Magic Paper

[Fouredged Sword]

According to the D20srd, one can make paper walls. They have a break DC of 1, 1hp, and zero hardness.

But we can magically enchant them to have a beak DC 21 and the HP 51. It costs 1500gp for a 10ftX10ft section, or with a nice DM, 375gp for a 5ft x 5ft section.

This is almost as good as a 6" wooden wall.

How can we abuse this? I am thinking building a field constructed fortress made of paper, carried in on the backs of a small battalion. Or maybe just a wall set up in the middle of a battlefield.

[Jeff the Green]

Stack them n sheets thick. Each one gives the one behind it total cover, so no single attack can penetrate them. Even a hulking hurler throwing the moon won't be able to get through it in fewer than n attacks.

[BowStreetRunner]

There is a line in the Gust of Wind (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/gustOfWind.htm) spell that states "In addition to the effects noted, a gust of wind can do anything that a sudden blast of wind would be expected to do. It can create a stinging spray of sand or dust, fan a large fire, overturn delicate awnings or hangings, heel over a small boat, and blow gases or vapors to the edge of its range" So whatever you are planning, you will certainly want to come up with a way to solidly anchor your fortress.

Of course, Gust of wind + Permanency could also turn your paper fortress into a really cool kite!!! :smallbiggrin:

[Fouredged Sword]

Ok, now I want to get an elder air elemental to pull my paper fortress around like a blimp.

Is there any way to add hardness to an object? It's one thing I can't figure out how to add to the paper walls.

[nedz]

To get extra layers you could fold them — like origami ?

Actually: can you enchant the edges ?
Regular paper cuts can be nasty, but +1 vorpal paper would be hilarious.

[SethoMarkus]

There's the spell "Hardening" from the Spell Compendium, which adds 1 hardness/2 caster levels.

There's a whole discussion in the EnWorld forums, linked here (http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?205091-Spells-that-increase-hardness-hit-points-in-objects).

[Fouredged Sword]

Awesome. Now with a very modest application of hardness with a CL of 12 or so we can get hardness 6 on our paper walls, allowing them to ignore most arrows. Our paper walls are now, in all ways except weight, superior to a 6" wooden wall.

[koboldish]

Wait, what spell are you using to enchant them like that? I think that would be great. You could do so many things... I would say giant paper airplanes that could be ridden across the sky. They wouldn't need propulsion, and you could easily climb a cliff with one (they're very light, and made of paper) to launch it.

[Jeff the Green]

Wait, what spell are you using to enchant them like that? I think that would be great. You could do so many things... I would say giant paper airplanes that could be ridden across the sky. They wouldn't need propulsion, and you could easily climb a cliff with one (they're very light, and made of paper) to launch it.

Giant paper airplanes wouldn't fly. They suffer from the same square-cube law that makes giant ants impossible.

[Fouredged Sword]

Here is the link to the walls section of the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/dungeons.htm#dungeonTerrain)

Anyone with craft wonderous items can make a wall magical, increasing the toughness.

Paper is a specific example of a wall.

Thus, we can have magic paper walls, with hardness applied though the hardness spell (1 per CL) and extra HP and break DC from the magically treated wall attribute.

A 10ftx10ft wall segment would weigh no more than a pound or two for a wooden frame.

[koboldish]

Very nice. I wonder if there would be a way to apply this to armor... It would be very light and unrestrictive, but would have a huge hardness... Actually, now that I think about it, it wouldn't reduce the force of anything, just prevent it from completely reaching you. Mabye like DR 5/Slashing and Piercing?

[malmblad]

You take a 10x10 piece of paper and cut/tear it into 1x1 squares. Enchant certain pieces (4 or 5) to improve hardness etc... Mark them appropriately, cast secret page to hide the markings. Use mending (multiple times) to turn the 1x1s back into a 10x10, placing the enchanted sheets in a walkable pattern across. Permanently levitate over pit trap of choice. Use mending to replace holes where adventurers have fallen through.

[Fouredged Sword]

Or just have a long bridge, 10ft wide, with 5ft by 5ft paper tiles as the floor. Some of them are enchanted, some are not. The room is over a deep pit.

After the party gets half way across, someone sets the one end on fire. Better hurry up and get to the other side...

[malmblad]

Or just have a long bridge, 10ft wide, with 5ft by 5ft paper tiles as the floor. Some of them are enchanted, some are not. The room is over a deep pit.

After the party gets half way across, someone sets the one end on fire. Better hurry up and get to the other side...

That's a very expensive piece of parchment to burn.

[SiuiS]

Stack them n sheets thick. Each one gives the one behind it total cover, so no single attack can penetrate them. Even a hulking hurler throwing the moon won't be able to get through it in fewer than n attacks.

Not true. Area attacks specifically do damage to the next object if they have enough damage to destroy cover. If the n paper walls have 51 HP and a fireball does 104 damage, it destroys all the walls in its area.

Assuming paper benefits from taking half damage from fire (not a given!) and that it's 1 hardness comes in after the fact.

[BowStreetRunner]

Giant paper airplanes wouldn't fly. They suffer from the same square-cube law that makes giant ants impossible.

Oh, the poor cat-girls! :smallfrown:

[koboldish]

Well... Then how do real airplanes fly? Huh? :smallbiggrin:

[nedz]

Take a large sheet of paper
Cast Improve Hardness on it
Make an origami clown
Cast Animate Object


Might need some Fire resistance too.

[BowStreetRunner]

Take a large sheet of paper
Cast Improve Hardness on it
Make an origami clown
Cast Animate Object


Might need some Fire resistance too.

What this really needs is a fear effect to make it complete!

