Why in the blasted infernal hells did V not already tell roy about the planet?

[theinsulabot]

a mistake like that I could see from elan easy, and haley, just due to her usual reticence and instinctual need to keep secrets. Heck, I could maaaaaaaybe see it from durkon if he just forgot. Might be a head tilter, but Durkon can be a bit absent minded at times. But V?

I just...cant find a reason for him to not share that bit of information. He isn't forgetful enough to forget, it doesn't risk the order learning to much about the splice because they already know the part where the phylactery was lost and there is no way V wouldn't see the tactical value in informing Roy that the damn snarl might not actually be real. Or at least, that they don't have all the details.

[Kish]

As s/he said, because s/he didn't believe Roy would listen to him/her.

:roy: "There's a planet inside the rift? You saw it?"
:vaarsuvius: "Not personally, but my familiar--"
:roy: "The illusionary crow 'saw' a planet, inside the planet we're standing on."
:vaarsuvius: :furious:

[theinsulabot]

the thought occurred to me, but while good for a joke gag, I feel like if at some point in camp, V said in his usual long winded form, I have knowledge you need to hear about the gates, Roy would listen even if told him it came from his dead relative speaking to him through his ancestral ponytail.

Not too mention if it was really that important blackwing and V could have proved the truth of blackwing's existence. I am willing to call vital information on the safety and surety of the 5 artifacts they have taken upon themselves against ye powers of darkness "that important."

[Throknor]

When?

The last time they were sitting together in a non-manic state was on the boat which is when V first learned of it from Blackwing. As V pondered what it means they arrived on the continent. They split up and V. decided to wait until Roy acknowledges Blackwing. A couple of days later they were separated again by the bounty hunters and didn't meet again until right before entering the Windy Canyon. Then they were separated again once they enter.

I know it seems like a long time to us, but it's been established to be about two weeks time since Roy's resurrection. V simply hasn't had a chance to a) work it out in his own mind and b) sit with Roy in a non-action state to discuss it rationally.

[Scrynor]

I think you can really easily chalk it up to mental distress and lack of certain information. V was really mopey, introspective, and shut away after Darth V. I don't think V was talking to anyone about the things that happened during the splice. I think "not in normal state of mind" is acceptable.

Furthermore, the information is so incomplete and it wasn't immediately relevant. V doesn't seem like the type to share idle speculation. V would think on it and work it all out and probably try and do some sort of arcane research before saying anything. I doubt "what if we are separated at a critical juncture involving whether or not to destroy a gate in a race against time" seemed overly plausible.

[SaintRidley]

V's an overthinker. I'd hazard a guess that V has been applying every logical and intellectual faculty to determining just what that information means, so as to put together a complete rundown of possibilities for Roy. I expect V to have been thinking this to death and expecting to find the gate with Roy and the others and explain the theory then, not to get freaked out about the Familicide and separated from the group where V is unable to communicate, unable to know that the Linear Guild is in the mix (believing them neutralized at the palace), and unable to know when Xykon goes on the move.

In short:

V was putting together every possible angle of the information to make sure the info was as complete as possible in typical long-winded overthinking V style.

V thought the variables would be set one way, allowing the group some time at the gate to figure things out. But the variables wound up very different. The Linear Guild surviving and adding Tarquin and Malack was unanticipated. V not being there to learn that Xykon is on the move was unanticipated. The Draketooths being dead was unanticipated. Separated and crunched for time is not how V would want to relay the information, I would think.

[theinsulabot]

When?

The last time they were sitting together in a non-manic state was on the boat which is when V first learned of it from Blackwing. As V pondered what it means they arrived on the continent. They split up and V. decided to wait until Roy acknowledges Blackwing. A couple of days later they were separated again by the bounty hunters and didn't meet again until right before entering the Windy Canyon. Then they were separated again once they enter.

I know it seems like a long time to us, but it's been established to be about two weeks time since Roy's resurrection. V simply hasn't had a chance to a) work it out in his own mind and b) sit with Roy in a non-action state to discuss it rationally.

