human mount/companion?

[Zoltro]

Hello,

In an upcoming campaign I'm about to play the divine spellcaster. I was thinking of playing a gnome druid with a mentally challenged human as his companion and mount. I borrowed the idea from the character "Master Blaster' from the movie Mad Max beyond Thunderdome. I was wondering if there are specific rules for using a human as a mount? Could you consider a human with int 2 an animal of some sort? Is there anyone who has done something like this before? It seems like a lot of fun, but I hope it doesn't involve a lot feats and rule bending.

Some answers would be great! Thanks in advance.

Regards,

Zoltro

[Rover]

I'd think that would be more of a mentally challenged cohort.
But it might work with some persuading the DM.:smallwink:

[Zoltro]

I'm not sure if we are allowed cohortsor other followers. A mount however is allowed. I already talked to the dm about it and he likes the idea, but is wondering if it were different rule wise, having a human as mount. Do you need certain feats or skills, or does the mount need something like that? I do need a custom carriage For rising on the back of the human i suppose.

[Uncle Pine]

I don't think you can ride a "normal" human. However, there should be a graft somewhere (Fiendish Codex maybe?) that turn a bipedal creature into a quadrupedal, and Advanced Bestiary has a Quadrupedal creature template. You'd only end with a human cohort if you take Leadership, though...

I hope you'll find some official rule to roll your human companion: I could make good use of such a character to create an hilarious Ubermount in a future campaign :smallbiggrin:

[awa]

well you take a penalty on ride checks for an unsuitable mount but that really it by raw. (as far as i know)

[Morph Bark]

In the 3.0 Arms & Equipment Guide, there were mounts listed, including bipedal (monstrous) humanoids. The only thing about them was that they needed some training for it (easy enough with their intelligence) and special saddles that cost a lot more than normal ones (2-4 times as much? It's in the PHB). Other than that, the normal mount rules (Str must be high enough to carry rider, must be at least one size larger than rider).

[Zoltro]

Leadership is out of the question since the campaign starts at level 1. Training will be costly, so I think the "human companion" might be my best bet. I don't know how much training a human needs to have to carry someone. Hodor seems to carry Bran pretty easy in Game of Thrones.

[RogueDM]

I don't think a mount necessarily -needs- to be a quadruped. Just has be larger (by at least one size) to carry the rider. I would say that an Intelligence score of 1 or 2 would be required to treat a human as an animal, ie Handle Animal. A mount with higher intelligence would require some Diplomacy in place of Handle Animal to convince them to let you ride about on their shoulders.

Additionally the Ride rules state that you suffer a -5 penalty for riding a creature that's ill suited for a mount. On top of that you'll need an exotic saddle to avoid the -5 penalty for riding bareback.

So, no feats -required- although Leadership makes your life a lot easier if you have it. A high Ride skill helps.

[awa]

of course mounts don't need to be quadruped in real life people can ride an Ostrich. In d&d there are lots of dinosaurs that get ridden

[Slipperychicken]

Before you can designate him as a cohort, you might want to pay Hodor (for lack of a better name) as a hireling of his level and maybe a share of the treasure for his Hodoring. That way he can be established as a loyal companion, even if not a very smart or useful one.

[Zoltro]

Before you can designate him as a cohort, you might want to pay Hodor (for lack of a better name) as a hireling of his level and maybe a share of the treasure for his Hodoring. That way he can be established as a loyal companion, even if not a very smart or useful one.

This sounds reasonable, although "Hodor" is going to be my main mode of transportation. The gnome will be weak and slow without hodor. He could be a cripple old gnome to make things interesting. I do want him to grow a bit stronger as my druids levels. I don't want him dying off from 1 fireball blast.

Would it be fair to use an exotic saddle, made specifically for Hodor? I do think that the saddle should weigh less than a regular saddle, since a gnome is smaller and weighs less than a human. It's not specified in the PHB that a saddle for a pony or riding dog weighs less as well.

[Ravens_cry]

The Ride (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/ride.htm)skill says "If you attempt to ride a creature that is ill suited as a mount, you take a -5 penalty on your Ride checks. " I would say a human or humanoid counts as this, but as long as you meet the other requirement, being one size smaller than your mount, go right ahead, at least by RAW. It's actually something I have considered for a character, but the game was too low level to eat the -5 penalty with impunity.

[Zoltro]

I suppose I could take skill focus (ride) and above average dex. The skill focus seems like a good feat for this character. I was wondering about 1 more thing though. I had found the race called Ghostwise Halfling. They are small, just as Gnomes are. Would it be possible to issue commands to Hodor through his telepathic ability? I would like to give the impression that Hodor is intelligent and makes his own decisions.

[Snails]

I suppose I could take skill focus (ride) and above average dex. The skill focus seems like a good feat for this character. I was wondering about 1 more thing though. I had found the race called Ghostwise Halfling. They are small, just as Gnomes are. Would it be possible to issue commands to Hodor through his telepathic ability? I would like to give the impression that Hodor is intelligent and makes his own decisions.

Read the Handle Animal (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/handleAnimal.htm) skill very carefully, and note the Link ability in the AC description (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/druid.htm#theDruidsAnimalCompanion). BTW, Handle Animal has a synergy bonus for ride, so once you hit 2nd level that -5 is not too terrible.

[Uncle Pine]

It seems that I got confused reading the paragraph "Mount" in Chapter 6 of DMG, where it use a giant as an example of a creature that can't be used as a mount because it can't transport it. I don't have the English manual, so I can't quote the phrase, though.

Anyway, by RAW the only problem seems to be that you only need an exotic saddle for Hodor. Also, remember that Mounted Combat (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#mountedCombat) lets you use your Ride check as your mount's AC 1/round.

