Incarnum Warforged Question/Talk

[DrunkenMists]

I was thinking today that I've not seen any prc/base/archetype for a Warforged or Construct based Incarnum.
As I've yet to start brewing anything; this forum thread area seemed a better idea than the homebrew thread yet.

Least as far as I've seen or been able to find.

so my question is....


Has anybody seen a Incarnum Warforged? (perferably a base class or prc; rather than a racial type)


Edit: Striked out following paragraph(s); I'm gonna likely make the class anyways; but I would still like to know if anybody has seen any Incarnum Warforged material.


Assuming no-one points me one out of the above question..

I was thinking of making a Base class Incarnum class based off the idea of being made for Warforged.
my thoughts sofar as as follows:

at least 1 Soulmeld per Class Skill. probally allow slightly more soulmelds at a time, but less chakra binds than say...totemist.
flavor the soulmelds/chakra binds as warforged components or "gears"
a slightly factotum like system that allows temporary physical stat boosts in encounters (or a burned use of essentia points for that date ; Boost STR by 4; burn away 8 essentia points till "sleep")
Think...Megaman. Kinda a "switching" focus. maybe allow less chakra binds; but slightly better daily soulmeld/chakra switching..
Flavor more for Warforged; but make still possible other classes could use; maybe flavor a little bit more "magitech-ish"


I Think a slightly better fluff fitting type of incarnum would work well with warforged; as one of the best things about warforged are thier ability to keep on going...all day long...and incarnum? ya can keep on trucking pretty much as long as you aren't worried about changing soulmelds/chakra binds or getting back daily uses of class abilities.

[KillianHawkeye]

My only comment is that you should not design a standard class with a racial prerequisite since it goes against one of D&D's most basic design philosophies. In other words, that's what prestige classes are for.

[DrunkenMists]

My only comment is that you should not design a standard class with a racial prerequisite since it goes against one of D&D's most basic design philosophies. In other words, that's what prestige classes are for.

Yea; I'm kinda aware of that; but a prc with it's own soulmelds would be...odd.. to balance in my opinion. Not to mention I'd perfer to balance it over 20 levels rather than over 10 levels; along with any class that might be perceively used with it as a base class. (not to mention that I don't feel any dnd incarnum class would fit fluff wise as a pre-requisite)

thats why I was going to "try" and make it's fluff able to fit with use by all races; but more flavored towards those of construct nature. On a human say; it might look a little overkill/heavy (purely from a fluff standpoint) like say...a Shoulder mounted "crossbow" would make more sense on a constuct; but a human could wear/use it still; it would just have a more noticeable pauldron with it.

[Krazzman]

My only comment is that you should not design a standard class with a racial prerequisite since it goes against one of D&D's most basic design philosophies. In other words, that's what prestige classes are for.

OR alternative Racial Class Features.

Warforged Totemists are actually quite awesome. Maybe switch the "Totem" Chakra out and give him a "Gear Chakra" and give a different Bonus. Switch the Wild Empathy and such stuff and give him other things.

But a whole class dedicated to say: "Hi, I'm a Warforged ONLY Incarnum Base Class. Oh yeah!" I would likely say no. Killian was right that this is more or less for Prestige classes.

[Fouredged Sword]

I would do a ACF set for the incarnate and/or the totemist.

Say for the Incarnate, lets make the class lose access to some binds, and maybe remove the increased essence capacity stuff, but add a class feature that allows the warforged to bind a meld to a slot that also has a warforged component in it, or maybe make binds become warforged components, meaning that they add extra bonuses.

[Piggy Knowles]

I would also allow warforged to take the Ironsoul Forgemaster prestige class.

[DrunkenMists]

I would do a ACF set for the incarnate and/or the totemist.

Say for the Incarnate, lets make the class lose access to some binds, and maybe remove the increased essence capacity stuff, but add a class feature that allows the warforged to bind a meld to a slot that also has a warforged component in it, or maybe make binds become warforged components, meaning that they add extra bonuses.

Warforged Components are magic items; there is already a feat that allows it; Split chakra I think is the name?