Hows about on the flying carpet on the way to the canyon? Or any of the other opportunities which come to mind?

They are on their way the 4th gate and certainly had some downtime while traveling together, a night camping if nothing else. Now, you are right in the sense that not as much time has past as it feels like to us, but on the other hand information about that planet to us almost seems like a trivial point or something we will learn about later as its part of a book we are reading. To V. and the others, the gate's are the apocalyptic macguffin that will doom not only their world but the very heavens above if misused or which should fall into the wrong hands. Further, have been repeatedly blown up until this point. Intended or not, the order has left a trail of smoldering gate parts in their wake, and V decides to not share the information on what it is they have been watching krakakooooom?

That's not something you sit on while you wait for people to start petting your pet bird and V is logical enough to understand that. You cant even blame his addled state of mind due to familicide because the majority of those two weeks when he had plenty of opportunity to do so took place before he found out.

[Jay R]

By now, you should have figured out that the Order doesn't always do things the intelligent way. Large chunks of the story so far could have been avoided by having the Order do things more intelligently.

But Rich isn't trying to wrap this up quickly. He's trying to tell a long, involved story.

The only reasons for somebody to do anything are to :
A. drive the plot where it's supposed to go, or
b. tell a joke.

There has not been a plot- or humor-driven need for V to tell Roy yet, and there was a plot-driven need for Roy not to know about it now.

So Vaarsuvius couldn't tell Roy yet.

In the words of one of the great 20th century philosophers, "Not any time. Only when it was funny."

[Trixie]

When?

A The last time they were sitting together in a non-manic state was on the boat which is when V first learned of it from Blackwing. B As V pondered what it means they arrived on the continent.

Between A and B there was a time skip. Plenty of time with nothing to do to tell what happened, IMHO.

[hamishspence]

Some of that time skip is shown in Snips, Snails, and Dragon Tales- the Order telling stories, on the trip over.

[Throknor]

Hows about on the flying carpet on the way to the canyon? Or any of the other opportunities which come to mind?


Are we reading the same comic? V was in the dimension of dipping sauces during that.

V thought about the information on the boat ride. In Sandsedge Roy reacted to Blackwing as an illusion, so the trip with the caravan wasn't going to be a good time to put him forth as a witness. Then after they found the gate illusion it was a day or two before the bounty hunters struck, and they had no time to speak until the day V came back, which is the morning of the day they entered the canyon in a race to beat the linear guild.

If you want to argue that Roy should have immediately confronted V and got his story with O-Chul's before setting out I will agree with you. Keep in mind that V realizes volunteering the information 'Hey, my bird you don't believe is there saw a planet inside the rift so the paladins and gods may be lying' would probably directly lead to the question 'how did you attack Xykon' and V's deal with the devils. So V needed to build himself up for that possibility as well, and there just hasn't been time to do that.

[Coat]

V's an overthinker. I'd hazard a guess that V has been applying every logical and intellectual faculty to determining just what that information means, so as to put together a complete rundown of possibilities for Roy.

This.

The only thing that V hates more than failing to deliver in ultimate arcane power, is failing to deliver in knowledge (more than you). Particularly on magical topics.

Yeah, there's pretty much no way V was going to mention to anyone what Blackwing saw in the rift without either a convincing explanation of what it is, or a pressing reason to do so. And up till now, there's been no urgency.

Dumb? Yes. In character? Also very much yes.

[Tock Zipporah]

This was addressed (albeit briefly) in comic, here: http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0633.html first panel.

V was waiting until Roy got over the whole "It's not a real raven, just an illusion of one" thing from the beginning of this book.

[pendell]

V's an overthinker. I'd hazard a guess that V has been applying every logical and intellectual faculty to determining just what that information means, so as to put together a complete rundown of possibilities for Roy. I expect V to have been thinking this to death and expecting to find the gate with Roy and the others and explain the theory then, not to get freaked out about the Familicide and separated from the group where V is unable to communicate, unable to know that the Linear Guild is in the mix (believing them neutralized at the palace), and unable to know when Xykon goes on the move.

