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TSGames
2013-05-30, 05:34 AM
Hello Playgrounders!

Development of One Shot has hit its final stage before the free alpha release. If you would like to be one of the first to sign up for the alpha test, head over to the TopSecret blog (http://topsecretgames.net/blog) and get your clearance by entering your email address.

As always, thank you for your continued support. Looking forward to alpha testing with you.

-James

Below is the old header. For interesting stuff and current development, check the last page of the thread or the blog (http://www.topsecretgames.net/blog/).
Hello fellow playgrounders!

I am currently working on a table system that's not quite traditional... it is silly, allows for quick random character generation (if wanted), and has the PCs competing with each other a little more than D&D; it's designed for one shot, beer and pretzel type campaigns. The system draws some heavy inspiration from Munchkin, Paranoia, and this iconic D&D video (http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/90046) =)

I've done the work on all the mechanics: HP, stats, non-combat skill systems, combat mechanics, etc... Now I need to pick what classes to implement and I need your help.

http://www.trollandtoad.com/images/products/pictures/313773.jpg
Well...kinda.

In a fun, one-shot, what kind of base classes would you like to see? Anything is welcome as an idea from serious to silly. Note that this is not D&D based, so any suggestion is welcome.

I will definitely incorporate the top 3 class ideas from this thread into the system and release as an alpha version to the Playgrounders (though you are welcome to contribute more than 3, heck, name as many as you like). Of course, you are also welcome to comment on mechanics of the system too if you like =)

___________________________________________

One Shot
A quick and easy tabletop rpg for one shot campaigns, and fun for all.

You meet up with your old roleplaying group and want to do a gaming session. This is the only time that you'll be able to do one with this group for a long time. Everyone wants to play an RPG, no one wants to spend hours rolling up characters for a half-way put together one shot, and some people just want to drink and have a good time.

Enter One Shot. This is a system designed from the ground up for one shot campaigns, featuring quick and potentially random character generation (including random back stories if needed). The mechanics of the system were built from the ground up with three goals:

It must be playable when slightly inebriated
The mechanics must be simple and fast without dragging on or rules lawyering
There should be some amount of competition between players ranging from friendly to one person wins the night

The dice systsem
This system uses a very simple d6 based mechanic for attacks and abilities, not only because it's an easy die to work with, but because it is the most common die. Unexpected roleplaying session? Not enough dice? Grab some from that dusty Monopoly board and you're good to go! This complements goal 1 and 2 nicely while also making it easy to keep bonuses small and manageable (for those of us who don't count better with alcohol). Consequently, HP and defense values are low as well.

Finally, in the default campaigns, there are a number of items that bestow abilities on the first ones to get them, as well as a couple of conflicting goals in the random character generator. This ensures goal #3's minimum of player competition. However, if you want a "winner takes all" session, you can crank up the bonuses and goal conflict as high as you need to.

Stats
There are none!
------------
Why? Well there's a simple answer to that: Stats are great for a tabletop battlefield simulation or anything attempting to be "realistic" as they can reflect the natural aptitude of your character and determine how it develops. In a one-shot campaign, stats are an unnecessary abstraction that add an extra layer of book keeping and extra time to character creation and progression. If my warrior has maxed out his ability to hit things REALLY HARD, then it is implied that he has a high Strength and I do not need to have that explicitly reflected in a stat. This is in keeping with goals 1 and especially goal 2 of the system design principles.
Starting the Game
Starting the Game: At the start of the game, each player takes 3 goals from the goal pile. Each player also takes 2 cards from lesser item pile, and 1 card from the magic item pile. They can attempt to begin the game with these items concealed, if they can pass a successful Houdini skill check; otherwise the items will be plainly visible on their character. Each player also begins with 3 meta, unless the GM has given them more.
Starting Combat
Starting Combat: At the start of every combat, the player that wants to act first rolls a Sprint check. The enemy with the highest Sprint rolls for his team. The winning team goes first. If there is a tie, then the Sprint checks must be re-rolled, however, the same PC cannot perform the re-roll.

When the PCs act, whoever rolled the Sprint check for their team must act first in the round; he cannot be challenged by opposed Sprint checks during the first round of combat. The PCs then act in any order they choose; if there is a conflict they make opposed Sprint checks to determine who acts first.
--------------------------------
In this particular mechanic, you are seeing a lot of goals 2 & 3. Team based initiative to keep it simple, with the first to plunge his team into combat receiving the reward of acting first. Players don't roll initiative against enemies, except to determine which side goes first, they roll initiative against each other to determine who acts and only when they cannot or will not agree on order. Keep this in mind for the upcoming items update.
Combat
Combat: Combat in One-Shot is similar to more traditional tabletops like D&D, but with much faster, much simpler rules to keep the game flowing amid beer, innuendo, and numerous distractions.

Combat has rounds! (Dun, Dun, DUNNNNNN......structured combat!)Each round a character gets to move and perform an action. Some special abilities will grant characters the ability to perform more actions.

Attacks are made using an ability. To simplify things, even basic attacks are classified as abilities. With only a few specific exceptions, there is no limit to how often you can use an ability and using an ability, in general, costs 1 action. Using abilities is simple: roll one die and add the ability level plus any other bonus you may get. It hits if it is higher than the defender's dodge. However, there are some defensive abilities that allow for a more...active defense.

So far it's not so different from what you've seen, right? Well...damage works a little differently in One-Shot than in most D&D-esque systems; some would dare say it works simpler and doesn't turn HP into tedious accounting, but those people are heretics! If a normal attack hits, it deals 1 damage. Some abilities will add to the damage dealt and other abilities will have higher base damage as they level up. In other words, getting hit by a level 1 adventurer vs getting hit by a level 4 adventurer makes a huge difference.

--------------

Some may be aghast by the lack of damage dice! Now, before you get out your pitch-forks let me explain. It all comes back to goals 1 & 2. There is nothing wrong with damage dice in general, but their use adds a layer of complexity that cannot be avoided.

Let's take an example: say every ability deals some damage based on varying sized dice, anything from 1d4 to 2d6 to 1d12. What this means is that PCs need to be able to survive hits from a 2d6 damage ability to ensure that they can continue to play without being taken out in one hit (because that's not very fun). The solution to this problem? It's easy, let's just bump up the HP so that either every or most characters can survive the average damage from 2d6! And then everything was great and there was no reason to type this lengthy explanation, the end.

...Well, not quite. As a result of bumping up the HP, two things happen. The first is that the amount of math and book keeping is increased. This comes from the simple fact that it is easier to keep track of 4 of something than to keep track of 7, 10, or 12 of something. This is only compounded by variable damages, leading to calculations every single time anything is hit. This is by no means unmanageable, it just gets slightly more difficult for some people while inebriated.

However, it's sideffect number 2 that that makes it a poor choice to meet goals 1 & 2. The second side effect is that bonuses now have to be increased. When rolling 2d6, a +1 or +3 bonus may be OK for level 1, but as MIGHTY TABLETOP GAMERS! we expect more as we level up. We need to hit harder, better, faster, stronger. So we end up adding in all kinds of small bonuses from numerous sources to calculate our final damage until making an attack becomes a few steps removed from Accounting 101.

In short, larger bonuses come from larger damage values (and variable damage values) and larger HP values, they lead to book keeping, and most folks don't find that part of the game to be fun (or all too manageable while inebriated). So the damage system was streamlined and everybody could have a good time playing a table top with their friends with no 10 minutes bonus calculating breaks.

HP, Death, and the Danger Zone
HP: Every class has a set amount of HP at first level. This amount increses in small, fixed increments at each level. Any time a character is hit, damage is subtracted from HP.

Dying: Once a character drops to 0 HP, they are in the "danger zone". Any more damage will make them fall unconscious. Once a character is in the "danger zone", the character can take 3 damage before dying. Each turn that a character is unconscious, the player can roll a d6. If it lands on a "6", the player character gets back up at 1 HP and can act on that turn.
Encouraging player competition
XP: XP values to level are kept low and they scale. For example, it is only 2 XP to level 2, and 3 XP to level 3, and so on. Meets goals 1, 2, and 3 (see below).

Gaining XP: XP can be gained in a number of ways: defeating enemies, achieving goals, last hitting bosses, and being the first to acquire items.

