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Jarelk
2006-12-07, 02:08 PM
I don't really care if this already exists. This is my first Prestige Class, so I am happy I have it finished. In fact, this is my first homebrew that I have ever finished! hooray:smallsmile:! Please give me detailed comments, especially on missed information. I don't really think I put all the necessary information down. Please give me things I can actually add, not just random directions. Anyways, here it is!

Deceiver

The deceiver’s main goal is to use his power for his own rights. His example of ideology is not to help others but to help himself. Though not all Deceivers are like that, there are not many reasons one should take this profession, other than to gain or kill.
Deceivers use the power of illusion, cunningness and stealth when in combat. They usually attack from the shadows, or from a spot no one would imagine him to be. The ability to cast illusions from a distance is useful, and thus grants a Deceiver the job for a dungeon lord, as it might create a spooky environment if adventurers run into illusions all the time.
If ever caught in a close combat battle, the Deceiver relies on agility and acrobatics. The sneak attack ability grants him a bonus, and can be proven quite useful.
Hit die: D6

Req.
Feats. You need at least two of the following Feats: Improved Initiative, Iron Will, Leadership, Weapon Finesse.
Skills. 8 ranks in Hide, 5 ranks in Bluff, 5 Ranks in Disguise, 5 ranks in intimidate, 5 ranks in Move Silently.

Class Skills
Balance (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Climb (Str), Diplomacy (Cha), Disguise (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Forgery (Int), Gather Information (Cha), Hide (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Profession (Wis), Search (Int), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), Spot (Wis), Tumble (Dex).
Skill Points each level: 8 + Int Modifier

http://img392.imageshack.us/img392/7155/table1sd7.png

Class Features
All of the following are class features of the Deceiver prestige class.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Deceivers are proficient with all simple weapons, plus the rapier, short swords and the sap. Deceivers are proficient with light armor, but not with shields.
Spells Per Day/ Spells Known: Beginning form 1th level, a Deceiver can cast a number of arcane spells. The spells are chosen from the Deceiver spell list (Down). To cast a spell, a Deceiver must have a Charisma score of 10 + spell level. A Deceiver who does not have the required Charisma cannot cast the spell. Deceiver Spells are based on Charisma, and saving throws against spells a Deceiver cast have a DC of 10 + spell level + Deceiver Charisma bonus (If any). If a Deceiver gains 0 spells per day on a certain level, he only gains the bonus spells he would get based on his Charisma score for that spell level . A Deceiver can cast spells without preparing before hand.
Upon reaching 6th level, and every even numbered level thereafter ( 8th, 10th), a Deceiver can decide to exchange one of the spells he already knows to get a new spell. The new spell’s level must be the same as the spell he exchanged, and it must be at least two levels lower than the highest level Deceiver spell he can cast.
http://img124.imageshack.us/img124/843/table2gg3.png
Shadows Concealment (Ex): Deceivers are born within the shadows. Deceivers that are in shadow can choose to make a DC 15 Hide check. If it succeeds, the Deceiver gains full concealment. If it fails, he gains normal concealment. If he moves, he must make another check, DC depending on how big a movement. DC +2 for 5 foot steps, +4 for half speed, and +8 for full speed. If he casts magic, the DC increases by +6, +2 when Somatics Components are used, and another +4 for Verbal components, which in total would bring +12. If he uses a range weapon, the DC check is +4, and if he uses a melee weapon, he automaticly becomes visible.
Disappear (Ex): Useable once per day/ 2 levels, a deceiver can enter a large shadow (A shadow from another person or a shadow from a pole or such automatically fails) or some other location which grants him concealment, and disappear and reappear at another shadow 20 feet away/3 levels. He can disappear through solid things, but he can not disappear through magical obstructions (Such as Wall of Ice), nor can he disappear through planes (He can not disappear through a dimension door if it is in range).
Ranged Illusions (Su): At 2nd level a Deceiver can cast Illusions at a larger range (but not scale) once per day. Every 2 levels thereafter (4th, 6th, 8th, 10th), he can use this ability one more time per day (Up to 5 times per day). The cast Illusion that has this ability on it has it’s cast range increased by a factor of ten, but not it’s range of effect. That means that for example, a Silent Image can be cast 4000 ft. away (+400 ft. per level), but it can still not move beyond four 10 ft. cubes (+ 1 10 ft. cube/level). This effect does not stack with other possible effects. No Metamagic feat can be used together with this ability, except Extend, Heighten, Still, Silent and Quicken. This effect can not be used on magical ability’s, only spells. This ability can still be stopped by magical means.
Sneak Attack: A Deceiver can sneak attack just like a rogue. This ability can be used when the target would be denied a Dexterity bonus to AC, or when the target is flanked. The attack roll is rolled normally, and the extra damage is 1d6, plus 1d6 every two Deceiver levels thereafter. This damage is not multiplied when a critical hit is cored. Range attacks count as sneak attacks only when the target is within 30 feet range. A target immune to sneak attacks can not be sneak attacked. Those with concealment can not be sneak attacked.
Charming Words (Ex): The Deceiver's words have power. Beginning at 4th level, whenever he bluffs or intimidates, the victim must make a DC 13 + Class Level, or get charmed like being under the effect of charm person. Every minute the victim can make a DC 20 check with his Will Save modifier. He also gets a +1 modifier for every time he failed this save. This can be done 1 time per day per level. The player chooses wether he uses this ability.