In short:

V was putting together every possible angle of the information to make sure the info was as complete as possible in typical long-winded overthinking V style.

V thought the variables would be set one way, allowing the group some time at the gate to figure things out. But the variables wound up very different. The Linear Guild surviving and adding Tarquin and Malack was unanticipated. V not being there to learn that Xykon is on the move was unanticipated. The Draketooths being dead was unanticipated. Separated and crunched for time is not how V would want to relay the information, I would think.

I think you're right. At the time V didn't have enough information to go to Roy with anything but idle speculation, which Roy has indicated already he has no time for. Roy is very task-oriented. That's why he's the leader.

After that time , they were all to busy with bounty hunters and desert raiders for V to have any time to think about it.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[Komodo]

If I could put my two cents into the ring? I haven't seen anyone give this argument yet:

Shame.

V saw the world while doing something she would later be intensely ashamed of. I'd wager she's been trying to bury the whole thing, especially the genocide, but also her failed conquest of Xykon. Bringing the whole thing up, even discounting Blackwing's help, would be to reveal to Roy what she did. It'd even be possible that he'd find out about the soul-splice in the course of the interrogation, as he might ask why she thought she could take the lich and she wouldn't have a better answer.

Foolish to leave it buried, certainly. But such is V's flaw. And now it looks like its coming back to bite her.

[Gift Jeraff]

Everyone thought V had gone temporarily insane at the time + they've barely had the time to discuss it + V's elven insensitivity to the flow of time is established in OtOoPC. Putting it off for 2 weeks is more like "I'll tell them after a good night's rest."

[Narren]

I know it seems like a long time to us, but it's been established to be about two weeks time since Roy's resurrection. V simply hasn't had a chance to a) work it out in his own mind and b) sit with Roy in a non-action state to discuss it rationally.

Whaaaaaat? You just blew my mind. I need to reread this comic.

[Werbaer]

The last time they were sitting together in a non-manic state was on the boat which is when V first learned of it from Blackwing.
As V pondered what it means they arrived on the continent.

Between A and B there was a time skip. Plenty of time with nothing to do to tell what happened, IMHO.
On day. There were in in Sandsedge two days (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0678.html) after V encountered the dragon.

[Throknor]

Whaaaaaat? You just blew my mind. I need to reread this comic.

About a fortnight (2 weeks) since Roy's resurrection. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0842.html) Given the 3 hour phantasm, that was maybe just four hours ago.

It was probably his plan to bring it up when facing the gate, but as fate has it he's not in the same room to do so. I have no doubt even if he hadn't told Roy before reaching the gate, hearing Roy say "I'm destroying the gate" V would have spoken up before letting him.

Between V wanting to ponder it out himself, the likelihood of needing to discuss the entire soul-splice episode and its cost, the race to get to the gate, and the fact he & Roy aren't two characters to spontaneously begin chatting there has just not been a time to discuss this.

[WindStruck]

Because he isn't nearly as smart as an 18+ int score would lead you to believe. Or maybe it's a lack of wisdom that's the problem. Either way, because he made yet another stupid decision thinking that it either didn't concern the others or making up other excuses.

Oh well, not complaining about the storytelling or anything.

[Chantelune]

Right after the discovery, as stated, V needed to wrap her head around that new information, then the rest of the party wouldn't acknowledge Blackwing's existence.

If V were to reveal what's inside the Rift, Roy would ask were that knowledge come from and if V were to say "my raven saw it", he would probably have dismissed it as some sort of dellusion or an attempt to make them believe in Blackwing.

Plus, at that time and after, Roy was set on protecting the gate, not destroying it, considering that destroying it would be bad. The information V held was not urgent nor critical as she had no reason to consider that Roy would want to destroy the gate.

Finally, the recent events put quite a lot of more pressing matters into V's mind than the planet within. Up until right now, telling Roy about it was not so urgent as V thought Roy would not try and blow up the gate.

