Sorcerer Nymph?

[Alokue]

Balance-wise, what do you think about changing a nymph's druid casting to sorcerer? Would you allow it as a DM? Consider this for a player character willing to take the 13 ECL swim through Nymph. Also keep in mind that Nymphs have +6 Wis and +8 Cha, since I know a lot of people will be likely to cite that in contention. This is a high OP gestalt game.

[Flickerdart]

Sorcerer casting is a lot better than Druid casting, but when you consider the LA it's so far behind that it probably won't matter much either way, unless your player wants to do some kind of Ultimate Magus shenanigans.

[ericgrau]

Right off the bat high OP makes the LA cost more so there should be less of it. Gestalt makes a level worth even more than that, unless you mean that the LA is only one side. Then that reduces the impact of LA instead so LA on only one side of a gestalt should go up instead. Racial HD has a similar effect, except it is only weak not completely worthless.

So first you need to figure out what a regular nymph is worth. Then compared to that I'd say the adjusted nymph is worth at most 1 LA more due to arcane casting and cha synergy. Maybe only 0.5 LA more. If anything it would be enough to round up a little if your LA estimate for the regular nymph is borderline. Or if the LA is only on 1 side of gestalt, it's a lot easier to add 1 LA.

[Spuddles]

High OP gestalt is already ridiculous. A 13 level prestige class with half casting, stat boosts, and unearthly grace would be fairly balanced compared to, say, a level of spelldancer, or incantatrix.

[Talya]

Sorcerer casting is a lot better than Druid casting, but when you consider the LA it's so far behind that it probably won't matter much either way, unless your player wants to do some kind of Ultimate Magus shenanigans.



Sorcerer has tier 2 casting. Druid has tier 1 casting. (Yes, a druid using the ACF in PHB2 that replaces wildshape and animal companion is still tier 1.)

Sorcerer casting is not better than druid casting. It's a full tier lower.

[Flickerdart]

Sorcerer has tier 2 casting. Druid has tier 1 casting. (Yes, a druid using the ACF in PHB2 that replaces wildshape and animal companion is still tier 1.)

Sorcerer casting is not better than druid casting. It's a full tier lower.
Sorry, I was thinking about just the spell list (of which Druid's is by far the worst of the big 3) and forgot that WotC hates Sorcerers for some reason.

[Urpriest]

Cha synergy is irrelevant, a Nymph's Druid casting is based on Cha.

While I don't think it's a big change, I also don't see the motivation. What does being a Sorceror get this character that being a Cha-based Druid like all the other Nymphs in the world wouldn't?

[Vaz]

Wings of flurry/Cover?

[ericgrau]

Cha synergy is irrelevant, a Nymph's Druid casting is based on Cha.


A nymph casts divine spells as a 7th-level druid.

Typical Druid Spells Prepared (6/5/4/3/1, save DC 13 + spell level)
...
Wis 17, Cha 19

The +3 save DC seems to suggest wis. I don't see any mention of cha casting. Is there some later add-on for this?

The tiers always struck me as iffy with divine prepared vs. arcane spontaneous because arcane spells are so much better than divine spells. And without high level utility spells available, you could just get cheap scrolls for low level utility and versatility with your major combat spells as your spells known.

[Urpriest]

The +3 save DC seems to suggest wis. I don't see any mention of cha casting. Is there some later add-on for this?

The tiers always struck me as iffy with divine prepared vs. arcane spontaneous because arcane spells are so much better than divine spells. And without high level utility spells available, you could just get cheap scrolls for low level utility and versatility with your major combat spells as your spells known.

Huh, don't know where I got that impression. Maybe confusing it with the homebrew monster classes.

Anyway, the Druid list doesn't have the volume of gamebreakers of the arcane list, but it's still very potent. Lots of immunities, lots of BFC, solid summoning.

[RFLS]

Cha synergy is irrelevant, a Nymph's Druid casting is based on Cha.

While I don't think it's a big change, I also don't see the motivation. What does being a Sorceror get this character that being a Cha-based Druid like all the other Nymphs in the world wouldn't?

I think he has some Evocation/Enchantment shenaniganry he mentioned wanting to get up to. This character is a spinoff of the one he also posted about up-page (with the Knock spell).

[Alokue]

Yea, maybe high OP wasn't the right thing to say, because I don't mean like "Everyone will be building cookie-cutter characters." I mean more like "There will be a lot of very powerful people using unique builds to give their character as much power as flavor allows.

The reason for the Sorcerer is basically that I'm building a gish and I want to take the Stormsinger class for like four levels (in addition to bard 1, obviously) to get some bardic music uses for uhmm. For Snowflake Wardance. And then on the other side I'm going to go glaivelock with 2 paladin levels and a battledancer level.

The LA would only be on one side, but I think I decided the racial hit dice were too much either way though, and that I'd be better off going without. 6HD and 7LA is just a bit of a buzzkill for the nymph powers, even if I can split them.

[Talya]

The stuff that comes with those fey hit dice are pretty good. The Level Adjustment is brutal, though.

[Spuddles]

Have you seen the gloura (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20031003e)? 7HD, 2 LA, and bardic casting. Pretty good entry for sublime chord.

It's basically an underground nymph without blinding beauty.

[Alokue]

Have you seen the gloura (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20031003e)? 7HD, 2 LA, and bardic casting. Pretty good entry for sublime chord.

It's basically an underground nymph without blinding beauty.

So do you remember that time when you were my hero?

[Alokue]

So do you remember that time when you were my hero?

Oh...you can't qualify for Stormsinger with it. Because you need Bardic Music.

[KillianHawkeye]

Oh...you can't qualify for Stormsinger with it. Because you need Bardic Music.

If you were going to dip a level of Bard anyway, you can still do that.

[Alokue]

That's true, but Druid>Sorcerer is a lot easier to justify than Bard>Sorcerer, and I don't care about Bard casting in the slightest.