Goals: Each player starts the game with 3 goals chosen at random from the goal pile. (Did I mention the system uses some cards as well?) You do not show these 3 goals to other players (unless you're feeling really lucky). These goals can be anything from winning a certain number of competitions, to sabotaging other competitions, being the first to reach an item, or last hit a bad guy. You flip over your card after completing the goal and gain the rewards immediately. You may gain bonus rewards if you can justify the completion and methods used to complete your goal in relation to your back story. In other words, bonus stuff if you can provide an in character reason for it. Depending on how you go about achieving your goals, the GM may decide to reward you with extra Meta.

Skills
Skills: Skills are used outside of combat to intereact with NPCs, win challenges, and achieve certain goals. The max skill level is 3. Leveling up a skill costs 1 Skill Point. Each character starts the game with a set amount of skill points and earns additional Skill Points each time they level up.

The skill list:

Fancy Feet - Tumbling, breakdancing, etc...
Awareness - Are you paying attention?
Loot - Looting bodies, looting the room, etc...
Thievery - Sneaking, stealin', and lock pickin', 'nuff said
Seduction - Woo that NPC!
Deception - Would I lie to you? I really am just a potted plant!
Athletics - Jump, Climb, show off
Gambling - Poker, dice, etc... Come on Lucky Sevens!
Sprint -You don't have to be faster than the bear...
Houdini - Magic tricks, escaping rope, tieing rope
Identify - Knowing what something does before you touch or drink it
Sway - Make 'em see it your way

Challenges (competitions)
Challenge: Throughout the session, players will have the option (and sometimes the necessity) of participating in challenges. A challenge is is an event sequence that promises reward for its completion. A challenge can take many forms from an attempt to bribe an official, to a game of high stakes gambling, to a high pressure bluff, to a dance off, and more! A challenge can be for a single PC, but may also involve multiple PCs; in this case, it is usually only possible for one side to win, but it is generally possible for all sides to lose.

Each challenge consists of a minimum of 3 phases that advance as the PCs pass the skills checks required through skill rolls, cheating, and cunning ability usage. Each challenge uses at least two distinct skills throughout, though a longer challenge may use more. At the end of the challenge the PC is awarded with XP depending on how difficult the challenge was, they may be rewarded with additional benefits depending on the challenge itself (i.e. bribing a guard could have many indirect benefits), and if the PC describes actions in character or is particularly cunning in a challenge, the GM may reward them with additional; benefits, including Meta.

MetaMeta: Meta is a metagame resource: a resource that player's posses, not their characters. At any time, a player may spend one meta to change a die that has just been rolled by tipping the die onto an adjacent side. Once the die has been tipped, it cannot be tipped onto an adjacent side again, without spending additional meta.

For example, Bob rolls a 6 on his attack against the big bad monster. Alice is pretty sure that if Bob hits with the attack, that he will land the last hit on the big bad monster and be rewarded with additional XP. Alice remedies this situation by spending 1 meta to flip the die over, onto a 2. Bob's attack will no longer hit, but he has no meta to change the die back. Bob, realizing the danger, decides to take the only reasonable course of action: he turns to John and asks John to use his meta to help him with the attack. John agrees for an in game item and a beer. Bob reluctantly accepts the deal and John spends one meta to flip the die back. Unfortunately, John is a little clumsy and only flips the die onto a 4. Bob's attack roll total is now 4 + the level of his ability. If Alice has additional meta, she can change it again, or other players can choose to affect the die as well.

At the start of the game, each player starts with 3 meta. Once these meta are spent, they cannot be gained back. All additional meta is given out by the GM for criteria determined by the GM. Those criteria depend solely on the atmosphere that the GM wishes to create: for a psudo-serious session, meta may be given out for exceptional role-playing, for a particularly competitive session, it may be given out for back-stabbery, for any session it may be given out for bribing the GM with additional drinks and pizza. The GM should try to be generally consistent when rewarding players with meta, but should provide just enough as rewards for random or meta-game actions to keep the players on their toes.

Finally, players can trade meta freely in exchange for food, beverages, in game items, favors, the antidote to the poison they just drank, etc... Lastly, player's may bet meta on the outcome of any event. If a player starts a betting pool, he states clearly what the terms are, for example "Bret the beer drinking bard will out drink the dwarven bartender in a drinking challenge" and then he states how much meta he is betting. If another players want to enter the bet, they put forward just as much meta. Meta that is currently being bet, cannot be used (though other meta that the player's own can be used). The winner takes the whole pot; if there are multiple winners then the pot is divided evenly between them.

Xaotiq1
2013-05-30, 08:02 AM
Pathfinder Alchemist (pfsrd)
Warblade (ToB)
Crusader (ToB)
Incarnate (MoI)
Totemist (MoI)
Barbarian (SRD)
Paladin (SRD)
Rogue (SRD)
Beguiler (PHBII)
Dread Necromancer (HoH)
Warmage (CArc)
Duskblade (PHBII)
My Monk Fix:http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=14616502#post14616502
Sorcerer (SRD)
Psion (XPH)
Psychic Warrior (XPH)
Wilder (XPH)
Favored Soul (CDiv/MiniH)

That should start things off with a sound!

TSGames
2013-05-30, 04:05 PM
So let's get the conversation rolling with a little more information about the system. Adding to the first post now.

[EDIT]
AND DONE!

Added some more info to the first post. I appreciate the suggestions so far, keep 'em coming guys!

@Frathe - This isn't my first rodeo; I'm a long time RPG fan and designer. I'm not really looking for the common classes (I can just open my D&D Edition X book for that!) but I wanted to hear what you guys would like to see. I think that's much better that rehashing the same old song and dance. ;)

Also, if there's interest, I may add further information to the first post to give a better feel for the system. Let me know if you'd like to see that.

Frathe
2013-05-30, 04:12 PM
The really archetypal character classes (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Character_class#Common_types_of_classes) are often considered to be (under different names) the Fighter, Rogue, Cleric, and Mage. If you want a quick simple system, you could probably get away with just these four classes, or just these plus a few more.

Frathe
2013-05-30, 06:00 PM
@Frathe - This isn't my first rodeo; I'm a long time RPG fan and designer. I'm not really looking for the common classes (I can just open my D&D Edition X book for that!) but I wanted to hear what you guys would like to see. I think that's much better that rehashing the same old song and dance. ;)Okay, just trying to be helpful. :smallfrown: I guess I like the idea of a detective class, also an alchemist class (or whatever you call a magical guy that makes stuff, rather than casts spells).

erikun
2013-05-30, 11:00 PM
For base classes? I'd like some that are (preferably) practical in a non-Tolkien setting as well, in case somebody wanted to play in someplace other than psudoD&Dland. As such, I'd probably like to see:

Sniper
Meleer (need a better name)
Tank ("Blocker")
Martial Artist (including wrestling/non-"asian" arts)
Spellcaster
Sneak

From there, it depends on what situations you plan on throwing at people. If you're combat focused, then you probably want a Healer (with some good non-healing abilities). If some focus on talking/exploring and such, then you'd probably want some kind of Face, a Bard/Enchanter, and probably some type of Forester/Woodsman/Druid (meaning someone in tune with nature, not someone who turns into Dire Velcoraptors).

Xaotiq1
2013-05-30, 11:10 PM
Make your base roll 3d6 + any relevant modifier, good RNG. No mods get over +/-20?

Take a deck of 52 cards. 13 are races, 13 are classes. The other cards are used to generate stats. Maybe 5 Strength, Agility, Vigor, Smarts, and Spirit.

The player draws three cards from the races/classes deck and discards one so they have a race and class. Yes, a redraw may need to happen here and there, but It won't slow anything down too bad. They draw 7 ability cards and discard any 2. Aces are 1 and Kings are 12. Ability mod is 1/2 the score (minimum +0).

Class cards have all the relevant info including skills, attack bonus, defense bonus, etc. I figure the GM will either have a database for a dry run, or the cards could be 6"x9".

