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View Full Version : Creative Writing and Roleplaying, are they two ways of scratching the same itch?



celtois
2013-05-30, 11:32 PM
Much like the title says. Thus far I've been deprived of a roleplaying game this summer, in large part due to difficulties setting up with local players, and a lack of games that use systems I want to play on the online PBP forums I frequent.

Recently as a challenge to myself I've started an extended NANOWrimo esque thing. I'm trying to write a novel by the end of the summer. Thus far I've been finding it really helps scratch my roleplaying itch.

So I'm curious what do other people thing, do you find creative writing a good way to satisfy your desire to role-play, if not why do you think it doesn't succeed for you.

Is this a common phenomenon among roleplayers? Or does roleplaying serve a purpose for many roleplayers that creative writing cannot.

Mr Beer
2013-05-30, 11:37 PM
Running RPG games is the perfect blend of writing, socialising and narrative creation for me. I should mention that I'm not hugely keen on any of these things purely for their own sake. YMMV.

Tengu_temp
2013-05-31, 03:14 AM
Nope. Roleplaying and creative writing are completely different things for me. The former is a spontaneous group exercise, the latter is something you plan and do on your own - other people's participation is limited to giving input.

Zaggab
2013-05-31, 09:01 AM
There is some crossover, but they're not completely the same thing.
The main difference is in creative writing, you have control over events, character reactions and interactions, while in roleplaing, you don't. If you approach GMing as you would creative writing, it leads to railroading.

However, in other areas it's very closely related.
Playing a PC or NPC is excellent exercise for getting to know the voice of a character, and to get a feeling for the inner psychology of a character.
Creating settings and communicating the settings idea and flavor are important for both GMing and creative writing.
Creating a lot of NPCs with acceptable backgrounds and reasonable but distinct character personalities is great practice for creative writing.

The Rose Dragon
2013-05-31, 09:07 AM
I don't quite think they are. When I want to write, I write. When I want to roleplay... well, I can't roleplay, but writing does not make me want to roleplay less. However, to me, both are social events, and they have some overlap.

neonchameleon
2013-05-31, 09:19 AM
Much like the title says. Thus far I've been deprived of a roleplaying game this summer, in large part due to difficulties setting up with local players, and a lack of games that use systems I want to play on the online PBP forums I frequent.

Recently as a challenge to myself I've started an extended NANOWrimo esque thing. I'm trying to write a novel by the end of the summer. Thus far I've been finding it really helps scratch my roleplaying itch.

So I'm curious what do other people thing, do you find creative writing a good way to satisfy your desire to role-play, if not why do you think it doesn't succeed for you.

Is this a common phenomenon among roleplayers? Or does roleplaying serve a purpose for many roleplayers that creative writing cannot.

Gah. You're drifting into Forge/GNS territory here (which I've summarised on my blog (the Forge itself appearing to be down) (http://eudaimonaiaclaughter.wordpress.com/2013/05/27/forging-motivation-game-design-is-mind-control)). But suffice to say storytelling is one of the motivations for players, and the Dramatist part of GDS should probably be split into "Storytelling" and "Safe inter-personal drama" anyway.

Step on Up - i.e. Gamist Play is another one. Outwitting what should be an overwhelmingly powerful dungeon or overwhelming adversaries through sheer skill. And then there's the metagame.

So there are plenty of itches that writing doesn't scratch that roleplaying does. But roleplaying as a form of collaborative storytelling is well known. (And if that's what you want to do I'd suggest getting your hands on both Fate Core (http://www.evilhat.com/home/fate-core-downloads/) and Fiasco (http://www.bullypulpitgames.com/games/fiasco/) if you don't already know them).

Jay R
2013-05-31, 10:01 AM
You need to be more specific.

Preparing to DM a session, or starting a new universe as a DM, scratches the Creative Writing itch.

DMing a session scratches the improvising itch, and the "show people what I wrote" itch, but not the creative writing itch.

Creating a character scratches the problem-solving itch mostly, and the creative writing itch a little.

Playing scratches the acting itch primarily, and the creative writing itch almost not at all.

[I got as deeply involved in the SCA as I did because it was the only place where I could scratch the role-playing itch, the fencing itch, the camping itch, the social itch, the poetry itch, and the history itch, all at the same time.]

Kalirren
2013-05-31, 11:13 AM
For me it just isn't the same thing without another person. I RP for social interaction, and for the immersion of adopting another persona. Creative writing does it only to a certain extent.

One of my closest friends in college roleplayed to scratch her acting and storytelling itches. Writing held very little appeal to her.

valadil
2013-05-31, 04:59 PM
There's definitely some overlap between GMing and writing. I don't find creative writing as satisfying, but I don't think that's the case for everyone. I don't find as much overlap between playing and writing.

Raimun
2013-05-31, 05:34 PM
Hmm... I'm not sure. Roleplaying is about overcoming challenges and playing a role. You have to improvise and react to your surroundings... or make the other characters improvise and react to what you do.

When you're writing a story, you are in complete control of the story. You can plan all the events and decide what everyone says.

Basically, roleplaying is more... chaotic? For example, poetic justice. Let's say you have a group of people who get in to adventures together. They meet a pretty major villain (not The Main Villain) who is antagonizing particularly one member of the group (let's call him "Hero A") and a grudge is formed between them. Now it's personal.

Sometime later, they meet the villain again and there will be a fight to the death.

In a novel (or whatever), 9 times out of 10, it'll be Hero A who kills the villain. Dramatic tradition demands it.

In a RPG, 9 times out of 10, it'll be the group's barbarian and not Hero A, who kills the villain.

