Claudia (Updated 6/28)

[Hawkflight]

Hello everyone,

So, I'm making a backup character for a 3.5 game. We're the bad guys, and we control a pair of stones that can make people immortal. Playing with this idea of immortality, I've decided to make a character based on Claudia from Anne Rice's 'The Vampire Chronicles' series. A little girl who's immortal, and lures people to their death with the 'innocent little kid' act.

This is where I need advice. I was thinking of making her a Warlock, because they have some cool all-day powers, but I was hoping for advice on this character. I'd like for it to not get around that she's actually an evil immortal murderer, so she can continue to f*** around with the 'good guys'. And while this is a low-optimization campaign (my allies are a TWF fighter and a monk/ninja for goodness' sake, though we are getting a cleric next game), she will need some damage potential and survivability for battles. I'm considering Hellfire Warlock for the damage output.

EDIT: Just to be clear, unless there's a very good reason to pick something else, I'm going with Warlock. I am not looking for class advice. I'm looking for advice on tactics, feats, invocation selection, etc.

UPDATE: The DM decided to ban Hellfire Warlock. I need advice on how to get my damage numbers back up.

UPDATE 2: Spellwarp Sniper. Thoughts?

[Azoth]

Warlock is a decent choice, but have you considered bard? Claudia is a smooth talker and plotter. She manages to very easily conceal her intentions of killing Lestat, convinces him that the tool of his murder is a gift of appology, and then nearly kills him. She also constantly manages to manipulate Louis to her whim with either guilt or deceit.

A bard easily packs the social skills and spells to pull off the schemer archetype. It also gives you a solid reason to pump her charisma up and play up the cute little girl angle. Granted that in combat bards are generally force amplifiers and not the star of the show, but again Claudia was used to complimenting Lestat and Louis' particular ploys and tactics in the book. She was the perfect instrument to create openings for them simply by being there.

[Crake]

Beguiler probably fits the role you're looking to fill pretty neatly. Bunch of skillpoints for the social skills, only problem is that casting is keyed off int, not cha, so you'll simultaneously need good cha and int at the same time unless you want most of your charms to work off spells rather than words.

You'll probably want to talk to your DM about homebrewing a small child stat modifier. Probably stick with +1 skillpoints/bonus feat for being human, but grab the halfling +2 dex, -2 str, small size, 20ft land speed bit?

[Hawkflight]

Eh, everything Beguiler can do that I care about, Warlock can do better and at-will. Plus the Warlock gets some interesting class features. Bard makes sense ... but ... I'll be honest, I kinda hate Bard. I don't know why, every time I've used it left a bad taste in my mouth.

Plus, Warlock gets Dimension Door at-will, and I just know my DM is gonna be a **** and spam nets at us. Again.

EDIT: I considered the fact that the Warlock only gets 2+Int SP, but after that and the bonus one from being human, I think I only need two or three more, so I can put my two best rolls into Int and Cha.

[Waker]

I would say that Bard or Beguiler is a solid basis for what you want to accomplish. You might consider mixing Beguiler with Warlock using Eldritch Theurge, gaining access to the Beguiler's long list of illusions and enchantments and use Eldritch Blast to give you some damage options. Very important to your character is the spell Undetectable Alignment, which is on both the Bard and Beguiler spell lists.

[nedz]

Consider:
Elf, Beguiler, Dip some class which gives you survival, Seeker of the Misty Isle

SotMI gets you the Travel domain: Spam Dim door as much as you like.

Ed: sorry you need to be able to cast 2nd level divine spells — my bad.
Bard with the Divine and Wilderness ACFs can do this though, no dip required.

[Adindra]

when i built her i dipped into pathfinder for the young template and the vampire template with the ancient child alternate thing if my memory serves, it fit what i wanted to get for her vampire wise (although for class i just went with a wizard because the party needed one more than that it fit the character herself)

[Hawkflight]

The DM will let me make an Invocation of 'Undetectable Alignment', so that shouldn't be a problem. And like I said, I absolutely despise Bard.

What I'm more looking for is advice on feats, tactics, and invocation selection.

[Jack_Simth]

The DM will let me make an Invocation of 'Undetectable Alignment', so that shouldn't be a problem. And like I said, I absolutely despise Bard.You don't want it as an Invocation. You want to buy a Ring of Mind Shielding (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/rings.htm#mindShielding), or better, a Third Eye Conceal (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/items/universalItems.htm#conceal).

