Polymorph any object at level 2

[Yogibear41]

Say you had polymorph any object once per day at level 2, with a caster level= to your class level, a casting time of 1d4 hours, and material component cost of 250 gold in components. How could you abuse this?

[NeoPhoenix0]

PAO yourself into a mind flayer, Should last two days if you are medium. Next day PAO yourself into an aberration that is related to a beholder but not a beholder. The next day PAO yourself into a beholder. Take Beholder Mage prestige class. These restrictions only add more steps to abuse it.

[LTwerewolf]

Infinite money. Polymorphing a regular boulder into gold is permanent (lowest arguable duration factor is 9).

100 cubic feet per level at level 2 means 200 cubic feet, which is a lot of gold. 1 cubic foot of gold weighs 1205 pounds. 200 cubic feet weighs 241,000 pounds, which means 12,050,000 gold pieces worth of gold per casting.

This amount of money every day can be used to buy whatever you want. Or if you're so inclined, to flood the markets and tear down civilization by eliminating the power of the upper classes.


"But wait!" you say! "It can't create gold or any other metal of value!" No, it can't, but you can find nearly anything else under the sun (such as diamonds, etc, etc) that can be sold. The gold was an example of truly how much wealth it can create in a single casting.

[dspeyer]

Polymorph yourself into a 30th level wizard?

Really, PaO *requires* houserules.

[Barsoom]

"But wait!" you say! "It can't create gold or any other metal of value!" No, it can't, but you can find nearly anything else under the sun (such as diamonds, etc, etc) that can be sold. The gold was an example of truly how much wealth it can create in a single casting.That's not what it says.


This spell cannot create material of great intrinsic valueNo diamonds etc, etc for you. The beholder trick unfortunately does work.

[Toliudar]

I can see this working if the DM has the absolute power to end the polymorph effect at any time. Then you're not so much dealing with "this is the most broken spell in the game" as "I have a costly win button that stops working whenever it unbalances the game."

Don't get me wrong. I think it's still a bad idea. But it becomes a more manageable bad idea.

[Yogibear41]

I would be more appt to use it to make items/gold/material components than to turn myself into a beholder mage.

[Fouredged Sword]

POA yourself into a creature with wish and use assume ability to get wish 3/day.

Now get +3 to all stats, as much gold as you want, and any magic items. Wish for multiple rings of three wishes and get the last +2 to each stat.

[flare'90]

PAO yourself into a Zodar, use the Su Wish to get a Ring of the Three Wishes (or a LE Candle of Invocation) and go chain-wishing everything. Then You PAO into a kobold, gain Manipulate Form and...

[Yogibear41]

My dm would counter with, whats a zodar? Have you ever met one? What do they look like? when did you meet one?

[Fouredged Sword]

Then buy a CL3 scroll of guidance of the avatar to make the knowledge the planes check to know about them (1 rank 10 int).

[Yogibear41]

knowledge checks aren't a cure all in this game. I have seen people get 30+ and still just know basic facts about a creature, because in certain situations there is just no way a particular person would know about such things.

[Blightedmarsh]

Start a cosmetic surgery/transgender/transrace clinic.

[NeoPhoenix0]

PAO the biggest boulder you can cast it on into a delicious muffin. Feed the muffin to an enemy within 20 minutes. Watch him explode.

[Incanur]

PAO (pow!) admittedly is a whatever-I-do-what-I-want spell, but it at least arguably inherits polymorph's HD restriction based on caster level. That would make abuse under this scenario a little more complicated.

Also note that RAW you can purchase PAO at 15th CL for 1,200 gp if you can get to a metropolis. This helps to balance monks. :smallamused:

[NeoPhoenix0]

PAO (pow!) admittedly is a whatever-I-do-what-I-want spell, but it at least arguably inherits polymorph's HD restriction based on caster level. That would make abuse under this scenario a little more complicated.

Also note that RAW you can purchase PAO at 15th CL for 1,200 gp if you can get to a metropolis. This helps to balance monks. :smallamused:

OK, so you have to wait until level 11 to do the beholder mage smelly limburger cheese of the apocalypse. On the other hand if you are medium you only have to go gauth then beholder.

[flare'90]

My dm would counter with, whats a zodar? Have you ever met one? What do they look like? when did you meet one?

I was only stating a method to abuse PAO, it's up to the DM to make it harder or impossible to exploit.

Beside, i'm not sure on the HD cap on PAO: it's the same as polymorph? It's unlimited?
Also, do you get the supernatural abilities of the creature you become? And the SLAs?

[NeoPhoenix0]

Ya know, If PAO keeps its restrictions on hit dice, then WotC gave us some impossible examples. You can't turn objects into creatures because creatures have hit dice and objects usually don't. The hit dice limit is caster level or hit dice of the subject, whichever is lower.

[flare'90]

Ya know, If PAO keeps its restrictions on hit dice, then WotC gave us some impossible examples. You can't turn objects into creatures because creatures have hit dice and objects usually don't. The hit dice limit is caster level or hit dice of the subject, whichever is lower.

Polymorph's HD cap is based on the end creature, not on the target's HD. Items don't have HD, so i guess you can PAO any creature in an item (Also, PAO can replicate stone to flesh and flesh to stone, so it's at least implied it can)
On the HD cap, you've got a RAW or at least Faq or CustServ quote on that? I'd be very interested in an official opinion.

[NeoPhoenix0]

Polymorph's HD cap is based on the end creature, not on the target's HD. Items don't have HD, so i guess you can PAO any creature in an item (Also, PAO can replicate stone to flesh and flesh to stone, so it's at least implied it can)
On the HD cap, you've got a RAW or at least Faq or CustServ quote on that? I'd be very interested in an official opinion.


...The assumed form can’t have more Hit Dice than your caster level (or the subject’s HD, whichever is lower)...
Link (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/polymorph.htm)


...This spell functions like polymorph, except that it changes one object or creature into another...
Link (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/polymorphAnyObject.htm)

RAW, normal objects don't have hit dice. The PAO spell doesn't make any special exemption to the HD restrictions. So normal objects can't be turned into creatures with hit dice.

FAQ and customer service aren't actual rules just interpretations of the rules so they aren't RAW.

Edit: Of course that is just rules-lawyer RAW stuff.

[Yogibear41]

Objection your honor!

Objects have no hit dice, not 0 hit dice their is a difference. Similar to how undead have no constitution score not a constitution score of 0. By referring to the rule of a non-ability score, I determine a coralary to this particular argument saying that an object can indeed be polymorphed into a being with hit dice. As evidence please see page 263 of the Players handbook under description of the aformentioned spell in question, you will see as an example that a pebble can indeed be transformed into a human for the brief period of 20 minutes.


At least if I was a lawyer I would say something like this :smallcool:

[TuggyNE]

Objects have no hit dice, not 0 hit dice their is a difference. Similar to how undead have no constitution score not a constitution score of 0. By referring to the rule of a non-ability score, I determine a coralary to this particular argument saying that an object can indeed be polymorphed into a being with hit dice. As evidence please see page 263 of the Players handbook under description of the aformentioned spell in question, you will see as an example that a pebble can indeed be transformed into a human for the brief period of 20 minutes.

If anything, the similarity to nonabilities makes things worse, not better. Creatures with nonabilities are simply immune to anything that targets the abilities they don't have, and automatically fail any attempts to make use of those missing abilities. The analogy would be that things with HD: - are immune to effects that are limited to HD, and automatically fail any attempts to make use of HD. After all, you can't give a zombie a Con score, not even for 1 min/level with bear's endurance.