Skills start at a +2. They can be raised as high as the character's relevant ability modifier. A character can raise 2 skills ranked below their relevant ability modifier, or one skill equal to or greater than the relevant ability modifier each time they earn an Advance (See Below)

Race cards have any racial adjustments to ability scores, inherent skills and abilities. Players should record info on notebook paper.
Once per game, any player may play their race card to cancel a failed roll?

Each character starts out with the classes starting package as far as equipment. You want fast, do this crap AHEAD OF TIME.

Here's where I start stealing MORE from Savage Worlds: Every 5 XP grants that character an advance. They can be used to rank up skills, as stated above, purchase a new arcane power, combat maneuver, or skill trick. They can also be used for 2 random draws or one choice from the Magic Item List. No power, maneuver, trick, or item can exceed the character's Rank.

For every 4 advances, the character gains a rank. This allows them to bump any 2 ability score under 10 by +1 or any one score over 10 by +1. This is in addition to the advance granted.

So, I think most of this could be done with a deck of cards, a handful of d6's a notebook and pencils. Plenty of room on the table for beer and pretzels. Thought????

celtois
2013-05-30, 11:24 PM
If you want comedy I can think of some pretty entertaining IC/OOC crossover that I suspect would get more fun/funny while one is drinking.

Potential classes.

Karaoke King/Queen: IC/OOC crossover, bonus for singing a verse from a thematically appropriate song. Or whatever. Badly is preferred.

Character should be royalty or nobility in game.

Pillsbury Dough Boy: IC/OOC crossover. bonus for successfully using a snack as a prop, silly is preferred.

Character should be rich, or filthy rich in game. Lots of dough

Starving Waif: IC/OOC crossover. bonus for successfully getting someone to pass him or her the snack of choice. Double bonus if you ask by saying "please sir may I have some more"

Character should be dirt poor, orphans preferred.

TSGames
2013-06-01, 02:58 PM
Adding more mechanics to the first post to give you a better feel for the system. Feel free to comment and add class ideas.

Encouraging player competition.
XP: XP values to level are kept low and they scale. For example, it is only 2 XP to level 2, and 3 XP to level 3, and so on.

Gaining XP: XP can be gained in a number of ways: defeating enemies, achieving goals, last hitting bosses, and being the first to acquire certain items.

Goals: Each player starts the game with 3 goals chosen at random from the goal pile. (Did I mention the system uses some cards as well?) You do not show these 3 goals to other players (unless you're feeling really lucky). These goals can be anything from winning a certain number of competitions, to sabotaging other competitions, or being the first to reach an item or last hit a bad guy. You flip over your card after completing the goal and gain the rewards immediately. You may gain bonus rewards if you can justify the completion and methods used to complete your goal in relation to your back story. In other words, bonus stuff if you can provide an in character reason for it.

Zweisteine
2013-06-01, 03:20 PM
This sounds cool... I can't wait for more stuff!

I think you should have metagaming class.

As is my wont, I see a new idea, and have ideas related to it, which I must then share. Sadly, my ideas are much more strictly D&D 3.5-based than would be ideal...
D&D-style instant casting
Gets spells per day (as wizard) and one (or two?) banned school(s). No need to prepare spells or restrict the list. Also, no spells with XP costs.
Unknown gear
Everybody gets unspecified mundane gear. They have any gear they can justify their character having (no pack rats allowed).

Madara
2013-06-01, 06:32 PM
I've already looked at the common classes from D&D and other games; what I'm asking for is the classes that you would like to see.

Silly Classes(DJ Bard(Dubstep (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qIaimKkgGv0)(Warning, Link contains Ponies) anyone?), Street Magician, Mime)
:smalltongue:

TSGames
2013-06-03, 04:23 AM
Adding some more details about the mechanics.

Challenges

Challenge: Throughout the session, players will have the option (and sometimes the necessity) of participating in challenges. A challenge is is an event sequence that promises reward for its completion. A challenge can take many forms from an attempt to bribe an official, to a game of high stakes gambling, to a high pressure bluff, to a dance off, and more! A challenge can be for a single PC, but may also involve multiple PCs; in this case, it is usually only possible for one side to win, but it is generally possible for all sides to lose.

Each challenge consists of a minimum of 3 phases that advance as the PCs pass the skills checks required through skill rolls, cheating, and cunning ability usage. Each challenge uses at least two distinct skills throughout, though a longer challenge may use more. At the end of the challenge the PC is awarded with XP depending on how difficult the challenge was, they may be rewarded with additional benefits depending on the challenge itself (i.e. bribing a guard could have many indirect benefits), and if the PC describes actions in character or is particularly cunning in a challenge, the GM may reward them with additional; benefits, including Meta.

TSGames
2013-06-04, 05:19 AM
Time for another update to the mechanics. This time let's dive into some of the nitty gritty:

Combat
Combat: Combat in One-Shot is similar to more traditional tabletops like D&D, but with much faster, much simpler rules to keep the game flowing amid beer, innuendo, and numerous distractions.

Combat has rounds! (Dun, Dun, DUNNNNNN......structured combat!)Each round a character gets to move and perform an action. Some special abilities will grant characters the ability to perform more actions.

Attacks are made using an ability. To simplify things, even basic attacks are classified as abilities. With only a few specific exceptions, there is no limit to how often you can use an ability and using an ability, in general, costs 1 action. Using abilities is simple: roll one die and add the ability level plus any other bonus you may get. It hits if it is higher than the defender's dodge. However, there are some defensive abilities that allow for a more...active defense.

So far it's not so different from what you've seen, right? Well...damage works a little differently in One-Shot than in most D&D-esque systems; some would dare say it works simpler and doesn't turn HP into tedious accounting, but those people are heretics! If a normal attack hits, it deals 1 damage. Some abilities will add to the damage dealt and other abilities will have higher base damage as they level up. In other words, getting hit by a level 1 adventurer vs getting hit by a level 4 adventurer makes a huge difference.

--------------

Some may be aghast by the lack of damage dice! Now, before you get out your pitch-forks let me explain. It all comes back to goals 1 & 2. There is nothing wrong with damage dice in general, but their use adds a layer of complexity that cannot be avoided.

Let's take an example: say every ability deals some damage based on varying sized dice, anything from 1d4 to 2d6 to 1d12. What this means is that PCs need to be able to survive hits from a 2d6 damage ability to ensure that they can continue to play without being taken out in one hit (because that's not very fun). The solution to this problem? It's easy, let's just bump up the HP so that either every or most characters can survive the average damage from 2d6! And then everything was great and there was no reason to type this lengthy explanation, the end.

...Well, not quite. As a result of bumping up the HP, two things happen. The first is that the amount of math and book keeping is increased. This comes from the simple fact that it is easier to keep track of 4 of something than to keep track of 7, 10, or 12 of something. This is only compounded by variable damages, leading to calculations every single time anything is hit. This is by no means unmanageable, it just gets slightly more difficult for some people while inebriated.

However, it's sideffect number 2 that that makes it a poor choice to meet goals 1 & 2. The second side effect is that bonuses now have to be increased. When rolling 2d6, a +1 or +3 bonus may be OK for level 1, but as MIGHTY TABLETOP GAMERS! we expect more as we level up. We need to hit harder, better, faster, stronger. So we end up adding in all kinds of small bonuses from numerous sources to calculate our final damage until making an attack becomes a few steps removed from Accounting 101.

In short, larger bonuses come from larger damage values (and variable damage values) and larger HP values, they lead to book keeping, and most folks don't find that part of the game to be fun (or all too manageable while inebriated). So the damage system was streamlined and everybody could have a good time playing a table top with their friends with no 10 minutes bonus calculating breaks.


Like it? Hate it? I should be burned at the stake, turned into a newt? Let me know! Feel free to keep those class ideas coming, we still need some to emerge as the clear favorites =)

[EDIT]
@Zweisteine


Unknown gear
Everybody gets unspecified mundane gear. They have any gear they can justify their character having (no pack rats allowed).
You're getting dangerously close to hitting the hail on the head! There's lots of fun stuff to start off the adventure right. That's an update for another day though ;)

gr8artist
2013-06-04, 05:44 AM
I like it, and really like the ideas behind it. I would advise against having any kind of complicated ability mod/ability score system or anything like that. If you want ability scores, keep the basics: Physique, Mental, Spirit, Movement... or something like that. Roll con and str together, or str/dex. Maybe magic is its own ability score. Social could also be, but avoid having too many mental/social things. You want it to be clear what every ability score covers, so the subtle nuances between "Charisma" and "Manipulation" are a no-no... (I hate you, Sion)

For reference, I recommend looking up the "Kobolds ate my baby" and "Risus" games, both pretty simple and straightforward. "Red dragon inn" is a great game with some neat deck-building concepts.