I should mention I only play, I don't GM. The above is just observation.

Darklord Bright
2013-05-31, 05:48 PM
Roleplaying is much closer to improvisational theatre than writing, in practice. In writing, you have complete control over the world and its characters. While while you may occasionally have a flash of inspiration that surprises you, nothing is too greatly unexpected or out of your control. Even the moments where characters seem to 'act' for themselves have to pass through your brain first, and you can tell them what not to do if it is too disruptive.

Roleplay operates on some basically similar principles, but is still very different. Especially if you are not in complete control of the world. Entire world-changing events and characters are completely out of your control, unless you're planning things with your partner/s in advance. Even then, your partners can still genuinely surprise you or hide important information from you. Roleplay is generally less about planning and building and more about reacting and understanding your part. Being a good writer might not even assist your roleplay skill, either. Things that are good in writing are not always good in roleplay. Certain character and narrative concepts are awkward or non-cooperative in a roleplay when they would be fine in a work of fiction, for example.

Really, while they come from the same place, I don't feel that they truly meet at the same place, if I'm making any sense at all.

Frozen_Feet
2013-05-31, 06:08 PM
No.

There's some overlap, and I tend to use RPG-crafting to scratch my creative writing itch.

But writing for RPGs, and actually playing them, are two very different things.

For starters, the latter has a social aspect that is completely missing from the former. And it also has a game aspect, and the unpredictability it implies.

I find playing chess or computer games actually scratches my RPG itch much better than writing.

Geostationary
2013-06-01, 02:05 AM
The biggest overlap I really see with the two is that both are good place to generate/throw interesting ideas and setpieces at; naturally how they develop and are used will be very different between the two.

Barsoom
2013-06-01, 03:02 AM
I like to create a world, a character, or a challenge, and share it with other people. I like the interactive aspect of RPG, the back-and-forth, the unpredictability, the knowledge that the story may go anywhere, I like the fact there are other people participating in the story. It's completely different from writing (and yes, I write too, but not as keen on it as I am on RPGs).

The Rose Dragon
2013-06-01, 04:05 AM
It is kind of weird to see how most people prefer roleplaying to creative writing, but I guess it is because the thread is in Roleplaying Games. I wonder if the responses would be different if posted in Arts & Crafts instead.

Jay R
2013-06-01, 09:11 AM
It is kind of weird to see how most people prefer roleplaying to creative writing, but I guess it is because the thread is in Roleplaying Games. I wonder if the responses would be different if posted in Arts & Crafts instead.

Of course. We're here because we like role-playing.

Post it in an embroidery forum somewhere, and most people will prefer embroidery.

Rhynn
2013-06-01, 09:27 AM
Nope. Roleplaying and creative writing are completely different things for me. The former is a spontaneous group exercise, the latter is something you plan and do on your own - other people's participation is limited to giving input.

Same. I think GMs who think they're novelists are particularly dangerous for a game. A good writer can make a great GM, but someone who just wants to be a writer may make the worst kind.

But part of a GM's usual job does come quite close: creating the setting. It's a very specific kind of applied creative writing, where you need to account for gaming considerations, but create writing within set boundaries is always more fun anyway (and forces you to be better).

That's the trick: it's not the game session, or even planning the adventure, where you should be scratching your creative writing itch. It's the creation of the world. And you can't just write reams of prose there, either: you need to write effectively (just like any real author), towards specific goals and in a specific style. (Playability and conciseness, IMO.)


(the Forge itself appearing to be down)

It closed down a good while ago.


Preparing to DM a session, or starting a new universe as a DM, scratches the Creative Writing itch.

DMing a session scratches the improvising itch, and the "show people what I wrote" itch, but not the creative writing itch.

Creating a character scratches the problem-solving itch mostly, and the creative writing itch a little.

Playing scratches the acting itch primarily, and the creative writing itch almost not at all.

This is a pretty good breakdown, although the latter two obviously vary from player to player.

Raum
2013-06-01, 09:56 AM
So I'm curious what do other people thing, do you find creative writing a good way to satisfy your desire to role-play, if not why do you think it doesn't succeed for you.

Is this a common phenomenon among roleplayers? Or does roleplaying serve a purpose for many roleplayers that creative writing cannot.No. I think you're seeing some correlation but that's not the same as causation at all.

Personally, writing frustrates me - it's too much like work. With a game I can simply throw an outline of ideas down, create a few NPCs, and get to the fun of play. I don't want (or need) to write much!

I've also noticed that gaming is a hobby much like any other hobby. It's an enjoyable way of filling a few hours but, unless it has become an obsession, those hours can be filled by any hobby you like and provide just as much enjoyment. :)

neonchameleon
2013-06-01, 09:17 PM
Same. I think GMs who think they're novelists are particularly dangerous for a game. A good writer can make a great GM, but someone who just wants to be a writer may make the worst kind.

But part of a GM's usual job does come quite close: creating the setting. It's a very specific kind of applied creative writing, where you need to account for gaming considerations, but create writing within set boundaries is always more fun anyway (and forces you to be better).

Depends on your game - a lot of modern games the players have a lot of control of the setting (see Smallville, Apocalypse World, Fate Core, and others for details). Any gamist game they really really don't. And agreed on GMs who want to be writers forcing PCs through railroad plots.


It closed down a good while ago.

The forums closed down in 2005 - but the entire website appears to be down, as is Lumpley Games and the Apocalypse World site. I suspect a shared server - I'm sure the Apocalypse World site and Lumpley were working a month ago.

Edit: Lumpley Games has been having problems for the last month (http://www.lumpley.com/).