These here undead are acting a bit funny

[rot42]

(this thread is safe for my PCs - feel free to read and comment)

What sort of check should I grant to notice that an undead abomination making a mockery of life has been Commanded by an evil Cleric? Spellcraft covers the spell Command Undead and similar, but I do not know of an equivalent use of Knowledge (Religion). Right now I am leaning towards breaking the check into two cases: acting against type or acting against character.

For an undead acting against type (the zombies count sand instead of shuffling toward your spicy brains, the Crypt Chanter stands silent, &c.), a Knowledge (Religion) check to know their usual behavior with the DC set as usual by HD. A concomitant Spot check might be in order if the behavioral modification is relatively subtle. For intelligent undead, the usual Sense Motive rules to notice that a Dominated creature is behaving abnormally.

Does anybody use or know of a better system? Does this seem well enough workable?
edit to add: system is 3.5

[karkus]

I don't quite think that this would work for unintelligent undead, but you could use Sense Motive (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Sense_Motive) as normal on undead as if to detect if they're Dominated or Charmed.

Sorry about taking so long to reply; forums weren't working for me a few hours ago.

[Waker]

Aside from noticing behavior, you might say that rebuked undead have the deities symbol that the cleric worships.

[TuggyNE]

I don't quite think that this would work for unintelligent undead, but you could use Sense Motive (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Sense_Motive) as normal on undead as if to detect if they're Dominated or Charmed.

That only works on Enchantments, and undead are not controlled by Enchantments. (Commanding undead by way of Cleric class feature doesn't even seem to have a school of magic at all.)

[Feytalist]

Allowing a Knowledge (religion) check against the undead's HD seems reasonable, personally.

[Splendor]

Its depends upon if the undead is intelligent or not and what the undead is doing.

Non-intelligent undead just stand there doing nothing unless attacked (if they haven't been commanded). Zombies don't go in search of brains or anything like that. Most non-intelligent undead should have been given atleast basic commands (attack anyone who enters this room but me).

Intelligent undead's actions vary greatly. Plenty of them could sit and have a normal conversation and act like anyone else (so long as their specific craving is satiated). Heck if it was poorly commanded it might tell you where the guy controlling it was, and to go get him.

I'd think only drastic control would be noticeable.
Ex - If a starving ghoul was commanded to stand still it might still yell about how its hungry and wants to eat the PC's succulent flesh. If the same ghoul was commanded to be quite and stand still then a perceptive character might notice its standing rigid and shaking slightly likes it trying to move.

In the second case I think the PC who makes a spot check (DC 15 maybe) would notice something strange about the corpse standing rigid in the corner and when they got closer would notice its eyes moving wildly or its body slightly moving.

[rot42]

Aside from noticing behavior, you might say that rebuked undead have the deities symbol that the cleric worships.

That would be a fantastic bit of flavor for a LE city where the use of undead is legal, regulated, and taxed. A divine Stamp Act, as it were.


Allowing a Knowledge (religion) check against the undead's HD seems reasonable, personally.

It is good to have the sanity check, thank you.


Intelligent undead's actions vary greatly. Plenty of them could sit and have a normal conversation and act like anyone else (so long as their specific craving is satiated). Heck if it was poorly commanded it might tell you where the guy controlling it was, and to go get him.

Consider the plot hook stolen. Obeying only the letter of a magical compulsion is a classic fantasy trope.



I'd think only drastic control would be noticeable.
Ex - If a starving ghoul was commanded to stand still it might still yell about how its hungry and wants to eat the PC's succulent flesh. If the same ghoul was commanded to be quite and stand still then a perceptive character might notice its standing rigid and shaking slightly likes it trying to move.

In the second case I think the PC who makes a spot check (DC 15 maybe) would notice something strange about the corpse standing rigid in the corner and when they got closer would notice its eyes moving wildly or its body slightly moving.

DC 15 Spot sounds about right for this, thank you.