[Hawkflight]

We're only level ECL 10, so my budget is limited.

[Waker]

Taking it as am Invocation isn't advised, you have a very small amount of those known. Would be better to dip into a class that grants it like Beguiler or Wizard or find an item as was suggested. How about the Enchanter (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/specialistWizardVariants.htm#enchanterVariants) variant. The Social Proficiency would give you access to the social skills you would need to be a convincing liar.

[Hawkflight]

I don't like having invocations/spells/maneuvers from more than one base class, but I could dip two levels of Fiend of Corruption.... (I have a negative LA, so I can afford it.)

[Jack_Simth]

We're only level ECL 10, so my budget is limited.

The Ring of Mind Shielding (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/rings.htm#mindShielding) is 8,000 gp. ECL 10 gets you a WBL of... 49,000 gp. Just over 16% of WBL. Slightly expensive, but a better investment than one of your invocations known.

[Sith_Happens]

(I have a negative LA, so I can afford it.)

Wait, what? In that case, what actual level are you?

You definitely want Beguiling Influence and Charm for manipulating purposes. Also strongly consider a Binder dip so you can get Disguise Self at-will, Skill Mastery for Bluff and Diplomacy, and no-penalty standard action Diplomacy from Naberius. If you go Hellfire Warlock this becomes mandatory, since the same vestige also heals ability damage for free.

[Hawkflight]

The Ring of Mind Shielding (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/rings.htm#mindShielding) is 8,000 gp. ECL 10 gets you a WBL of... 49,000 gp. Just over 16% of WBL. Slightly expensive, but a better investment than one of your invocations known.

Eh, I guess. Not like I have many other items to spend money on. The thing is, there's only two, maybe three least invocations that I really want. And now my DM wants to rule that 24-hour buffs leave a visible and deathly-scary visual effect, which I'm trying to shoot down.


Wait, what? In that case, what actual level are you?

12 class levels, after a -2 LA.


Also strongly consider a Binder dip so you can get Disguise Self at-will, Skill Mastery for Bluff and Diplomacy, and no-penalty standard action Diplomacy from Naberius. If you go Hellfire Warlock this becomes mandatory, since the same vestige also heals ability damage for free.

Eh ... I'm a little iffy on that, but it ... could work? I'm not sure it fits with my character's theme, but maybe. Thing is, I can only use one of those abilities at a time, and most of them can be replicated by invocations.

[Sith_Happens]

Eh ... I'm a little iffy on that, but it ... could work? I'm not sure it fits with my character's theme, but maybe. Thing is, I can only use one of those abilities at a time, and most of them can be replicated by invocations.

No, all of the abilities I listed are from the same vestige, so you get all of them at once (as well as a few others).

[Hawkflight]

Ah. Well, I can just grab the Bind Vestige feat, and not have to dip into a whole other class.

[Souju]

And now my DM wants to rule that 24-hour buffs leave a visible and deathly-scary visual effect, which I'm trying to shoot down.



That's...probably one of the dumbest houserules regarding spell effects i've ever seen. Having Undetectable Alignment give off any visible aura at all would be like ...well, I can't even think of a metaphor or simile better than that! It's a spell designed to make your alignment undetectable, it's only really supposed to show up when Detect Magic is cast, otherwise it defeats the purpose of having it.

"Oh, i can't see your alignment, but I can see that weird glowy thingy. As a person whose specific job it is to hunt down evil creatures, I know that aura indicates you've got Undetectable Alignment on you, and the only reason you'd do that is if you'd ping as evil...DIE EVILDOER!"

I remember for a bard I made that was a demon worshipper I jumped through a few hoops to design a custom item with permanent undetectable alignment. God I spent a lot of time on that character's backstory...then we abandoned that campaign cuz the DM no longer had time to run it. So sad.

[dysprosium]

No, all of the abilities I listed are from the same vestige, so you get all of them at once (as well as a few others).


Ah. Well, I can just grab the Bind Vestige feat, and not have to dip into a whole other class.

Actually iirc the Bind Vestige feat only gives you some of Naberius' abilities (and not the ability damage regen). You would need to dip.

