X & R Reaction [Archive] - Giant in the Playground Forums

F.Harr

2013-07-14, 01:41 PM

If they did, it would entail a pretty drastic change in plans. I mean, they COULD use the rifts to, I don't know, go to the beach. Assuming that you can safely travel and the other side has breathable are and the whole thing isn't a swirling mass of chaos hidden behind a pleasent espression.

NerdyKris

2013-07-14, 01:45 PM

I get the feeling everyone is about to change their game plan right now.

F.Harr

2013-07-14, 01:46 PM

I get the feeling everyone is about to change their game plan right now.

Hopefully after a good long think. But I doubt it. That's not sufficiently dramatic.

R. Malcovitch

2013-07-14, 09:39 PM

They'd probably try to kill each other.
I agree. Redcloak has gone through so much for The Plan, and absolutely hates Xykon, but keeps him around because he needs him. The Plan is kaput, then he would almost certainly try to kill him.

Meanwhile Xykon has devoted quite a bit of his (un)life to following Redcloak's idea, and if he finds out there was never anything there to begin with, he'd be the angriest he's ever been, and would almost certainly try to kill him.

Vinsfeld

2013-07-14, 10:06 PM

The Linear Guild might still show up somewhere and engage Team Evil in battle.

Demolator

2013-07-14, 10:09 PM

The Linear Guild might still show up somewhere and engage Team Evil in battle.

I actually hope this happens, I don't want Redcloak dying so soon (because if :redcloak: and :xykon: fought I'm not confident the goblin would live).

Amphiox

2013-07-14, 10:23 PM

bguy

2013-07-14, 10:24 PM

I actually hope this happens, I don't want Redcloak dying so soon (because if :redcloak: and :xykon: fought I'm not confident the goblin would live).

Xykon is actually unusually vulnerable to Redcloak right now. All Redcloak has to do is hit him with an anti-magic field spell and Xykon is effectively immobilized.

Vinsfeld

2013-07-14, 10:26 PM

I actually hope this happens, I don't want Redcloak dying so soon (because if :redcloak: and :xykon: fought I'm not confident the goblin would live).

And also, if they go together against the Order now, the Order would be no more. If the Linear Guild shows up and fights Team Evil, it could be a good chance for the Order to run away. (unless, like some people are saying, they jump in the rift, but I don't see this a likely scenario)

KillianHawkeye

2013-07-14, 10:41 PM

Xykon is actually unusually vulnerable to Redcloak right now. All Redcloak has to do is hit him with an anti-magic field spell and Xykon is effectively immobilized.

What makes you think that Redcloak is capable of doing that? Antimagic Field is not a Cleric spell. :smallconfused:

Besides, inside an Antimagic Field, Redcloak loses almost any means he has of harming Xykon, so it's not a very good strategy. Especially because the field will follow the caster, so Redcloak cannot even try to leave Xykon behind in this way.

thatSeniorGuy

2013-07-14, 11:52 PM

What makes you think that Redcloak is capable of doing that? Antimagic Field is not a Cleric spell. :smallconfused:

Yes it is. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/antimagicField.htm)
Rest of your point stands though; I think that Xykon could kick Redcloak's behind in melee as well.

Demolator

2013-07-14, 11:58 PM

And also, if they go together against the Order now, the Order would be no more. If the Linear Guild shows up and fights Team Evil, it could be a good chance for the Order to run away. (unless, like some people are saying, they jump in the rift, but I don't see this a likely scenario)

Surrounded at the bottom of the sand dunes by the LG, Team Tarquin, and Team Evil, it might be their only way out.

Perseus

2013-07-15, 12:07 AM

Yes it is. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/antimagicField.htm)
Rest of your point stands though; I think that Xykon could kick Redcloak's behind in melee as well.

Redcloak would only need to stand outside the AMF and fire something from the conjuration school into the AMF to crush Xykon.

