thoughts and opinions please!

[blelliot]

I've decided to run a low magic campaign. I'm using a mage order of my own designed to keep a very close hold on arcane magic in the world, while the priesthoods of the various gods keep a hold on the divine magic. These two plot devices are to help keep magic on the down low. The druids of the world will also be keeping tabs on their own kind as well. The question I have is what opinions does anyone have on this idea? I want any constructive critiques on my new idea. Thanks!

[Waker]

I've decided to run a low magic campaign. I'm using a mage order of my own designed to keep a very close hold on arcane magic in the world, while the priesthoods of the various gods keep a hold on the divine magic. These two plot devices are to help keep magic on the down low. The druids of the world will also be keeping tabs on their own kind as well. The question I have is what opinions does anyone have on this idea? I want any constructive critiques on my new idea. Thanks!

How exactly are they "keeping tabs" on everyone? Will there be an Order of Mages (Priest/Druids) who hunt down transgressors and make sure everyone is playing nice? Will there be a restriction on what spells the players will have access to?
If you want to run a low magic campaign, you might want to look at E6, which can let characters be heroes without having access to the insane levels of power that magic can grant. You might also consider replacing the standard classes with toned-down casters like Beguilers, Healers, and Binders.

[ArcturusV]

Basically... yeah. The only setting I can think of that really did something akin to this is Krynn. The Tower of High Sorcery "tested" everyone in a potentially crippling, sanity shattering, deadly test in order to become a licensed mage... and if you didn't take their test they'd send people to hunt you down and stab you in the face.

Clerics would have an easier time "keeping tabs" in that vein due to generally having more and better divinations and at lower levels.

Mages would have a harder go of it. Not impossible. But harder. Druids generally being a fraternity where you have to be taught to be a druid, you can't just "pick it up" naturally allows druids to know all the druids in operation.

So it's really the Mages you have to worry about. No one is going to be a Druid without other Druids knowing about them and potentially policing the situation. Might even want to look at older editions if you REALLY want to be severe. They used to have rules like "There can only ever be 10 druids of level 11 in the world. If you would reach level 11, you don't until you can arrange a challenge and dispose one of the level 11 druids".

But Mages. How are you gonna keep tabs on a Mage? They don't NEED an organization. Mages are perfectly capable of learning all on their own, be it Sorcerers or Wizards. They don't need some Academy or organization. They generally don't have as good Divinations to just "know" stuff until they hit prohibitively high levels (Meaning you're not going to have enough Wizards of a high enough level to be able to keep tabs on everyone).

[blelliot]

How exactly are they "keeping tabs" on everyone? Will there be an Order of Mages (Priest/Druids) who hunt down transgressors and make sure everyone is playing nice? Will there be a restriction on what spells the players will have access to.

Yes to both. The Order of the Magi (original, I know lol) has a "secret police", Comprised of an order of assassins and anti magic warriors that are on constant lookout for arcane users that are abusing the privelidge of magic. The clerics keep tabs with not so draconic of methods, believing that all the priests of their diety will know what to do with the power granted to them. The druids work in an almost "alpha male/female" heirarchy. All casters will have the spells they can learn restricted. The wizards will have to go through a liscensing procedure to learn their spells. The clerics must pass tests of faith, and the druids must go on a spirit journey of sorts. The spontaneous casters don't exist in this world either. The binder and the warlock exist as heretical magic classes that are hunted by the order,s assassins constantly

[Waker]

That works then. Make sure to stress to the party the code of conduct that they have to adhere to before the game starts though. Otherwise the party may feel you are unfairly attacking them and limiting their roleplaying options.

[blelliot]

Would allowing the two rogue mage classes I mentioned before( binder and warlock) be a good idea for flavor? The idea of a good person using odd means to do good things sounds appealing but I just don't want it blowing up in the games face

[Waker]

Would allowing the two rogue mage classes I mentioned before( binder and warlock) be a good idea for flavor? The idea of a good person using odd means to do good things sounds appealing but I just don't want it blowing up in the games face

Unless you want the party to be anti-heroes, probably not. If this Order can keep tabs on the use of magic so closely, the party members who play these classes will be under intense scrutiny and constant harassment. If the goal of the campaign is to somehow undermine the authority of the Order and bring it down, go crazy. Otherwise it probably wouldn't be a good idea.

[Sylthia]

You could do something like Baldur's Gate 2, where the Cowled Wizards port in and try to kill anyone they detect using magic.

