Unused weapons

[Draconisister]

In the players handbook there are a lot of weapons that don't get used or very little at least that I have noticed. Is there a specific reason for this? or do people just prefer the more classic weapons? I was looking trough the PHB II at the whole background/personality building stuff and i figured I would have them be exotic so now I'm trying to decide on an uncommon weapon to use with out taking a exotic weapon prof feat. Any suggestions on what I should pick? On a side note can you cast spells while holding a 2 handed weapon? I can see just holding the weapon in one hand and cast with the other I know that in combat there would be no chance of casting Or is this just some dream of mine

[NeoPhoenix0]

You can cast while wielding a two-handed weapon, because it is a free action to release and grab the weapon with one hand.

[Darth Stabber]

In the players handbook there are a lot of weapons that don't get used or very little at least that I have noticed. Is there a specific reason for this? or do people just prefer the more classic weapons? I was looking trough the PHB II at the whole background/personality building stuff and i figured I would have them be exotic so now I'm trying to decide on an uncommon weapon to use with out taking a exotic weapon prof feat. Any suggestions on what I should pick? On a side note can you cast spells while holding a 2 handed weapon? I can see just holding the weapon in one hand and cast with the other I know that in combat there would be no chance of casting Or is this just some dream of mine

You can cast spells with a 2 hander (you can take a hand off the weapon long enough to cast a spell).

As far as weapons go, great club, heavy flail, and halberd are, in my experience, not frequently used.

[Draconisister]

Okaii that's good to know.

I was actually thinking about scythe, halberd, or trident for possible weapons. But I'm unsure which one would be the better choice.

[Gerrtt]

They all have their advantages and disadvantages.

Scythe and Halberd can both make trips.

Halberd deals a little more base damage, and more damage when someone charges you and you're set for it.

Trident can be thrown.

For my money...I'd go with the scythe if those were the only three choices I had. It deals two types of damage, massive crits, the option to trip people, and deals two damage dice instead of one...so a minimum of 2 damage instead of 1.

It's the most expensive of the three, sure, but I dig it.

[NeoPhoenix0]

Don't forget the coup de graces from a scythe is absolutely deadly with a minimum 18 fortitude save or die from someone with a strength of 10

[DeltaEmil]

The Trident is a one-handed weapon.

If you take a two-handed weapon, I'd suggest the halberd, since it has the option of being set against a charge in addition to the trip ability it shares with the scythe, but if you're a spellcaster, you're not going to use readied actions that often, so it wouldn't really matter if you're taking the scythe or the halberd.

I've seen spellcasters mostly use the scythe, because of the image of some death god wizard priest or something like that, even if they never make any melee attacks at all.

[The Fury]

Yeah there are reasons why some weapons are used less often. In the case of the exotic weapons the reason people don't use them is that any advantage in using it is pretty marginal, as in not worth taking a feat to use. Double weapons are especially seldom-used because they require at least two feats to use.
There's also the fact that more common weapons are, well more common. If you lose your longsword you can find another one pretty quick. It's also not unreasonable to expect to find an enchanted version of a fairly common weapon in random loot.
All that being said, if you do choose an exotic weapon I'd say choose one that has reach. Other than that, I'd say it depends on what your character concept is-- I'm guessing a spellcaster of some kind?

edit: out of the weapons you're considering I vote halberd. No other reason than I think halberds are cool.

[NeoPhoenix0]

My level 1 sorcerer used his scythe a lot. Then again he opened half of the encounters with color spray. That's right, death loves rainbows.

[buttcyst]

or you could go with a long spear, or maybe mounted with a lance?

[Draconisister]

I was thinking about mounted with a lance but the first few adventures are going to be close quarters dungeon crawl so getting a mount around would cause a problem.

[Silvanoshei]

Don't forget the coup de graces from a scythe is absolutely deadly with a minimum 18 fortitude save or die from someone with a strength of 10

Huh?????????

[DeltaEmil]

Reference to the coup de grace rules, where the target must succeed on a fortitude save equal to DC 10 + damage or die instantly. A scythe deals 2d4 damage, and has a x4 multiplier on a critical hit. When making a coup de grace, you automatically score a critical hit, so you deal 2d4 x4 damage, for a variance of 8-32 damage.

[Draconisister]

Well the scythe sounds like a lot of fun It may be my weapon of choice.

[Rubik]

A lot of exotic weapons are even worse than martial weapons. Some are even worse than simple weapons! Look at the monk's list of weaponry, for instance. None of those are worth using if you have access to weapon proficiencies in some other fashion, except maybe the unarmed strike, if the DM rules that you're proficient with it, and that's just because unarmed strikes can be used while holding other weapons.