But I would just use miracle (though I bet RC prepares it) to cast Undeath to Death for the lulz. 17d4 is 2.5 * 17... 42 HD. If that doesn't work there are plenty ways to destroy xykon in one round. I doubt xykon is at 1/2 HP....

thatSeniorGuy

2013-07-15, 12:16 AM

Redcloak would only need to stand outside the AMF and fire something from the conjuration school into the AMF to crush Xykon.

An invisible barrier surrounds you and moves with you. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/antimagicField.htm)

I doubt that anyone in OOTS will use Miracle/Wish, given Rich's views on it. Or am I confusing Wish/Miracle with True Resurrection?
Your point on Undeath to Death seem mechanically reasonable though; I just read the SRD, I haven't actually played 3E.

KillianHawkeye

2013-07-15, 01:54 AM

Redcloak would only need to stand outside the AMF and fire something from the conjuration school into the AMF to crush Xykon.

But I would just use miracle (though I bet RC prepares it) to cast Undeath to Death for the lulz. 17d4 is 2.5 * 17... 42 HD. If that doesn't work there are plenty ways to destroy xykon in one round. I doubt xykon is at 1/2 HP....

A) Redcloak cannot stand outside of an Antimagic Field that he has cast, since as I said before, it follows him around.

B) Undeath to Death cannot kill Xykon because the spell inherits Circle of Death's restriction on only affecting creatures with fewer than 9 Hit Dice.

C) If Redcloak tried to kill Xykon, the MitD would eat him.

skaddix

2013-07-15, 04:10 AM

RC would probably have a mental breakdown

karkus

2013-07-15, 05:49 AM

If Redcloak tried to kill Xykon, the MitD would eat him.

This is why y'all need to read SoD, A.S.A.P.

Perseus

2013-07-15, 06:08 AM

A) Redcloak cannot stand outside of an Antimagic Field that he has cast, since as I said before, it follows him around.

B) Undeath to Death cannot kill Xykon because the spell inherits Circle of Death's restriction on only affecting creatures with fewer than 9 Hit Dice.

C) If Redcloak tried to kill Xykon, the MitD would eat him.

A: I always forget its centered on the caster, though RC wouldn't need it.
B: what a useless spell then.
C:" Don't worry mitd, I'm healing xykon" lol

Ellye

2013-07-15, 06:37 AM

Redcloak would never accept the idea that The Dark One betrayed him - or perhaps not even the ideia that The Dark One was wrong.

He would probably find some way to justify the planet existence without discarding the Snarl. For his own mind sake.

bguy

2013-07-15, 08:22 AM

Besides, inside an Antimagic Field, Redcloak loses almost any means he has of harming Xykon, so it's not a very good strategy. Especially because the field will follow the caster, so Redcloak cannot even try to leave Xykon behind in this way.

He would be able to strip an effectively immobilized Xykon of his magic items though. In particular he could take away Xykon's item that protects him from fire damage and even more importantly

SOD SPOILERS Xykon's ring that protects him from positive energy attacks.

Once those items are gone Xykon is a lot more vulnerable to Redcloak. (Especially since Xykon is already showing heavy damage.) Redcloak then only has to drop the anti-magic field and hit Xykon with a Heal spell.

As for the Monster in the Dark, if Redcloak cast an anti-magic field on himself, do you really think the Monster would even realize it was an attack on Xykon?

Also would Xykon's geas even work on the Monster if he was inside an anti-magic field?

Rest of your point stands though; I think that Xykon could kick Redcloak's behind in melee as well.

Normally I would agree with you, but at the moment Xykon doesn't have any legs. Its kind of hard to win at melee when you only means of moving is by crawling with you arms.

GreatWyrmGold

2013-07-15, 08:29 AM

I'm amused by Redcloak's response.
I wish Xykon wasn't so busy looking for his bones, then we could see if he remembered Roy this time.

David Argall

2013-07-15, 12:24 PM

F.Harr

2013-07-15, 01:59 PM

They are both so invested in the idea of the Snarl being behind the gates that I doubt just seeing the planet beyond would convince them that the Snarl wasn't there.

It is far more likely that their first conclusion would be that the Snarl was living/hiding on that planet.

Or, it's the snarl, smiling at you. Also, the gods don't know about the planet, as far as we know.

