Feelings on the Android [PF]

[Anderlith]

The Inner Sea Bestiary introduces the Android race. It's about as close to a Warforged as Pathfinder will get. They have some interesting abilities, but some harsh penalties. What are your views on the race?

[Ailowynn]

In terms of fluff or mechanics?

As far as fluff: I hate it. Pathfinder, recently, has gotten farther and farther from fantasy. The gears and guns were controversial, but androids? STUPID! That's just my opinion though.

As far as mechanics...generally anything with bonuses OR penalties that big can be abused. For NPCs? Sure. But it's too easy for PCs to minmax.

[JusticeZero]

Looked at it, didn't see anywhere to put it into a campaign that would fit, so itdoesn't exist, same as how elves and orcs don't exist. The niche just isn't open for them. As far as the race itself, they do seem to be throwing some big numbers around, so i'm sketchy on whether they would work correctly. I also note that they casually tossed in immunity to fatigue and exhaustion, and putting that on something like a barbarian makes me slightly nervous. And at the cost of what? A low Sense Motive? It needs another revision in my opinion. I don't use it.

[Gildedragon]

It's allright.
I don't mind the tech in my magic, especially how PF is all for broadening the possibilities of play. The term android is... Funny, a bit too scifi, but not irksome.
Problem I have with it is that it doesn't feel that construct-y. Their living construct on their race guide felt better better, though the stats were lackluster.
The fun with warforged was (to me) their golem-y ness (forehead mark and all), their distinct design and physiology, and the place they fit in the world.
As for the android's stats. I don't remember them, and thus can't comment.

[Feralventas]

Well, it works alright; pretty much on par with PF's Elf or Half-orc or other Core races. Nanite Surge is a nice 1/day chance of succeeding significantly. I might consider it a bit more powerful than average if the average in PF hadn't been risen (Human getting a variable +2 stat in addition to bonus feat and skills).

Fluff-wise, it's a matter of how you want your setting fluff to go. Paizo wanted to allow for all kinds of adventures in their primary setting, so Golarion's got a mix of all sorts of things, from swords and sorcery to Indian Mythology to wild west and Egyptian tomb raiding.

The game isn't stagnantly held to Lord of the Rings and adding in mechanics for a myriad set of concepts seems like a good way to allow for diverse campaign design.

They should be restricted to games in which it's going to fit, but can be refluffed into Golem constructs with bound/artificial souls or some such in order to fit in more with a magical perspective; I've read a story of an android character being built for a couple who'd lost their child as a replacement. You could even take a turn for the morbid and macabre by stating that they need to be made from the flesh of a creature that they resemble, making them into a flesh patchwork creature akin to Frankenstein's creation.

[NamelessNPC]

I also note that they casually tossed in immunity to fatigue and exhaustion, and putting that on something like a barbarian makes me slightly nervous.

Well, don't worry about that:


Androids can never gain morale bonuses, and are immune to fear effects and all emotion-based effects.

Still, there's usually something good to be done with immunities.

[grarrrg]

Feelings...Android...
Androids do not have feelings.

[Psyren]

It's about as close to a Warforged as Pathfinder will get.

There's a new living construct race coming out in Ultimate Psionics that's even closer to the mark - the Forgeborn. Fluffwise they are not far off from Warforged, though they look markedly different.

EDIT: Found a pic:

http://fc02.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2013/038/e/8/forgeborn_by_shawcj-d5u4d3r.jpg

[Cirrylius]

Feelings on the Android

I read that as "Feeling up the Android".

Guess I'll let myself out.:smallredface:

[Anderlith]

There's a new living construct race coming out in Ultimate Psionics that's even closer to the mark - the Forgeborn. Fluffwise they are not far off from Warforged, though they look markedly different.

EDIT: Found a pic:

http://fc02.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2013/038/e/8/forgeborn_by_shawcj-d5u4d3r.jpg

This looks VERY interesting. Thanks for sharing it.

[Kudaku]

The following is based on their PFSRD entry, since I do not have access to the ISB.

Android looked kind of dull to me. +2 Dexterity, +2 Intelligence seems to be a very common set of stat boosts, they share it with (off the top of my head) tieflings, elves, and sylphs.

+2 to Perception is useful but again, very common. Aasimar, Half-elf, elf...
Nanite Surge is a great racial ability. It's more or less Dice: Yes once a day.
Emotionless is quite fitting, but maybe it's a little forced to have it affect sense motive? SM makes me think of detecting lies - something you'd think a robot who apparently has very keen senses would be good at - internal lie detectors and all that.
Constructed is very neat, but I feel like they could have done more with it.