Keep everything simple. And mix it up a little. Instead of the DnD base classes/archtypes, why not add in some from City of Heroes? The blaster (range damage), Controller (debuffs), Scrapper (melee damage), Tank (derrr..), Defender (support)
Or FFXIII: Commando (melee), Ravager (magic), Medic (derrr), Sentinel (debuff), Synergist (supt), and Saboteur (debuff)

TSGames
2013-06-05, 04:19 AM
I like it, and really like the ideas behind it. I would advise against having any kind of complicated ability mod/ability score system or anything like that. If you want ability scores, keep the basics: Physique, Mental, Spirit, Movement... or something like that. Roll con and str together, or str/dex. Maybe magic is its own ability score. Social could also be, but avoid having too many mental/social things. You want it to be clear what every ability score covers, so the subtle nuances between "Charisma" and "Manipulation" are a no-no... (I hate you, Sion)


Bam! You hit the nail on the head. So, without further ado, it seems like stats should be my next update.

Stats
There are none!
------------
Why? Well there's a simple answer to that: Stats are great for a tabletop battlefield simulation or anything attempting to be "realistic" as they can reflect the natural aptitude of your character and determine how it develops. In a one-shot campaign, stats are an unnecessary abstraction that add an extra layer of book keeping and extra time to character creation and progression. If my warrior has maxed out his ability to hit things REALLY HARD, then it is implied that he has a high Strength and I do not need to have that explicitly reflected in a stat. This is in keeping with goals 1 and especially goal 2 of the system design principles.

Really narrowing it down now. Not too many future updates, just: Abilities, Skills, HP, Dodge, Character Class Design, Starting Combat, Items, Starting the Game, and Meta.

Any particular topic you would like to see an update on first?

JustPlayItLoud
2013-06-05, 03:08 PM
As you talk about this, I'm starting to envision a hybrid between a rules lite tabletop game and Munchkin. Basic races/class that can be chosen at random. Stats should be largely ignored in favor of selecting a small handful of skills from a relevant list.

I can see decks of cards for goals, monsters, treasure etc. For example, a (fighter type) class that picked swords and axes would be assumed to have a basic weapon of either type, but could use a better one from a treasure card. Or he could draw an awesome magic spear and be unable to use it.

The biggest thing I'm having trouble thinking would be how to structure sessions in such a way that the GM is more than a glorified referee presiding over a complex board game.

Finlam
2013-06-06, 09:06 AM
Just stopped by to say that I really like the idea so far. I'd like to see the rest of it.

As for class ideas, maybe a ninja or a pirate? A don't forget everyone's favorite class: the bard! XD

TSGames
2013-06-07, 04:58 AM
As you talk about this, I'm starting to envision a hybrid between a rules lite tabletop game and Munchkin. Basic races/class that can be chosen at random. Stats should be largely ignored in favor of selecting a small handful of skills from a relevant list.

I can see decks of cards for goals, monsters, treasure etc. For example, a (fighter type) class that picked swords and axes would be assumed to have a basic weapon of either type, but could use a better one from a treasure card. Or he could draw an awesome magic spear and be unable to use it.

The biggest thing I'm having trouble thinking would be how to structure sessions in such a way that the GM is more than a glorified referee presiding over a complex board game.
You've just about guessed where I was heading with it: a combination of a rules-lite tabletop and munchkin. As for the role of the GM, there will be a little more information provided about that later. Needless to say that while the GM handles NPCs and things, the GM has a slightly more active role in encouraging party conflict/competition. More on that later =)


As for class ideas, maybe a ninja or a pirate? A don't forget everyone's favorite class: the bard! XD
Like the suggestions, keep coming.
-----------------------

Time for an update:

HP, Death, and the Danger Zone
HP: Every class has a set amount of HP at first level. This amount increses in small, fixed increments at each level. Any time a character is hit, damage is subtracted from HP.

Dying: Once a character drops to 0 HP, they are in the "danger zone". Any more damage will make them fall unconscious. Once a character is in the "danger zone", the character can take 3 damage before dying. Each turn that a character is unconscious, the play can roll a d6. If it lands on a six, the player gets back up at 1 HP and can act on that turn.

After typing that up I have to post this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3-zaTr6OUo). XD

There's a little more to follow up on with the dying part: it would be boring if people died early and couldn't finish the game. More on that later =)

Silverbit
2013-06-07, 05:43 AM
This looks hilarious, I'm watching closely. If you want class ideas, how about some monster classes? Werewolves get to pretend they're a different class for the first part of the game and don't take as much damage from most things as everyone else, Vampiries get extra points for doing a Bela Lugosti/Christopher Lee impression (no sparkling), and Black Knights get to ignore limb damage (if that exists): "It's only a scratch!"

This game looks cool, when it's done my IRL group might try it.

Grinner
2013-06-07, 05:52 AM
Breakdancer
Fly Tamer
Big Eater
Vampire (Sparkly)
Vampire (Non-sparkly)
Mob Hitman
Exobiologist
Deaf Composer
Whale
Gorilla
Ashtray - Naturally, they would evolve psionic powers so to better cope with their environment.

ISitOnGnomes
2013-06-08, 07:30 AM
Dog Catcher (this guy must be BA, what with all the magical beasts :smallcool:)

Mexican Wrestler

Drunk Bum (maybe you can improve his powers by actually drinking)

Badass animal with human companion

Dual crossbow wielder

TSGames
2013-06-09, 06:06 PM
This looks hilarious, I'm watching closely. If you want class ideas, how about some monster classes? Werewolves get to pretend they're a different class for the first part of the game and don't take as much damage from most things as everyone else, Vampiries get extra points for doing a Bela Lugosti/Christopher Lee impression (no sparkling), and Black Knights get to ignore limb damage (if that exists): "It's only a scratch!"

This game looks cool, when it's done my IRL group might try it.

Always appreciate the interest! After the alpha release, I will be looking for people to try it out and provide some feedback; I'm always looking to improve on my work =)

@Grinner: I'm digging the breakdancing, but I've got a pretty cheesy sense of humor sometimes =)

@IsitOnGnomes: I like the dual wielding crossbow guy; I think he should wear leather and dark sunglasses XD

It seems like it's time for an update!

Skills
Skills: Skills are used outside of combat to intereact with NPCs, win challenges, and achieve certain goals. The max skill level is 3. Leveling up a skill costs 1 Skill Point. Each character starts the game with a set amount of skill points and earns additional Skill Points each time they level up.

The skill list:

Fancy Feet - Tumbling, breakdancing, etc...
Awareness - Are you paying attention?
Loot - Looting bodies, looting the room, etc...
Thievery - Sneaking, stealin', and lock pickin', 'nuff said
Seduction - Woo that NPC!
Deception - Would I lie to you? I really am just a potted plant!
Athletics - Jump, Climb, show off
Gambling - Poker, dice, etc... Come on Lucky Sevens!
Sprint -You don't have to be faster than the bear...
Houdini - Magic tricks, escaping rope, tieing rope
Identify - Knowing what something does before you touch or drink it
Sway - Make 'em see it your way


That's the skill list =)

Grinner
2013-06-09, 07:25 PM
Thought of a few more today:
Botanist
Archaeologist
Haberdasher

TSGames
2013-06-11, 04:32 AM
Time for another update!

Starting the Game
Starting the Game: At the start of the game, each player takes 3 goals from the goal pile. Each player also takes 2 cards from lesser item pile, and 1 card from the magic item pile. They can attempt to begin the game with these items concealed, if they can pass a successful Houdini skill check; otherwise the items will be plainly visible on their character.

BONUS UPDATE!

Starting Combat
Starting Combat: At the start of every combat, the player that wants to act first rolls a Sprint check. The enemy with the highest Sprint rolls for his team. The winning team goes first. If there is a tie, then the Sprint checks must be re-rolled, however, the same PC cannot perform the re-roll.

