I picked up a Pathfinder module yesterday...

[Renegade Paladin]

I was in my old hometown yesterday and stopped in the comic/game shop for old times sake while I was there. They have a lot of RPG stuff in stock (as opposed to my now-local shop, which is smaller and has to do a lot of things special order if people want them), so I picked up the Pathfinder module Broken Chains after flipping through a few different ones just to use as a one-shot to give new players a feel for what it's like outside the Pathfinder Society play.

Having done this, I went home and gave it a thorough reading, and immediately noticed something: In thirty-two pages it calls for no less than eight non-core sourcebooks, with creatures from the Bestiary 2 and NPCs from the GameMastery Guide on the random encounter table, one of the prominent NPCs being an inquisitor (Advanced Player's Guide) with spells from both Ultimate Combat and Ultimate Magic in her spells known and gear from Ultimate Equipment, creatures from the Bestiary 3 inhabiting a room later in the scenario, and almost every cleric preparing a spell listed as from the Inner Sea World Guide. Some of those I have, some are on my to-get list anyway, and the Inner Sea World Guide one has the effects of the kind of unholy water it apparently produces listed in a sidebar, but that still seems a little extreme. Do they do this for every module, or did I just grab a really prolific one by coincidence? The need to possess an entire library to run a one-shot aside, it's just damned inconvenient to need to page through ten different books to get all the relevant rules. Note cards and the SRD can let me get through it, but I find myself curious.

[Jerthanis]

Nope, this is every Pathfinder product in my experience. Every one of them will have citations leading to additional products on nearly every single page. Usually I will find they will reprint enough material for you to actually use the content, but that seems not to be the case for you here.

The Pathfinder SRD can help you take notes on abilities from sources you don't have to at least let you run your module.

[Tholomyes]

I'm one of those wierdos who uses computers fairly heavily, so it's not so much a problem for me, since often time, I flip to the SRD even for core material, if I need a quick reference. I don't find it too much of a problem. Though, full disclosure, I never use Random encounter tables, so I don't encounter the problem of needing to search through sourcebooks to find a randomly rolled NPC or Monster.

Honestly, though, it gets more apparent in later modules, simply because there's more stuff for them to reference, so if you want to run something that doesn't rely on non-core stuff, there are plenty of good modules from early in Pathfinder's Life, such as Carrion Hill, which are core only, simply because that's what existed at the time.

[Yora]

In those cases, use this SRD (http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/). It lets you find things much faster than the other one, if you know the source.

[avr]

To me this says that they are using the material they've put out, so there's less chance of it being orphaned the way that some 3.5e subsystems were. It may be annoying but I think it does actually reflect well on Paizo.

[Saph]

I've found the longer I play PF, the longer I rely on the PF SRD (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/). It's got everything you just referenced and more, including FAQs, errata, and just about anything else you want to know.

It really is the best reference out there for PF games.

[Drelua]

I've found the longer I play PF, the longer I rely on the PF SRD (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/). It's got everything you just referenced and more, including FAQs, errata, and just about anything else you want to know.

It really is the best reference out there for PF games.

And if you happen to have a computer or an ipad without an internet connection, all the same first party material is on Combat Manager (http://combatmanager.com/). It's got feats, spells, monsters, NPCs, items, everything, and without the inconvenient name changes they had to give everything not covered by the OGL.

[Yora]

If you run an adventure path, I think it should be obvious that you go through everything before you start playing, so you can simply copy-paste the passages that you need.

[Sylthia]

Thankfully, it is all on Pathfinder's website free of charge. If they demanded you buy every book, it would be a problem, but at least this way, you can print/copy the info you need before the game.

[Jandrem]

I've found the longer I play PF, the longer I rely on the PF SRD (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/). It's got everything you just referenced and more, including FAQs, errata, and just about anything else you want to know.

It really is the best reference out there for PF games.

But that's not the "official" PF SRD. This one is. (http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/)

The differences are subtle, but there are sometimes still bits of info on the one you cited, that fall back to 3.5 rules instead of PF one's. I heard they were still using 3.5's reach templates up until a few months ago(PF does reach differently, for those who don't know).

[Raven777]

But d20pfsrd is easier to navigate.

@OP Everything you might ever need to run Pathfinder is on the two websites linked, entirely free of charge. You can play Pathfinder without ever buying any book. That's what my Skype group does.

[Jandrem]

I was in my old hometown yesterday and stopped in the comic/game shop for old times sake while I was there. They have a lot of RPG stuff in stock (as opposed to my now-local shop, which is smaller and has to do a lot of things special order if people want them), so I picked up the Pathfinder module Broken Chains after flipping through a few different ones just to use as a one-shot to give new players a feel for what it's like outside the Pathfinder Society play.

Having done this, I went home and gave it a thorough reading, and immediately noticed something: In thirty-two pages it calls for no less than eight non-core sourcebooks, with creatures from the Bestiary 2 and NPCs from the GameMastery Guide on the random encounter table, one of the prominent NPCs being an inquisitor (Advanced Player's Guide) with spells from both Ultimate Combat and Ultimate Magic in her spells known and gear from Ultimate Equipment, creatures from the Bestiary 3 inhabiting a room later in the scenario, and almost every cleric preparing a spell listed as from the Inner Sea World Guide. Some of those I have, some are on my to-get list anyway, and the Inner Sea World Guide one has the effects of the kind of unholy water it apparently produces listed in a sidebar, but that still seems a little extreme. Do they do this for every module, or did I just grab a really prolific one by coincidence? The need to possess an entire library to run a one-shot aside, it's just damned inconvenient to need to page through ten different books to get all the relevant rules. Note cards and the SRD can let me get through it, but I find myself curious.

