UMD Questions

[Commander_Vimes]

I'm confused on exactly when a character needs to make a UMD check.

If I am a level 1 Cleric, and I use a level 1 wand of cure light wounds I don't need to. Would I if the wand was made at caster level 5?

If that same cleric has a scroll or wand of some level 3 spell does he need to make a UMD check?

[Seth1221]

If the spell is on your caster list you don't need UMD check, if the spell exceeds your current spell level avaiable you need to make a caster level check to see if you manage to cast the spell from the scroll. If you don't have the spell on your list (a rogue trying to cast CLW from a csroll or a wand for example) you need to make a UMD check.

[Diarmuid]

Spell Trigger items (like wands) only require you to have the spell on your spell list.

Spell Completion items (like scrolls) require you to both have the spell on your list and be of the appropriate caster level.



To have any chance of activating a scroll spell, the scroll user must meet the following requirements.

The spell must be of the correct type (arcane or divine). Arcane spellcasters (wizards, sorcerers, and bards) can only use scrolls containing arcane spells, and divine spellcasters (clerics, druids, paladins, and rangers) can only use scrolls containing divine spells. (The type of scroll a character creates is also determined by his or her class.)
The user must have the spell on his or her class list.
The user must have the requisite ability score.

If the user meets all the requirements noted above, and her caster level is at least equal to the spell’s caster level, she can automatically activate the spell without a check. If she meets all three requirements but her own caster level is lower than the scroll spell’s caster level, then she has to make a caster level check (DC = scroll’s caster level + 1) to cast the spell successfully. If she fails, she must make a DC 5 Wisdom check to avoid a mishap (see Scroll Mishaps, below). A natural roll of 1 always fails, whatever the modifiers.


In your scenario, if a 1st level cleric wanted to use a CL5 CLW wand, there is no issue and it would just work.

If that was isntead a CL5 scroll of CLW (and assuming the cleric has a minimum 11 Wisdom), then the cleric would only need to make a Caster Level check to successfully activate the scroll. There would be no need for a UMD check.

If it were a spell not on the cleric's spell list or the cleric didnt have the necessary Wisdom to cast a particular spell from a Spell Completion item, then the cleric would need to make the necessary UMD checks.

[RogueDM]

Follow-up question: I remember being told that there was a difference between the caster lists for Wizards and Sorcerers in spite of sharing the same spell list; something to the effect of Sorcerers only counting their known spells while Wizards count anything of a level they can cast (or something like that).

Tangent: Best description I've seen of a UMD skill attempt (albeit a failure) is Ash in Army of Darkness just coughing in place of a command word he didn't remember. "Klatu Verata N*cough*. Good enough!"

[Telonius]

Follow-up question: I remember being told that there was a difference between the caster lists for Wizards and Sorcerers in spite of sharing the same spell list; something to the effect of Sorcerers only counting their known spells while Wizards count anything of a level they can cast (or something like that).

Tangent: Best description I've seen of a UMD skill attempt (albeit a failure) is Ash in Army of Darkness just coughing in place of a command word he didn't remember. "Klatu Verata N*cough*. Good enough!"

There are a very few spells that are Sorcerer-only; this thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=159289) lists a few. Otherwise, no. If it's on the Wizard/Sorcerer spell list, it counts for both of them. It's not like Wizards only get to count spells that are actually in their spellbook as being on their list.

[Kelb_Panthera]

There are a very few spells that are Sorcerer-only; this thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=159289) lists a few. Otherwise, no. If it's on the Wizard/Sorcerer spell list, it counts for both of them. It's not like Wizards only get to count spells that are actually in their spellbook as being on their list.

Also of note, there are a handful of wizard only spells as well and at least one of them is core.

[Commander_Vimes]

So my one level dip in cloistered cleric nets my Factotum good saves where he's weak, some minor utility from the level 1 spells, heavy armor proficiency, three awesome feats from trading the domain abilities for the domain feats in Complete Champion, and I can use cleric wands without any chance of failure?

Awesome. Now I just need to find a wand of Divine Power.