Sniper Build?

[Gwazi Magnum]

Basically an archer who can get ridiculous ranges and still be pretty accurate.

I know this is pretty easy since you gain your range increment again each time you take a -2 penalty to your attack roll so it becomes a simple matter of getting ridiculous accuracy.

So I guess the basic question then is how do you make a ridiculously accurate archer who can still do decent damage?

[Waker]

Well, as far as sniping goes there are a few popular choices. Hunter's Eye and Sniper's Shot both come to mind as somewhat decent choices for doing damage at range. There is also a post somewhere about by Tippy detailing a Factotum using Cunning Strike for massive damage at range, but I am having trouble locating it at the moment. Crossbow Sniper extends your range to SA/Skirmish and adds some Dex to damage.
There is also the Sniper variant ACF for Scout in Dragon #346.

[Hiro Protagonest]

D&D hates snipers. The only way to be a good archer is to try your best to turn your bow into a light machine gun.

[Darrin]

Tippy's Bird of Prey (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=286818) build is about as sniper-ish as D&D gets.

[Piggy Knowles]

I've also got a sniper build in my archer compendium. In particular, check out the Deepwood Sniper build in the "in progress" category (I'll edit in a link when I get home). Build stub is Ranger 2/Feat Rogue 4/Deepwood Sniper 7/Chameleon 7, and it's focused on sniping from distance with a single shot. Also, google "ksbsnowowl archer compendium" for some more snipers (ksbsnowowl's original sniper is what inspired me to play around with archers in the first place, and gave me the idea for my own Deepwood Sniper build).

EDIT: Here you go:

Deepwood Sniper Build

Ranger 2/Wilderness Feat Rogue 4/Deepwood Sniper 7/Chameleon 7

(Dedicated to an Elder Evil of your choosing.)

1. Feat Rogue1- PBS, Precise Shot, Able Learner, Evil Brand
2. Ranger1- Track
3. Ranger2- Rapid Shot, Darkstalker
4. Feat Rogue2- WF (Comp. Longbow)
5. Feat Rogue3- Blood War Conscript
6. Feat Rogue4- Far Shot, Martial Study (Shadow Jaunt)
7. Deepwood Sniper1-
8. DWS2-
9. DWS3- Knowledge Devotion
10. DWS4- Murderous Intent
11. Chameleon1-
12. Chameleon2- Martial Stance (Assassin’s Stance)
13. DWS5-
14. DWS6-
15. DWS7- Apostate, Craven
16. Chameleon3-
17. Chameleon4-
18. Chameleon5- Maiming Strike
19. Chameleon6-
20. Chameleon7- Insane Defiance

It gets all the relevant stealth and tracking goodies, and can use Hunter's Mercy and Murderous Intent to fire off arrows guaranteed to crit with a x6 multiplier (with kaorti resin arrows). It gets Poison Use, and Chameleon can nab Minor Creation to make poisons on demand. It can pick up new favored enemies on demand via the floating feat for Extra Favored Enemy (since Murderous Intent is reliant on Favored Enemy, this is important). With Hunter's Eye we're looking at 4 points of Charisma damage, which translates to 24 points with the auto-crit.

So, assuming a +2 collision energy bow with GMW cast on it, and a +4 strength bonus, we can look at something like...

1d8 +2 FE +20 craven +1 Blood War Conscript +5 enhancement +5 collision +4 strength +17 power shot +5 knowledge devotion = 1d8+59 base damage. So with a single arrow, we're looking at a MINIMUM of 360 points of damage, plus poison and 24 points of Charisma damage. That's just from the first shot that successfully hits - if this fails to KO, the remaining shots should.

[BowStreetRunner]

Basically an archer who can get ridiculous ranges and still be pretty accurate.

The one real drawback to ridiculous ranges is that many DMs will hit you with the ridiculous Spot penalties (-1 per 10 ft of distance) in the rules in order to even pick out your target. (Not all DMs remember these rules however, and some just don't care to enforce them.)

So an american football player lined up 10 yards (30 ft) deep in the endzone on a kickoff would have a -36 penalty (100 yards, plus 10 yards each for the endzones themselves) to spot the goal post in the opposite endzone. A professional soccer goalie would have a -30 penalty to spot the opposing goalie.

And when I was shooting my M-16 in the army at man-sized targets 300 yards (900 ft) away without a scope apparently I was somehow able to overcome a -90 spot penalty to still hit my target.

Honestly, I think the point of the spot penalties and certain other range-based rules were simply to shrink the playing area to a manageable size, so it doesn't bother me. But keep in mind that when going after long-range shots with a composite bow your spot check will become more of an issue than the range-increment penalties in many cases.

[Gwazi Magnum]

Well, as far as sniping goes there are a few popular choices. Hunter's Eye and Sniper's Shot both come to mind as somewhat decent choices for doing damage at range. There is also a post somewhere about by Tippy detailing a Factotum using Cunning Strike for massive damage at range, but I am having trouble locating it at the moment. Crossbow Sniper extends your range to SA/Skirmish and adds some Dex to damage.
There is also the Sniper variant ACF for Scout in Dragon #346.

Can't find the ACF, when I try to get the pdf it demands a password.

The spells look awesome though and crossbow might be something I'd look into as well.


Tippy's Bird of Prey (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=286818) build is about as sniper-ish as D&D gets.

