So a Mk1 tournament might have a point limit of 500. In Mk2, that'd probably be the equivalent of 35 points.

I haven't really had a chance to play it, but I do like the rule system they've come up with and I haven't seen any exploitative combos so far (nothing worse than what you might get in Pathfinder, at least) although some people have expressed concern about Gun Mage/Riflemen. Of course, such a character won't have much in the way of social skills and you could also put him in situations where having a rifle slung over their back could cause problems.

Jerthanis
2013-05-31, 02:24 PM
I haven't really had a chance to play it, but I do like the rule system they've come up with and I haven't seen any exploitative combos so far (nothing worse than what you might get in Pathfinder, at least) although some people have expressed concern about Gun Mage/Riflemen. Of course, such a character won't have much in the way of social skills and you could also put him in situations where having a rifle slung over their back could cause problems.

Gunmage/Rifleman IS too good, but it's not so much an exploitative combo as it is putting two careers together that both are good at ranged damage that just happens to be the best combination of careers for ranged damage.

The major issues of IK are: 1.) Gobbers seem to suck to the point of being almost unplayable, outside of a specific build that involves spamming skill rolls for Feat points and then giving them out to allies, which is arguably not supposed to be allowed because the DM section warns not to give feat points for spamming skill rolls.

2.) Gunmage/Rifleman is insanely damaging.

3.) Prices don't make any kind of realistic-world sense and also there's no guideline to how wealthy PCs are supposed to be. Some careers require money to function (expensive ammunition) and others could not receive a dime through the whole game and not suffer any difficulty.

banjo1985
2013-06-03, 04:11 AM
Mk2 was what I was used to, may just be that I played against an unusually competitive player possibly.

So, giving Gobbers a reason to exist, and hoping players don't realise the power of a Gun Mage Rifleman would seem to be central to making the system fair. We tend to play fast and loose in regards to in-game currency anyway, so that wouldn't be a major problem.

caden_varn
2013-06-03, 06:10 AM
To be honest, PCs can do horrible damage with lots of combos. I can't say much about the Gunmage Rifleman combo specifically, but the Pirate/Rifleman in my game, with the skilled archetype and the virtuoso(think thats right?) benefit gets 3 shots per round with an extra dice (drop the lowest) on both attack and damage - so he generally kills whatever he is aiming at.

You can do the same in melee with the right choice of careers though - while he is the most deadly of the group, the others can do a heap of damage in a round too. In fact combat is very deadly and can feel rather rocket-tag like (that may just be my inexperience with the system coming through - I am not sure I have really got the hang of building encounters to the right level of challenge yet).

userpay
2013-06-03, 07:27 AM
Well if this is the Iron Kingdoms that I recall at one point I'd gotten into a game where I was a gun mage/rifleman//Arcane Meckanik that was riding around in a self made mech... Unfortunately the game never actually started so I can't say whether it was op or not but certainly fun to make. Chances are I probably gimped myself somewhere along the way. Actually still got the sheets...

caden_varn
2013-06-03, 10:52 AM
Unless it was recent, it is most likely the old d20 version - they have recently released their own RPG using a variant of their Warmachine rules.

TheThan
2013-06-03, 11:40 PM
I’ve been playing it since it was released, and I’ll tell you the system is GREAT. The rules fit the setting perfectly, the character creation system is fun, intuitive and every character you create is going to be freaking cool.
As for the rules, they are similar to the warmachine/hordes rules, but don’t think it’s a straight copy and paste job with a few tweaks, there are enough differences to get someone confused, so it’s a good bet to just ignore the similarity and think of it as a different system.

As others have said, download the intro scenario from the rules book and see for yourself. That’s actually the opening scenario I presented my players with.

Player characters can dish out horrible amounts of damage and can have “combos”, however they are VERY squishy, and one attack can easily wreck a hero and kill him. They’re in essence glass cannons, if you want to challenge your players; you have to get out of the DND mindset of fair encounter design and appropriate challenge ratings. Heck there are so few monsters in the game currently that you’ll find yourself building them. I’ve had to reverse engineer war jacks and war beasts to fit in the game an encounter.

Now I’ve tried to run a pathfinder game in the same setting, it’s possible, but it’s a nightmare to try to make it work, I know pathfinder supports guns and there are artificer type stuff out there, but trust me your better off running the IK rules.

ShadowFighter15
2013-06-04, 01:39 AM
Player characters can dish out horrible amounts of damage and can have “combos”, however they are VERY squishy, and one attack can easily wreck a hero and kill him. They’re in essence glass cannons, if you want to challenge your players; you have to get out of the DND mindset of fair encounter design and appropriate challenge ratings. Heck there are so few monsters in the game currently that you’ll find yourself building them. I’ve had to reverse engineer war jacks and war beasts to fit in the game an encounter.

Yeah, this is something I should've pointed out. Combat is very lethal in this system for both sides of the fight - one-shotting players is just as possible as them one-shotting the bad guys. If spellcasters in the party get particularly bad; don't feel like you're breaking fluff by sticking an Iosan Mage Hunter in if it fits the plot - they could either be working deep-cover as a mercenary for the Retribution (which is still in hiding by the RPG's 'default' present day, which is just before/during the short-stories in the wargame's faction books, for those curious - basically pre-Wrath) or an ex-Retribution member. Make a good one and he could be a recurring antagonist (though you might have trouble with explaining how he got away, what with teleportation being ridiculously rare in the setting).

banjo1985
2013-06-04, 03:03 AM
Thanks for the info, I've downloaded the opening adventure from the website, and I'll give it a whirl. :smallsmile:

I'll admit, the fluff I've read is entertaining enough to give me plenty of ideas for running a campaign, which is a good sign.