So yeah, right this instant, that information is critical, but up until now, it was at best secondary. Can't really blame V for not bringing it up as nobody in the party seemed ready to acknowledge Blackwing and might dismiss the information anyway.

[David Argall]

Why should V have told Roy? Does the knowlege of the rift world get the party to the rift ahead of X? Does it tell them how to beat X? Does it tell them how to build a gate?
It's pretty much worthless information. The sort of thing you might mention in a bored moment, but really it does not change anything.
Now right now, the information seems important to V because he/she is having a crisis. Having casually made a decision now shown to be very bad, she/he is afraid to make any decisions where there are major unknowns. The elf is imaging all sorts of impossible fears.

[Mike Havran]

V has always been a scholar, and a "I just saw a planet-within-planet" report doesn't really give enough ground to shine. V needed more insight to the whole topic, more information, more clues ... and it's not like the responsible Sir Greenhilt would be willing to destroy another Gate just like that ... right?

[denthor]

Why should V have told Roy? Does the knowlege of the rift world get the party to the rift ahead of X? Does it tell them how to beat X? Does it tell them how to build a gate?
It's pretty much worthless information. The sort of thing you might mention in a bored moment, but really it does not change anything.
Now right now, the information seems important to V because he/she is having a crisis. Having casually made a decision now shown to be very bad, she/he is afraid to make any decisions where there are major unknowns. The elf is imaging all sorts of impossible fears.


To build on Davids point. Why in the past did V have any reason to open her mouth. She only speaks when (s)he is sure of all of the details no speculation.

[WindStruck]

Well, here's one, for starters: because the sapphire guard gate was destroyed intentionally in order to prevent xykon from getting control of it, and that was also the same excuse used to let the OOTS off the hook for blowing up Dorukan's gate.

So clearly, the tactic of destroying the gate as a last ditch effort should have been known, and V should have thought of the ramifications of that earlier.

[Tock Zipporah]

Well, here's one, for starters: because the sapphire guard gate was destroyed intentionally in order to prevent xykon from getting control of it, and that was also the same excuse used to let the OOTS off the hook for blowing up Dorukan's gate.

So clearly, the tactic of destroying the gate as a last ditch effort should have been known, and V should have thought of the ramifications of that earlier.

Does the order know how or why the gate was destroyed? I don't believe so. None of them were in the throne room at the time, and Haley reacted with shock when she found out Miko was dead.

I think all the order knows is "the battle was already going bad, then the gate went kraakaboom, and we ran away."

[VeliaRae]

This may have been said already, but had V told everyone about the planet, would it really change their course of action? I understand it might at this current point in the most recent strip, but ultimately their plan would still be "oppose Xykon" right?

[King of Nowhere]

I'll go wiith "wanted to think it through and/or make some research on it before reporting it".
I am a scholar, and I understand exactly that kind of behaviour. If in my job I find something I don't understand, before telling my boss I try to gather all the informations I can. And my boss is a researcher too, and can give useful input. Roy is not a scholar, as well learned as he is, and there's no way he can contribute to solving that mistery. So V wanted to have something more concrete in his hands before reporting. It's reasonable. I an see myself doing the same. I have done the same several times, waiting to report my findings to my boss until I had more data. V just never considered that the information may suddenly become important in a moment when he could not relay it.

By the way, I don't think V's revelation changes much about the gate. I'd still destroy it. likely, it won't harm the inhabitants on the inside, not any more than the blowing of the other gates, as long as kraagor's gate still stands. And Xykon still wants the gate and can be there at any time. Furthermore, even if the snarl don't exist anymore, the gods don't know it, so the dark one could still use the gates as a treath. Of course we lack plenty of vital informations and I may be horribly wrong, but with the information at hand, I still think they should blow the gate.

[Bulldog Psion]

I figure it's probably because V's wisdom score is about on a par with Belkar's.

[WindStruck]

It's a very safe assumption that the order knows it was destroyed on purpose. Remember all that "debriefing" stuff that O-Chul did? If they were told something relatively as insignificant as redcloak losing an eye, they were bound to hear that more important detail too. That would have also been a good time period to inform them about the planet he saw. Yuup, he had weeks to figure out a way. And no, there's no way he could further study it, so an excuse along that lines doesn't even make sense...