I know Tippy's good at making builds, but that was just too brief for me to understand what he was going with there.
Other than high Wisdom for accuracy, but doesn't that prevent him from gaining several feats?

Also his BAB was suffering with +12 at level 20.


I've also got a sniper build in my archer compendium. In particular, check out the Deepwood Sniper build in the "in progress" category (I'll edit in a link when I get home). Build stub is Ranger 2/Feat Rogue 4/Deepwood Sniper 7/Chameleon 7, and it's focused on sniping from distance with a single shot. Also, google "ksbsnowowl archer compendium" for some more snipers (ksbsnowowl's original sniper is what inspired me to play around with archers in the first place, and gave me the idea for my own Deepwood Sniper build)

Interesting, but how is it you're getting guaranteed crit and a x6 multiplier?


The one real drawback to ridiculous ranges is that many DMs will hit you with the ridiculous Spot penalties (-1 per 10 ft of distance) in the rules in order to even pick out your target. (Not all DMs remember these rules however, and some just don't care to enforce them.)

So an american football player lined up 10 yards (30 ft) deep in the endzone on a kickoff would have a -36 penalty (100 yards, plus 10 yards each for the endzones themselves) to spot the goal post in the opposite endzone. A professional soccer goalie would have a -30 penalty to spot the opposing goalie.

And when I was shooting my M-16 in the army at man-sized targets 300 yards (900 ft) away without a scope apparently I was somehow able to overcome a -90 spot penalty to still hit my target.

Honestly, I think the point of the spot penalties and certain other range-based rules were simply to shrink the playing area to a manageable size, so it doesn't bother me. But keep in mind that when going after long-range shots with a composite bow your spot check will become more of an issue than the range-increment penalties in many cases.

Noted, and it does seem ridiculous.
But I guess I'll need to find a way to increase spot a lot too know, which makes Wisdom Archer and skill focus (spot) look more attractive now.

[Piggy Knowles]

Interesting, but how is it you're getting guaranteed crit and a x6.

1. Murderous Intent feat means I automatically confirm all crits versus favored enemies. If the enemy I'm sniping isn't a FE for Arcane Hunter, I use the chameleon floating feat for Extra Favored Enemy to nab the appropriate option.

2. Hunter's Mercy spell ensures that my next hit is an auto-crit,

3. Kaorti resin arrows have a x4 crit multiplier, and seven levels of Deepwood Sniper increases that by two stages to x6.

[Tvtyrant]

Launch item can trip with area effect items is a good way. Bead of force is especially good ammo.

[Oontarg]

Races of Stone has Cragtop Archer. At first level you get Farsight which gives you -1 to spot for every 20ft (normally 10Ft). Level 3 you gain Arcing Shot which gives you and additional 5 range increments or 15 range increments. This plus Far Shot and levels in Deepwood Sniper allows you to fire a bow very far. A good spell to cast on ones self is True Strike effectively remove 10 range increments on the next attack(if you don't mind firing only once).

EDIT: Farsight is great with a spyglass.

[Waker]

Can't find the ACF, when I try to get the pdf it demands a password.

The spells look awesome though and crossbow might be something I'd look into as well.

The gist of it is that you lose Skirmish and Fast Movement. Every 4 levels you gain an additional 1d6 damage. As a full-round action (no 5ft step) you can shoot a target +60ft away.
Really not that impressive damage-wise or how they restrict the action to one full-round attack. The only potential upside is that if you have line of effect and some method of seeing the target at extreme range, you can shoot it and deal extra damage.

[elonin]

I asked a similar question to my game group and they reminded me that the max range is 5 increments. I thought there were ways to get an extra one, but feats like far shot only increase your increment size.

-1 per 10' is a bit harsh. Though when you were shooting the m-16 were the targets hiding? Much of the time I've played it wouldn't matter as I play an archer and many encounters aren't range friendly. Many times even in areas that don't grant much concealment the encounters start at melee range. That's not even to mention dungeons.

[Oontarg]

5 range increments is for throw weapons. Other ranged weapons have 10.

[Emperor Tippy]

I know Tippy's good at making builds, but that was just too brief for me to understand what he was going with there.
Other than high Wisdom for accuracy, but doesn't that prevent him from gaining several feats?
Nope, has all of the needed sniping feats..


Also his BAB was suffering with +12 at level 20.
Yes but his AB is +36 and you get 3 attacks.

[rypt]

Deepwood Sniper from Masters of the Wild increases the critical hit multiplier of your bow.

Peerless Archer from Silver Marches gives you ranged power attack.

The hunter's mercy spell guarantees a critical hit.

If you're able to use material from Dragon Magazine, then the Mystic Ranger, Targeteer Fighter and/or the Dead Eye feat will all contribute meaningfully to your build.

[Oontarg]

The spell every sniper should use is Guided Shot from Spell Compendium. it lets you ignore distance, cover and concealment penalties.

If a sniper Assassin, Ranger/rogue or Wizard/rogue the spell Sniper Shot (Spell Compendium) you sneak attack at range.

[Samalpetey]

Out of interest, how would you counter something like a Cragtop Archer shooting from 1000 feet away?

[Piggy Knowles]

Out of interest, how would you counter something like a Cragtop Archer shooting from 1000 feet away?

Wind Wall?

[thethird]

Get a cragtop archer who is large, be it by race or by magic, give it strongarm bracers, then get a huge crossbow with self loading and quick loading. And presto, you have an archer that fires a siege weapon, and thus bypasses wind wall