rogue / ranger / scout multiclass help

[GuilherWolfang]

Hey guys, i'm trying to do a build for a bounty hunter character. We decided the initial class(rogue in my case) before rolling ability scores(with possibility to swicth 2 ability scores). I ended up with 9, 16, 14, 18, 13, 11, at least a high int score...so i figured out that 3 levels of swashbuckler for Insightfull strike would be good.

I saw 2 in teresting feats: daring outlaw and swift hunter and decided to go with rogue/ranger/scout multiclass...but i needed feats, so 2 levels os fighter, more feats: monk(cobra strike variant) for 2 more feats and a little more will save. I ended up with this:

4 rogue levels: evasion, sneak attack +4d6, substitute rogue trap sense for Penetrating strike(Dung), makes SA useful in everything melee. Substitute uncanny dodge(get from scout later) for Disruptive attack(PHB2). Substitute rogue trapfinding for poison use(get trap finding with scout too)

3 scout levels: skirmish 2d6, +1ac , uncanny dodge, trackless step, trapfinding

2 monk: flurry, improved evasion, 2 bonus feat(cobra strike ACF(fighting styles) - dodge and mobility)

2 ranger: 2 favored enemy, track, wild empathy, combat style(TWF)

3 swashbuckler: weapon finesse(dex to attack roll), insightfull strike(int to damage), grace

obs.: ranger/scout levels stack for skirmish and swashbuckler/rogue stack for sneack attack

2 fighter: bonus feats: Improved TWF, Greater TWF

4 invisible blade: +2d6 sneak attack(6d6 total), unfettered defense(int to AC), uncunny feint(move action), feint mastery

BAB TOTAL: 17/12/7/2 + attacks from flurry and TWF, leading me to 8 attacks, with movement and feats that let me apply skirmish and sneack attack to many of my attacks.

Good AC from feats and bonuses.

Good saves: fort:15 ref:18 will:7 just from classes, without any bonus yet

bonus feats from PC levels would be: weapon focus, point blank shot, far away shot(pre requisites for PrC), daring outlaw, swift hunter, spring attack(that's why the monk ACF with didge and mobility, they're pre-requisites for spring attack) and improved critical

Using Kukri that means 8 attacks with 15-20 range critical and +8d6 in many attacks(2 from skirmish, 6 from SA).

I have no idea if it would work or even be a little good in practice. How can i make this better?

Edit: the 2 favored enemies will be undead and construct ^^

[Waker]

Well, let's see where to start.

2 monk: flurry, improved evasion, 2 bonus feat(cobra strike ACF(fighting styles) - dodge and mobility)
Unless the class specifically says otherwise, you do not receive Improved Evasion when you have two instances of Evasion. Thus dipping Rogue and Monk wouldn't result in Improved Evasion. Also note that
When using flurry of blows, a monk may attack only with unarmed strikes or with special monk weapons (kama, nunchaku, quarterstaff, sai, shuriken, and siangham). She may attack with unarmed strikes and special monk weapons interchangeably as desired. So you wouldn't be able to use a Kukri while Flurrying, it's one or the other. There are certain feat that expand on the options for weapons you can flurry with, but the only ones that come to mind are Longsword and Spear.
If you are going to go Invisible Blade, ask your DM to drop Far and Point Blank Shot from the feat requirements. Those were holdovers from when Invisible Blade and Master Thrower were one PrC.
You may want to simplify your build a bit more and try something like Rogue/Swashbuckler or Ranger/Scout rather than sampling a bit of everything.

[BowStreetRunner]

Generally speaking, it is difficult in practice to trigger both skirmish and sneak attack damage at the same time. While some players argue that having both increases the likelihood that you will be able to trigger at least one of the two, in practice I do not believe this actually works out. In a build dedicated to one or the other you generally put part of your focus into creating situations that will result in triggering the conditions for sneak attack or skirmish. You also try to increase the damage dealt as much as possible. In a dual build this gets diluted. You end up having difficulty reliably triggering either ability and when you do, the damage done is sub-par.