Deceiver Spell List
1st Level: Color Spray, Disguise Self, Nystul’s Magic Aura, Silent Image, Ventriloquism, Sleep, Obscuring Mist, Alarm, Hypnotism, Feather Fall, Jump.
2nd Level: Blur, Hypnotic Pattern, Invisibility, Leomund’ s Trap, Magic Mouth, Minor Image, Mirror Image, Misdirection, Obscure Object, Daze Monster, Cat’s Grace.
3rd Level: Displacement, Illusory Script, Invisibility Sphere, Major Image, Dispel Magic, Clairaudience/Clairvoyance, Hold Person, Deep Slumber, Suggestion, Blink.
4th Level: Hallucinatory Terrain, Illusory Wall, Greater Invisibility, Phantasmal Killer, Rainbow Pattern, Shadow Conjuration, Detect Scrying, Solid Fog, Locate Creature.

mac13eth
2006-12-07, 02:48 PM
This class seems to build from rogue, but the feat choices are not favorable to rogues. The +2/+2 skill feats are not very useful to a character getting more than 8 ranks per level to spend.

The skill rank requirements seem to indicate a level 3 entrance requirement, but the feats would force most rogues to hold off until 6th level. You should consider what level you intend characters to enter this class.

The wording on the range special ability needs work. It might work better to give them a power that lets them cast anywhere in their home/dungeon/castle which seems to be what you are going for with the flavor text.

I hope my input is helpful.

Jarelk
2006-12-07, 03:04 PM
It certainly is. I was aiming for low level but it seems that went wrong. I think I thought too much in themes than in what's useful for the character. I am going to work on it. Thank you! Any more comments anyone?

And I was trying to use the feats as some sort to get agile, not really combat focused. I REALLY have to think through...
Well, I added a new feat. I'm also going to heighten the requirements for this Prestige Class.

Oh, and by the way, what do you mean by +2/+2 skill feats? The thing where if you have 5 ranks in one, you get +2 on the other?

Mewtarthio
2006-12-07, 11:16 PM
The ability to cast illusions from a distance is useful, and thus grants a Deceiver the job for a dungeon lord, as it might create a spooky environment if they run into illusions all the time.

Just a flavor note here: You should specify who "they" refers to in the latter part of the sentence. I'd presume either adventurers or intruders.


Shadows Concealment: Deceivers are born within the shadows. Deceivers that are in shadow can choose to make a DC 15 Hide check. If it succeeds, the Deceiver gains full concealment. If it fails, he gains normal concealment. If he specifically explained moves, he must make another check, DC depending on how big a movement.

