Jump and the Action Economy

[Razanir]

So I managed to get my jump up to +48 with a 30 ft move speed. Roll a 20, and now I'm long jumping 68 ft, which even rounded to 65 ft, is more than twice my move speed. That would mean I'm taking two turns of just jumping.

Am I able to take other actions while in the air, as long as it doesn't consume my move action to jump?

[Barsoom]

If it's of any help, you can draw a weapon or ready a shield in combination with a move action.

[BowStreetRunner]

The rule states that "If you run out of movement mid-jump, your next action (either on this turn or, if necessary, on your next turn) must be a move action to complete the jump." Now, since you need a 20 ft running start before making the 65 ft jump, you very well might need to use not only your next move action but also your next standard action to complete the jump. As Barsoom state, there are actions like drawing a weapon or shield that can be performed during a move action, and these would be allowed. But you would not be able to take another distinct action until the jump is completed, since it states your next action must be to complete the jump.

[Razanir]

The rule states that "If you run out of movement mid-jump, your next action (either on this turn or, if necessary, on your next turn) must be a move action to complete the jump." Now, since you need a 20 ft running start before making the 65 ft jump, you very well might need to use not only your next move action but also your next standard action to complete the jump. As Barsoom state, there are actions like drawing a weapon or shield that can be performed during a move action, and these would be allowed. But you would not be able to take another distinct action until the jump is completed, since it states your next action must be to complete the jump.

Actually, part of how I got the bonus was Leaping Dragon Stance. It seasons the build with just a dash of always-counts-as-running-for-a-jump parmesan.

[Kelb_Panthera]

Actually, part of how I got the bonus was Leaping Dragon Stance. It seasons the build with just a dash of always-counts-as-running-for-a-jump parmesan.

The point remains. If you make a jump that would exceed your base land speed you either have to take a move action to complete the jump or complete the jump on your next turn if you use up both move actions for your turn (having given up your standard). If your speed is 30ft and your jump check is 60 then it will take 2 move actions, which must be consecutive to one another, to complete the jump.

How this interacts with sudden leap is another question altogether.

Also note that you can jump as part of the run action and doing so gives you up to 4 times your base speed to complete the jump.

[Razanir]

How this interacts with sudden leap is another question altogether.

Also note that you can jump as part of the run action and doing so gives you up to 4 times your base speed to complete the jump.

Sudden Leap is a swift action to move the entire distance. I think. Bring in the dancing lobsters rules lawyers!

If I'm reading it all correctly, I can jump 300 ft optimized in the blink of an eye as a swift action.

[Chronos]

Yeah, I think Sudden Leap is pretty clear on that. You obviously don't move the distance you could normally move in a swift action, because you normally can't move with a swift action at all. And it specifically says you go a distance equal to your Jump check, in the swift-action initiation time. If this sometimes gives a superhuman result, well, so be it.

[Phelix-Mu]

One has to wonder how a normal very high Jump check could possibly take so long. Having it take in excess of one round, over six seconds in the air, seems comically silly. Your character could get a manicure while in the air. And with enough Jumplomancy, well...

Actually, this could be an interesting point to explore more silliness. What about triggering one of the celerity line as part of a very long Jump. What actions can you accomplish with interrupting extra actions?

This is some interesting kung fu, for sure.:smallconfused:

[Slipperychicken]

superhuman result

It seems pretty superhuman to jump 65ft horizontally, and land 18 seconds after you jumped.

[Xervous]

I saw that 10 minutes ago, rocket jumping soldier with -3 FPS.

[Harrow]

Wait, so, conceptually, if you get jump bonuses from stuff like Masterwork tools and Guidance of the Avatar, it doesn't actually make you faster, and you have to use actions to move equal to your base movement through the air, so it should be possible to reduce your speed to 5 ft and be nauseated, then jump a silly long distance... in slow motion.

Let me say that again. Being nauseated means you fly through the air more slowly. Yes, penalties stop you (most likely) from jumping hundreds of feet over several minutes, but it's still a very silly thing.

What happens if you are already jumping through the air and you are denied your actions completely? If you are hit by Irresistible Dancing, daze, stun, or paralysis, do you just suddenly lose all momentum and fall to the ground? Oh wait, this is D&D, there's no such thing as momentum (except for the running start to a jump) so I guess those move actions are spent to continually propel yourself through the air by force of jump alone. What if it's not straight action denial, but you just aren't allowed to move? Is continuing a jump you've already started considered a 'purely mental action'?

[kulosle]

Oh god the idea of making an amazing jump check and then mid jump becoming nauseated and then all of a sudden moving so slow. The mental image is hilarious.

[ericgrau]

That and a high strength score to carry a platform to help your allies to jump across. It's like optimizing jump for the whole party.

[nedz]

I was thinking of trying to work out the longest jump you could make, not in terms of distance but in term of the number of rounds it would take to complete.

This is rendered moot though because if you had a Sorcerer (possibly more than one) spamming Daze, and you kept failing the saves, you could get stuck mid-jump indefinitely.

This works for other conditions.
Should you acquire the Dying condition, but stabilise, you could be stuck mid-jump for days.