[137beth]

I'll go wiith "wanted to think it through and/or make some research on it before reporting it".
I am a scholar, and I understand exactly that kind of behaviour. If in my job I find something I don't understand, before telling my boss I try to gather all the informations I can. And my boss is a researcher too, and can give useful input. Roy is not a scholar, as well learned as he is, and there's no way he can contribute to solving that mistery. So V wanted to have something more concrete in his hands before reporting. It's reasonable. I an see myself doing the same. I have done the same several times, waiting to report my findings to my boss until I had more data. V just never considered that the information may suddenly become important in a moment when he could not relay it.

By the way, I don't think V's revelation changes much about the gate. I'd still destroy it. likely, it won't harm the inhabitants on the inside, not any more than the blowing of the other gates, as long as kraagor's gate still stands. And Xykon still wants the gate and can be there at any time. Furthermore, even if the snarl don't exist anymore, the gods don't know it, so the dark one could still use the gates as a treath. Of course we lack plenty of vital informations and I may be horribly wrong, but with the information at hand, I still think they should blow the gate.
I'm gonna go with this as well. The order has basically no reason to expect that destroying the gate would harm the planet inside the rift, any more than they have reason to suspect that not destroying the gate would create issues.

I figure it's probably because V's wisdom score is about on a par with Belkar's.
V has an average wisdom score, so he/she probably has a better wisdom than Belkar. It's his/her charisma that is really low.

[Sethala]

Keep in mind that until recently (in comic time, not real time; specifically, as of the day before the current comic), the Order's plan was to get to the gate, find Girard and/or whoever's in charge now, and brief him on Xykon and his hobgoblin army. They'd likely stay nearby and ready to help defend it when Xykon shows up, but there was no need to concern anyone about what might be on the other side of the gate at the time. It's very likely he would want to check out Girard's gate before saying much of anything anyway, and as he mentions in strip 693 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0693.html), he was waiting until at least the rest of the group acknowledged Blackwing's presence before saying anything.

The need to tell everyone about what's inside the gate didn't become pressing until they found the Draketooth family and realized there were no defenders any more. At that point, V was too distraught over finding the family tree to think clearly on anything, and was quickly separated from the rest of the group.

[OctoberRaven]

V probably had a lot on V's mind even before the family tree and divorce papers. Not just processing the info Blackwing gave V, but also the complete popping of V's hubris with the defeat to Xykon and trying to cope with the complete and total fear in V's family's eyes. Seeing your family look at you with even more terror than an adult black dragon... can't sit well on your psyche.

The further ramifications (the divorce papers) probably felt like a knife twisted in V's heart... V did love the family even though V had a funny way of showing it... V was either so wrapped up in the emotional duress, or trying to forget the whole ordeal... possibly both.

EDIT- Also, don't forget NOBODY was aware that Roy was going to destroy the gate. How was V supposed to think "Oh, in case you were destroying the gate, I should tell you..." when probably even Roy didn't consider it as a possibility up until they found the gate?

And side note:



V has an average wisdom score, so he/she probably has a better wisdom than Belkar. It's his/her charisma that is really low.

I'd figure V to be above average (12 or 13) as V has proven to be clever at times (mostly relating to uses of Explosive Runes).

[theNater]

And no, there's no way he could further study it, so an excuse along that lines doesn't even make sense...
The Order was hoping to work alongside the guardians of Girard's gate, who would presumably know something about the rifts.

Alternatively, there are divination spells that can yield information that nobody knows. Vaarsuvius may have been hoping for some extended downtime with access to a magical laboratory, or may have been casting minor divinations every day(with insignificant results so far).