When the PCs act, whoever rolled the Sprint check for their team must act first in the round; he cannot be challenged by opposed Sprint checks during the first round of combat. The PCs then act in any order they choose; if there is a conflict they make opposed Sprint checks to determine who acts first.
--------------------------------
In this particular mechanic, you are seeing a lot of goals 2 & 3. Team based initiative to keep it simple, with the first to plunge his team into combat receiving the reward of acting first. Players don't roll initiative against enemies, except to determine which side goes first, they roll initiative against each other to determine who acts and only when they cannot or will not agree on order. Keep this in mind for the upcoming items update.

TSGames
2013-06-13, 04:36 AM
Updated skill list

Finlam
2013-06-14, 07:47 AM
Skills
Skills: Skills are used outside of combat to intereact with NPCs, win challenges, and achieve certain goals. The max skill level is 3. Leveling up a skill costs 1 Skill Point. Each character starts the game with a set amount of skill points and earns additional Skill Points each time they level up.

The skill list:

Fancy Feet - Tumbling, breakdancing, etc...
Awareness - Are you paying attention?
Loot - Looting bodies, looting the room, etc...
Thievery - Sneaking, stealin', and lock pickin', 'nuff said
Seduction - Woo that NPC!
Deception - Would I lie to you? I really am just a potted plant!
Athletics - Jump, Climb, show off
Gambling - Poker, dice, etc... Come on Lucky Sevens!
Sprint -You don't have to be faster than the bear...
Houdini - Magic tricks, escaping rope, tieing rope
Identify - Knowing what something does before you touch or drink it
Sway - Make 'em see it your way


That's the skill list =)

The skill list description looks....intriguing. I like that you kept it small, instead of making it the overly complicated 30+ skill system that D&D's various editions are often giulty of.

As for more classes:

Cowboy - Shoots guns, YEEEHAAAW
Backstabber - Best to keep him in front of you

polymachine
2013-06-15, 03:26 PM
I love the sound of this game!
I've always been looking for something to play inbetween bigger games or when party members are unawailable for a weekend. Or as an alternative to settlers of catan on game night T_T

some classes i think'd pretty funny:


Igor: a Master with scalpel, thread and needle; surgeon par excellence (and pretty good at tailoring in a pinch). Items mostly include traits he's inherited from his relatives (e.g. his grandfather's eyes or his uncle's good right hand), and maybe from fallen enemies too, if an opportunity presents itself.

Hero: Blurring the already fine line between bravery and madness these hardened fighters carry with them a tool of an unimaginable manyfold of use and application, with which they are able to solve any problem, no matter the brain-melting complexity: a five foot sword.

Accountant: Able to clear out an entire room of fighters and brawlers by only mentioning the word "taxes", Accountants are one of the most intimidating forces of nature. A mature one is said to be able to make platoons commit suicide only with accounts of holidays (haha. and their sense of humor).


These are heavily Discworld influenced, since that is prety much the standard that I hold all my comedic fanatsy to ^^

TSGames
2013-06-16, 06:58 PM
I love the sound of this game!
I've always been looking for something to play inbetween bigger games or when party members are unawailable for a weekend. Or as an alternative to settlers of catan on game night T_T

some classes i think'd pretty funny:

Thank you, I'm always glad to hear interest in my work, especially as I draw near to printing off the first deck. =)



Igor: a Master with scalpel, thread and needle; surgeon par excellence (and pretty good at tailoring in a pinch). Items mostly include traits he's inherited from his relatives (e.g. his grandfather's eyes or his uncle's good right hand), and maybe from fallen enemies too, if an opportunity presents itself.

Hero: Blurring the already fine line between bravery and madness these hardened fighters carry with them a tool of an unimaginable manyfold of use and application, with which they are able to solve any problem, no matter the brain-melting complexity: a five foot sword.

Accountant: Able to clear out an entire room of fighters and brawlers by only mentioning the word "taxes", Accountants are one of the most intimidating forces of nature. A mature one is said to be able to make platoons commit suicide only with accounts of holidays (haha. and their sense of humor).


These are heavily Discworld influenced, since that is prety much the standard that I hold all my comedic fanatsy to ^^
I really like the Igor class idea. That's pretty awesome and definitely plays right into design goal #3. I can see the other PCs eyeing the Igor with suspicion with every new "item" he acquires, wondering "Will he have my hand next?" Morbid, funny, passively threatening; absolutely perfect.

Keep the ideas coming, the playground is too clever by half; no clear winners for favored classes yet. However, in the absence of clear winners, I am starting to form an idea of which I like the best so far ;)

Keep the input coming, I really like the feedback.

TSGames
2013-06-18, 04:47 AM
Time for a major update! This one covers one of the main mechanics for design goal #3 as well as the GM's ability to encourage player competition in game.

Meta
Meta: Meta is a metagame resource: a resource that player's posses, not their characters. At any time, a player may spend one meta to change a die that has just been rolled by tipping the die onto an adjacent side. Once the die has been tipped, it cannot be tipped onto an adjacent side again, without spending additional meta.

For example, Bob rolls a 6 on his attack against the big bad monster. Alice is pretty sure that if Bob hits with the attack, that he will land the last hit on the big bad monster and be rewarded with additional XP. Alice remedies this situation by spending 1 meta to flip the die over, onto a 2. Bob's attack will no longer hit, but he has no meta to change the die back. Bob, realizing the danger, decides to take the only reasonable course of action: he turns to John and asks John to use his meta to help him with the attack. John agrees for an in game item and a beer. Bob reluctantly accepts the deal and John spends one meta to flip the die back. Unfortunately, John is a little clumsy and only flips the die onto a 4. Bob's attack roll total is now 4 + the level of his ability. If Alice has additional meta, she can change it again, or other players can choose to affect the die as well.

At the start of the game, each player starts with 3 meta. Once these meta are spent, they cannot be gained back. All additional meta is given out by the GM for criteria determined by the GM. Those criteria depend solely on the atmosphere that the GM wishes to create: for a psudo-serious session, meta may be given out for exceptional role-playing, for a particularly competitive session, it may be given out for back-stabbery, for any session it may be given out for bribing the GM with additional drinks and pizza. The GM should try to be generally consistent when rewarding players with meta, but should provide just enough as rewards for random or meta-game actions to keep the players on their toes.

Finally, players can trade meta freely in exchange for food, beverages, in game items, favors, the antidote to the poison they just drank, etc... Lastly, player's may bet meta on the outcome of any event. If a player starts a betting pool, he states clearly what the terms are, for example "Bret the beer drinking bard will out drink the dwarven bartender in a drinking challenge" and then he states how much meta he is betting. If another players want to enter the bet, they put forward just as much meta. Meta that is currently being bet, cannot be used (though other meta that the player's own can be used). The winner takes the whole pot; if there are multiple winners then the pot is divided evenly between them.
So, that's the big mechanic that helps to give the GM a little more active role. A good GM plays a psychological game and has the players dancing to the tune; meta is just the most obvious tool at his disposal ;)

Any thoughts? Am I a terrible person? Sounds fun? Like it? Hate it? I turned you into a newt? Thoughts? Comments? Suggestions?

Finlam
2013-06-19, 12:28 PM
Time for a major update! This one covers one of the main mechanics for design goal #3 as well as the GM's ability to encourage player competition in game.

Meta
Meta: Meta is a metagame resource: a resource that player's posses, not their characters. At any time, a player may spend one meta to change a die that has just been rolled by tipping the die onto an adjacent side. Once the die has been tipped, it cannot be tipped onto an adjacent side again, without spending additional meta.

For example, Bob rolls a 6 on his attack against the big bad monster. Alice is pretty sure that if Bob hits with the attack, that he will land the last hit on the big bad monster and be rewarded with additional XP. Alice remedies this situation by spending 1 meta to flip the die over, onto a 2. Bob's attack will no longer hit, but he has no meta to change the die back. Bob, realizing the danger, decides to take the only reasonable course of action: he turns to John and asks John to use his meta to help him with the attack. John agrees for an in game item and a beer. Bob reluctantly accepts the deal and John spends one meta to flip the die back. Unfortunately, John is a little clumsy and only flips the die onto a 4. Bob's attack roll total is now 4 + the level of his ability. If Alice has additional meta, she can change it again, or other players can choose to affect the die as well.