My recommendation is not to take levels in both Rogue and Scout. The only exception would be the Swift Ambusher build with Scout 3/Rogue 17 where you are getting full skirmish and nearly full sneak attack. A messy build like the one you are proposing just doesn't get enough of either to be worthwhile.

[Invader]

How do you get 4d6 sneak attack from 4 levels of rogue? Did I miss something :smallconfused:

[Waker]

How do you get 4d6 sneak attack from 4 levels of rogue? Did I miss something :smallconfused:

4 levels of Rogue with 3 levels of Swashbuckler equals 4d6 sneak attack when you take Daring Outlaw.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Generally speaking, it is difficult in practice to trigger both skirmish and sneak attack damage at the same time. While some players argue that having both increases the likelihood that you will be able to trigger at least one of the two, in practice I do not believe this actually works out. In a build dedicated to one or the other you generally put part of your focus into creating situations that will result in triggering the conditions for sneak attack or skirmish. You also try to increase the damage dealt as much as possible. In a dual build this gets diluted. You end up having difficulty reliably triggering either ability and when you do, the damage done is sub-par.

My recommendation is not to take levels in both Rogue and Scout. The only exception would be the Swift Ambusher build with Scout 3/Rogue 17 where you are getting full skirmish and nearly full sneak attack. A messy build like the one you are proposing just doesn't get enough of either to be worthwhile.

Well it is not exactly imposible, a swift ambusher who has ways to reliably hit a DC 40 tumble check and has the Island of blade stance would be able to trigger skirmish and sneak attack quite easilly against large (or bigger) foes, you just need a flanking companion (Wild cohort+massed charge teamwork benefit is another way)

[Waker]

Well it is not exactly imposible, a swift ambusher who has ways to reliably hit a DC 40 tumble check and has the Island of blade stance would be able to trigger skirmish and sneak attack quite easilly against large (or bigger) foes, you just need a flanking companion (Wild cohort+massed charge teamwork benefit is another way)

It would probably be easier to go with a crit-fisher build and snag Telling Blow.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

You're trying to do too much. Unless you're actually starting play at 20th level, this character will be unbelievably mediocre in the months/years of play it will take to reach that level. If you are starting play at 20th level, this is still incredibly mediocre for that level of play.

I don't see anything there that allows you to move and full attack, and your Invisible Blade feint will only grant sneak attack for one attack. You won't be getting skirmish on all eight of those attacks, and you won't be sneak attacking on all eight of those attacks.

This character is incredibly MAD. You want high Int for Swashbuckler and Invisible Blade. You want high Cha for Feint. You want high Wis for Monk. You want high Dex for TWF. You want high Con for obvious reasons. You can't dump Str due to melee damage. That's all six ability scores, and for a fairly minor benefit from making any one of them extremely high. You're trying to do too much.

[Dusk Eclipse]

It would probably be easier to go with a crit-fisher build and snag Telling Blow.

Without Disciple of Dispater shenanigans (which are likely banned and would cut into your sneak attack/skirmish progression ) you have at most a 25% chance per hit to trigger it and that is without taking into consideration crit immunity (I know there are ways to bypass it; but the easiest one (Swift Hunter) is not likely to be available) on a Swift Ambusher build.

[GuilherWolfang]

Thanks! ^^ I will focus on one thing...but in this case(trying to be a bounty hunter who can be stealth) and with my ability scores, what would do better?

-scout/ranger swift hunter
-rogue/swashbucler daring outlaw
-scout/rogue swift ambusher edit:scout 3/rogue 17 as suggested by BowStreetRunner

and between these 3 who can deal most damage and a good prestige class?

[ericp65]

Have a look at the Swift Hunter class. Using that in place of rogue, ranger, and scout will free up some character resources, so you can build it out to be even more capable (and either more diverse, or more focused, depending on which way the player wants to take the character).