[Darrin]

Does it have to be paper? Grell Crystal (Lords of Madness) costs 10 GP, weighs 1 lb, mix it with 5 gallons of water, and in one hour it grows into a 5' x 5' sheet that's 1 inch thick, weighs 50 lbs, hardness 7, 20 HP per inch of thickness.

[Mithril Leaf]

I'd probably want to harden it first because making it magic would double the hardness you gain from the spell.

[CaladanMoonblad]

Well... Then how do real airplanes fly? Huh? :smallbiggrin:

With engines that provide constant force forward pushing air underneath the wings. A giant paper airplane is essentially a glider, which is why modern gliders have much larger wingspans than say, a Spitfire from WWII (which has an engine to pull it forward via propeller).

Paper walls... would likely be from a Rokugan type gameworld. I would put them in my Daimyo's fortress just to laugh when my heroes try to break through and are rebuffed... maybe magic those walls to also have a permanent "web" on them like a human sized fly paper.

Another use might be for nobles who create a paper wall around their favorite carriage, have it made invisible, and suddenly they have a mobile security vehicle to dissaude assassination (not unlike bulletproof windows for modern religious / political figures).

Other uses for magic paper walls... hm... Ah! Invisible bridges ala Indiana Jones! Paper is much easier to deploy, and far easier to carry when stretched between two poles.




Here's a question; while magic can increase the hardness and hitpoints of paper walls... what happens when the paper walls get wet? Real paper tears apart easily... would the magic inherently protect against water? Or not? Suddenly these paper walls could become soggy soddy messes with the first rain storm.

[Fouredged Sword]

A pain of magically hardened, then magically treated glass would be an interesting material to make stuff out of. One could build a glass structure with a hardness of 20 (assuming glass has zero hardness, which is probably incorrect)

Your glass carriage sides could easily have enough hardness to stop even siege weaponry and still be transparent.

[Nettlekid]

Giant paper airplanes wouldn't fly. They suffer from the same square-cube law that makes giant ants impossible.

I beg to differ. (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Formian)

[Gildedragon]

On the subject of magic paper: dragon magazine has origami golems and OA has magical origami a la marvellous pigments

[Cog]

Giant paper airplanes wouldn't fly. They suffer from the same square-cube law that makes giant ants impossible.
And giant ants, after all, are nowhere to be found in D&D (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/giantAnt.htm).

In D&D, I'm pretty sure the square-cube law merely describes how cubes are to be drawn on battle mats.

[Kelb_Panthera]

Giant paper airplanes wouldn't fly. They suffer from the same square-cube law that makes giant ants impossible.

Since others have highlighted the flaw in the giant ant comparison, I'll simply bring up the existence of hang-gliders.

:biggrin:

[Gildedragon]

Also, what happens if you have soarwood-pulp paper. Is it still floaty? Is it allowed on paper plane contests

Edit: soarwood pulp paper: the cheap(er) way to build a flying castle

[Slipperychicken]

@Paper Ariplane: Craft a Hang-Glider or Ornithopter (levitating hang-glider) out of it?

[koboldish]

Exactly! The proportions would be slightly off, but one could easily make a gliding machine out of paper. In your face, square-cube law!

[Fouredged Sword]

The statement of the square cubed law states that a human would need 30 or so feet of wingspan (based on wing design, possibly less) to fly. It doesn't say that human sized things CAN'T fly, we just need big wings.

Gliders have been made with VERY large wingspans. A glider made from paper that has a higher tensile strength than any known material (a single sheet of paper with the strength and toughness of 6" of wood!) would make building a large glider a simple proccess for anyone who understands wings and lift.

Now the issue is finding someone in DND who understands wings and lift.

[CaladanMoonblad]

The statement of the square cubed law states that a human would need 30 or so feet of wingspan (based on wing design, possibly less) to fly. It doesn't say that human sized things CAN'T fly, we just need big wings.

Gliders have been made with VERY large wingspans. A glider made from paper that has a higher tensile strength than any known material (a single sheet of paper with the strength and toughness of 6" of wood!) would make building a large glider a simple proccess for anyone who understands wings and lift.

Now the issue is finding someone in DND who understands wings and lift.

Except it doesn't have the same rigidity as wood. It has the same rigidity as paper. It just has higher hardness and increased hitpoints via magic. In all other respects, it acts like paper such as folding, blowing, getting wet, etc... because it is paper, and not wood. (Paper is traditionally made via rags, such as the paper imported to Europe via Crusaders returning from ------ censored------- countries).

The frame would have to be a rigid material (like mithral) that is lightweight and strong. You could have magic paper wings, but the wingspan still has to be enough to carry the glider itself and the passenger (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glider_(aircraft)). As a GM, this would be a Knowledge (Architecture and Engineering) DC 30 or so check considering that DaVinci's design would never fly based on his materials, and acts as a controlled fall with nylon and fiberglass (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XC74ImdHaLQ).

[Razanir]

According to the D20srd, one can make paper walls. They have a break DC of 1, 1hp, and zero hardness.

But we can magically enchant them to have a beak DC 21 and the HP 51. It costs 1500gp for a 10ftX10ft section, or with a nice DM, 375gp for a 5ft x 5ft section.

This is almost as good as a 6" wooden wall.

How can we abuse this? I am thinking building a field constructed fortress made of paper, carried in on the backs of a small battalion. Or maybe just a wall set up in the middle of a battlefield.

Simple and insanely durable 1" thick walls. Take a wall of wood about an inch thick. This is entirely for stability; paper is VERY flimsy. On either side of this, we have three sheets of protection. Magically treated and hardened paper, followed by lead, followed by more paper. Thin, fairly light, and capable of shielding a good amount of damage, most projectiles, and most divination spells