Claudia was quite manipulative, you definitely want your social skills as high as possible especially to get the synergies with other social skills -- Bluff, Diplomacy, Sense Motive, etc

[Hawkflight]

That's...probably one of the dumbest houserules regarding spell effects i've ever seen. Having Undetectable Alignment give off any visible aura at all would be like ...well, I can't even think of a metaphor or simile better than that! It's a spell designed to make your alignment undetectable, it's only really supposed to show up when Detect Magic is cast, otherwise it defeats the purpose of having it.

"Oh, i can't see your alignment, but I can see that weird glowy thingy. As a person whose specific job it is to hunt down evil creatures, I know that aura indicates you've got Undetectable Alignment on you, and the only reason you'd do that is if you'd ping as evil...DIE EVILDOER!"

I remember for a bard I made that was a demon worshipper I jumped through a few hoops to design a custom item with permanent undetectable alignment. God I spent a lot of time on that character's backstory...then we abandoned that campaign cuz the DM no longer had time to run it. So sad.

Yeah ... turns out he was considering it because it was a rule he played under once and loved it. When I ... *ahem* voiced my concerns, he was like, "Well, okay, you don't gotta do it. But think of it! People running in fear from a child!" And I was like, "No. :smallannoyed:"


Actually iirc the Bind Vestige feat only gives you some of Naberius' abilities (and not the ability damage regen). You would need to dip.

Claudia was quite manipulative, you definitely want your social skills as high as possible especially to get the synergies with other social skills -- Bluff, Diplomacy, Sense Motive, etc

Yeah, but I can pick up to two (with a second feat), and that's really all I need.

[limejuicepowder]

Have you checked out a warlock handbook? There are several of them around, and they give a good breakdown of strategies, uses of invocations, etc. Basically everything you need. Here's (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=252715) one I like.

I strongly recommend you dip binder for naberious - if you go hellfire warlock it's basically required, but even without hellfire all of the abilities he gives are pretty amazing. Still though, if yah don't want to yah don't want to....and if you're getting 12 levels to play with overall, there's something to be said for starting with imbue item.

I don't want to go over the exact same stuff you're going to see in the handbook, but there is one thing I think is worth going over: warlocks, being lower tier, don't change their role very well. You kind of have to chose what you want to do from the beginning and stick with it.

If you want to do rather obscene damage, go the eldritch claw route. You'll be a melee glass-cannon type that can put out very respectable damage.

If you want to debuff and do decent damage, go for the eldritch glaive. You'll still be melee (with reach though), and good iterative attacks with easy touch attacks means you'll force a lot of saves against debuffs.

Ironically, warlocks aren't great ranged damage dealers. Even with hellfire, your damage is going to be quite low. Lack of iteratives hurts, badly. I wouldn't recommend this route.

Lastly, you can basically forget about doing damage and focus on flexibility, BFC, or some other aspect of the class (like items). Imbue item and deceive item are very good abilities, and picking up scribe scroll and create wand can make you a very very flexible character, with access to virtually every spell in the game.

Based on your party, I recommend going for some version of the last type. Even if they aren't optimized, damage dealing is covered by the other members of the party. If you break out with some excellent BFC (chilling tentacles is amazing) and some wand-based buffs, you will compliment them very well.

[Hawkflight]

What are your suggestions for wands?

EDIT: Just wanted to report that the DM ruled that Rapid Shot and Manyshot apply to Eldritch Blast, so that's a thing.

[limejuicepowder]

What are your suggestions for wands?

EDIT: Just wanted to report that the DM ruled that Rapid Shot and Manyshot apply to Eldritch Blast, so that's a thing.

Individual wands are pretty cheap, but if you want a lot of them (and you do), the cost is still going to add up quickly. For that reason, you want to buy minimum caster level wands, which makes the saves poor. Thus we arrive at no-save spells, which generally means buffs. Still though, there are several no-save offensive spells of note. Basically, look at a list of great spells of 4th level and below and pick the ones that look interesting and useful to you.

Off the top of my head, I'd consider wands of haste, polymorph, lessor vigor, lay of the land, invisibility, silence, silent image, and fly.