I'll be honest; the idea of using the incarnate or totemist; even with a ACF comes mostly down to fluff; even with a ACF; alot of how the class works and "is" comes down alot to the class it already is. the incarnate is alot more alignment based than I imagine a warforged incarnum would be. and the totemist emulates monsters which...well if I wanted a beasttransformer..I'd play a druid as such.


I would also allow warforged to take the Ironsoul Forgemaster prestige class.
Been there; done that; bought the t-shirt.


I kinda wanna move away from the "dual magic item/soulmeld" idea of the of incarnum classes; I think there are enough of them.

[Fouredged Sword]

Well, maybe we can make a Incarnate Body style class.

Lets make an incarnate fighter class.

Zero alignment restrictions.

Let's call it

Melded Warrior

HD 1d10 - The class is con focused, so HP won't be a problem
BAB - Full
Saves Fort - Good, Reflex - Bad, Will - Good

Let the main class feature be

Incarnum Body
The character learns to focus incarnum not into magical constructs, but into themselves, fortifying and empowering them directly. As such, they have a greatly limited selection of melds, but the melds are harder to dispel than normal (+4 to resist dispelling).

Melded Warriors get far fewer melds and binds than most incarnum classes, and somewhat less essence to spend. They can shape one meld at 1st level, and one aditional meld every three levels (2 at 3rd, 3 at 6th, until 7 at 18th). At 4th level, and every 3 levels after the melded warrior gains a bind, allowing him or her to keep almost all of his or her soulmelds bound.

There are Six melds available to this class, called focuses. These melds increase an attribute, and provide additional bonuses based being bound to a slot. Each bind can be bound to almost any chakra, allowing for a great deal of flexibility.

Strength Focus
+1 enhancement bonus to strength, +1 per essence invested
Bind - Hands - The character decreases the penalty for wielding a weapon by the amount of essence invested. This can remove the penalty for non-proficiency, over sized weapons, or two weapon fighting, but not for things like power attack or other penalties assumed to gain a direct bonus.

Dexterity Focus
+1 enhancement bonus to Dexterity, +1 per essence invested

Constitution Focus
+1 enhancement bonus to Constitution, +1 per essence invested

Wisdom Focus
+1 enhancement bonus to Wisdom, +1 per essence invested

Intelligence Focus
+1 enhancement bonus to Intelligence, +1 per essence invested

Charisma Focus
+1 enhancement bonus to Charisma, +1 per essence invested

More later, I go to go now, but you get the idea.

[DrunkenMists]

Well, maybe we can make a Incarnate Body style class.

Lets make an incarnate fighter class.

Zero alignment restrictions.

Let's call it

Melded Warrior

HD 1d10 - The class is con focused, so HP won't be a problem
BAB - Full
Saves Fort - Good, Reflex - Bad, Will - Good

Let the main class feature be

Incarnum Body
The character learns to focus incarnum not into magical constructs, but into themselves, fortifying and empowering them directly. As such, they have a greatly limited selection of melds, but the melds are harder to dispel than normal (+4 to resist dispelling).

Melded Warriors get far fewer melds and binds than most incarnum classes, and somewhat less essence to spend. They can shape one meld at 1st level, and one aditional meld every three levels (2 at 3rd, 3 at 6th, until 7 at 18th). At 4th level, and every 3 levels after the melded warrior gains a bind, allowing him or her to keep almost all of his or her soulmelds bound.

There are Six melds available to this class, called focuses. These melds increase an attribute, and provide additional bonuses based being bound to a slot. Each bind can be bound to almost any chakra, allowing for a great deal of flexibility.

Strength Focus
+1 enhancement bonus to strength, +1 per essence invested
Bind - Hands - The character decreases the penalty for wielding a weapon by the amount of essence invested. This can remove the penalty for non-proficiency, over sized weapons, or two weapon fighting, but not for things like power attack or other penalties assumed to gain a direct bonus.