[Zoltro]

Thanks for all the replies so far. They've all been very helpful.
I'll be sure to pick up mounted combat and ranks in handle animal.
It seems I can't avoid this -5 penalty for riding an ill suited mount, but with at least 14 dex and 4 ranks into ride, i will get a +1 modifier on ride checks on lvl 1.
At level 2 i will have enough funds to buy an exotic military saddle. This will give me a +2 on staying in the saddle checks. It also lowers my chances of falling off if i get knocked unconscious. At level 2 I will also have 5 ranks in handle animal which, gives me a +2 synergy bonus.

This means i will always stay in my saddle and be able to steer with my knees.
The higher dc skill checks will still prove difficult, such as Fight with Warhorse (hodor) which is dc 15.

I'm not sure if it's worth spending a feat in Skill Focus Ride for that. I do know that my character is probably going to spend most of the campaign mounted.

[thethird]

In one game I wanted to get my DM's to allow me to have a child familiar. They are 1 HD creatures after all...

[Uncle Pine]

You may or may not found the Mount Handbook useful. Here (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=7414) it is anyway.

I also found a pretty nifty 5 level PrC on Lords of Darkness (FR): Zhentarim Skymage (it's also mentioned in the handbook above). It gives you full spellcasting progression as well as a ton of other bonus abilities. On top of that at 1st level it gives you a special mount. The only limit to this mount it's that it has to be a flying mount: this means that even a human (if you slap on it something like the winged template from Savage Species) could be chosen. The problems are that (1) the Zhentarim are a group of very bad guys, (2) it's Forgotten Realms specific and (3) it requires some arcane spellcasting (you must be able to cast detect thoughts, invisibility, suggestion and summon monster III or above) even if it can theorically progress divine spellcasting. Basically, I only mentioned this PrC because it can grant a humanoid "special mount"*, but it could be difficult to tweak it to insert in a campaign outside FR.

*Here I mean a mount with special abilities, not the paladin's special mount.

[Zoltro]

I don't know how to balance things since there are no specific stats for a "hodor companion." Since we're going to end up at 8th level probably, I didn't go any further than that. Here's what I've made:

On every level, Hodor gains 1 hit die.
He does not however, gain any bonus natural armor.
Instead of gaining 2 str and dex around lvl 6, he gets 1 stat allocation at 4 and 8, like a regular character.
The bonus tricks and special features stay the same.
I'm not sure if it's too much to give him 1 hit die every level, but it seems more fitting for a human. He has to be a bit tanky.

As for his statistics:
Str 16, Dex 12, Con 16, Int 2, Wis 10, Cha 8.

Uses Animal Subtype for calculating Base saves (fort/ref high), BAB (3/4), D8 HD, Skill Points equal to 2+int, minimum is 1. He will not gain low-light vision or gain proficiency with natural attacks. Instead I would give him proficiency with simple weapons and proficiency with light armor or something.
It might be even easier to let him gain class levels into warrior instead of using the animal subtype.

One more question, by the way. Would you say that spells that affect animals (calm animals, animal growth), will affect Hodor? Would spells that affect humanoids (hold person), affect Hodor as well?

edit: the prestige class sounds a bit too evil and arcane-spellcaster-ish. Thanks for the tip and the link to the handbook though. THere's some nice stuff I can use from there.

[Gwendol]

No, it's still a human, not an animal or plant despite the lack of intelligence. Also, I'd give Hodor INT 3, which is the minimum for humans.

[Zoltro]

Fair enough, he will be a regular human with int 3. I suppose he will have some combat training because bashing stuff is what he is good at. Are the ability scores I mentioned too strong for a companion like that? Can I assume he knows how to wear armor and wield simple weapons? I could always spend feats on it so he is trained with them. I don't want to make him a melee powerhouse and have him outshine the party's melee specialist.

[Snails]

Guiding a train war mount in battle is a DC 10 Ride check for a free action.

Ordering a trained animal to apply its attack trick is a DC 10 Handle Animal check as a free action for an animal companion. Either the human mount is an "animal" for these purposes or it is intelligent enough to simply accept verbal instructions.

[Toliudar]

The other way to approach this would be to use all of the mechanical elements of a standard animal companion, refluffing it into a "brain-damaged human." as desired. The stats for a pony, for example, could work very well at level 1, and then swap over to Ape stats at level 4, etc. Simple.

Otherwise, giving you a human "animal companion" with the ability to use spears, armour, etc - and with a pretty decent stat array - is even more broken at level 1 than the animal companion ability already is.

[Slipperychicken]

Would it be fair to use an exotic saddle, made specifically for Hodor?

Yes

http://1-media-cdn.foolz.us/ffuuka/board/tg/image/1339/62/1339629045303.jpg

[Sparkzlight]

I once had a halfling bard that used a charmed half-ogre as a mount.

[Zoltro]

I was thinking of giving Hodor weapon/armor proficiency, but only the ones the druid can use, so no metal armor and only the weapons listed in the phb in the druid discription.

Since I would have to equip both the druid and Hodor, it's going to be expensive so i'm probably not going to be able to purchase 2 dragonhide plates for the both of us. I think Hodor is going to end up with studded leather and a shield. That's nothing you can't achieve with natural armor and barding that animals would get.

Studded Leather (3) +heavy wooden shield (2) +12 dex (1) = 16 AC. The same amount a riding dog has.
His weapon would be a shortspear, club or scimitar, which does 1d6 dmg, plus his strength bonus, which is 3. 1d6+3, the same amount the riding dog does with a bite attack.

It could be just me, but i don't see anything overpowered here yet.