Trouble with Metapower

[Xalik]

My friend is playing a 10th level Elan Erudit, and we have some problem with interpretation of his feat "Metapower".

He already has metapsionic feats like Empower and Maximize Power. His idea is to take Metapower feat twice in order to reduce the modification cost, but he plans to take it for the 'same' power.

That is, he plans to take Energy Missile and maximize it using Maximize power feat and Metapower, thus spending only 2 (instead of 4) power-points. Since the description of Metapower says that it permanently modifies a power, and it further says "You can gain this feat multiple times. Each time you do, you choose a power—either one you have already modified or another power you know—and reduce the metapsionic feat cost of that power by 2 power points for a different specific metapsionic feat." He thus plans to use Empower Power and (second) Metapower feat on the already modified (maximized) version of Energy Missile (thus he won't have to spend extra power-points for empowerment at all, since Metapower reduces the cost by 2 and Empower power costs 2).

The resut would be quite a devastating spell that could (along with Overchannel) deal a lot of damage: Maximized 10d6 (10 manifester level, -2 Maximize, +2 Overchannel) + additional (non-maximized) 5d6 (Empower) + 15 (if he uses cold or fire damage). Approximately 92 damage for up to five creatures.

The problem is the following: since both Empower power and Maximize power require expending a psionic focus (and he, being an non-epic character without psicrystals) can have only one psionic focus. His interpretation is that Metapower feat allows one to manifest a power with both Empower and Maximize feats even when one cannot have two psionic focuses. He finds the reason for this belief in the description of Metapower mentioned earlier; since it explicitly says that one can apply another Metapower on already modified power (one that already requires expending psionic focus), two metapower feats can be applied to the same power without one being able to have two psionic focuses.

Would you agree with this explanation? My interpretation would be that already modified version can be modified again only if one has two psionic focuses (so, in epic levels or with psicrystals), but he believes that spending 4 feats on a single power should be sufficient cost to make this possible even when one cannoth have more than one psionic focus. What do you think? Tnx :smallsmile:

[TuggyNE]

Sorry, getting a psicrystal to enable two focuses is quite common, and entirely expected by the system. Without that, or an explicit exception, there's no reason I know of to suppose Metapower would give you a free focus, especially since focuses are one of the two biggest limits on manifester power. (The other one is ML, of course.) Basically, Metapower assumes that you have a way of applying two metapsionic feats, but doesn't let you do that if for some reason you do not.

[Keld Denar]

Yea, no dice. If he doesn't have 2 focuses, he can't use 2 metapsionic feats. Metapower doesn't change this. Even if it reduces the PP cost of a feat to 0, it doesn't reduce the need to expend the focus. Period.

He's extrapolating rules where there are no rules. There are no rules there for a reason, because what he's trying to do is wrong.

[Raendyn]

As keld denar said, he is talking nonsense.

btw considering the

The resut would be quite a devastating spell that...

If I invested 6 feats(2 metapsionics-2metapowers-crystal and containment for 2nd focus) and I had turned my most powerfull power into something I use once per encounter hurting every other metapsionic I would like to manifest, then I demand it to be a devastating power, there is nothing bad or nerfable about this. If he ever pays all 6 feats for it, then let him do it, he will regret it anyways.

[Shaynythyryas]

He finds the reason for this belief in the description of Metapower mentioned earlier; since it explicitly says that one can apply another Metapower on already modified power (one that already requires expending psionic focus), two metapower feats can be applied to the same power without one being able to have two psionic focuses.

The way i read it, yes, you can apply two or more metapowers feat ; but it nevers says that you do it in the same action.
To clarify : you can metapower EM for empower and metapower EM for maximize ; the gain will be for each one of these, SEPARATELY.
It's perfectly understandable to prepare a power for different metapowers which won't be used at the same times.