Dexterity Focus
+1 enhancement bonus to Dexterity, +1 per essence invested

Constitution Focus
+1 enhancement bonus to Constitution, +1 per essence invested

Wisdom Focus
+1 enhancement bonus to Wisdom, +1 per essence invested

Intelligence Focus
+1 enhancement bonus to Intelligence, +1 per essence invested

Charisma Focus
+1 enhancement bonus to Charisma, +1 per essence invested

More later, I go to go now, but you get the idea.

neat idea; would work towards a PRC I'd imagine...
it's the enchancement to mental stats that I feel could be overpowered.


.....but I'm willing to run with the idea sofar.


what would be things I wanted to add into the idea I had earlier in the thread..

..a Ranged weapon.....that could appear under dex as a chakra bind... for...shoulder.

Each Stat could have a extra effect on the seperate binding that gives a slight bit more skill bonus than boosting the stat (instead of incarnums normal +2 /essentia. maybe plus +1 to 1 skill and +2 to another on each binding. (as normally; it would be +2 on a meld; and the melds chakra binding; but since for every 2 essentia in the soulmeld you get +1 stat mod; your already gaining some skill ranks on the ability)

with low soulmelds and chakras class abilities could be a bit more ability for changing out the binds/soulmelds during the day.

Other ideas:
Class ability like Incarnum Raideince; where you can "share" the binding bonus's around a bit for ?/rounds a day.

Something useable a little more constantly; maybe a ability like crusaders furious counterstrike and the other half of it...lets you funnel some of the damage taken into a harder hit; tie how much damage you can "asorb" to essentia in the ability? (Defense and Counter MODE!)

[Krazzman]

ACF way:

Totemist replacement:
1st Level:
Gears of War:
Instead of the normal List of Soulmelds available for Totemists the Warforged Totemist gets the following War-Gears:
[Insert Table here.]

2nd Level:
Gear Chakra (Replaces Totem Chakra).
Functions like Totem Chakra but with War-Gears.

[x Level]
Something replacing WIld empathy.

Incarnate:
Remove Alignment restriction.
give him the ability to "copy" Melds of another person for a short time etc.
Give him another custom list of Soulmelds.


For the Class way:
I would remove the int, wis and cha focus.
And give him a few more "other" class abilities, maybe counting as a fighter of [class level]-2 etc.

[Fouredged Sword]

I am concerned about dips, but really, the best you are looking at is maybe a +8 enhancement bonus to a stat. You can do a +6 with an item, so it isn't that bad.

The class itself looks shape starved at first, but the idea is six very general melds that can do many things, and eventually you bind all of them at once.

The idea would be to make each bind expand the use of that stat somehow. Dex to damage, Con to natural armor, Int to saves, Wisdom to initiative, that sort of thing. Also, there should be better options that open up with essence invested based on a bind, like dexterity bound to brow granting TWFing, and improved TWFing at 1 essence invested, and so on all the way though the TWFing tree, all the way to removing the TWFing penalties period.

You get a warrior who end up being focused on his stats in an odd way. You get to do cool stuff that is flavored about using all your stats to their limit. Moving essence around will open up new combat options and allow the standard warrior stuff to get pushed to the limit.

The give the class access to a single soulmeld from another class at 5th, 10th and 15th level.

[DrunkenMists]

I am concerned about dips, but really, the best you are looking at is maybe a +8 enhancement bonus to a stat. You can do a +6 with an item, so it isn't that bad.

The class itself looks shape starved at first, but the idea is six very general melds that can do many things, and eventually you bind all of them at once.

The idea would be to make each bind expand the use of that stat somehow. Dex to damage, Con to natural armor, Int to saves, Wisdom to initiative, that sort of thing. Also, there should be better options that open up with essence invested based on a bind, like dexterity bound to brow granting TWFing, and improved TWFing at 1 essence invested, and so on all the way though the TWFing tree, all the way to removing the TWFing penalties period.

You get a warrior who end up being focused on his stats in an odd way. You get to do cool stuff that is flavored about using all your stats to their limit. Moving essence around will open up new combat options and allow the standard warrior stuff to get pushed to the limit.