Delete "specifically explained." Also, the DC "depending on how big a movement" needs to be clarified. Normally, you can remain hidden if you move at half your speed, but this doesn't seem to be normal hiding since you'll get a nice miss chance from your enemies. You should state whether this is Supernatural or Extraordinary.


Disappear: Useable once per day/ 2 levels, a deceiver can enter a large shadow (A shadow from another person or a shadow from a pole or such automatically fails), and disappear and reappear at another shadow 20 feet away/3 levels. He can disappear through solid things, but he can not disappear through magical obstructions (Such as Wall of Ice), nor can he disappear through planes (He can not disappear through a dimension door if it is in range).

Isn't this just like a Shadow Jump? Why not just say he gets Shadow Jump?


Ranged Illusions: At 2nd level a Deceiver can cast Illusions at a larger range (but not scale) once per day. Every 2 levels thereafter (4th, 6th, 8th, 10th), he can use this ability one more time per day (Up to 5 times per day). The cast Illusion that has this ability on it has it’s cast range increased by 10, but not it’s range of effect. That means that for example, a Silent Image can be cast 4000 ft. away (+400 ft. per level), but it can still not move beyond four 10 ft. cubes (+ 1 10 ft. cube/level). This effect does not stack with other possible effects. No Metamagic feat can be used together with this ability, except Extend, Heighten, Still, Silent and Quicken. This effect can not be used on magical ability’s, only spells. This ability can still be stopped by magical means.

You should note that it is increased by a factor of ten. Also, why the metamagic restriction? I presume this is supernatural.


Charming Words: The Deceiver's words have power. Beginning at 4th level, whenever he bluffs or intimidates, the victim must make a DC 13 + Class Level, or get charmed like being under the effect uf charm person. Every minute the victim can make a DC 20 check with his Will Save modifier. He also gets a +1 modifier for every time he failed this save. This can be done 1 time per day per level.

Again, note this as either (Su) or (Ex).

Jarelk
2006-12-08, 07:24 AM
Just a flavor note here: You should specify who "they" refers to in the latter part of the sentence. I'd presume either adventurers or intruders.

It does. I will correct it.


Delete "specifically explained." Also, the DC "depending on how big a movement" needs to be clarified. Normally, you can remain hidden if you move at half your speed, but this doesn't seem to be normal hiding since you'll get a nice miss chance from your enemies. You should state whether this is Supernatural or Extraordinary.

Will do. I think it's Extroadinary, as long as I think I know what it means.


Isn't this just like a Shadow Jump? Why not just say he gets Shadow Jump?

It looks a lot like Shadow Jump, but it works with different numbers and "times per day". Shadow Jump is 50 ft./level per day, no matter how you divide it, but Disappear can be used several times a distance. I will clarify more differencies, like when in concealment.


You should note that it is increased by a factor of ten. Also, why the metamagic restriction? I presume this is supernatural.

The metamegic restriction was for if it would get too powerful. Especially the range Metamagic was a little bit frightening. If the range would be double increased, it would get too powerful I thought. I'll rethink it.


Again, note this as either (Su) or (Ex).

Done.

Oh, and I think I need help with the feats. I don't really know what good feats are for this class.

mac13eth
2006-12-08, 08:27 AM
By "+2/+2 skill feats" I mean feats that give a +2 bonus to two skills. Those feats are very appealling at low level, but most of my players have learned that the bonus is too small to make it worth a feat slot. It looks like about half of the prereq feats fit into this category.

I like the addition of improved initiative. Another you might consider is leadership; this class seems to be about running an oganization. Iron will, the feat, would help imply a transition from a martial character to a magical character. I did a bit of research and it seems that few published classes have such freedom in prereq feats. I think picking from a shorter list might help the class seem less clunky to get into.

Jarelk
2006-12-08, 10:48 AM
I changed the list, but I think I want that he only needs two feats. I don't really know how to choose between the list of 4. I can also keep it this way.

Also, I want to know something else. How do any of you actually like the idea of the Prestige Class? Is it app(e)alling? What do or don't you like? I want to know if this class was a good idea:smallwink:.