[3.5] Chamaleon PrC: Who benefits the most?

[ArqArturo]

Now, the Chamaleon as it stands has some nice features, and in my opinion, it's one of the most flexible PrCs there is, since it lets you do fun stuff with it. Now, the question is: Who makes the most of it?.

A friend argues that the Dragon Shaman actually benefits more from this class than most, since he loses little and gains quite a lot. I think it's a bit of hogwash, considering the Dragon Shaman is a weird class to begin with, and it deals with auras/breath attacks. It could be said that the warlock could definitely benefit from this, but also, the warlock would not gain anything from the class, since he no longer gains invocations while gaining levels in the PrC.

All in all, I think a Fighter/Rogue might win the cake, since he gains much more. So, who do you think gains more from the Chamaleon?.

As a sidenote, here is an interesting build on the Chamaleon: Roland, Bear of the North (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=2919.50;wap2).

[Fouredged Sword]

Personaly I love a good Duskblade 3 / Spellthief 2 / Chameleon 10 / Abjurant Champion 5

You get the arcane channeling of the duskblade, the spellthieving of the spellthief, and all casting in light armor. Your CL stays high because all your levels add together due to master spellthief.

You get all the normal duskblade spells, but you stack on ALL THE SPELL LISTS, allowing arcane strikes with some very interesting effects.

BAB ends up being something like 17 so you get all your itteratives, and you get access to all divine spells 1-6 to CODzilla yourself a good blitz.

Spellthief 2 can be replaced with spellthief 1 / cloistered cleric without much loss as well. Nothing like DMM persist on the chameleon frame.

[Dusk Eclipse]

That is a pretty cool build, use the trickster variant for spellthief (gives a spell progression similar to bard's IIRC) and you have even moar spells.

[ArqArturo]

Hmm, I didn't contemplate on the Duskblade as a viable option. Seems cool to try though. Also, lvl 2 Spellthieves get Detect Magic as a spell-like ability, right?.

[The Trickster]

The factotum seems to make sense here as well, at least from a fluff perspective. However, from an optimization point of view, losing out on inspiration points may not be the best. I don't play factotum very often.

[Dusk Eclipse]

After factotum 8 Chameleon is a pretty good option since the expanded spell list is awesme' though Able Learner is pretty useless for a factotum.

[Piggy Knowles]

I like splashing in a little ToB or incarnum, personally. Then you can use the floating feat for high level maneuvers, chakra binds, etc.

[kulosle]

So i think the build that gets the most out of chameleon is Factotum 5/Chameleon 10/Zhentarim Spy 5

Zhentarim spy is a PrC from PGtF that gives you alternate identities. When combined with chameleon and factotum you can make each alternate identity have very specific/different builds. It's the funnest NPC i've ever run. Slightly less fun as a PC because you GM has to give you the time necessary to change.

[Chronos]

Warlock 12/Chameleon 2 is often suggested for crafting. A warlock 12 can make any item at all via UMD, provided he has the appropriate crafting feat, and chameleon 2's bonus feat can give you whichever crafting feat you need for any given item (as long as it's not one of the few items that needs multiple feats, like a Rod of Lordly Might).

[Piggy Knowles]

The other nice thing about a chameleon dip on a warlock chassis is that, when you're not crafting, you can use that floating feat to pick up new invocations.

[Timballisto]

I personally like a Changeling with the first level of Changeling Rogue racial substitution level to take a ten on social skills, then eight levels of Factotum for Cunning Surge, and all ten levels of Chameleon.

Changeling Rogue 1 / Factotum 8 / Chameleon 10 / Whatever 1

For the 'Whatever 1' maybe Mindbender for telepathy, or Binder with improved vestige, tons of great dips out there.

[ArqArturo]

Hmm, would a Changeling Warlock 5/Cabinet Trickster 5/Chamaleon 10 be a good idea? Considering he can some interesting abilities, although the Eldritch Blast is very very weak.

[Cirrylius]

How useful would a Chameleon be as a cohort?

[Dusk Eclipse]

It could be really useful as both as a buffer and as a crafter.

[ArqArturo]

And, considering the fluff of the Chamaleon, you really wouldn't know if he's your consort, or an assassin/spy/saboteur, planted there to patiently wait for the right time to strike at you and/or the party :belkar:.

[Fouredged Sword]

No, he is YOUR spy, who travels ahead of the party is secret, lining up work and seeking out trouble before you get into town. He is loyal, yet capable of acting on his own. He is allied with the party, but travels apart. He coordinates your loyal followers to secretly plant themselves in rival organisation is preparation of your takeover.

Through your own blade you defeat your enemies, but through him you defeat everyone else.

[eggynack]

The factotum seems to make sense here as well, at least from a fluff perspective. However, from an optimization point of view, losing out on inspiration points may not be the best. I don't play factotum very often.
The loss in inspiration points isn't that big a deal, mostly due to font of inspiration (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/frcc/20070606). In four uses of that feat, you get inspiration points equal to those you gain over the course of the entire progression, so if you really need to push that aspect of it, it's more than doable. Combining multiple standard actions with something to use those actions on is some sweet business as well.