[Ebon_Drake]

Keep in mind that until recently (in comic time, not real time; specifically, as of the day before the current comic), the Order's plan was to get to the gate, find Girard and/or whoever's in charge now, and brief him on Xykon and his hobgoblin army. They'd likely stay nearby and ready to help defend it when Xykon shows up, but there was no need to concern anyone about what might be on the other side of the gate at the time. It's very likely he would want to check out Girard's gate before saying much of anything anyway, and as he mentions in strip 693 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0693.html), he was waiting until at least the rest of the group acknowledged Blackwing's presence before saying anything.

The need to tell everyone about what's inside the gate didn't become pressing until they found the Draketooth family and realized there were no defenders any more. At that point, V was too distraught over finding the family tree to think clearly on anything, and was quickly separated from the rest of the group.

Good point. V may have been planning on quizzing Girard/the head Draketooth as well as studying the gate to get a better understanding of what Blackwing saw before explaining it to the party.

[Harry Leipzig]

Why hasn't V told Roy about the planet? Because that would mean confessing to going to Azure City. Which would require confessing to trying to kill Xykon. Which would require explaining why he thought he could take on Xkyon. Which would require revealing the deal. Outside of Belkar, I don't think any of the others would have been very happy to hear that.

[SaintRidley]

Why hasn't V told Roy about the planet? Because that would mean confessing to going to Azure City. Which would require confessing to trying to kill Xykon. Which would require explaining why he thought he could take on Xkyon. Which would require revealing the deal. Outside of Belkar, I don't think any of the others would have been very happy to hear that.

"I am going to go and kill Xykon. I will return shortly." (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0650.html)

[ChristianSt]

Why hasn't V told Roy about the planet? Because that would mean confessing to going to Azure City. Which would require confessing to trying to kill Xykon. Which would require explaining why he thought he could take on Xkyon. Which would require revealing the deal. Outside of Belkar, I don't think any of the others would have been very happy to hear that.


"I am going to go and kill Xykon. I will return shortly." (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0650.html)

And O-Chul confirmed it a few strips later (663 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0663.html)) (Not the killing Xykon, but that V was there). So while Roy wasn't there I am sure that some of that information was retold in their briefing/war council later (and at least Haley and Elan knows it for sure)

[Kish]

but while good for a joke gag,
It just occurred to me, rereading this, that one of the surest and most recurring ways to be disappointed with the webcomic is to read it with a mental partition between "joke gags" and "things that actually relate to the plot."

One of the villains was out of the action for hundreds of strips because he was hauled off by lawyers for being a copyright violation, Vaarsuvius didn't tell Roy about the world inside the rift because Roy doesn't believe the source of Vaarsuvius' information exists, Prismatic Spray will only work if it happens to be cast on color pages, and shadowdancers get very little use out of one of their class features. That's OotS. The fact that all four of those were jokes doesn't change the fact that they're also all part of the lives of the residents of the OotS world, which they need to adapt to and work around, and which can get them killed.

[DaveMcW]

And side note:

I'd figure V to be above average (12 or 13) as V has proven to be clever at times (mostly relating to uses of Explosive Runes).

Word of Giant is V has moderate wisdom (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=211493#post211493), so more like 10 or 11.

[theinsulabot]

It just occurred to me, rereading this, that one of the surest and most recurring ways to be disappointed with the webcomic is to read it with a mental partition between "joke gags" and "things that actually relate to the plot."



That wasn't the point I was making. It was that if they really wanted for Roy to understand that blacking was a real familiar, they could have sat him down and worked with him, resolving the issue in relatively short order and without much difficulty. Needing to relate extremely pertinent details about the gate is a good enough reason to do just that.

By good for a joke gag I was referring to the fact that the entirety of their attempts to convince Roy and the others of blackings existence amounted to a short bit of banter. The order not believing in black wing's existence is, when you get right down to it, a small and easily fixable problem, certainly no impediment to V relating what he knows

EDIT: also, did nobody get the joke in the title of this thread about V and the mishandling of the gates? That makes me a bit sad

[King of Nowhere]

That wasn't the point I was making. It was that if they really wanted for Roy to understand that blacking was a real familiar, they could have sat him down and worked with him, resolving the issue in relatively short order and without much difficulty. Needing to relate extremely pertinent details about the gate is a good enough reason to do just that.