At the start of the game, each player starts with 3 meta. Once these meta are spent, they cannot be gained back. All additional meta is given out by the GM for criteria determined by the GM. Those criteria depend solely on the atmosphere that the GM wishes to create: for a psudo-serious session, meta may be given out for exceptional role-playing, for a particularly competitive session, it may be given out for back-stabbery, for any session it may be given out for bribing the GM with additional drinks and pizza. The GM should try to be generally consistent when rewarding players with meta, but should provide just enough as rewards for random or meta-game actions to keep the players on their toes.

Finally, players can trade meta freely in exchange for food, beverages, in game items, favors, the antidote to the poison they just drank, etc... Lastly, player's may bet meta on the outcome of any event. If a player starts a betting pool, he states clearly what the terms are, for example "Bret the beer drinking bard will out drink the dwarven bartender in a drinking challenge" and then he states how much meta he is betting. If another players want to enter the bet, they put forward just as much meta. Meta that is currently being bet, cannot be used (though other meta that the player's own can be used). The winner takes the whole pot; if there are multiple winners then the pot is divided evenly between them.
So, that's the big mechanic that helps to give the GM a little more active role. A good GM plays a psychological game and has the players dancing to the tune; meta is just the most obvious tool at his disposal ;)

Any thoughts? Am I a terrible person? Sounds fun? Like it? Hate it? I turned you into a newt? Thoughts? Comments? Suggestions?
I like this mechanic! It sounds like a good way to get the players more into the game. I'd be interested to see if certain items gave meta or if players got meta for achieving character goals.

TSGames
2013-06-20, 01:46 PM
I like this mechanic! It sounds like a good way to get the players more into the game. I'd be interested to see if certain items gave meta or if players got meta for achieving character goals.

One again, the Playground is too clever by half!

Some items will give meta; completion of character goals also grants a small amount of meta. Meaning that the first to achieve a goal or get an item could gain a huge metagame advantage. If I was devious I would have some of the goals include obtaining items, just to keep the players guessing...

polymachine
2013-06-20, 05:50 PM
Meta sounds like an excellent source of paranoia, mistrust and backstabbery. Especially combined with the paranoia already given by not knowing the random goals of your party members.


I really like the Igor class idea. [...] Morbid, funny, passively threatening; absolutely perfect.

Okay since that is the direction you're going, I have two more suggestions:


Conspiracy Theorist: Constantly telling everyone how they are all connected and trying to get at him, or somebody he sympathizes with and therefore wants to "open their eyes", also liable to cause TPKs just so that the Aliens showing him a computer simulation of an adventure are thrown off. (Possibly a rogue like class?)
Mime: Just think about it ... its a Mime. A Clown that just stares at you ... and never says a word of why he's even in the party :smalleek: (possibly a caster with gesture based magic, e.g. silence field, invisble wall and strong winds ?)


I hope that appeases your tastes, great creator ^^


One again, the Playground is too clever by half!

Some items will give meta; completion of character goals also grants a small amount of meta. Meaning that the first to achieve a goal or get an item could gain a huge metagame advantage. If I was devious I would have some of the goals include obtaining items, just to keep the players guessing...

Depending on how hard the goals are going to be to fulfill (and therefore how long the game's gonna last) and how many different item's there are going to be, it seems like the item-gain goals will have to be crafted very delicately to fit with the rest.

Goals like "last-hit X Monsters over your level (i.e. bosses)" or "cause the death of X party members" are easily tuned, but "find the left turning helical staff of greater biological discomfort" seems like it depends wholly on how many other items there are, which is not as easily changed, especially thanks to the law of diminishing returns. I don't know, would it be "easier" to have them find a set of similarly themed armor or weapons?

TSGames
2013-06-25, 04:42 AM
Meta sounds like an excellent source of paranoia, mistrust and backstabbery. Especially combined with the paranoia already given by not knowing the random goals of your party members.

Thank you, sir. That's exactly where I was going with it =)




Okay since that is the direction you're going, I have two more suggestions:


Conspiracy Theorist: Constantly telling everyone how they are all connected and trying to get at him, or somebody he sympathizes with and therefore wants to "open their eyes", also liable to cause TPKs just so that the Aliens showing him a computer simulation of an adventure are thrown off. (Possibly a rogue like class?)
Mime: Just think about it ... its a Mime. A Clown that just stares at you ... and never says a word of why he's even in the party :smalleek: (possibly a caster with gesture based magic, e.g. silence field, invisble wall and strong winds ?)


I hope that appeases your tastes, great creator ^^

I like these classes too! The conspiracy theorist would fit in well for the murder mystery variant that I'd like to get up and going, but that's a story for another day. The mime would be fantastic! I would certainly have to require that he act all of his character's communication XD

Also on the note of mimes, if you haven't seen it, I may take some inspiration from this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRZ-jLOrFfk).



Depending on how hard the goals are going to be to fulfill (and therefore how long the game's gonna last) and how many different item's there are going to be, it seems like the item-gain goals will have to be crafted very delicately to fit with the rest.

Goals like "last-hit X Monsters over your level (i.e. bosses)" or "cause the death of X party members" are easily tuned, but "find the left turning helical staff of greater biological discomfort" seems like it depends wholly on how many other items there are, which is not as easily changed, especially thanks to the law of diminishing returns. I don't know, would it be "easier" to have them find a set of similarly themed armor or weapons?

Once again, you hit the nail on the head. There are a few twist to the items and the item collection goals. No goals as specific as "collect the unsanitary dagger of salmonella" as that is a goal that may not be achievable in all games . Some goals will be harder than others, but the rewards will also be higher.

--------------------------------
Sorry for not posting updates for a couple of days, it's really busy around here. There will be a rather large update later this week that should start to tie some things together pretty nicely. Stay tuned =D

polymachine
2013-08-07, 07:21 AM
Sorry for not posting updates for a couple of days, it's really busy around here. There will be a rather large update later this week that should start to tie some things together pretty nicely. Stay tuned =D

Sooo .... did the whole thing collapse then? :smallconfused:

TSGames
2013-08-28, 05:51 PM
Sorry for not checking in, I haven't been on the forum all that much lately! It's been a busy last couple months with moves and medical and pet stuff and a ton of excuses, but that's over now!

http://b.vimeocdn.com/ts/275/709/275709559_640.jpg



Sooo .... did the whole thing collapse then?


Quite the opposite! In fact, I've just recently printed off the first deck and started testing. I'm making just a few tweaks before I release the alpha version. There will be a few more updates to the thread, but most news will now be posted on the official blog (http://topsecretgames.net/blog) (dun,dun,duuuunnnnn)!

/shameless plug: There's also the twitter (https://twitter.com/CaptSteampunk), where random stuff and updates will happen a couple times per week.

Also, I'll be a bit more active in checking the Playground; if anyone wants to participate in the alpha test, this is the place to post. Likewise, if you have any questions, thoughts, or comments, feel free to post, scream, yell, or fwollop in the thread and I'll get back to you.

erikun
2013-08-29, 01:14 AM
If I may offer critique on a few ideas?

First, you seem to be putting together a psudo-board game here. As such, you might want to look into how similar games work for other ideas or ways to handle things.

You didn't really specify the dice rolling mechanic. I'm assuming 1d6+bonus, although it isn't really specified. I assume it will be stated clearly in examples, but it's probably good to point out so that you don't forget it.

You indicate wanting to use d6 because it's easy to find, but require a special deck of cards to run it. It's not inheritly a problem, but reading the introduction I assumed it would just be rolling dice.

Is there any reason you're specifying between magic equipment and mundane equipment? In-game, it probably wouldn't make much of a difference after all. Equipment would either be single-use (and so a smokebomb to attack first isn't different from a magic wand that does the same) or can be worn (magic armor the same a good mundane armor).

The easiest way to run combat is to have the players make an awareness roll. Success means they spotted the encounter first and go first. Failure means ambush and they go second. Combat resolves in turns, with all the players taking actions then all the opponents taking actions. Much easier to handle.