[Zonugal]

No, he is YOUR spy, who travels ahead of the party is secret, lining up work and seeking out trouble before you get into town. He is loyal, yet capable of acting on his own. He is allied with the party, but travels apart. He coordinates your loyal followers to secretly plant themselves in rival organisation is preparation of your takeover.

Through your own blade you defeat your enemies, but through him you defeat everyone else.

Screw that, he'll be my imposter!

And whenever he dies it'll be revealed they were simply an imposter. I'll pick up another imposter and continue on my way.

I will be the DnD equivalent to Dr. Doom.

[ArqArturo]

No, he is YOUR spy, who travels ahead of the party is secret, lining up work and seeking out trouble before you get into town. He is loyal, yet capable of acting on his own. He is allied with the party, but travels apart. He coordinates your loyal followers to secretly plant themselves in rival organisation is preparation of your takeover.

Through your own blade you defeat your enemies, but through him you defeat everyone else.

How do you know he did not slay your cohort?... In retrospect, I'm guessing this is why my players hate me as a DM :smallamused: .



Screw that, he'll be my imposter!

And whenever he dies it'll be revealed they were simply an imposter. I'll pick up another imposter and continue on my way.

I will be the DnD equivalent to Dr. Doom.

Or the scooby-doo villain, sans the dog and the gang.

[Snowbluff]

My fave build would have to be Divine Minion Human Swordsage1/Master of Many Forms9/Chameleon10. PRETEND TO BE ANYTHING!

The sweet spot would be MoMF7/Chamy2, since your can pick up Assume (Su) and MoMF gives you the (EX) abilities of your wildshape forms.


Personaly I love a good Duskblade 3 / Spellthief 2 / Chameleon 10 / Abjurant Champion 5

You get the arcane channeling of the duskblade, the spellthieving of the spellthief, and all casting in light armor. Your CL stays high because all your levels add together due to master spellthief.


The CL for the Chameleon Spells would actually be quite high.

[Urpriest]

No, he is YOUR spy, who travels ahead of the party is secret, lining up work and seeking out trouble before you get into town. He is loyal, yet capable of acting on his own. He is allied with the party, but travels apart. He coordinates your loyal followers to secretly plant themselves in rival organisation is preparation of your takeover.

Through your own blade you defeat your enemies, but through him you defeat everyone else.

Wait...so Reek was a Chameleon?

[Dusk Eclipse]

My fave build would have to be Divine Minion Human Swordsage1/Master of Many Forms9/Chameleon10. PRETEND TO BE ANYTHING!

The sweet spot would be MoMF7/Chamy2, since your can pick up Assume (Su) and MoMF gives you the (EX) abilities of your wildshape forms.



The CL for the Chameleon Spells would actually be quite high.

CL 30 if I did my math right, investing in some way to break CL caps in damage spells might be pretty worthwhile now that I think so.

[Rubik]

Just so you know, O.P., it's chameleon, not chamaleon. I don't even know where you got that extra A from.

[Dusk Eclipse]

OP is from México (BTW ¡Hola desde el D.F!) and in spanish Chameleon is spelled Camaleón.

[Yael]

OP is from México (BTW ¡Hola desde el D.F!) and in spanish Chameleon is spelled Camaleón.

Caaaama-Cama-Cama-Cama-Camaleón~~ Yo soy, el Camaleón~~ (8)
Saludos desde Ensenada, B.C.!!

I once played a changeling rogue/factotum chamaleon, whose abilities were pretty nice, the ton of skill points that the RSL provides helps with doing pretty much almost everything, also, with Knowledge Devotion, you get the killer combos with Combat Focus (even with your low-BAB and pretty low average damage), you know, more strike chance for that 1d6 of Sneak Attack~~. Int have a great synergy with Arcane Focus, also you can use a high Wisdom for Trapfinding issues (that you get back with Factotum), for the Search skill to benefit more from Divine Focus. You can cast pretty much every spell that is covered on any spell list (as long as it is Arcane or Divine), check out the Trapsmith spells (Dispel Magic, Greater at level 3rd? yes please~~).

I don't use to get into Stealth Focus or Wild Focus, but stealth focus provides Trapfinding (if you don't take those levels in factotum for regaining trapfinding and exploiting Int) and some skill bonuses. Wild focus gives you Wild Empathy, which I would not use so frecuently (due to my teammates worshiping the Kick-in-the-door plans), but having a druid-like ability to bypass nature's encounters easily (you know, lions or bears that want to destroy you), here you could focus more on your Charisma skill that you could also exploit with your Social Intuition (from the Changeling Racial Substitution Level 1st).

[Cirrylius]

Wait...so Reek was a Chameleon?

Well, Reek does rhyme with sneak.