My gut response at first, was "Eww, that's a lot of extra stuff you have to have on hand to be able to even play that."

But, the more I thought on it, the less it bothered me. Like Avr mentioned mentioned upthread, at least they're coming back to things they print, unlike those orphaned subsystems in 3.e. That, and it's on the SRD sites, so it's not so bad.

[Jandrem]

But d20pfsrd is easier to navigate.

@OP Everything you might ever need to run Pathfinder is on the two websites linked, entirely free of charge. You can play Pathfinder without ever buying any book. That's what my Skype group does.

I'd be less concerned with ease of navigation, over incorrect game rules. Just my opinion.

[Saph]

But that's not the "official" PF SRD. This one is. (http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/)

The layout is worse, it's harder to read due to poorer colour contrast, there's less material, and it's more poorly hyperlinked. As a GM, I'd recommend sticking with the one I linked.

[Jandrem]

Help me out here, I'm not a big PF player really(vastly prefer 3.5). Why would the actual, official site have less material? Does the unofficial one use homebrew material or something?

And again, I'd be more concerned with which site had the official errata and rulings, if a dispute arose.

[undead hero]

Help me out here, I'm not a big PF player really(vastly prefer 3.5). Why would the actual, official site have less material? Does the unofficial one use homebrew material or something?

And again, I'd be more concerned with which site had the official errata and rulings, if a dispute arose.

Because for all the hype Paizo is still the same company that made the 3.5 Dragon Mags.

Fans tend to fix things that are messed up.

Also watch out for PF rulings... Their team will randomly make a ruling on their forum and it becomes law. Like SKR and his ideas on monks and twf.

It won't be updated but you are expected to follow as if it was. The fan made d20 site actually keeps track of those random burst of insight that keeps the game balanced

[Jandrem]

Because for all the hype Paizo is still the same company that made the 3.5 Dragon Mags.

Fans tend to fix things that are messed up.

Also watch out for PF rulings... Their team will randomly make a ruling on their forum and it becomes law. Like SKR and his ideas on monks and twf.

It won't be updated but you are expected to follow as if it was. The fan made d20 site actually keeps track of those random burst of insight that keeps the game balanced

Ok, that does make sense. Thank you.

And yeah, the "random forum rulings made LAW" irritate me; it's as if following errata updates and such isn't enough, I have to comb through 500+ page threads(Monk, etc) to find a small mention of a rule clarification. I wasn't aware the fan site did that, so, that's pretty cool.

[Yora]

However, d20pfsrd marks it very clearly when something is changed in any other way than by the official errata files and new printing versions. There will be a big box explaining what the change is and where it comes from.

[Renegade Paladin]

I know about the SRD, but I'm not much for gaming with a laptop in front of me, primarily because I don't own one. :smalltongue: I'll make note cards on the relevant material for the books I don't actually own and it'll be fine, it was just something of a shock for it to call for more books than I can actually cram in my backpack to run something so short.

[137beth]

I'd be less concerned with ease of navigation, over incorrect game rules. Just my opinion.

It's your game. Who cares what counts as "official"? Unless you are the "official Paizo-approved DM" for some reason, does it really matter whether it is the "official website"?
I will note that in my experience, the pfsrd actually adds errata faster than the prd, so if that is a concern, then the "unofficial" pfsrd is your best bet. It doesn't really matter that it's "unofficial," since its not like you are reading off of the official DM screen anyways.

Help me out here, I'm not a big PF player really(vastly prefer 3.5). Why would the actual, official site have less material? Does the unofficial one use homebrew material or something?

And again, I'd be more concerned with which site had the official errata and rulings, if a dispute arose.
Some of the more obscure sources are not put on the prd. Just like WotC released a lot of open-gaming content in the XPH and ELH which were never placed on the "official" 3.5 srd, so d20srd.org has more content than the WotC SRD, even though both of them only include "official" content. And once again, the contradictions between d20srd.org and WotC's srd is that d20srd actually uses all/most the official errata, so you don't have to flip through the errata files to see what's changed. Paizo does substantially more errata than WotC did, so having all the updated rules in one place is even more useful for pathfinder than it is for 3.5.

I will note that the prd server appears to be faster--those pages always load sooner for me, so I will usually pull it up if the thing I'm looking for is
a)in the prd,
b)I know where in the prd it is, and
c)I don't think it's been recently errata'd (or don't really care)
Otherwise, it's easier to find stuff in the pfsrd, so I use that.

[Jandrem]

It's your game. Who cares what counts as "official"? Unless you are the "official Paizo-approved DM" for some reason, does it really matter whether it is the "official website"?
I will note that in my experience, the pfsrd actually adds errata faster than the prd, so if that is a concern, then the "unofficial" pfsrd is your best bet.


Well, for one, my players and I care what counts as "official." I'm pretty sure Pathfinder Society players are pretty concerned with what's "official" as well.

If there's a rules dispute, we default to what the official ruling for something is, and if we aren't happy with that, we come up with a better compromise.



It doesn't really matter that it's "unofficial," since its not like you are reading off of the official DM screen anyways.

Where did this come from? What, you mean This one? (http://www.amazon.com/Pathfinder-Roleplaying-Game-GMs-Screen/dp/1601252161) Yeah, I actually am reading off of it when I DM(I like the XP table on the far right side). Why would you even bring this up?

The issues you brought up, actually got answered about 5 hours before you even posted.