[blelliot]

Well now for something completly different. Would the two half breed races of the players handbook, would it be a good idea to have them being races that have bred true? If not then are there aany good no la races that could stand in for them?

[Waker]

Well now for something completly different. Would the two half breed races of the players handbook, would it be a good idea to have them being races that have bred true? If not then are there aany good no la races that could stand in for them?

Mechanically there is nothing wrong with that idea, other than the fact that Half Orc/Elves are rather weak compared to the other races. As for breeding true, they can already do that. A half-elf mating with another half-elf makes a third half-elf. Eberron even had a whole thing about one of the societies being mostly about Half-Elves.

[blelliot]

The reason I want to do this is that the other races of the ph represent the "humanized" versions of those races. I will be using the grugach and gray elves for the npc elves, the mountain dwarves for the npc dwarves, the ghostwise halflings, and the forest gnomes. The ph races will be the city dwelling versions. They are the way they are b/c of their prolonged exposure to humans

[Waker]

For "City" Orcs you could use the Sharakim from Races of Destiny. Knock off the LA1 though, I have no idea what the creators were thinking when they judged that one.

[BowStreetRunner]

If you get a chance, try reading 'Beneath the Vaulted Hills' and 'The Compass of the Soul' by Sean Russell. The story revolves around Lord Eldritch, the last living mage, who has been involved in the systematic elimination of all traces of magic from the world.

One interesting concept that is developed in this series is the rise of empiricism (a.k.a. science) in the absence of magic. I mention this because one of the enormous drawbacks of low-magic campaigns is the void created in game balance by the absence of magic available to the party. The challenge-ratings of monsters are designed with the expectation of certain magical resources in the hands of the party and without these, the party can be seriously over-matched by certain challenges. Replacing certain 'magical' resources with similar resources not powered by magic can help to restore this balance.

[blelliot]

Ok. Now for another idea I need some feedback on. I have decided that all the fiends of the lower planes under one ruler. The idea is to use that one "king of the fiends" as the head villan of a campaign. How he does it is he subjugates the demons through force, using the daemons(yugoloths) as his soldiers in addition to his devils. The idea is he acts as the devil of christian mythos. The gods hate him, good, neutral, and evil alike. He wishes to get a piece of divinity for himself and ascend to godhood as the one god. Any thoughts? Anything I may need that I left out?

[Eslin]

I guess provide an incredibly good reason for that force to have not taken over the multiverse

[blelliot]

a treaty with the gods that prevents him from doing just that

[Eslin]

Why would he make such a treaty?

[blelliot]

Well here's the cliff notes of the creation myth of my world. First there was one all powerful diety, and he created the earth and populated it. He then created his first angels to police the world. He then created hell to act as a prison for all the evil dead souls that crossed over.A group of these angels that acted as the guards of hell, led by a cruel angel named appolyon, came to thinkk the god was too soft on the mortals. Appolyon then led a revolution, thinking he could do better. The diety had given these first angels a spark of his divine power and viwed them as his children, so therefore would not smite appolyon. Appolyon, however had no such reservations, and with his special weapon created for just this moment, struck a mortal blow on god. Appolyon, weary from battle, thought he had won. He did not, however, count on the divine energy of the great diety. The essence of god entered the eighteen angels still faithful to him and transformed them into quasi dieties. These beings fully restored to health, appolyon saw his victory almost escaping . Then an idea struck. He surrendered himself and wished to negotiate terms of surrender. He then asked to be banished to hell with his followers. The gods obliged and sent him there. He then began to rule hell and all its inhabitants. The idea was not only that it is better to reign in hell than serve in heaven, but also to unite the fiends that hell began morphing the evil souls into, so he could build an almost unstoppable army. One day, he will most likely storm the gates of heaven and then conquer the prime material plane as well.

[blelliot]

First of all, I want to thank everyone for their feedback, it os helping my new world grow by leaps and bounds:-) second if I'm posting to much and talking everyones ear off about my new world concepts and ideas, I do apologize. I just want to get this new world off the ground. And third, I have another idea I require feedback on. The new world is broken up into an empire and the surrounding countries. The empire consists of the humans and the "humanized" races that live with them. All citizens are equal in this empire, ie there are no slave races. Now to the surrounding countries- there are two elven nations. One is grugach, and I've made them into spirit/nature worshippers akin to ancient native americans. The other is a nation of xenophobic and racist gray elves. These two races split off from one another ages ago, in the vain of the vulcan "logic vs illogic" wars of star trek mythos. The grugach lands are neutral to the empire. The gray elves are hostile to the empire. Next is the nation of mountain dwarves that supply the empire with gems, precious metals, weapons and crafts. They are friendly toward the empire. Next are a naation of ghostwise halflings that are nomadic in an area of plains close to the empire. They are neutral to the empire b/c of constant threat from a tribe of gnolls who I'm modeling after the dothraki from game of thrones. Next is a coastal area where some gnomes live that are also friendly to the empire. Finally, beyond the mountains is a waste land where an alliance of goblinoids and orcs who worship the fiend king appolyon make their residence. Now what I'm looking for thoughts and opinions on what you guys think I should add to make itall come together. I've got pages of notes, so if there are any questions, feel free to ask. Thanks guys!