By good for a joke gag I was referring to the fact that the entirety of their attempts to convince Roy and the others of blackings existence amounted to a short bit of banter. The order not believing in black wing's existence is, when you get right down to it, a small and easily fixable problem, certainly no impediment to V relating what he knows

EDIT: also, did nobody get the joke in the title of this thread about V and the mishandling of the gates? That makes me a bit sad
Not sure it was easily fixable. V could easily summon a raven and pretend it's his familiar after all.
But it didn't look an important matter until, well, now.

[snikrept]

Before today, V had not yet received the epiphany that ve was guilty of human genocide, and considered what that felt like. Before, I imagine the fate of an extra planet was rather academic to vir. Today, it is suddenly not.

[Thanatosia]

I fear the only explanation that really makes sense is that the Giant tossed V the Idiot Ball (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/IdiotBall) for the sake of this plot.

[martianmister]

Not sure it was easily fixable. V could easily summon a raven and pretend it's his familiar after all.

Why so much distrust? Do they really believed that he's insane, or pathologically lying for some reason? :smallconfused:

[King of Nowhere]

Why so much distrust? Do they really believed that he's insane, or pathologically lying for some reason? :smallconfused:

Yes, they do. The part i boldened at least.

[martianmister]

Yes, they do. The part i boldened at least.

Then isn't he little bit dangerous for the job?

[Harry Leipzig]

And O-Chul confirmed it a few strips later (663 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0663.html)) (Not the killing Xykon, but that V was there). So while Roy wasn't there I am sure that some of that information was retold in their briefing/war council later (and at least Haley and Elan knows it for sure)
Forgot about that. Been a while since I've gone back and reread the comic. May have to do that after this arc ends. :smallredface:

[OctoberRaven]

Word of Giant is V has moderate wisdom (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=211493#post211493), so more like 10 or 11.


I wasn't aware of this. Like I said, I was going by my impressions of V. And I suppose if V was higher WIS, V would probably have a better time grasping the concept of gender differences in nonelves.

[Chantelune]

I fear the only explanation that really makes sense is that the Giant tossed V the Idiot Ball (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/IdiotBall) for the sake of this plot.

If you read the whole topic, you'd have found quite a lot of explanation making some sense and not going down to "V is suddenly stupid". But then again, you wouldn't have been able to make a link to tvtropes.

The mere fact that the question raised by this topic just come up with that peculiar strip tend to prove that the world within the rift was in no way a pressing matter until right now. Even us readers never considered V telling Roy about it as something urgent and critical before that strip.

[Thrillhouse]

Worth noting that V likely thought he had plenty of time. There was no way of knowing he'd be separated from the party so early on.

[F.Harr]

If I could put my two cents into the ring? I haven't seen anyone give this argument yet:

Shame.

V saw the world while doing something she would later be intensely ashamed of. I'd wager she's been trying to bury the whole thing, especially the genocide, but also her failed conquest of Xykon. Bringing the whole thing up, even discounting Blackwing's help, would be to reveal to Roy what she did. It'd even be possible that he'd find out about the soul-splice in the course of the interrogation, as he might ask why she thought she could take the lich and she wouldn't have a better answer.

Foolish to leave it buried, certainly. But such is V's flaw. And now it looks like its coming back to bite her.

That's possible. That added to the necessity of explaining Blackwing's existance again and again and again. But mostly what you said.

"So clearly, the tactic of destroying the gate as a last ditch effort should have been known, and V should have thought of the ramifications of that earlier."

Would a', could a', should a'.

"I am a scholar, and I understand exactly that kind of behaviour. If in my job I find something I don't understand, before telling my boss I try to gather all the informations I can. And my boss is a researcher too, and can give useful input. Roy is not a scholar, as well learned as he is, and there's no way he can contribute to solving that mistery. So V wanted to have something more concrete in his hands before reporting. It's reasonable. I an see myself doing the same. I have done the same several times, waiting to report my findings to my boss until I had more data. V just never considered that the information may suddenly become important in a moment when he could not relay it."