Yes it is. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/antimagicField.htm)
Rest of your point stands though; I think that Xykon could kick Redcloak's behind in melee as well.

Well, prod. 'Cause Xykon's ain't got no legs.

Starwulf

2013-07-15, 03:34 PM

You are talking about an epic character vs a mere paragon. In comic we see X beat up Super-V while Redcloak is reduced to giving advice. Redcloak will need some special circumstances or his best strategy is Word of Recall, followed by hiding until X forgets about him [which given X,might only take minutes.]

Super-V went in guns a blazing with nary a thought towards strategy or tactics, thinking he could just brute-force his way through the entire encounter. On the other hand, Redcloak has likely been devising a way to take down Xykon for a very, very long time, and probably has X amount of spells prepared every single day just on the off-chance that that day will be the day he has to do it. I'd say the odds are much more in Redcloaks favor then they ever were in Super-V's.

F.Harr

2013-07-16, 03:53 PM

That also fits in with RC's personality. He's smart, a long-term planner and knows he's riding a bear. It would make sence that he has a way of killing the bear should it become necessary.

David Argall

2013-07-16, 09:41 PM

Super-V went in guns a blazing with nary a thought towards strategy or tactics, thinking he could just brute-force his way through the entire encounter. On the other hand, Redcloak has likely been devising a way to take down Xykon for a very, very long time, and probably has X amount of spells prepared every single day just on the off-chance that that day will be the day he has to do it. I'd say the odds are much more in Redcloaks favor then they ever were in Super-V's.
For plot reasons maybe, but he is still just paragon vs Epic. And his performance vs super-V gives us no confidence he can take X. Add in that he very much needs X. He very much does not want to fight X. It would likely means the last 30 years of his life have been a total waste.
Oh yes, let us note that the last time somebody tried to trick X so to take him out in a fight, X knew about it all the way while Redcloak was totally surprised. With that sort of a record, Redcloak would have to be extremely desperate to take such a risk. But we have no such evidence he is at all desperate.
Redcloak is most likely working on an ace in the hole, which given the rules of drama, he will have to use, but when he uses it, those same rules of drama say he is going to get creamed. X is reserved for Roy.

137beth

2013-07-17, 01:10 AM

Surrounded at the bottom of the sand dunes by the LG, Team Tarquin, and Team Evil, it might be their only way out.

Surrounded? What makes you think they are surrounded? There's no reason to assume that the other three groups would be equally spaced in a circle around the order.

Demolator

2013-07-17, 01:50 AM

Surrounded? What makes you think they are surrounded? There's no reason to assume that the other three groups would be equally spaced in a circle around the order.

Well it would be pretty dramatic and give them a nice reason to go for a swim in the rift.:smalltongue:

137beth

2013-07-17, 04:34 AM

Well it would be pretty dramatic and give them a nice reason to go for a swim in the rift.:smalltongue:

Well yea, but you are starting from the assumption that you want them to go through the rift, then concocting a scenario to make it happen. That's not an indication that they are likely to be surrounded, just an indication that you want them to go through the rift:smalltongue:

martianmister

2013-07-17, 02:22 PM

I guess we'll wait for their reactions...

Demolator

2013-07-17, 02:38 PM

Well yea, but you are starting from the assumption that you want them to go through the rift, then concocting a scenario to make it happen. That's not an indication that they are likely to be surrounded, just an indication that you want them to go through the rift:smalltongue:

Hm, I suppose you have a good point, especially since now it looks like they're not going in anytime soon.

On the subject of the reaction, however, part of me thinks that was the reaction right there, though there could be more once they reach the next gate. I wonder if the monster would save Xykon/Redcloak from each other like it did with the Order.

GreatWyrmGold

2013-07-19, 09:35 AM

Firstly:

I'm amused by Redcloak's response.
I wish Xykon wasn't so busy looking for his bones, then we could see if he remembered Roy this time.
Called it. Xykon didn't remember Roy.

Or, it's the snarl, smiling at you. Also, the gods don't know about the planet, as far as we know.
And they don't not know about it as far as we know, either.