[ArcturusV]

I wouldn't give the "Nomads" their own lands necessarily. But have them wander among other empires that accept them. Or don't accept them. For example they may be among the Xenophobic Grey Elves against their will, operating as raiders in their territory, maybe even having a few Camps/Bases in Grey Elf territory where they can attack the other elves, or the Empire from and cross into Grey Elf land to evade response.

The halflings are found among all the "Peaceful" empires. Some are just wanderers, herders, traders. Some are thieves, bandits, and the like. Gives them a different sort of feel perhaps.

But it always seems weird to me when a "nomadic" race has a Homeland and defined borders.

[blelliot]

I wouldn't give the "Nomads" their own lands necessarily. But have them wander among other empires that accept them. Or don't accept them. For example they may be among the Xenophobic Grey Elves against their will, operating as raiders in their territory, maybe even having a few Camps/Bases in Grey Elf territory where they can attack the other elves, or the Empire from and cross into Grey Elf land to evade response.

The halflings are found among all the "Peaceful" empires. Some are just wanderers, herders, traders. Some are thieves, bandits, and the like. Gives them a different sort of feel perhaps.

But it always seems weird to me when a "nomadic" race has a Homeland and defined borders.
I did have an idea of that, with using the idea of mecca, the islamic holy city, I.e. the halflings do wander the different lands and once a year they convene in this city that is sacred to them. Which could explain the gnolls and them not getting along at all, the gnolls could control the territory that the city is in. Thanks! Anyone else have anyrthing to add?

[blelliot]

al righty then! Time for a new series of questions! In this world, when a caster levels up, they need to seek approval of the spells they wish to learn, since magic is severely limited and controlled. Does anyone out there have any ideas that they have used? Im currently thinking of something involving the spellcraft skill. All thoughts are appreciated!

[ArcturusV]

Well, Spell Research is a thing in the rules. And either needs to be nixed, or considered as just the main mechanic of gaining spells, depending on what your preference is.

The other solution which uses as many of hte rules as possible is to use the Copy from a Scroll rules for spellbooks (Apply it to Spells Known classes and Divine as well), and just have it so only the "Proper Authorities" actually have spell scrolls.

And having a black market for spell scrolls out there as a natural consequence allowing for those few rogue spellcasters you wanted.

[blelliot]

Alrighty, now for the subject of weapons and armor and other equipment to allow. I've read the arms and equipment guide for an idea of what weapons to allow. I'm shooting for a crusades era feel, and tghat particular book gave me an idea, but the game has so many weapons, and I'm a little over whelmed on what gear would fit my theme. I'm not a history buff and some of the equipment is made specifically for the game. So any thoughts about what to allow? I've already decided against monk weapons(kama, siangam, etc.), but I'm stuck on the racial weapons and weapons with an arabic feel(scimitar, falchion, etc.) All thoughts are always appreciated!

[BowStreetRunner]

Did you look at the equivalency table (1-6) on page 12 of the Arms and Equipment Guide? It has a column specific to the Crusades.

[blelliot]

Did you look at the equivalency table (1-6) on page 12 of the Arms and Equipment Guide? It has a column specific to the Crusades.

Yes I did. The only problem is that it doesn't cover all the weapons available in the game. I was looking for opinions on those weapons. Thanks though

[blelliot]

Next idea I have is on the subject of magical items. I've decided on not banning them entirely since that would make the casters of the world overpoweres, even though I'm severly limiting the amount of magic that is available to them. An idea I have is weapons of legacy, that represent items that the pcs could find along the way and quest for as well. But I don't want all the magical items to be legacy items. So the idea is that the players must not only have to quest for items but must also hire some caster who has to then ask his higher ups for permission to make the item in question. so what I'm asking is what does anyone else do for a low magic setting in regard to magic items? All thoughts and ideas are always welcome