Attacks dealing 1 HP (except for abilities or specific weapons) makes sense. Keep that.

You do not need a "danger zone" for characters. If they have 0 HP, they're knocked out and can't do anything until they recover - rolling a 6, healing spell, health item, or whatever. The character would only die if something happens to them at that point. (Perhaps monsters kill characters if they're knocked out and all other allies leave combat.)

You shouldn't need XP for a one-shot, pick up and play game. Most such games don't even have XP. If you still want levels, you could just give out a level every time a player accomplishes their goals, ranging from Level 0 to Level 3 (for all three). And if I may make a suggestion, simplifying rolls to "1d6+Level" would make things run much faster. Players would get a bonus if they specialized in a skill, or had equipment that granted a bonus. Speaking of which...

It would be much simplier to have players choose three skills to "specialize" in, granting them a bonus with rolls, rather than worrying about skill points and such. Specializing would add a +1 or +2 to rolls, depending on which is more balancing.

Meta is interesting, although I would personally name it "Luck" for the game. I'd also want some way of gaining luck, perhaps by exchanging one item for one point of Meta/Luck, or something similar.

TSGames
2013-08-29, 06:14 AM
You didn't really specify the dice rolling mechanic. I'm assuming 1d6+bonus, although it isn't really specified. I assume it will be stated clearly in examples, but it's probably good to point out so that you don't forget it.

The Playground is full of people with sharp eyes, thank you for lending me your pair =)

The first post does not contain all the mechanics of the system, but rather just enough to give you a feel for it. There will be future updates with the specifics of the dice rolling, HP/death, victory conditions, items, and a few other things as well. Right now it's a bit of a toss up as to how much of the mechanics will be released via post/update vs how many will be released with the rule sheet for the alpha version. Stay tuned ;)


You indicate wanting to use d6 because it's easy to find, but require a special deck of cards to run it. It's not inheritly a problem, but reading the introduction I assumed it would just be rolling dice.

The reason for the cards ultimately boils down to it being more manageable than books. To expound on that: the core mechanics of the game are simple and flexible, if you want to run campaigns using these mechanics or create your own classes/characters/items, the mechanics should be perfectly up to task. However, in the interest of making it easy to do a short one-shot adventure game the cards are provided to help make quick characters, items, bad guys, and classes. The cards are an efficient alternative to a cumbersome book.

If, however, you do want to do a session just rolling the dice, there will be rules for that as well. Think of the cards as more of a 'quick start'. When you need a campaign now, they facilitate, but do not provide in themselves, a quick and easy setup. In short, they are there for your convenience and are not mandatory to enjoy the game.



Is there any reason you're specifying between magic equipment and mundane equipment? In-game, it probably wouldn't make much of a difference after all. Equipment would either be single-use (and so a smokebomb to attack first isn't different from a magic wand that does the same) or can be worn (magic armor the same a good mundane armor).

The distinction between magic and mundane equipment will be better defined in future updates; as it stands now, it might be good to think of magic equipment as just equipment that is better or at least different via magical enhancement. A sword is good, a magic sword is better, a hat is good, a magic hat is better. The item stats/capabilities are better for a magic item, that's about it. (After all, a talking hat is way better than normal one, right?)



The easiest way to run combat is to have the players make an awareness roll. Success means they spotted the encounter first and go first. Failure means ambush and they go second. Combat resolves in turns, with all the players taking actions then all the opponents taking actions. Much easier to handle.

Attacks dealing 1 HP (except for abilities or specific weapons) makes sense. Keep that.

You do not need a "danger zone" for characters. If they have 0 HP, they're knocked out and can't do anything until they recover - rolling a 6, healing spell, health item, or whatever. The character would only die if something happens to them at that point. (Perhaps monsters kill characters if they're knocked out and all other allies leave combat.)

You shouldn't need XP for a one-shot, pick up and play game. Most such games don't even have XP. If you still want levels, you could just give out a level every time a player accomplishes their goals, ranging from Level 0 to Level 3 (for all three). And if I may make a suggestion, simplifying rolls to "1d6+Level" would make things run much faster. Players would get a bonus if they specialized in a skill, or had equipment that granted a bonus. Speaking of which...


All good suggestions. However, the combat system, the leveling system, the item system, the HP system are all designed with rule number three in mind:
3.There should be some amount of competition between players ranging from friendly to one person wins the night
While a flat level game may make it simpler, having players compete for levels is much more in the spirit of the game. That's not to say that there aren't somewhat chummy modes of play, there certainly are. However, by having the competitive aspects from initiative, combat, leveling, and death players are encouraged to remember that it may be a team sport, but they're all still trying to be MVP.

This harkens back to the Paranoia and Munchkin inspirations of the game, though it is toned down quite a bit(from Paranoia, anyway). Without some competition it wouldn't be One Shot, it would be any other d6 based RPG.


It would be much simplier to have players choose three skills to "specialize" in, granting them a bonus with rolls, rather than worrying about skill points and such. Specializing would add a +1 or +2 to rolls, depending on which is more balancing.

You've come dangerously close to hitting the nail on the head. I'll be posting pictures of the first deck soon along with a more detailed explanation of leveling and class design. Classes and leveling in this game are a lot simpler than that of D&D and other tabletops. The goal of the class design is to be simple, functional, and fun.


Meta is interesting, although I would personally name it "Luck" for the game. I'd also want some way of gaining luck, perhaps by exchanging one item for one point of Meta/Luck, or something similar.
I'm glad you're intrigued by Meta, the game wouldn't be the same without it. I appreciate the feedback, check in throughout this next week to see detailed explanations of the initiative system, pictures of the first deck, and a breakdown of the class system.

It's good be back on the Playground =D

TSGames
2013-09-02, 03:22 PM
As promised, here's an in-depth look into the design and play of initiative in One Shot. There's a little bit more of a preface over at the blog (http://www.topsecretgames.net/blog/), and it should look a lot better on mobile devices too.

Initiative in One Shot

Initiative is included in One Shot for the same reason it is included in traditional RPGs: to resolve narrative disputes. However, a good mechanic should always reflect the core design of the system. Let's take a look at goals of the system design:


1.It must be playable when slightly inebriated
2.The mechanics must be simple and fast without dragging on or rules lawyering
3.There should be some amount of competition between players ranging from friendly to one person wins the night
Magnificent rules for a game! But what does it mean for the initiative system? To keep it short: resolving narrative disputes isn't enough, it needs to be simple and make the players rub elbows a little bit. To this end, initiative in One Shot works a little different than in your traditional RPG. First, to speed things up, initiative is only rolled only once for each side; it's up for the team members to decide individual order. Second, who ever calls it first rolls for initiative, but can instead choose to pass the honor to someone else. Finally, whoever rolls initiative for their team must act first. Let's have an example:

Standing on the wooden deck, you see a multitude of grappling hooks fly over the rails. In a flash, a dozen pirates have scrambled up the sides of the vessel, swords drawn and ready for battle.

At this point, Jim declares "I'm rolling initiative!" and rolls a six sided die. Everyone else at the table looks at each other. They know that Jim is low on HP and has been joking about leaving them on the ship if pirates attacked. They also know that Jim's character is currently standing next to the only lifeboat on the ship. Fortunately, on his turn, Jim instead chooses to attack a pirate. After taking him down, Jim is only one first blood away from completing his character goal which will award him additional Meta and XP.

That's it for initiative. A quick and simple system that encourages players to leap into combat, act first, and ask questions later. Take note, if Jim had simply been the first to declare he was rolling initiative, but not rolled, the other players could have then tried to convince or bribe him for the privilege of rolling initiative.

polymachine
2013-09-03, 08:00 AM
Still alive? Awesome! :smallbiggrin:
I was slowly giving up hope tbh..


Also, I'll be a bit more active in checking the Playground; if anyone wants to participate in the alpha test, this is the place to post.

:elan: {Ooh! Ooh! Me! Pick mee!) (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0002.html)

Seriously though, I'd be honored to help out ^^
(If you're okay with Europeans, what with time management and all..)

TSGames
2013-09-04, 06:41 AM
Still alive? Awesome! :smallbiggrin:
I was slowly giving up hope tbh..



