What books should be thrown at this guy's head?

[Zanfire]

Twofold question here reguarding this partial build:

Major Bloodline X 3/Binder 1/Uncanny Trickster 3/Xxx X//Generic Spellcaster X/Metaphysical Spellshaper 3/Warweaver 5/ Spellguard of Silverymoon 5/Xxx X

Spell list included every buff of note across the Druid, Cleric & Wiz/Sor list

Had a familiar, and Persistent Spell

The two questions are, what rule books would you through at this player if they brought it to your table; and what can we fill in the xs with to abuse it more?

[Barsoom]

Generic classes are a DM option to begin with. And even if allowed, they shouldn't be allowed to be mixed with normal character classes.


If you use these generic classes, you shouldn't also use the standard character classes (or variants of those classes).

[Pesimismrocks]

They'd need a good backstory and I just don't see that happening so they'd just be disallowed. I see no incantatrix and that's always great.

[herrhauptmann]

Abjurant Champ is nice, and you've already got the Combat Casting prereq for spellguard. Free quicken/extend on your abjurations? Yes Please.

Which books to throw? I'd say every source book for the things he's using.

So UA/ToM/PGtF/...

[Zanfire]

With metaphysical spellshaper and nabarius he doesn't need incanatrix

[CaladanMoonblad]

The two questions are, what rule books would you through at this player if they brought it to your table; and what can we fill in the xs with to abuse it more?

Well, it depends on the self defense laws in your state; if you are required to retreat, do not choose a sharp edged book when throwing the book through your player.

As a GM, if you've given carte blanche to your players in terms of every Wizard and 3rd party product under the sun... expect this sort of thing, especially if you decide to run a 20th level or higher campaign out of the starting gate. There are all sorts of builds that would likely kill a character if the player had to start the build at 1st level...

[Zanfire]

Generic classes are a DM option to begin with. And even if allowed, they shouldn't be allowed to be mixed with normal character classes.

The exact quote from the book not the SRD spells out classes from the player's handbook, so technically the build isn't in violation of that rule, although it may violate gestalt rules by having prcs on both sides simultaneously, unless that's fixed by filling in the Xs.

[EyethatBinds]

Once you can't say your caster's classes in a single breath the character is no long playable.

[Rebel7284]

Once you can't say your caster's classes in a single breath the character is no long playable.

Because Barbarian 1/Fighter 1/Monk 2/Warblade 1/Crusader 1/Master of Nine is so broken, right? ;)

[Amidus Drexel]

Because Barbarian 1/Fighter 1/Monk 2/Warblade 1/Crusader 1/Master of Nine is so broken, right? ;)

You can't say that in one breath?

[Drachasor]

Once you can't say your caster's classes in a single breath the character is no long playable.

This is why they made speech synthesizers.

[Barsoom]

Once you can't say your caster's classes in a single breath the character is no long playable.Try saying "Dragonborn of Bahamut Dark Whisper Gnome Dragonfire Adept" ten times fast.

[BWR]

Easy fix to Prestige Class dipping: they are prestigious.
The fluff of them is they generally require special training with a certain group, and requiring allegiance to said groups is not unreasonable. Just look at things like Spellguard of Silverymoon: why should any idiot be able to learn their secret techniques without formal training? Why should they teach them to any passing adventurer, not keeping it exclusive to the Spellguard?


Demand that people:
a) find those teaching the prestige class
b) convince the group to train them (usually means "join us")
c) finish one prestige class before picking up a new one. Base classes are fair game for dipping, but prestige are prestigious, and you finish one before being allowed to move on.

If nothing else, demanding people make an in-game excuse for why and where they picked up this special training will make them think more about background than they would otherwise.

[the_david]

There's an alternative rule in Unearthed Arcana (and the SRD) that says you can replace the requirements of a Prestige Class with a roleplaying requirement. A sidequest, if you will.

[Xervous]

I absolutely love how topics can get derailed by the oddest things.

>> What book(s) to throw?
>> How to make this better?

????

== Roleplay requirements on pretty much pure mechanical stuff that can be fluffed any way you please.



Anyways. I wouldn't be throwing a book. I wouldn't even be throwing dice. They'd be doing a nice dungeon crawl and suddenly I'd say "Start making Will saves, I'll tell you when to stop."

If someone wants to play High OP-Arms Race, the DM is perfectly allowed to return fire.

[Zanfire]

Easy fix to Prestige Class dipping: they are prestigious.
...

The build doesn't dip into any prc, it takes all of them to completion, actually uses bloodlines and Uncanny Trickster to push Warweaver farther...


If someone wants to play High OP-Arms Race, the DM is perfectly allowed to return fire.

And this is why the second question, so I can throw it back on steroids

[Mithril Leaf]

On the left dip one level of every binding class. You advance four levels of binding for every dip you take, due to the cheese of bloodlines. I recall a build like this floating around somewhere, I'll tell you if I can dig it up.

[Darth Stabber]

I tend to be highly lactose tolerant, but if you wan't something good to throw, may I recommend the Encycolopedia Britannica? If he's focused on buff spells it might not be an issue. I tend toward simplicity in my caster builds, so I wouldn't jump through all those hoops.

Things to add? Archmage is always a popular addition.

[SwordChucks]

I suggest War and Peace...in braille.

[LordBlades]

Demand that people:
a) find those teaching the prestige class
b) convince the group to train them (usually means "join us")
c) finish one prestige class before picking up a new one. Base classes are fair game for dipping, but prestige are prestigious, and you finish one before being allowed to move on.



While a) and b) can make sense from a RP perspective and indeed done properly can add quite a bit of flavor to the campaign world, there are mainly 2 problems with them IMO:

First of all, while it's perfectly logical for the abilities of some prestige classes(like like Spellguard of Silverymoon for example) to be 'secrets of the trade' for some groups, it's a stretch for many others. For example it's a bit weird to require finding somebody to teach you how to become a Duelist, while you can pick all the required knowledge&skills to become a Wizard, Druid, Warblade, or even Swashbuckler (which is very similar to Duelist) just fine on your own.

Secondly, especially if you're running long term campaigns and/or persistent campaign worlds, you need to keep track of every single prestige class you've had into the game, and what it's tied too. It gets tedious rather quickly.

Regarding c), I think such a rule hurts the verisimilitude of the campaign world quite a bit. It's one thing to have NPCs insist that you complete your training before you move on, but enforcing it as a rule might lead to some very weird moments. Consider a hypothetical character, Gogu the Gish (insert prerequisites here/eldritch knight 9) who just leveled up. With this rule in effect, Gogu can't learn anything about casting arcane spells in armor (take one level in Spellsword),which would be a rather logical path for the progression of his abilities, but he can totally learn how to cast divine spells, develop a spiritual bond with nature and gain an animal companion (take 1 level in Druid).

[Threadnaught]

Spell Compendium is a nice heavy book. Hhowever, there is the chance that he'd return fire with even more force.

Though I'd put on the latex gloves and throw the complete works of Stephanie Meyer. There's no recovering from that. :smallamused:

[Zanfire]

Another question to do with this guy, although I'm pretty sure I'm safe in that it can't be done, but maybe there is a way out there, Iot7fv's Wardings/Veils cannot be made to work with the Warweaver's Eldrich Tapestry correct?