Compared to the Warforged the android doesn't feel very... "Alien". Then again, androids are basically robots that are designed to closely mimic humans - maybe that's intentional?

Personally I would have changed their Perception bonus to Disable Device and justify it with a line about how Androids have excellent control (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPEZdl7BvjA) of their appendages.

I'd probably change the ability score bonuses too, since Dexterity/Intelligence is quite common already. Maybe... +2 Strength/Intelligence, -2 Charisma? The smart bruiser is an interesting concept and I don't believe there's too much support for it at the moment. The race would work well with the melee alchemist, meaning you'd have barely controlled androids who occasionally go into "MURDERDEATHSLAY"-breakdown mode, which seems thematically fitting :smallbiggrin:

[shadow_archmagi]

Can I just interrupt to say that Feelings on the Android would be a great album title?


That said, I like Warforged better. Dungeonpunk over arbitrarily induced sci-fi every day.

[JusticeZero]

Looking forward to the release of that book.. Wish I knew more about what they are adding new so I can work some of it into my setting. (which is psi only) I hope it adds a siege specialist Marksman.
Anyways, I can see adding something like the Android to some settings, but I'm not sure how much I care for that specific build. It looks like it's tied to some fluff that isn't detailed very well, and just isn't described in a very interesting way, added to a design that just looks like it needs another pass.

[JusticeZero]

@Kudaku :Yes, I was thinking something like that myself. Str /Int would be good, I would have thought Con myself but both are better than Dex. Str is better for flavor rather than being a favorite wizard race. Ditto the issue with Sense Motive. It felt like a cheese thing, those checks aren't usually important on an individual level in a lot of cases. "Oh gee, I need a weakness to slip this by the GM, I know, I'll limit Sense Motive, the rogue makes all those checks anyways.." Put it on Diplomacy AND Intimidate and we can come back to the table, but I think it could be done even better than that.

[Raven777]

As far as setting specifics are concerned, I assume in Golarion, they are relics from Numeria? Because Numeria is the place with the robots, mutants and alien tech. Lorewise, an ancient alien ship crash landed there eons ago. There's a very At The Mountains of Madness-esque segment from Second Darkness that goes through there if I remember correctly.

[LordErebus12]

the Distant Worlds pdf explored the solar system and all its planets and worlds, besides golarion. aliens, my friends. that and old portals to other worlds. the material plane is bigger than we knew, other planets are among the Dark Tapestry.

[Raven777]

the Distant Worlds pdf explored the solar system and all its planets and worlds, besides golarion. aliens, my friends. that and old portals to other worlds. the material plane is bigger than we knew, other planets are among the Dark Tapestry.

Ah yes, I always forget the other planets. There's one that's a shameless ripoff from John Carter's Mars and another that's basically Pandora. Nice places. Doesn't Reign of Winter have a segment on one of them? The one with the Dragons?

[Yora]

Part 4 plays on one of the other planets that is currently in a 15 year long winter.
Part 5 playes in Russia in World War 1.
I like the idea of the AP, but this one requires a LOT of reworking to fit it into a normal fantasy setting.

I was never a fan of Golarion, it's a good thing they are keeping the campaign setting quite distinctly separate from the game system.

[LordErebus12]

Ah yes, I always forget the other planets. There's one that's a shameless ripoff from John Carter's Mars and another that's basically Pandora. Nice places. Doesn't Reign of Winter have a segment on one of them? The one with the Dragons?

basically. there are a ton of worlds and moons, most livable.

hell, the sun has cities.

[Anderlith]

Yes, I do think Androids should have a Str bonus not a Dex bonus. Robot grip! :P
but that would be the only change I'd make to them mechanics-wise.
Fluff-wise, I just want them to look like warforged, & I wished they had the warforged flavor & fluff :( & the feats/equipment.

[Anderlith]

basically. there are a ton of worlds and moons, most livable.

hell, the sun has cities.

What's wrong with that? Hell, every Campaign world has the Plane of fire. How is the sun different?

I kind of like Distant Worlds, it gives the game a real, Deathgate Cycle feel. Where perhaps the Planes are actually planets.

[Spuddles]

There's a new living construct race coming out in Ultimate Psionics that's even closer to the mark - the Forgeborn. Fluffwise they are not far off from Warforged, though they look markedly different.

EDIT: Found a pic:

http://fc02.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2013/038/e/8/forgeborn_by_shawcj-d5u4d3r.jpg

Who is publishing Ultimate Psionics?

[JusticeZero]

Mindscarred does all the Pathfinder psionic stuff.