Besting the weakness - Adler would be so proud!

[Seth1221]

Hello playgrounders!

In my current campaign I have this whole elaborate devil's tempting the party gig going on. Part of it is bestowing them (as for now they don't know the source of these "blessings") with extraordinary... stuff. For now I want to strengthen their weak sides. Here goes:

First party member is a bit of a coward - a nice +1 to will should suffice for starters. Any other suggestions?

Second party member is gullible - I was thinking of giving him some bonus to sense motive. What amount would be appropriate? +2, +3, +4?

Third party member is not good at the whole teamwork idea. She is arrogant and tends to think she is self-sufficient (Yes - she is an elf:smalltongue:). I don't really have an idea for her. Some sort of bonus that works only if she is with her teammates?

So any ideas on the topic? Especially with the third party member since I don't have a ready bonus for her.

[LordHenry]

If she is a melee character, she could get an additional +2 from flanking.

[Seth1221]

Cool idea - unfortunately she is a sorcerer so she rarely flanks (like, never:smallwink:)

[Tokiko Mima]

How about a wyrmling gold/silver dragon as a familiar? Particularly one that is extremely Lawful Good, and insists on helping teammates or NPCs, and constantly stresses the importance of friendship as the highest duty one can perform? Maybe it doesn't take orders as well as a normal familiar, and charges into battle whenever danger threatens anyone. This would force the sorceress to care more; for one thing, she thinks she is on the hook for 200XP/level if the familiar dies.

If the sorceress already has a familiar, maybe the devil could kidnap the original?

In general, I think I would try to give gifts that can be easily removed later, exposing these same vulnerabilities.

As for the coward, I would try to address the source a bit more directly. If he is afraid for his life because of physical danger, why not prepare a Clone (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/clone.htm) spell for him? Now he need not fear death.

For the gullible one, why not allow him to actually see the thoughts of others? A helm of telepathy (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#helmofTelepathy) would be ideal; never would he be tricked again. Of course, it would be cursed; it would read only the thoughts of the good and neutrally aligned, and for evil aligned people, it would just read the gullible PC's own mind, and tell him what he thinks the evil being is thinking.

[Crake]

How about a wyrmling gold/silver dragon as a familiar? Particularly one that is extremely Lawful Good, and insists on helping teammates or NPCs, and constantly stresses the importance of friendship as the highest duty one can perform? Maybe it doesn't take orders as well as a normal familiar, and charges into battle whenever danger threatens anyone. This would force the sorceress to care more; for one thing, she thinks she is on the hook for 200XP/level if the familiar dies.

I don't think familiar's can be forced onto a player (and if they can, then I don't think any DM should regardless). That said, instead of giving the player something when they work as a team, perhaps give them something that is only useable on someone else?

[Analytica]

How about for the sorceress, the ability to gain flank bonuses to spells? I.e. +1 to hit or +1 to DC for spells against targets threatened by an ally?

[Seth1221]

How about a wyrmling gold/silver dragon as a familiar? Particularly one that is extremely Lawful Good, and insists on helping teammates or NPCs, and constantly stresses the importance of friendship as the highest duty one can perform? Maybe it doesn't take orders as well as a normal familiar, and charges into battle whenever danger threatens anyone. This would force the sorceress to care more; for one thing, she thinks she is on the hook for 200XP/level if the familiar dies.

If the sorceress already has a familiar, maybe the devil could kidnap the original?

In general, I think I would try to give gifts that can be easily removed later, exposing these same vulnerabilities.

As for the coward, I would try to address the source a bit more directly. If he is afraid for his life because of physical danger, why not prepare a Clone (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/clone.htm) spell for him? Now he need not fear death.

For the gullible one, why not allow him to actually see the thoughts of others? A helm of telepathy (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#helmofTelepathy) would be ideal; never would he be tricked again. Of course, it would be cursed; it would read only the thoughts of the good and neutrally aligned, and for evil aligned people, it would just read the gullible PC's own mind, and tell him what he thinks the evil being is thinking.

Those ideas, as they are intriguing, are a bit too powerfull. The party is only level 5 right now. Small bonuses is what I am aiming for. And who said I can't just take those away when needed most?:smallamused:


How about for the sorceress, the ability to gain flank bonuses to spells? I.e. +1 to hit or +1 to DC for spells against targets threatened by an ally?

That could actually work. It seems balanced compared to the other bonuses.

[LordHenry]

What I don't really understand is, when do I need a little bonus the MOST? I'd say never... that +1 to will save is a minor bonus, but never will I charge in somewhere and say: "Damn, if it weren't for my great willpower, I'd be screwed now"
In my opinion, if you want the devilish "bonus I later take away when needed", you should make them more of an impact.

[Diarmuid]

For a balance perspective, +2 will save and +3 to a skill are both able to be gained by taking a feat. Now, that being said...I think most people would say that +2 Will is a lot better than +3 Sense Motive, so maybe you dial it back to +1 Will and +2 Sense Motive. Just some ideas on keeping things mostly balanced.

For the caster, you could simply give a free Precise Shot for any spells cast at targets in melee with her companions. It's not huge, but it promotes helping teammates and shouldnt widen any existing Caster > NonCaster balance issues you already have. Boosting damage, CL, or DC in some manner are too prone to being abused in my opinion.

[GeekGirl]

Instead of a small bonus, you could give them a bigger bonus with limited uses.

The gullible one could get Discern Lie (http://dndtools.eu/spells/players-handbook-v35--6/discern-lies--2496/) once or twice a day.

The coward maybe get a bigger bonus to will, based on level perhaps if they are going to have it for a while. Or auto pass a will save vs fear (or anything really) once of twice a day.

The Sorceress, free extend or maximize spell but only on a buff not targeting herself. same as the other one of two times a day.

[iDesu]

What classes are the other characters playing? Giving the sorcerer a free spell known, like Mass Snake's Swiftness or another buffing spell, may help have her think about her team mates more.

[Seth1221]

All good ideas, thanks. The deal with these minor bonuses is this - it is only the begining. the campaign will go on for a while and there will be plenty of other moments for them to recieve bonuses, buffs etc, and when the right time comes - they will be stripped of them all unless they agree on the devil's terms. (more or less:smallwink:)

The other party members are crusader (coward) and rogue (gullible one). The rogue is going for the master thrower class.

Oh and the whole party is basically new to D&D so I sometimes push them a little to be a bit more optimized. Don't know if this information will help:smallwink:

[iDesu]

The other party members are crusader (coward) and rogue (gullible one).

Ah, what could be amusing is eventually giving the party members each others weaknesses. For example you shore up the crusaders cowardice, but you end up giving the rogue something like craven. It's something I could see a devil doing.