Scrolls are a bit harder. They can be of any level making them very powerful, but their single usage makes them a much bigger investment. Technically speaking, you have access to 9ths. You might want to talk to your DM about that though; he/she might not like you bringing shapechange or gate or wish to the fight with the BBEG. With all that said, it's worth spending a couple G's on extremely useful spells that can save the party, like teleport and resurrection.

Heward's handy haversack is almost a must.

[Hawkflight]

It should be noted that magic is a ... tricky subject here. Since over the past 1,000 years, most spellcasters over level 9 have been pretty much killed off by either side.

[limejuicepowder]

It should be noted that magic is a ... tricky subject here. Since over the past 1,000 years, most spellcasters over level 9 have been pretty much killed off by either side.

Sounds like you should not bother with scribe scroll then. It would be a pretty large investment for 1-shot items anyways.

Also, with rapid shot usable with eldritch blast ranged combat just became a lot more viable. Touch attacks are near auto-hits, so that effectively doubles your damage. With hellfire you'll be a moderately respectable ranged damage dealer.

binder 1 warlock 8 hellfire warlock 3 would be my build. I'd take beguiling influence, baleful utterance, eldritch spear, brimestone blast, flee the scene, voracious dispelling, and chilling tentacles.

This build won't get you imbue item right away, so you're going to have to get wands through WBL. Pick 5 nifty ones and put them in a wand bracer for quick access. Possible pick up a couple cheaper utility-type wands like lay of the land and lessor vigor for out of combat stuff.

[Hawkflight]

Well, like I said, I'm not comfortable taking multiple base classes when I have scaling abilities, like invocations and Eldritch Blast. I'm just weird like that. Still, I can take two feats and bind Cerberus, getting everything I need from him. I know it's a bit of a feat tax, but I have enough feats I can afford it.

All that said, how would you recommend pumping my AC? It's a little low, as it is.

[limejuicepowder]

All that said, how would you recommend pumping my AC? It's a little low, as it is.

What's a little low?

Honestly I'm not a great optimizer so you're almost certainly better off looking elsewhere for AC boosts. However, I do know enough to know that what you really want is miss chance. Displacement is good and wandable, as well as available via magic items. Same with greater invisibility. Just those two and making full use of eldritch spear should keep you quite safe. Still though, you don't want to spend the first two rounds of every combat buffing. Tactics is the best defense.

A quick google search as yielded this (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=331.0), which look promising.

[Hawkflight]

Well ... at the moment, 13. +2 from Dex, +1 from size.

[Sith_Happens]

Yeah, but I can pick up to two (with a second feat), and that's really all I need.

It's preset which two abilities you get, though the second one is the Diplomacy and Bluff goodies (the first is a worthless piece of junk). Not having the ability healing is a pain with Hellfire Warlock, is the thing.

[Hawkflight]

The DM says he'll just let me pick which two I get. It's kinda finagling it a bit, but with this guy I need all the help I can get. Besides, Claudia is really not going to be in combat a whole lot, her talents lie elsewhere.

[limejuicepowder]

It's preset which two abilities you get, though the second one is the Diplomacy and Bluff goodies (the first is a worthless piece of junk). Not having the ability healing is a pain with Hellfire Warlock, is the thing.

Won't matter if hellfire warlock isn't even used, which looks like the case.

[Hawkflight]

No, I'm going to use HFW, just not very often, and I can recover well enough with wands in any case.

[Hawkflight]

UPDATE: The DM decided to ban Hellfire Warlock. I need advice on how to get my damage numbers back up.

[Waker]

If you are looking to increase your damage as a Warlock without Hellfire, you'll probably have to consider Eldritch Glaive or Claws. If you want to try something odd, you might look at Grappling Blast from the same issue that Eldritch Claws comes from. You can deal blast damage when grappling, which gives you a bonus to maintain the hold next round. Might make for an amusing image, a little girl who can out-wrestle people twice her size.

[Hawkflight]

*ahem*

Just for the record, I would like to post my character sheet (with the HFA levels removed).

www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=610274

Note that she is small, she is fragile, and she has a Str score of 4. She is not going to be doing any grappling. Now or ever. And if she's in melee, then something went horribly wrong.

I'm also considering Raise The Dead, which could be ... interesting.

[Hawkflight]

So, I need some advice. What do you guys think of Warlock 6 / Spellthief 1 / Spellwarp Sniper 5?