:elan: {Ooh! Ooh! Me! Pick mee!) (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0002.html)

Seriously though, I'd be honored to help out ^^
(If you're okay with Europeans, what with time management and all..)

No problem! Glad to have ya =D

Look for a bigger update tonight with some pictures (although it may be a little late for you people living in the future =P )

Thunderfist12
2013-09-04, 07:47 AM
Thunderfist12 would like to test the game...

TSGames
2013-09-05, 06:13 AM
Thunderfist12 would like to test the game...

No problem, I'll start adding people to a list in the first post.

Here's a big update (http://www.topsecretgames.net/blog/).
Let me know if you like it, hate it, want to burn it, etc.

Pictures of the first deck, a little bit of explanation, and a little bit of future design goals. All in all, not too shabby. There's still a lot to improve on and many things to do before it's even ready for an alpha release (to say nothing of beta :smalleek: ), but it's a great starting point.

Should have a few more pictures and some info on classes up within this next week.

Any thoughts on the first deck so far? Suggestions? Insults? Shenaniganry?

polymachine
2013-09-05, 11:34 AM
The card design seems straight forward, Magic is probably a good base line for the cards; I think Munchkin cards would be also, since it's very much in the spirit of this game.

The flavor text is vital in my opinion, because it gives the card a lot of humor and a counter point to the descriptive title ... Also what would an RPG be without flavor text?! Flavorless, is what.

Not sure about the listing of abilities... I mean the abilities are fine, it's just the literal "ability 1" thing that make sit sound like the card would have to level up t get "ability 2" as well. Maybe just head them with "Abilities:" and then list them with bullet points?

Other than that, great starting point ^^
You can fill the blank cards with humorous doodles in the meantime =D

TSGames
2013-09-07, 08:05 AM
You can fill the blank cards with humorous doodles in the meantime =D
I was thinking the exact same thing =D

About the 'ability 1', 'ability 2' thing: that's mostly because I haven't named all the abilities yet and needed placeholder names. That will be one of the next things to be fixed. Also, I like the idea of looking at Munchkin cards for design inspiration, and I may draw a little heavier on that in future revisions.

I'm glad you like the flavor text; it was one of my favorite parts too. =D

Sometime in the next couple days I should have pictures up of the example class cards which will go for miles toward providing a better explanation of class design than written text.

TSGames
2013-09-15, 07:16 PM
**UPDATE**

Some of you may have noticed that I have not uploadrd the class pictures this week. I can't promise a good reason for it, but I can give you truth: staring at the alpha deck, I decided that the first class cards I reveal needed to have a little bit of pizzazz (to use the technical term). That's not to say that the current class cards are pizzazzless, oh no, they've got plenty of it, but I really want the first class cards I reveal to have the right flavor of pizzazz. (Oddly enough, I happen to think pizzazz would make a great Dorito flavor).

So bear with me, it will be a big update, and I hope you all will enjoy it as much as I have enjoyed working on it.

That said, after a week of no news, I am not so cruel as to leave you completely without an update. With no further delay: I present the updated (current) class skills.


Fancy Feet -Deft, Debonaire, dashing, maneuvers, and dancing.
Awareness - What's going on?
Theivery - Grubbiness of mitts.
Seduction - ;)
Convince - Talk your way into and out of all the trouble you can.
Gabling - We're concerned you may have a problem.
Athletics - Run, Jump, Swim, Bowl your way to victory!
Houdini - Magic tricks and sleight of hand.
Sprint - How quick are you on your feet?
Identify - Before I drink this: What is it?


Why the change? For starters, it knocks the skills down to 10, which is a nice even number. =P

Sorry, I couldn't type that with a straight face. The real reason is that there was simply too much overlap between the skills. The skills need to be unique: not step on each other's toes, and they need to provide a rough idea of what they do by name. In this way, it gets a lot easier to choose which skill to use when, and when you don't know which skill to use, default to sprint.

What you will see in the class card update is that skill are handled somewhat differently from traditional tabletop RPGs. The players have a little less control over their skills, which is not a bad thing at all.

-As always, I am open to suggestions, criticism, insults, and bribery.

TSGames
2013-10-01, 11:49 AM
Another update is coming later tonight along with some good news.

;)

Yakk
2013-10-01, 12:52 PM
Meta is neat with the "rotate the die", but with "higher is better" it is a no brainer.

Maybe if you stole ORE mechanics with your d6s -- a success is a matching set.

That would also let you do away with initiative -- everyone rolls.

Each round you'd do an Attack and a Maneuver, maybe (gasp) using different kinds of dice.

Successful attempts are represented by pairs of dice.

6s go first, then 5s, then 4s, then 3s, then 2s, then 1s.

Higher level folk have more dice, so get more pairs, so do more actions. But even barely competent folk have 4d6 (2d6 attack, 2d6 maneuver), which is enough to usually get at least a pair.

Distinguish between damage and advantage somehow, or maybe parries, dunno.

TSGames
2013-10-01, 07:39 PM
http://media.screened.com/uploads/0/4987/303690-good_news_everyone.jpg

=D

The class update is out on the blog (http://www.topsecretgames.net/blog/?p=73). This time, we cover ability and class design in OneShot, as well as a little bit about the layout of the cards (which will be gloriously updated in the near future). To give you a quick rundown of how class abilities are designed:
*Every class has 3 abilities
*Each class has one ability that levels up its class skills.
*Class skills are set by picking the class, they do not change.
*The two other abilities are unique to their class.
*Each ability has a max level of 3.
*Each ability starts at level 0.
*An ability can only be used if it is at least level 1.
*Each time an ability is leveled it either A) becomes better or B) has a higher chance of succeeding.

The pictures help to give a better feel for the layout and design (you can also click on them to make them bigger). As always, I am open criticism, advice, good times, and bribery.

[EDIT]
OOOps. I forgot to mention: updating should be more regular on the blog from here on out. As for the thread, it will be updated more often than it has been lately. Look for an update coming to answer some intentionally unanswered questions, as well as an update going into greater detail about items and their role in OneShot.

TSGames
2013-11-01, 09:44 PM
Hey guys, I've got some good news.

I've been working on One Shot for a while and I know that I haven't been the best about keeping the Playground thread up to date.

The good news is that I've been busy developing One Shot and another project. But just because I'm working on another project doesn't mean that development of One Shot has suffered. In fact, there's only one thing standing between One Shot and its free alpha release to the playground: my ruthless sense of quasi-perfectionism.

Here's a look at what One Shot currently has going for it:
*A functioning and complete rule system
*Four developed classes
*Two written adventures
*Over thirty different magical items

This isn't a bad place to be and the lazy guy in my brain is saying "It's good enough for alpha release, just put it out there already!"

http://www.reuniting.info/images/pot2.gif
What's the worst that could happen?

But the perfectionist in my brain keeps insisting that it's not yet time, just keep tweaking it and add a little here and there. But I realize the danger of this approach lies in perfection being forever one more improvement away.

So I've decided on a compromise between the two parts of my brain. I'm going to continue to work on One Shot a little while longer, but only until I meet designated goals. Once these goals are met I will release it to the Playground for the free alpha test. Then the real work starts. 0_0'

Just so you can hold me to it, here are my goals for the alpha release:
*A decent looking, easily printable rulesheet
*Three written adventures
*Six unique classes
*Upwards of 40 unique magic items
*Newly redesigned class cards

I'm about 80%-90% done with most of these goals, but it's last 10% that's always the hardest.

http://morbidholiday.com/comics-bestof/the-last-ten-percent-thumb.png
It's like this, but fun. Right? Right?

I've decided to devote a lot more time and care to this project as it enters its final stage before alpha release. To that end, I won't be actively updating the Playground thread anymore. I will still check in on it, so if you have any questions, concerns, or complaints, this is still the place to post them.

When all my goals are met, I'll start a new thread specifically for the alpha release. Speaking of which, if you would like to sign up for the alpha release, just visit the TopSecret blog (http://www.topsecretgames.net/blog/) and enter your email. Check back regularly as the blog is now updating every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. (And Monday is a pretty cool article comparing the design of some popular trading card games).

Thank you all so much for your support thus far. There's quite a bit more work to go, but if you stick with me, you won't be disappointed.