[zilonox]

I've seen spellcasters mostly use the scythe, because of the image of some death god wizard priest or something like that, even if they never make any melee attacks at all.


My level 1 sorcerer used his scythe a lot. Then again he opened half of the encounters with color spray. That's right, death loves rainbows.

Just wondering here (and apologies if it's been covered before), but can a scythe be enchanted to become a wizard's staff? From the SRD (emphasis is mine):


A typical staff is 4 feet to 7 feet long and 2 inches to 3 inches thick, weighing about 5 pounds. Most staffs are wood, but a rare few are bone, metal, or even glass. (These are extremely exotic.) Staffs often have a gem or some device at their tip or are shod in metal at one or both ends. Staffs are often decorated with carvings or runes. A typical staff is like a walking stick, quarterstaff, or cudgel. It has AC 7, 10 hit points, hardness 5, and a break DC of 24.

Seems like a scythe would fit the description (though the blade may stretch "shod in metal on one end" a bit too far). I know a scythe has a curved handle, but not all artist renderings or author's descriptions of staffs are straight sticks.

[BWR]

Only if you count all polearms and things like clubs as staves.
By real English semantics, you can make an argument for the case.
By RAW, I don't care. By RAI, no.

[NeoPhoenix0]

Just wondering here (and apologies if it's been covered before), but can a scythe be enchanted to become a wizard's staff? From the SRD (emphasis is mine):



Seems like a scythe would fit the description (though the blade may stretch "shod in metal on one end" a bit too far). I know a scythe has a curved handle, but not all artist renderings or author's descriptions of staffs are straight sticks.

Ask your DM. If you enchant the weapon you may need to use the 1.5 times cost for either the weapon enchantments or the staff.

[Draconisister]

As a DM I would be ok with it if the player could give a valid in character argument for it. It would also have to cost at least 1.5 the cost for unconventional choice and i would probably have the character make it themselves.

[Darth Stabber]

A weird thought on scythes: given that they are farming implements commoners should be able to get proficiency in scythes with their 1 proficiency. I would say the same for kamas and nunchucks (for the same reason). It's not like it's going to break anything.

[Draconisister]

I would consider giving a proficiency in a 'farming tool' If someone had x ranks in profession (farming)

[mabriss lethe]

Does your weapon choice have to come from the PHB?

You could create a character with a more primitive twist, using an atlatl (sandstorm) in ranged combat and a maquahuitl (MM3) for melee. basically a spiked greatclub d10 damage, critX2 , deals bludgeoning and piercing.

[Medic!]

Farming tools (including farming scythes) would most likely fall under improvised weaponry. The martial scythe is an adaptation according to PHB.

[Chronos]

Personally, I'd allow a scythe-as-wizard-staff with no added cost and no justification needed beyond rule of cool. You would probably have to make it yourself, though, unless you found an item vendor or treasure horde with the same sense of aesthetics.

To justify the no-added-cost: First of all, a wizard's staff is just a stick, and the handle of a scythe is likewise just a stick. Take the blade off, it's a stick. Enchant the stick. Now stick the blade back on, and it's both a staff and a scythe. Second, magic weapons are enchanted on a per-role basis, not on a per-item: A double weapon can be enchanted separately on its two heads, or even enchanted on one and mundane on the other, with no additional cost, and a shield that's used for bashing is enchanted independently for defense and offense. An item that's used for storing spells and for hitting should also be enchanted independently for its two roles.

[GreenETC]

If you want to do something cool with a non-standard weapon, I'd take a look at some of the feats in Complete Warrior, like Net & Trident or Anvil of Thunder. They can make for some fun tricks.

[Rubik]

I want to dual-wield half-orc monks. With the penalty to Int, they count as simple weapons, right?

[Darth Stabber]

Personally, I'd allow a scythe-as-wizard-staff with no added cost and no justification needed beyond rule of cool. You would probably have to make it yourself, though, unless you found an item vendor or treasure horde with the same sense of aesthetics.

To justify the no-added-cost: First of all, a wizard's staff is just a stick, and the handle of a scythe is likewise just a stick. Take the blade off, it's a stick. Enchant the stick. Now stick the blade back on, and it's both a staff and a scythe. Second, magic weapons are enchanted on a per-role basis, not on a per-item: A double weapon can be enchanted separately on its two heads, or even enchanted on one and mundane on the other, with no additional cost, and a shield that's used for bashing is enchanted independently for defense and offense. An item that's used for storing spells and for hitting should also be enchanted independently for its two roles.

Emphasis mine.

The bolded section is not entirely accurate, as evidenced in the spoiler

http://www.learnersdictionary.com/art/ld/scythe.gif

As you can see it's not just a "stick with a blade", or at least less so than most polearms.