A Bard could also fascinate you mid jump, also allowing you to take no actions.

Panicked, Petrified, Stunned and Unconscious can work similarly.

[Eldan]

Is it me, or is it funny that the first person to reply in a thread on superjumping is called Barsoom?

Anyway. I think there actually was a build once that achieved a kind of infinite levitation by first jumping high into the air, then reducing its move speed to 0 while still in the air. I think by having someone else cast a polymorph spell on it into a form that could not move out of water.

[nedz]

Actually it's easier than that — you just keep delaying indefinitely.

[BowStreetRunner]

Actually it's easier than that — you just keep delaying indefinitely.

Not an option. "your next action (either on this turn or, if necessary, on your next turn) must be a move action to complete the jump." Delay is actually a 'special initiative action' and you would not be allowed to select it as your next action.

[Stux]

Is it possible for a jump to be interrupted, RAW?

Like if you get knocked prone half way through a jump. What happens when you get back up, do you still have to complete the jump?

What if you are grappled part way through a jump?

[kulosle]

I think there is a certain point where you start using rules as makes sense. And this is probably it.

[Slipperychicken]

I think there is a certain point where you start using rules as makes sense. And this is probably it.

Yeah... better than abusing a glitch to hover by jumping.

[nedz]

I think there is a certain point where you start using rules as makes sense. And this is probably it.Yeah... better than abusing a glitch to hover by jumping.

This is a bit of a fallacy. We are being asked about the rules, but the rules are dysfunctional. This means that a houserule is required, but that's a different question.

[ericgrau]

I assumed this whole thing was silliness and that no one would actually use it.

[Flickerdart]

I think there is a certain point where you start using rules as makes sense. And this is probably it.
What, you mean you don't use a combination of jump and sleep to suspend crows of people in the air for minutes at a time?

[Stux]

I think there is a certain point where you start using rules as makes sense. And this is probably it.

Oh totally, I wasn't asking for practical reasons. Just curious!

Like if you are knocked unconscious mid-jump, are you RAW obliged to complete the jump when you regain consciousness? Even if it is days later?

[Phelix-Mu]

*In a distant realm the God of Gravity looks up, in the midst of eating his midnight snack of fruit loops*

"Jump? Wait, what?":smallbiggrin:

[137beth]

What, you mean you don't use a combination of jump and sleep to suspend crows of people in the air for minutes at a time?
No, I'd use a permanency+symbol of sleep to suspend people in the air permanently:smalltongue:
(wait, would that work?)

[Razanir]

This whole discussion about breaking physics is interesting and all, but it doesn't concern my character. +24 Tumble– Enough to avoid any AoO

[nedz]

+24 Tumble– Enough to avoid any AoO
Well that depends upon their reach, and how many squares you have to tumble through, at -2 per square.

[Razanir]

Well that depends upon their reach, and how many squares you have to tumble through, at -2 per square.

Correction: +24 is enough to get through at least 1 tile, and probably get though like 5-6 more

[Another_Poet]

That and a high strength score to carry a platform to help your allies to jump across. It's like optimizing jump for the whole party.

This is where I lost it. My LOL hat is off to you, Ericgrau.

[TuggyNE]

No, I'd use a permanency+symbol of sleep to suspend people in the air permanently:smalltongue:
(wait, would that work?)

Unclear. Symbol of death, which symbol of sleep is based on, lets you permanency it*, with the result that it rearms 10 minutes after shutting off. However, symbol of sleep's effect only lasts for 3d6*10 minutes, though the symbol itself remains active to affect new targets for 10 minutes/CL. So I think you'd need to (Sudden) Maximize symbol of sleep, but cast it at the minimum CL to make sure it would shut off (and then reactivate) before any targets woke up.

Or, you know, just have staggered symbols such that they're likely to cover each other's deactivation times.

*And permanency lists both of them as valid spells.

[Harrow]

What if you die in the middle of a jump? No one's brought that up yet, that I've seen, but I think, by RAW, you don't fall. Ever. Your corpse would remain in place. Wouldn't it? Then, if you were Resurrected or Animated, you would have to continue using actions until you used up your jump.

You could still be moved, of course, by being targeted by teleportation or being grappled or something, but as far as I can tell jumping just tells gravity to go away and sit in the corner and new gravity rules are brought into being until the jump is over.

[Curmudgeon]

Like if you get knocked prone half way through a jump. What happens when you get back up, do you still have to complete the jump
You can't use any action other than move actions to complete the Jump, so you stay prone in the air until after you land. Regardless of what happens to you, you're using move actions to complete the Jump until it's finished (or you are :smalltongue:). When you're in the air, having your legs knocked out from under you just changes your attitude rather than immediately splatting you on the ground. The same thing happens when someone using a Fly spell is tripped: they're horizontal, but still up in the air.

This whole discussion about breaking physics is interesting and all, but it doesn't concern my character. +24 Tumble– Enough to avoid any AoO No, only just the first one and only if you merely pass nearby and don't go through their square(s). You're not allowed to slow down to half speed while in a Jump, so +24 to your Tumble check just ensures you can pass by one enemy with Accelerated Tumbling. (You might do better with a decent roll, but that's not guaranteed.)