The give the class access to a single soulmeld from another class at 5th, 10th and 15th level.

incarnum is both excellent for dips and horrible for it.
if all you want is the quick skill bonus; yea; incarnum all the way; but since your your essentia tend to hold you back from spending "enough" into a ability for it to be worth it beyond the base bonus.

most are looking for the switchable +2 or 4 they provide at the base...and the 1 essentia the classes start with (so plus 2/6 at the most; long as the class doesn't provide above that your probably good)


I'm still thinking about making it into more of a base class.
I've even mocked up a soulmeld!.

Appraising Specs
“a pair of googles adorns your head; the lenses glow faintly and appear to look deeply into ones soul”
Descriptors: None.
Classes: Ironsoul
Chakra: Crown, Brow
Saving Throw: None

While wearing Appraising Specs, you gain a +2 insight bonus on appraising checks. Essentia: Every point of essentia invested in the Appraising Specs increases the bonus by 2.

Chakra Bind (Crown): When Appraising Specs are bound to Crown, you gain the ability to aid another as a swift action; being able to provide affect them as if you were using Aid Another as a immediate Action instead. The Bonus Provided is 1/essentia infused in this ability.
This Ability can only be used once every 1d4 rounds.

Chakra Bind (Brow): When Appraising Specs are bound to Brow, you can't be flanked

[Keld Denar]

There are guidelines in MoI for investing essentia into things that aren't feats or soulmelds or specific magic items. I'd allow a 'forged to invest essentia into his composite plating, his slam (or battlefist), and probably into various warforged components, depending on the benefits.

[DrunkenMists]

I'm working on a concept like my first post; but I've taken advice and I'll be making it work for any race.
it will be instead kinda a Skill based incarnum class; the soulmelds being based on the skill list.

it is located at Homebrew threads as Ironsoul [Incarnum, Base Class, PEACH (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=287834)

Fouredged Sword: I still to love the concept you seem to have going. If you decide you would like to follow it up; I would love to keep and eye on it and help out where I can. An Ability based Incarnum class sounds like it could be an interesting concept; especially if it ends up as a PRC.

[Chronos]

Choose Warforged as your race and Incarnate or Totemist as your class. Done. If you want more flavor, add it however you'd like.

[DrunkenMists]

Choose Warforged as your race and Incarnate or Totemist as your class. Done. If you want more flavor, add it however you'd like.

Well done; Quite the most useful comment. Thank you for posting it.:smallyuk:

[Fyermind]

I'd say make a totemist ACF tree and a few dedicated feats. I like the idea of a gear chakra. I think that rewriting a lot of the totem binds as gear binds and refluffing the descriptions or the soulmelds (or simply allowing players to do so) would go a long way.

Wild empathy could be swapped out for construct empathy or something allowing you to influence constructs not under your control. Either something diplomacy like or something like Rebuke Constructs.

Levels would be at level 1, 2, and 3. Level 1 would swap out wild empathy and allow soulmelds to be refluffed. Level 2 would swap out totem chakra, allow the choice between totem binds and gear binds (though only one of the two at any given time) and depending on the versatility of gear binds perhaps reduce the number of soulmelds by 1 permanently. Level 3 would replace totem protection with something related to constructs. All references to Totem Chakra would be made synonymous with references to Gear Chakra by the level 2 ACF.

The Gear binds should be at most slightly more useful than the totem binds, and never significantly stronger. I've detailed two samples below.

Exe: Mantiore Belt Gear Bind
As a standard action fire 1 dart / essentia invested in Manticore Belt. Each dart deals 1d6+1/2 str mod damage, with a range of 30'. This soulmeld is treated as both a natural and manufactured weapon for the purpose of spells, class features, and feats, and other effects.

Exe: Frost Helm Gear Bind
As a standard action you can emit a sonic screech that stuns targets within 20'. You can effect 1 target plus 1 per essentia invested in frost helm. Targets are stunned for 1d4 rounds. If attacked or shaken (a full round action) the target is entitled to another saving throw. A creature who has successfully saved against this effect cannot be affected by it again for 24 hours. This is a sonic attack. Constructs are not immune to this effect, despite normally being immune to stunning.