That being said, I would probably use your ruling, and would open it to any polearm for the sake of consistancy. A spear's haft is pretty much a quarterstaff, unlike the scythe's, and all of the other polearms us the same type of straight haft.

[NeoPhoenix0]

I'm gonna chime in here. The artist didn't do the research when they drew a picture of a martial scythe. It should look more like the stuff at the top of this picture.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/ff/Kosy_i_piki.jpg/402px-Kosy_i_piki.jpg

[Drelua]

I'm gonna chime in here. The artist didn't do the research when they drew a picture of a martial scythe. It should look more like the stuff at the top of this picture.


Actually, I'm pretty sure the artist just wasn't drawing a martial scythe. The handle is shaped the way it is on a farming scythe so that it can very easily swing by a person's side, making the work a lot easier. This would provide absolutely no bonus in combat unless all you were doing was aiming for the shins of the people to your side. From what I've heard, when scythes were to be used as weapons, the blades were removed and attached to a straight pole with the blade running parallel to it. This would look just like the picture you provided, and is really the only way a scythe is practical in combat.

So basically, yeah, it would be a stick almost exactly like a quarterstaff if you took off the blade.

[Draconisister]

but what if i want to go after peoples shins? would it be considered a simple weapon if i didnt change out the handle and just used a farming scythe? it is a basic tool any idiot farmer should be able to use.

[Humble Master]

but what if i want to go after peoples shins? would it be considered a simple weapon if i didnt change out the handle and just used a farming scythe? it is a basic tool any idiot farmer should be able to use. I would rule that it would be an improvised weapon because it isn't made for combat. I would probably also give it slightly higher damage than a improvised weapon of the same damage seeing as it is still a sharp piece of metal.

[Medic!]

There's a world of difference between a simple tool any idiot could use and using that same tool in a fight for your life...actually there's only about -4 worth of difference :smallcool:

[NeoPhoenix0]

As a DM i would probably give the farming scythe the stats of a martial scythe and just make it improvised. It's just as deadly for coup de graces, maybe even easier to use for executions, and it has the same blade just in a harder to use form.

[denthor]

My level 1 sorcerer used his scythe a lot. Then again he opened half of the encounters with color spray. That's right, death loves rainbows.

I am guessing that your Sorcerer was neutral at best?? coup de graces is not something a lot of good characters do. I do like the color spray idea however. Death loves rainbows:belkar: still laughing

To the original post I ran a fighter that was concepted to be second line whip, net and halbred I misread thought it had reach I was wrong:smallredface:. She became a front line fighter very quickly.

The triple damage threat was just to great.

[GlorinSteampike]

Okaii that's good to know.

I was actually thinking about scythe, halberd, or trident for possible weapons. But I'm unsure which one would be the better choice.

Scythe, Halberd and Trident are some of the most commonly used weapons from my characters. And I see the scythe a lot for its x4 and the trident I've seen multiple times.

A combo I like is Goliath Mountain Rager with Halberd and Lucern Hammer/Ranseur for super reachy combat maneuver times. Also combos really good with monk, Because you can dual wield reach weapons and threat adjacent to you with unarmed attacks.

[NeoPhoenix0]

I am guessing that your Sorcerer was neutral at best?? coup de graces is not something a lot of good characters do. I do like the color spray idea however. Death loves rainbows:belkar: still laughing

To the original post I ran a fighter that was concepted to be second line whip, net and halbred I misread thought it had reach I was wrong:smallredface:. She became a front line fighter very quickly.

The triple damage threat was just to great.

He started out as CN, the kind of CN that isn't an excuse to do random evil deeds. Killing was part of combat to him and killing in a way that didn't put him at much risk seemed logical to him. Now he is well on the way down the slippery slope of insanity thanks to a Cthulhu style cultist book he used to save the party and a small town and his own distant demonic ancestry, obyrith ancestry not tanar'ri. He might qualify as CE now but i don't think he's there yet as his motives are still generally good. He is becoming slightly psychopathic but won't harm the party because most of what he does is for their sake.

[Tvtyrant]

I could see the larger forms of Giants using scythes as weapons on smaller folk. Farm scythe through a formation...

[NeoPhoenix0]

I have a question. Why would anyone take a heavy mace when a morningstar exists. They are both one-handed simple weapons, do the same damage, same crit multiplier, and neither has a range increment. Yet the morningstar is cheaper, does both bludgeoning and piercing damage, and weighs less.

[bobthehero]

I guess you could argue that the mace can deal non lethal damage more easily.

[Humble Master]

I have a question. Why would anyone take a heavy mace when a morningstar exists. They are both one-handed simple weapons, do the same damage, same crit multiplier, and neither has a range increment. Yet the morningstar is cheaper, does both bludgeoning and piercing damage, and weighs less. That is RAW for you I guess.