O.K., O.K., O.K., that's reasonable, too.

"By the way, I don't think V's revelation changes much about the gate. I'd still destroy it. likely, it won't harm the inhabitants on the inside, not any more than the blowing of the other gates, as long as kraagor's gate still stands. And Xykon still wants the gate and can be there at any time. Furthermore, even if the snarl don't exist anymore, the gods don't know it, so the dark one could still use the gates as a treath. Of course we lack plenty of vital informations and I may be horribly wrong, but with the information at hand, I still think they should blow the gate."

You know, if the OotS'ers knew that all Readcloak wanted to do was put the fear of the Snarl into the hearts of the non-goblin gods in a negotiation process, and could be reasonably assured that goblinoids would be built up rather than humanoids torn down, it might behove them to let it happen.

Yes, I'm a liberal. A bleeding-heart one, in point of fact. But that reasonable assurance seems VERY hard to establish.

"And O-Chul confirmed it a few strips later (663) (Not the killing Xykon, but that V was there). So while Roy wasn't there I am sure that some of that information was retold in their briefing/war council later (and at least Haley and Elan knows it for sure)"

Reasonable, however, that wouldn't make V any less ashamed of themselves. And sufficient shame can make a person a coward.

"If you read the whole topic, you'd have found quite a lot of explanation making some sense and not going down to 'V is suddenly stupid'."

Indeed. You don't need to be stupid to make poor decisions. Indeed, since the very intelegent aren't used to being wrong, they can hold onto a poor decision long after someone else has reccognised the problem and moved on.

"Then isn't he little bit dangerous for the job?"

So? They're all dangerous. Even Elan has a bit a danger to him.

[Cavenskull]

Then isn't he little bit dangerous for the job?
So's Belkar, and they have a history of keeping him around.

[Ghost Nappa]

V's an overthinker. I'd hazard a guess that V has been applying every logical and intellectual faculty to determining just what that information means, so as to put together a complete rundown of possibilities for Roy. I expect V to have been thinking this to death and expecting to find the gate with Roy and the others and explain the theory then, not to get freaked out about the Familicide and separated from the group where V is unable to communicate, unable to know that the Linear Guild is in the mix (believing them neutralized at the palace), and unable to know when Xykon goes on the move.

In short:

V was putting together every possible angle of the information to make sure the info was as complete as possible in typical long-winded overthinking V style.

V thought the variables would be set one way, allowing the group some time at the gate to figure things out. But the variables wound up very different. The Linear Guild surviving and adding Tarquin and Malack was unanticipated. V not being there to learn that Xykon is on the move was unanticipated. The Draketooths being dead was unanticipated. Separated and crunched for time is not how V would want to relay the information, I would think.

I would like to bolster this claim with a recreational activity encouraged by another author altogether. "Nerd sniping. (http://xkcd.com/356/)" See Panel 1.

[F.Harr]

That's mean. And funny. :D

[Fish]

So clearly, the tactic of destroying the gate as a last ditch effort should have been known, and V should have thought of the ramifications of that earlier.
V is only speculating that by destroying the Gate, the world inside is put in jeopardy. There is no evidence of that at all. It appears to be an innocent world, and it may be affected by the Gate's destruction, but ... who knows?

In any case, the existence of the world sheds some light on the fiends' quote: if their plans succeed, the slaughter of five good dragons for every black dragon killed would be "trivial." They're definitely playing for big stakes.

[exenia]

To me, V wanting to get crucial information out of the Draketooths first, and then the sudden perspective shift of finding them dead, are enough explanation.

On the boat to Sandsedge, V's mentality was "Something is fishy here". That didn't become "Oh crap, we'd better stop and think this through" until V was already separated from the party.

It probably would have been a good idea for V to Send to Roy after calming down. "Be careful, we haven't been told the full truth about these Gates." And it would have been sensible to have Sending ready considering the party was preparing to work their way though mazes/illusions and then sit down to talk, there's no need for a full rack of combat spells.